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Posted: 8/7/2005 6:47:33 PM EDT
news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050807/ap_on_re_us/us_hiroshima


Next time don't bomb the USA. These people forgot who started that fight. They do remember who finished it.



Hiroshima Survivors Call for Ban on Nukes By BARRY MASSEY, Associated Press Writer
Sun Aug 7, 5:24 AM ET



Survivors of the deadly blasts that devastated Hiroshima and Nagasaki 60 years ago joined hundreds of activists in support of a global ban on nuclear weapons.

They rallied Saturday at the birthplace of the atomic bomb, outside the national labs that feed today's nuclear arsenal, on the tiny island where the Enola Gay took off for Hiroshima with its deadly payload, and in the nation's capital.

Bombing survivor Koji Ueda attended a rally in the Los Alamos park where there were research laboratories when the Manhattan Project developed the world's first atomic bomb.

"No more Hiroshimas. No more Nagasakis," Ueda said. "We send this message to our friends all over the world, along with a fresh determination of the 'hibakusha' (atomic bomb survivors) to continue to tell about Hiroshima and Nagasaki, aiming at a planet set free of wars of nuclear weapons."

In Oak Ridge, Tenn., 15 protesters from a group of more than 1,000 were arrested for blocking a road outside the heavily guarded weapons factory that helped fuel the bomb during World War II.

At the Nevada Test Site, about 200 peace activists, including actor Martin Sheen, gathered for a nonviolent demonstration outside the gates. Dozens were given citations and released after crossing police lines. There was no immediate count of exactly how many were detained.

In California, hundreds of activists marched to the gates of Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory, some holding sunflowers and others hoisting a 40-foot inflatable "missile."

The city of Hiroshima, meanwhile, marked the anniversary with prayers and water for the dead.

At 8:15 a.m., the instant of the blast, Hiroshima's trolleys stopped and more than 55,000 people at Peace Memorial Park observed a moment of silence that was broken only by the ringing of a bronze bell.

Ueda, who was 3 when the bomb was dropped on Hiroshima, was joined at Los Alamos by Masako Hashida, who was 15 and working in a factory a mile from where the second bomb fell three days later on Nagasaki.

In an interview with The Associated Press, Hashida recalled hearing a loud metallic noise and then seeing waves of red, blue, purple and yellow light. She said she lost consciousness and awoke outside the twisted metal ruins of the factory, which had made torpedoes used in the attack on Pearl Harbor.

She saw a person trying to stand, with burns and swelling so severe it was impossible to tell if it was a man or a woman.

In the Los Alamos park where research laboratories stood during the Manhattan Project, placards carried anti-war slogans including "No More War for Oil and Empire."

A group of veterans offered an opposing message across the park from the more than 500 activists. One sign read: "If there hadn't been a Pearl Harbor, there wouldn't have been a Hiroshima."

In Washington, G.R. Quinn, 54, of Bethesda, Md., held a sign across from the White House reading: "God Bless the Enola Gay," referring to the B-29 that dropped the first bomb. Nearby, about three dozen peace activists declared President Bush was not doing enough for nuclear disarmament.

More than 300 activists marched to the gates of Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory, about 50 miles east of San Francisco, some planning to plant the sunflowers they outside its fence.

The facility was created years after the bombs were dropped, but it has helped develop nuclear weapons in the nation's current arsenal.

A group of U.S. veterans met with atomic bomb survivors on the tiny island of Tinian in the Northern Mariana Islands to commemorate the anniversary. The island was the launching off point for the plane Enola Gay, which dropped its deadly payload over Hiroshima in 1945.

About 70 veterans and several survivors agreed to use their final years to advocate world peace and call for an end to nuclear proliferation.

The uranium for the bomb dropped on Hiroshima was supplied by the Y-12 nuclear weapons plant in Oak Ridge, which continues to make parts for every warhead in the country's nuclear arsenal.

More than 1,000 demonstrators carrying signs and beating drums marched outside the Y-12 gates in the largest peace protest ever in the city, which was built in secrecy during World War II. Fifteen protesters were arrested for blocking the road about 100 yards from the entrance, a misdemeanor.

"Those of us who live here have a special, maybe accidental, responsibility to think about the hard sides of these questions," said Fran Ansley, a University of Tennessee law professor.

___

Link Posted: 8/7/2005 6:48:06 PM EDT
all that means is that we didn't finish the job.....
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 6:48:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 6:48:45 PM EDT by NimmerMehr]
so, they do this every year. nothing new.


edit: they have called for a ban since aug 6th 1945.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 6:48:57 PM EDT

Originally Posted By VTwin60:
all that means is that we didn't finish the job.....



Halfassed! That's the American way!
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 6:49:09 PM EDT
See? More proof that we need to invest more in improving them. The nukes missed some people.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 6:50:32 PM EDT
Same shit every anniversary.

Cry me a river...
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 6:52:16 PM EDT
Fine.

Go convince the Chinese, the Koreans, the Russians, the French, the Pakistanis, the Indians, the South Africans, and the Iranians and their ilk, then get back to me.

I'll be over here performing PMS on my arsenal.

Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:02:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 7:04:22 PM EDT by warlord]
Those folks have forgotten the Rape of Nanking and the Bhattan Death March.

I would like the western news media interview some survivors from the Bhattan Death march, or the survivors from the Rape of Nanking.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:05:17 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 7:05:38 PM EDT by VTwin60]

Originally Posted By warlord:
Those folks have forgotten the Rape of Nanking and the Bhattan Death March.

I would like the western news media interview some survivors from the Bhattan Death march, or the survivors from the Rape of Nanking.



Yeah but thats part of war or at least so say their history books......and of course they have nice war shrine memorial to them all .....including the war criminals who were never prosecuted....
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:07:51 PM EDT

Originally Posted By warlord:
Those folks have forgotten the Rape of Nanking and the Bhattan Death March.

I would like the western news media interview some survivors from the Bhattan Death march, or the survivors from the Rape of Nanking.




+1


Why don't they promote that shit? Liberal bias in the media? Nah.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:09:29 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:10:52 PM EDT
No different than Sarah Brady wanting to ban guns after hubby got shot.

Ain't gonna happen.

HH
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:13:50 PM EDT
No... I want them to dig up POWs or Chinese that the Japanese tested or used Anthrax on...

Why don't I see that story?

Like said above...

Cry me a river!
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:16:44 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BobCole:

Originally Posted By warlord:
Those folks have forgotten the Rape of Nanking and the Bhattan Death March.

I would like the western news media interview some survivors from the Bhattan Death march, or the survivors from the Rape of Nanking.



+1

Why don't they promote that shit? Liberal bias in the media? Nah.


Maybe the news media can retrace the steps of the Bhattan Death March to bring attention to the few last remaining survivors. How many men died on that march?
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:16:46 PM EDT
These people are idiots, perhaps they got too much radiation?

First Japan invaded China, a violation of international law.

Later they attacked the U.S., another violation of international law.

So we are to believe making more laws is the answer?
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:18:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By VTwin60:
all that means is that we didn't finish the job.....



No shit. Maybe we should go back.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:19:38 PM EDT
Aw, what the heck – Let's just ban wars entirely.

They're just so...yucky!
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:22:51 PM EDT
"Those that show no mercy, should not expect any mercy"
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:27:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 7:42:59 PM EDT by glockguy40]

Originally Posted By DigDug:
Fuck em. We're the ones with the nukes.



True... but Japan has the worlds largest stock pile of reprocessed plutonium. They have the space program to have very capable delivery vehicles, and they have the scientists and technology to rapidly develop advanced nukes. They have the the super computers necessary to develop them in such a fashion that may allow them to even bypass doing nulcear tests.

So before saying fuck them, we have the nukes.... the only thing keeping Japan from having the same is their lack of desire to possess them. So you might want to STFU.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:29:46 PM EDT

Originally Posted By glockguy40:

Originally Posted By DigDug:
Fuck em. We're the ones with the nukes.



True... but Japan has the worlds largest stock pile of reprocessed plutonium. They have the space program to have very capable delivery vehicles, and they have the scientists and technlogy to rapidly develop advanced nukes. They have the the super computers necessary to develop them in such a fashion that may allow them to even bypass doing nulcear tests.

So before saying fuck them, we have the nukes.... the only thing keeping Japan from having the same is their lack of desire to possess them. So you might want to STFU.



Think they can build them in less than a 1/2 hour?

Ben
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:31:47 PM EDT

Hiroshima Survivors Call for Ban on Nukes
Fuck'em.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:31:54 PM EDT
I say we ban imperialistic asshole Japanese people.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:38:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 7:41:19 PM EDT by glockguy40]

Originally Posted By fadedsun:

Originally Posted By glockguy40:

Originally Posted By DigDug:
Fuck em. We're the ones with the nukes.



True... but Japan has the worlds largest stock pile of reprocessed plutonium. They have the space program to have very capable delivery vehicles, and they have the scientists and technlogy to rapidly develop advanced nukes. They have the the super computers necessary to develop them in such a fashion that may allow them to even bypass doing nulcear tests.

So before saying fuck them, we have the nukes.... the only thing keeping Japan from having the same is their lack of desire to possess them. So you might want to STFU.



Think they can build them in less than a 1/2 hour?

Ben



Well... considering that the Japanese own about 1/2 our economy, are you planning to nuke them anytime soon, making americans stand in bread lines due to the depression that ensues???

Secondly, we are not facing any threat from them at the present and therefore nuking them in the next half an hour seems unlikely... however, should we fail to get North Korea to denuclearize.... they will be nuclear before you know it
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:45:46 PM EDT

Originally Posted By glockguy40:
So before saying fuck them, we have the nukes.... the only thing keeping Japan from having the same is their lack of desire to possess them. So you might want to STFU.



Wrong, they don't have the nukes because they lost world war 2 and they aren't allowed to have them (or much less a standing offensive military) by the The International Atomic Energy Agency and the US. So you might want to heed your own advice and STFU.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:47:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 7:48:09 PM EDT by VTwin60]

Originally Posted By glockguy40:

Well... considering that the Japanese own about 1/2 our economy, are you planning to nuke them anytime soon, making americans stand in bread lines due to the depression that ensues???



Where the hell are you coming up with this line of BS? A Japanese appologist? So if Japan owns half and China owns half while the English are the biggest foreign investor in the US stock market.......heed your advice.....you're making yourself look dumb.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:48:13 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:52:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DigDug:
glockguy40,

Japan is completely dependant on other countries for even the basics of life. They can't even feed themselves. They had their big chance on the world stage. They lost. It seems both you and they can't move on.


Shhhh! Don't burst his bubble! The Japanese think it's their destiny to rule the world, dontchaknow.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 8:05:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 8:13:36 PM EDT by glockguy40]

Originally Posted By VTwin60:

Originally Posted By glockguy40:
So before saying fuck them, we have the nukes.... the only thing keeping Japan from having the same is their lack of desire to possess them. So you might want to STFU.



Wrong, they don't have the nukes because they lost world war 2 and they aren't allowed to have them (or much less a standing offensive military) by the The International Atomic Energy Agency and the US. So you might want to heed your own advice and STFU.



yes because the IAEA, treaties, and the US prevent people from having nuclear weapons. LMAO.

North Korea must not really exist.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 8:06:55 PM EDT
No S**t. I would to if I got one dropped on me.

I call for a ban on surprise attacks.

Payback is Hell isn't it.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 8:06:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 8:10:49 PM EDT by glockguy40]

Originally Posted By DigDug:
glockguy40,

Japan is completely dependant on other countries for even the basics of life. They can't even feed themselves. They had their big chance on the world stage. They lost. It seems both you and they can't move on.



I can move on just fine. I just thought your statement was stupid. They have the capability to go nuclear. They could begin a weapons program tomorrow and be nuclear within a year.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 8:09:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By VTwin60:

Originally Posted By glockguy40:

Well... considering that the Japanese own about 1/2 our economy, are you planning to nuke them anytime soon, making americans stand in bread lines due to the depression that ensues???



Where the hell are you coming up with this line of BS? A Japanese appologist? So if Japan owns half and China owns half while the English are the biggest foreign investor in the US stock market.......heed your advice.....you're making yourself look dumb.



perhaps 1/2 is an exaggeration.. yet they own a sizable amount of our debt and also account for a very large proportion of investment in the US economy.

Are you saying the destruction of Japan would have no effect on the US economy???

With the shape our economy is in now, we would be in a depression for sure. If you doubt otherwise, you are dillusional.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 8:13:35 PM EDT

Originally Posted By glockguy40:

Originally Posted By VTwin60:

Originally Posted By glockguy40:

Well... considering that the Japanese own about 1/2 our economy, are you planning to nuke them anytime soon, making americans stand in bread lines due to the depression that ensues???



Where the hell are you coming up with this line of BS? A Japanese appologist? So if Japan owns half and China owns half while the English are the biggest foreign investor in the US stock market.......heed your advice.....you're making yourself look dumb.



perhaps 1/2 is an exaggeration.. yet they own a sizable amount of our debt and also account for a very large proportion of investment in the US economy.

Are you saying the destruction of Japan would have no effect on the US economy???

With the shape our economy is in now, we would be in a depression for sure. If you doubt otherwise, you are dillusional.




Are the japanese not still in the depression that is resultant of their realestate market gone amuck amongst other things?

Last I checked their economy made our current situation look stellar. I could be wrong though, as I have not read up on it in a while.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 8:17:48 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 8:19:24 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 8:19:42 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Surf:
news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050807/ap_on_re_us/us_hiroshima



Hiroshima Survivors Call for Ban on Nukes By BARRY MASSEY, Associated Press Writer
Sun Aug 7, 5:24 AM ET



Survivors of the deadly blasts that devastated Hiroshima and Nagasaki 60 years ago joined hundreds of activists in support of a global ban on nuclear weapons....




I wonder if any of those activists ever heard of Unit 731? Research what the Japanese did to their POW's and civilian prisoners, then get back to us. They made the Nazi's look like amateurs.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 8:20:31 PM EDT
Pearl Harbor survivors call for a ban on Hiroshima idiots.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 8:46:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 8:57:24 PM EDT by glockguy40]

Originally Posted By DigDug:

Originally Posted By glockguy40:

Originally Posted By DigDug:
glockguy40,

Japan is completely dependant on other countries for even the basics of life. They can't even feed themselves. They had their big chance on the world stage. They lost. It seems both you and they can't move on.



I can move on just fine. I just thought your statement was stupid. They have the capability to go nuclear. They could begin a weapons program tomorrow and be nuclear within a year.



They can't even feed themselves. What's stupid is the fact you are so misinformed about the world. They lost. Well, they picked a fight they couldn't win.

You want to talk about bombing? Look up Dresden...



What the fuck does Japan having lost the war or what happened to Dresden have to do with Japan's ability to go nuclear you moron? What does their ability to produce food have to do with their ability to produce nuclear weapons??? Last time I checked you dont need farm land to produce nuclear weapons.

(ETA: Just to further the point... North Korea cant "feed itself", and is dependent on China for its basic needs, yet they have nukes. Hmmmm... interesting )

They can go nuclear. They have the materials, the technology, the scientific know-how, and the money to get it done. Case closed.

It has nothing to do with what happened in WWII or how much food or oil they can produce domestically??? How are you too obtuse to see that!!
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 8:54:09 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Surf:
news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050807/ap_on_re_us/us_hiroshima


Next time don't bomb the USA. These people forgot who started that fight. They do remember who finished it.



Hiroshima Survivors Call for Ban on Nukes By BARRY MASSEY, Associated Press Writer
Sun Aug 7, 5:24 AM ET



Survivors of the deadly blasts that devastated Hiroshima and Nagasaki 60 years ago joined hundreds of activists in support of a global ban on nuclear weapons.


___



Ooohh, sounds like the Million Mom March.

CW
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 8:58:06 PM EDT
I think the bomb was a blessing, actually. They should, too. It spared millions more dead Japanese.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 9:05:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 9:07:15 PM EDT by DigDug]
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 9:15:39 PM EDT
When nuclear weapons are outlawed, only outlaws will have nuclear weapons.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 9:31:09 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 9:34:37 PM EDT by glockguy40]

Originally Posted By DigDug:
glockguy40,

Japan could not go nuclear in a year. You are wrong. Their own people wouldn't allow it to happen even if they have the resources. That is because of the people we are talking about in the first post of this thread.

Enough with the name calling.



You just made my point for me. As I said in my original post....


Originally Posted By glockguy40:

Originally Posted By DigDug:
Fuck em. We're the ones with the nukes.



True... but Japan has the worlds largest stock pile of reprocessed plutonium. They have the space program to have very capable delivery vehicles, and they have the scientists and technology to rapidly develop advanced nukes. They have the the super computers necessary to develop them in such a fashion that may allow them to even bypass doing nulcear tests.

So before saying fuck them, we have the nukes.... the only thing keeping Japan from having the same is their lack of desire to possess them. So you might want to STFU.



I said the only thing that was keeping Japan from going nuclear was the Japanese themselves, so you might not want to open your mouth.

You were arguing that they could not go nuclear if they wanted to, making stupid and non-sensical arguments about their ability to produce food and what not.

You should of just agreed with me in the first place and STFU.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 9:34:51 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 9:37:28 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Wobblin-Goblin:
I think the bomb was a blessing, actually. They should, too. It spared millions more dead Japanese.



Not to mention it kept Stalin out of the north sparing Japan a communist partitioning like that seen in Korea and Vietnam.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 9:37:57 PM EDT
More were killed with napalm than nukes in japan during world war 2...

Why aren't they protesting napalm? Oh yeah, because they don't know jack shit but what their lopsided propaganda books tell them.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 9:39:37 PM EDT
I wonder what the survivors of the Rape of Nanking want of ban?

Hmmmm?
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 9:47:01 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 9:54:21 PM EDT by DigDug]
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 9:58:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 10:08:38 PM EDT by glockguy40]

Originally Posted By DigDug:

Originally Posted By glockguy40:

Originally Posted By DigDug:
glockguy40,

Japan could not go nuclear in a year. You are wrong. Their own people wouldn't allow it to happen even if they have the resources. That is because of the people we are talking about in the first post of this thread.

Enough with the name calling.



You just made my point for me. As I said in my original post....


Originally Posted By glockguy40:

Originally Posted By DigDug:
Fuck em. We're the ones with the nukes.



True... but Japan has the worlds largest stock pile of reprocessed plutonium. They have the space program to have very capable delivery vehicles, and they have the scientists and technology to rapidly develop advanced nukes. They have the the super computers necessary to develop them in such a fashion that may allow them to even bypass doing nulcear tests.

So before saying fuck them, we have the nukes.... the only thing keeping Japan from having the same is their lack of desire to possess them. So you might want to STFU.



I said the only thing that was keeping Japan from going nuclear was the Japanese themselves, so you might not want to open your mouth.

You were arguing that they could not go nuclear if they wanted to, making stupid and non-sensical arguments about their ability to produce food and what not.

You should of just agreed with me in the first place and STFU.



"Their own people wouldn't allow it to happen even if they have the resources."

Can you read? Where did I agree with you that they have the resources? I don't see that. I see a hypothetical situation in which they had the required resources (they don't) and they still couldn't have a nuke program in a year. So either way they can't have a nuke program in a year. Your point again was what?



How are you going to possibly suggest they dont have the resources???

Hardest part of making a bomb is acquiring fissile material. CHECK. Japan has about 35 tonnes in excess of what they need to go nuclear.

Ability to create a nutron initiator. CHECK... Japan has the necessary technology.

Ability to smelt uranium melt into tamper. CHECK.... considering Iran bought the equipment from japan.

Necessary expertise with explosives for implosion of core and the creation of super-criticality. CHECK

Necessary scientists to figure out the necessary geometry and mathematical equations for proper placement of explosive around core. CHECK

Necessary expertise with space launch vehicles to develop ICBM's. CHECK.... Considering they launch commerial satellites into space with regularity.

Ability to miniturize warhead. This is not necessary to be considered a nuclear nation as long as you have the bomb, but I believe the Japanese could figure it out without even using actual testing. They could simply do super computer simulations and make use of existing nuclear data that is available to them. So... CHECK

Ability to mount warhead to delivery vehicle. Easily accomplished within a year with their knowledge of delivery vehicles. CHECK

ETA: In addition... Japan is not North Korea or Iran. It is considered a responsible member of the international community, and therefore would have free access to procure anything it could not produce on its own (though it would not need to).

THIS all adds up to you being incredibly wrong and obtuse and no longer worth wasting my time.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 10:12:59 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 10:14:17 PM EDT by The_Macallan]










Link Posted: 8/7/2005 10:16:57 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 10:28:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 10:33:39 PM EDT by glockguy40]

Originally Posted By DigDug:
Yup, just let those supercomputers crunch away. They'll come up with something..

They neither have the means nor the will to create nukes. They just want to change history so they don't look so much like the bad people they actually were.

Why mention they could buy from others if they wouldn't have to? Way to cover your ass!

Japan is on it's way to third world status if they don't get their shit together. I can remember a time when everything was made in Japan. Not any more...



You really are a moron. I put the comment in there about being able to buy anything they wanted to cut off a possible moronic response by you that they couldnt produce certain items themselves, so they couldnt build nukes... no need cover my ass... I know I am right.

This is the last argument I am going to make because you are an idiot and will never understand the science behind building nukes nor what it takes to produce them.

Israel has released many statements that it would take Iran several years to produce nukes on their own, because they lack the fissile material to do so. Iran has not mastered the nuclear fuel cycle yet to enable them to produce enough fissile material to produce a weapon.

However, the Israelis have also stated that if Iran acquired fissile material through some other source, such as the blackmarket or Russia, they could produce a bomb in a crash program in 6 to 12 months time.

If a way less techincally advanced country such as Iran could accomplish this, then certainly Japan could as well; and, since the Japanese have the necessary fissile material already.... they can, therefore, build nukes whenever they choose, within the same or an even shorter time period (6 to 12 months).

Just admit you are wrong and go back to sleep and dream the big bad Japanese will never hurt you

ETA: I dont care we bombed the Japanese. I dont care about what happened in WWII.

This is a technical discussion of Japanese potential nuclear capability in which you are blatantly wrong and dillusional.
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