I was thinking of ordering or making some tannerite, and so I started researching the state laws and regs.

In Colorado "using" an explosive without a permit is a no-go; just wanted to bring that to everyone's attention.

No possibility of valid tannerite use here that I can see.  Permits issued for mining, construciton, and ag uses.   I guess we could try to get a ruling from the appropriate deparment that reactive targets are "ag uses" but I kind of doubt it.

Isan't gunpowder an explosive?

Quoted: Isan't gunpowder an explosive?

Blackpowder for rifles, and reloading components are carved out.

The state regs specifically close the "loophole" that Tannerite falls in by felonizing even the transport, possession, or use of the separate components of a binary compound.  Hell, from my read of these regs, mixing the Tannerite at the range falls into the category of "manufacture."

Damn shame.

Quoted: Quoted: Isan't gunpowder an explosive? Blackpowder for rifles, and reloading components are carved out. The state regs specifically close the "loophole" that Tannerite falls in by felonizing even the transport, possession, or use of the separate components of a binary compound.  Hell, from my read of these regs, mixing the Tannerite at the range falls into the category of "manufacture." Damn shame.

Dude, that sucks!  Are you sure it specifically lists component binary explosives?  Have you called the local law to ask them their interpretation of Tannerite used in a responsible manner in a permitted area?  I wonder if they would make an exclusion?  

It'd be a good idea to put this in your HTF.

get a ruling

Quoted: Quoted: Isan't gunpowder an explosive? Blackpowder for rifles, and reloading components are carved out. The state regs specifically close the "loophole" that Tannerite falls in by felonizing even the transport, possession, or use of the separate components of a binary compound.  Hell, from my read of these regs, mixing the Tannerite at the range falls into the category of "manufacture." Damn shame.

Technicaly, anyone with cleaning products has binary componets to explosives.  What farmer doesn't have AN and diesel?  This could have a hard time holding up in court since there is a huge number of products that can be combined and become explosive.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Isan't gunpowder an explosive? Blackpowder for rifles, and reloading components are carved out. The state regs specifically close the "loophole" that Tannerite falls in by felonizing even the transport, possession, or use of the separate components of a binary compound.  Hell, from my read of these regs, mixing the Tannerite at the range falls into the category of "manufacture." Damn shame. Technicaly, anyone with cleaning products has binary componets to explosives.  What farmer doesn't have AN and diesel?  This could have a hard time holding up in court since there is a huge number of products that can be combined and become explosive.

It only gets tested in court if the facts of your case implicate the overbreadth you're talking about.   I'd say that if you order a binary set of materials from Tanner and you bring it to the range they can pretty much prove you fall within their intended definition, and you will not have standing to raise the "I'm just a soccer mom with some cleaning chemicals" defense.

Its not an explosive, it's a rifle target!!

Quoted: Its not an explosive, it's a rifle target!!

That's right, a reactive rifle target.

Just curious...but what two ingredients make up Tannerite?

Quoted: Just curious...but what two ingredients make up Tannerite?

Actual Tannerite has more than two ingredients, but it is mostly ammonium nitrate and powdered aluminum. Those two alone will work though.

There's always a loophole for these type of things.... if you keep rereading it you'll find it... actually where you looking? Is it in the state firearms laws? if so where. let me know and i'll look at it too.

Quoted: There's always a loophole for these type of things.... if you keep rereading it you'll find it... actually where you looking? Is it in the state firearms laws? if so where. let me know and i'll look at it too.

No loophole.

I do law for a living and they've got a pretty well drafted statute and series of regs.

Agricultural uses do not always need a permit, but the problem is that I think short of a letter signed by the attorney general himself, no one would accept reactive targets as an agricultural use.  

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Isan't gunpowder an explosive? Blackpowder for rifles, and reloading components are carved out. The state regs specifically close the "loophole" that Tannerite falls in by felonizing even the transport, possession, or use of the separate components of a binary compound.  Hell, from my read of these regs, mixing the Tannerite at the range falls into the category of "manufacture." Damn shame. Technicaly, anyone with cleaning products has binary componets to explosives.  What farmer doesn't have AN and diesel?  This could have a hard time holding up in court since there is a huge number of products that can be combined and become explosive. It only gets tested in court if the facts of your case implicate the overbreadth you're talking about.   I'd say that if you order a binary set of materials from Tanner and you bring it to the range they can pretty much prove you fall within their intended definition, and you will not have standing to raise the "I'm just a soccer mom with some cleaning chemicals" defense.

It says possesion and transport.  That means when you go to Walmart(who is also in possesion) and buy some cleaning stuff and take it home.  You have broken the law.  Unless they have specified the exact componds, it applies to all.  

What the state intends and what they wrote arn't the same...  Well, actualy they are, they don't wan't any binary explosives.  I guess they forgot the part where you can't make an omlete withouth breaking an egg.

I don't know the exact wording, but I doubt they put much thought into this.

Quoted: It says possesion and transport.  That means when you go to Walmart(who is also in possesion) and buy some cleaning stuff and take it home.  You have broken the law.  Unless they have specified the exact componds, it applies to all.   What the state intends and what they wrote arn't the same...  Well, actualy they are, they don't wan't any binary explosives.  I guess they forgot the part where you can't make an omlete withouth breaking an egg. I don't know the exact wording, but I doubt they put much thought into this.

Here's the relevant part of the exact wording:

Scope of the Regs:

1.1 Scope These rules and regulations shall apply to the use, manufacture, purchase, possession, sale, storage, transportation, and disposal of explosive materials in the State of Colorado by any individual, corporation, company, firm, partnership, association, or state or local government agency. These rules and regulations shall not apply to: (A) The shipment, transportation, and handling of military explosives by the Armed Forces of the United States or the State Militia. (B) The normal and emergency operations of any government law enforcement agency including all departments, and divisions thereof, provided they are acting in their official capacity and in the proper performance of their duties and functions. (C) Explosives in the forms prescribed by the official United States Pharmacopoeia or the National Formulary and used in medicines and medicinal agents. (D) Explosive materials while in the course of transportation by for-hire commercial carriers via railroad, water, highway, or air when the explosive materials are moving under the jurisdiction of, and in conformity with, regulations adopted by any Federal Department or Agency. (E) The components for hand loading rifle, pistol, and shotgun ammunition and/or rifle, pistol, and shotgun ammunition. (F) The manufacture, sale and use (public display) of pyrotechnics commonly known as fireworks, including signaling devices such as flares, fuses, and torpedoes. (G) Gasoline, fertilizers, installed propellant/powder-actuated safety devices or propellant/powder-actuated power tools. (H) The use and storage of model rocket motors containing a propellant weight of 62.5 grams or less and which produce less than 17.92 pound seconds of total impulse. No permit shall be required for the occasional purchase of explosives by a person for normal agricultural purposes where such person is known by the seller of such explosives, and a record is kept of such transactions by the seller, including the specific purpose for which such explosives will be used, the location of the purposed use, the signature of the purchaser, and the certification of the seller as to his personal knowledge of the purchaser. Violation of this record requirement shall cause the seller’s permit to be canceled.   A permit is required for any manufacturing, storage, dealing, or non-agricultural use of explosives as outlined in Chapter III of this regulation.

Some relevant definitions:

Binary (two-component) explosive: A blasting explosive formed by the mixing or combining of two plosophoric materials... Bullet-Sensitive Explosive Material: Explosive material that can be detonated by 150 grain M2 ball ammunition having a nominal muzzle velocity of 2,700 feet per second when the bullet is fired from a .30 caliber rifle at a distance of not more than 100 feet and the test material, at a temperature of 70-75 degrees  Fahrenheit, is placed against a backing material... Explosive Materials: These include explosives, blasting agents, and detonators. The term includes but is not limited to dynamite and other high explosives; slurries, emulsions, and water gels, black powder, initiating explosives, propellant rockbreaking cartridges (such as Rockrackers™), detonators (blasting caps), safety fuses, squibs, detonating cord, igniter cord, and igniters.  Binary explosives sold in two or more components, are considered an explosive material requiring a Division of Oil and Public Safety explosives permit. Manufacturer: Any individual, corporation, company, firm, partnership, association, or state or local government agency engaged in the business of manufacturing explosive materials for the purpose of sale, distribution or for his own use. Pyrotechnics: Any combustible or explosive compositions or manufactured articles designed and prepared for the purpose of producing audible or visible effects. Pyrotechnics are commonly referred to as fireworks. Type I Permit: A permit issued by the Division of Oil and Public Safety to individuals who possess and control explosive materials during the use, manufacture, acquisition, purchase, sale, distribution, storage, transportation, or disposal of explosive materials. Type II Permit: A permit issued by the Division of Oil and Public Safety to corporations, companies, partnerships, firms, individuals operating a business, associations, or state or local government agencies involved in the use, purchase, sale, manufacture, transportation, acquisition, distribution or disposal of explosives materials. Type III Permit: A permit issued by the Division of Oil and Public Safety to corporations, companies, partnerships, firms, individuals operating a business, associations, or state or local government agencies for the storage of explosives in approved magazines.

And the general framework:

3.1 Basic Legal Obligations (A) Except as specifically allowed by these regulations, it is unlawful for any person to use, possess and control, manufacture, purchase, sell, store, transport, or dispose of any explosive material without possessing a valid permit from the Division of Oil and Public Safety.  18-12-109 (2) and 9-7-101, et seq., C.R.S.

And, permit requirements for the easiest permit:

3.5.1 Type I Permit (A) All individuals who possess and control explosive materials shall have a valid Type I permit issued by the Division of Oil and Public Safety. (B) The requirements of permitting a Type I permittee shall be: (1) Any individual who possesses and controls explosive materials during the use, transportation, storage, distribution, manufacturing, sale, acquisition, or purchase of explosive materials. (2) An individual who makes any or all of the following decisions: (a) Decides total quantity of explosives used; (b) Decides borehole size, spacing, or depth; (c) Decides quantity of explosives in each borehole or charge; (d) Decides initiation system to be used; (e) Decides timing delays to be used. (3) An individual who directly supervises all personnel assisting in the use of explosives and supervises all personnel in training. (4) An individual who shall also be physically present during the use of explosives, at the point of initiation when a charge is detonated and either initiates the detonation or gives the order to initiate the detonation of the charge. (C) The classification of permits the applicant may apply for shall be: (1) Construction; (a) Applicant must also apply for a Type I transporter permit, or provide to the Division of Oil and Public Safety a written plan documenting the manner in which explosives shall be legally transported to and from construction sites. (2) Construction Limited; (a) Applicant may use or possess class 1.4, 1.5 explosives or binary products only. (3) Quarry Operations; (4) Avalanche Control; (5) Geophysical Exploration; (6) Transporter; (a) Applicant must submit a copy of applicant’s Commercial Driver’s License with Hazardous Material Endorsement. (b) Required for the transportation of explosive materials and blasting agents in quantities required to be placarded across or over roads within the state. (7) Special (special use or possession and control as described on the permit including, but not limited to, fabrication, research and development, manufacturing technician, demolition, law enforcement, demolition, UXO, purchasing agent, well perforation, or sales agent etc.) (D) Type I permittee qualifications: (1) The Type I permittee shall be able to understand and give written and oral orders; (2) The Type I permittee shall be qualified by reason of training, knowledge, and experience in the field of using, transporting, possessing, storing and handling of explosives, and have a working knowledge of state, federal and local laws and regulations which pertain to explosives; (3) The Type I permit applicant shall be required to submit proof of not less than one year of explosive experience or on the job training in explosives specific to at least one classification of permit. (4) The Type I permit applicant shall be required to submit proof of not less than six months of explosive experience or on the job training in explosives specific to each additional classification of permit applied for. (5) The Type I permittee shall be knowledgeable and competent in the use of each type of blasting method and initiation system used. (6) A Type I permit applicant for a transportation classification permit only shall have a valid commercial driver’s license with a hazardous materials endorsement and experience in the transportation of explosive materials for a period of not less than ninety days. (7) The Type I permit applicant shall include the name(s) of the valid Type II permittee the applicant is employed by or associated with, and for whom the applicant will possess and control explosive materials. (8) The Division of Oil and Public Safety will issue a Type I permit card with the permittee’s photograph which shall state the classifications of the permit, the name(s) of the valid Type II permittee the applicant is employed by or associated with, and for whom the applicant will possess and control explosive materials. (E) Type I permittee limitations: (1) A Type I permit shall be limited to possession and control of explosives while authorized by the Type II permittee(s) for whom the Type I permittee is employed or otherwise associated. (2) The Type I permit shall be placed on inactive status by the Division upon notification in accordance with 3.9(D) that the Type I permittee is no longer authorized to possess and control explosives for a Type II permittee. (3) Upon receipt of written notification by a Type II permittee of authorization and the return of the original Type I permit card, the Division shall return the Type I permit to active status and issue an updated permit card reflecting the change in employment or association.   (4) An active status Type I permit card shall be carried by the Type I permittee at all times when using, transporting, or possessing explosives. 3.5.2 Type II Permit (A) Corporations, companies, partnerships, firms, individuals operating a business, associations, or state or local government agencies involved in the use, purchase, sale, manufacture, transportation, or disposal of explosives shall have a valid Type II permit. (B) Only one Type II permit shall be required of any corporation, company, partnership, firm, individual operating a business, association, or state or local government agency, and may be issued for all or any of the following classifications: (1) CLASSIFICATION AS A MANUFACTURER OF EXPLOSIVES authorizes the possession, manufacture, and purchase of materials required in the process of manufacturing the finished product. A corporation, company, partnership, firm, individual operating a business, association, or state or local government agency that combines compounds to manufacture an explosive is engaged in the business of manufacturing explosives and shall be responsible for compliance with the provisions of 9-6-105 C.R.S., the Explosives Act, 9-7-101, et seq. C.R.S., and any rules and regulations promulgated thereunder. (2) CLASSIFICATION AS A DEALER OF EXPLOSIVES authorizes the purchase, possession, and resale of explosives or blasting agents. A dealer permit is required of jobbers, wholesalers, distributors, dealers, and retailers, whether or not they physically handle, store, or have possession of the explosives or blasting agents. This permit is also required for all nonresidents who desire to sell explosives within the State of Colorado; (3) CLASSIFICATION AS A PURCHASER OF EXPLOSIVES authorizes the purchase or acquisition and possession of explosives and blasting agents; (4) CLASSIFICATION AS A PURCHASER LIMITED authorizes the purchase or acquisition and possession of 1.4 and 1.5 classes of explosives and binary products; (5) CLASSIFICATION AS A USER OF EXPLOSIVES authorizes the possession and use of explosives and blasting agents by a corporation, company, partnership, firm, individual operating a business, association, or state or local government agency conducting an operation or activity which requires the use of such materials. User permits shall be issued for the following types of operations; (a) Construction; (1) Applicant must also apply for a Type II transportation permit, or provide to the Division of Oil and Public Safety a written plan documenting the manner in which explosives shall be legally transported to and from construction sites. (b) Construction limited; (1) Applicant’s use and possession of explosives is limited to 1.4 and 1.5 classes of explosives and binary products. (c) Quarry Operations; (d) Avalanche Control; (e) Geophysical research; (f) Special (special use as described on the permit including, but not limited to, Fabrication, Demolition, UXO, Well Perforation, Law Enforcement, Research and Development, etc.); (6) A TRANSPORTATION permit authorizes the transportation of explosive materials and blasting agents in quantities that are required to be placarded across or over roads within the state when such transportation is in compliance with federal, state and local transportation laws and regulations. (a) A copy of a Hazardous Materials Transport Permit issued by the Public Utilities Commission shall be submitted with the application.

Every individual that possesses or uses the stuff needs a Type I.   But you can't do anything with the Type I unless authorized by a Type II.

Type II can only be issued for the purposes specified.  I suppose a type (f) "special" use might be arranged for events like a Colorado Boomershoot or the like.   But as they write the regs, the person firing the shot would have to be licensed too as a Type I.

Best avenues I see for possible use of Tannerite in Colorado would be (a) get the state to classify tannerite targets as "fireworks" because they produce a visual or audio effect for entertainment (seems doubtful as shooting a charge of TNT or dynomite could have the same effect and they wouldn't want to create an exception you could drive a Ryder truck through); or (b) that shooting reactive targets is an agricultural use exempted.   Only problem is, that its really not.

Sounds to me like someone who wanted to regularly use tannerite would have to get a Type I and II permit under a "special" use (f) for the specific purpose of using binary reactive targets.

When was this law written?

That almost looks like parts of it were written with tannerite specifically in mind.  Wow.  Looks like someone in the Colorado State legislature got real pissed at his neighbor for using tannerite and decided to do something about it.

I hope that doesn't spread around to other States.

Quoted: When was this law written?

The law exists at Titles 18 (crimes) and 9 (licensing) of the statutes.  Both of those sections delegate authority to the state department of regulations to promulgate rules and exercise regulatory authority.  The stuff I quoted comes out of the regs, they were recently updated and went into effect in May 2005.

So, yes, there clearly was cognizance of Tannerite and an explicit effort to regulate it out of use.

nothing to see here...

Edited for paranoia

Quoted: Quoted: When was this law written? The law exists at Titles 18 (crimes) and 9 (licensing) of the statutes.  Both of those sections delegate authority to the state department of regulations to promulgate rules and exercise regulatory authority.  The stuff I quoted comes out of the regs, they were recently updated and went into effect in May 2005. So, yes, there clearly was cognizance of Tannerite and an explicit effort to regulate it out of use.

That's what I read as well, what other product would this be talking about:

Bullet-Sensitive Explosive Material: Explosive material that can be detonated by 150 grain M2 ball ammunition having a nominal muzzle velocity of 2,700 feet per second when the bullet is fired from a .30 caliber rifle at a distance of not more than 100 feet and the test material, at a temperature of 70-75 degrees Fahrenheit, is placed against a backing material...

Use them in remote areas on private property and don't be obnoxious enough to have someone report you.

This is a lot like the whole concealed carry thing.  Keep it concealed.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: When was this law written? The law exists at Titles 18 (crimes) and 9 (licensing) of the statutes.  Both of those sections delegate authority to the state department of regulations to promulgate rules and exercise regulatory authority.  The stuff I quoted comes out of the regs, they were recently updated and went into effect in May 2005. So, yes, there clearly was cognizance of Tannerite and an explicit effort to regulate it out of use. That's what I read as well, what other product would this be talking about: Bullet-Sensitive Explosive Material: Explosive material that can be detonated by 150 grain M2 ball ammunition having a nominal muzzle velocity of 2,700 feet per second when the bullet is fired from a .30 caliber rifle at a distance of not more than 100 feet and the test material, at a temperature of 70-75 degrees Fahrenheit, is placed against a backing material...

That can apply to a lot of compounds.   TNT, dynomite, and certainly all of the primaries, can be exploded with a bullet.   I think that issue comes into play more under the regs about storage magazines etc.   Bullet sensative stuff has to be stored in magazines with steel separation that will stop bullets.

The specific reference to unmixed binaries as being subject to licensing, however, applies only to a few construction site compounds and, of course, tannerite.

Bummer, to be sure, but knowledge of the pitfalls is what is important.  

edit for OpSec

I wonder if they can have Mentos and Diet Coke...

hmmm....