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Posted: 7/30/2001 4:37:01 PM EST
I need some real life advice from some folks who have gone through this kind of thing. This is the group that I have been frequenting the most lately, as I await my AR, so I am posting here because I know a bunch of you are level headed, and I also know the troll jerks. This just isn’t something I am up to talking about in the off-line world right now. My wife was pregnant and was not expecting until late August. We knew the baby had a heart problem, so we were going to the big research university hospital down state. She went there Thursday for a check up, and they said she had to give birth right away. On Friday morning she had a c-section, and the baby was born. I had been at the U to get my degree, and our old pastor from that town was there to baptize the baby as soon as he was born (we called the pastor), even while they were working on him, so we do know he is in heaven. He lived most of the day. They told us in the afternoon that he would not make it, and let us be with him and hold him until the end. My wife was pumped full of drugs so she could sit through all this (and I am grateful for that so she could be with him) Today there was also a bunch of running around getting a cemetery plot and a funeral arranged, so she is again straining and setting back her healing. I think after the burial it will be many weeks before she heals. She has expressed a desire to travel to: 1) Disney; 2) Sandals Caribbean resorts (we have been before); and 3) to see friends in Utah. I am very sad, but she has had times Sunday and today where she is totally devastated, like curled into a ball as much as she could with the pain and the inabliity to bring her legs up. Right now some friends and family are lining up to help her and stay over, but I would expect that to naturally trickle off. We have few friends that live in in this new city. I am worried about her just having me and very few other folks in the coming weeks. I have to work to pay for everything (med bills, funeral, travel). I can take a week this year, and two after the new next year, but that’s about it. Has anyone gone through this? What helped your wife? Is travel what she really wants? Disney scares me, because of all the kids. Should it? Should I look for a support group? My firm represents some local hospitals, and I get the impression that their support groups are more like bitch sessions. Is that helpful?
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 4:42:06 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/30/2001 4:38:25 PM EST by Shlomo]
Good lord man... I can't even pretend to offer advice on something like this. All I can do is offer my sincerest deepest sympathies... [:(]
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 4:47:12 PM EST
My condolences on the loss of your child. I have a 12yr.old girl and I can not begin to imagine the pain your wife and you are enduring. Talk with your pastor/preacher/rabbi. Do find some sort of support group. The talking will help relieve the strain. By next summer you may be 'ready' for Disneyland. Being around laughting screaming kids will, I'm sure, once again fill your hearts with what could be. God bless you in your sorrow.
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 5:04:15 PM EST
I've no children of my own, and I know it's not even close, but having held a niece who only made it a few short moments, I hurt for you. I too would be scared of Disney. The kids are a primary reason, but it's also tacky, noisy, and artificially happy all the time. It's tempting to think of it as a distraction, but going to Disney with a heavy heart sounds like a recipe for misery. Familiar is good though.
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 5:04:53 PM EST
My deepest sympathies also for the loss of your son. My sister inlaw lost two babies in birth and what helped her the most was her three sisters and her religious beliefs.
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 5:17:24 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 5:27:56 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 5:53:33 PM EST
Our faith tends to be more accepting of God's will then touchy feely about things. A lot of our religious comfort is based on the knowledge that he is in heaven now. I am going to call on some of the women in the local church body we joined, to ask them to visit and such when the friends and family peter out. I also think that the comment about the forced happiness at Disney may be on the mark. I wonder if that is what she wants at some deep internal level? Marketing is a scary thing. I know I am not rational about some of this, either. We would not allow anyone else to hold him until after the end, and then I saw that I was acting oddly in insisting that everyone had to be very very careful of his head (it was very loose on his neck after he died) when the grandparents and aunts held him. I knew I was out there in the way I was making those requests, but couldn't stop myself. I also had this intense anger on saturday when I walking to the wendys to get some solid food for my wife. It was like a lance of hate (I could feel it coming out of me, does this make sense?), and I wanted someone to look at me wrong so I could hurt them. I knew it was crazy even when I felt it. I had hurt people in the MPs for a good reason, but this was just a desire to hurt for any reason. Anyway, I am not the super calm and cool one here, but I would like some advice from someone who has been here about what is best for my wife's well being, because she seems to be worse off than I am.
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 5:54:16 PM EST
You have ny deepeste sympathy brother. The closest I have been is only as I said.....close. After trying to become pregnant for 23 months my wife finally was and we were elated. We already had names and everything picked out. Well, she had problems from the beginning and we were told she had 50/50 of carrying the baby. After 3 months there was a misscarriage. Although not as much a reality as giving birth to your own child nor as devastating as your own loss we still felt as though we had lost our child. And..........we did. We cried our eyes out.....we went through every emotion possible. We even had due dates etc etc and had told everyone. When it was all said and done we placed our faith in the Lord God. He created the life that was and he took the life that was. We comforted oursleves with the knowledge and beleif that there was a reason for this and we sadly accepted it. I know where she is right now though! I still suffer from this as well as does my wife and June 12 (due date) of each year is a sad day for us both. Holly would now have been 2 years old and even though I never held her I miss her deeply. I was a Father from the point of conception and a Father at the miscarriage. Love, attention, support and anything else your wife says she needs is best to try and do for her. My wife and I just held eachother for a whole day. My prayers are with you and your wife. I understand your loss.
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 6:01:01 PM EST
You are doing the right thing by turning to the Lord. That is the only thing that got us through our loss. No, you are not acting irrationally in my opinion. Perfectly natural as we all mourn in different ways. Eventually, your methods will turn to more personal and more inner-self related thoughts. I do think Disney would be bad in the long run and would try to avoid that. A quiet respite away from everything would probably be best. A visit to friends would be my choice as I would not feel like being in the Caribbean on such a sad note. I have fled there before after a divorce and it only made things worse as the beauty around me only reminded of the beauty I had lost. Be strong and take care of your wife!
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 6:04:51 PM EST
Thanks
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 6:13:07 PM EST
Sorry to hear the bad news Happyshooter. When I was six my mom had a baby boy who died after 5 days. He was born a week before my birthday and buried on my birthday. I am not sure how hard it was on my parents, but he was the last kid born in our family. I can remember my Dad coming home from the hospital with the news and that we went to mass that evening. That was just about exactly 30 years ago. The other sad thing is that the funeral is the last time I saw my grandmother healthy. She was soon dying from cancer and was gone in about 7 months. GunLvr
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 7:08:02 PM EST
My wife had three pregnancies that almost went to term. We found that you don't really get over it. You just eventually get tired of grieving. I know this isn't any consolation, but I've had three close relatives that had babies with heart conditions. All three lived painful lives that lasted less than 5 years. Two had transplants, and the other had multiple open heart surgeries. All three couples were left owing for hospital bills that's going to take them years to pay back. At least, your child didn't suffer long, and you'll still be able to afford to support another child, if you have the chance.
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 7:47:17 PM EST
Happyshooter - This aches my heart. I haven't lost a child like this - I can only try to imagine how it must be. When you said you could take a week off this year, there was an implication that is was because of needing the dough to pay all those bills. However if that's not the case, and they just won't let you have the time off, check this: Family and Medical Leave Act of 1993 [url]http://law.freeadvice.com/resources/gov_material/dol_family_medial_leave-act.htm[/url] You would have to check with your personnel department, legal adcvice, or possibly the U.S. Dept of Labor to see if it applies. I think it may cover more than childbirth, maybe taking care of your wife would count, too. Also there may other laws, federal or state, that apply. Good luck to you and your wife. [red][size=4]PRK[/red][/size=4]
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 8:04:47 PM EST
In July of 1997, we lost our firstborn child. He was due in August but never made it. Eventhough he had died, my wife had to go through a regular delivery. That was probably the toughest trial she, and I, have ever faced. We had found out a few months earlier that he was very sick. The ultrasound showed heart and brain problems. It also showed that he was a boy. We named him right away. From that point on, we prayed for him, that he might be healed, or if not, that we would have the strength to love him in the midst of all his problems. Mainly, we just thanked God for every day we had with him. When we first had found out that my wife was pregnant, we sat down and talked about not taking this child for granted. He was a gift from the LORD and we would be thankful for a day or a lifetime with him or her. Most people probably think that such a discussion after you find out that you are going to have a baby is a bit morbid, but we truly believed that before the world was created, God had ordained all things, including whether we got to have that child with us for a few months, a few years or until he was married and was having his own children. If I went into something which I ultimately didn't control and presumed that I did control matters, I guess I figure I was was setting myself up for disappointment. Surely if there was anything that we could have done to make it right, we would have. But when something is totally beyond your control, that just it - it's beyond you. If my wife and I are thankful for whatever the LORD Christ desires for us and our family, whether it seems good or bad at the time, we can't lose! When Stephen died before his due date, we were thankful for the 8 months we had with him, and then we knew for sure that he was just too sick to make it. My advice is trust the Lord Christ in this and every affair of life, great or small. That is the only way we came through that trial intact. (Romans 8:28 - And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.)
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 8:27:16 PM EST
I am deeply sorry for your loss. My wife had a miscarriage between the birth of our two children. I think that zoom said you don't ever really get over it, you just learn to live with it. I cannot think of anything harder than only spending a short time with your son before he went to Heaven. Your wife also has the physical aspects of childbirth and hormonal changes to deal with. If you don't have any family close by, by all means turn to your church, or any program you can find that will help you and your wife through this situation. I understand your concern for your wife's well being and it is understandable that you should be. Don't try and shoulder this burden entirely on your own, when so much help is available if only for the asking. You could probably be able to obtain some relief for the costs of funeral expenses, hospital bills, etc. if you will ask for it and hopefully you will run across some compassionate and caring persons who will make your situation bearable. I hope everything works out for you, keep us posted.
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 8:43:48 PM EST
Im 16, and in reality have no business even attempting giving advice, and haven't been exactly in your situation, but I have lost my best friend, and many close family members, and my parents divorced, in the same year. though nowhere near the pain of a losing a child (which I cant even pretend to understand) it was still difficult for me. The only thing I could do was turn to the church and to my friends. Nothing else helped me, it took my friends and the church to help me though it all. Reading these posts put tears in my eyes, god bless you all, and may god give you the strength you and your wife need. In my eyes, nothing can replace the strengh of christ, no matter what obstacle you have to overcome. Have faith in the lord, and he will help you as much as you need.
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 8:48:45 PM EST
Happyshooter, it is hard to say what the best advice is for you and your wife. I know that time is really the best healer but only if you come to terms with your grief. I lost my twin brother when we were just over one year old. He died from spinal meningitis. My dad was a doc in the army and to this day blames himself for my brother's death. He still won't see children in his practice. I think that my parent's only saving grace was that I was still on God's earth. My mom and dad did have two more boys a few years later (not twins) so I know now that they healed enough to not be afraid to try again. Keep to the faith and keep with your friends and family. I am sorry for you and your wife.
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 8:58:45 PM EST
22 years ago we lost a 4 y/o in a traffic accident. There's no pain so great as losing a child. I don't think my wife and I have ever gotten completely over it. My wife is ok but she still takes anti-depressants. It so happens that we are members of the dominant religion of Utah, so we know our child is automatically saved, even without baptism. I find you wife behavior somewhat normal. It takes time to get over these things. Your child will always be in your heart. Give your wife time. Remember when Adam and Eve fell, the rules were changed and things weren't perfect anymore. Also miscarriages and birth problems are not that uncommon. It happens more than you think.
Link Posted: 7/30/2001 9:06:51 PM EST
Happyshooter, I'm sorry to hear of your loss. I had my first son die 2 weeks before he was due (they never found out why). We had a normal birth and held him for a day before we buried him. I hav'nt, and probally never will get over it. All I can do is visit his grave so maybe he can see who his Daddy was. I bring him matchbox cars, and if no ones around I tell him things I would of liked to do with him. I try to think of it positively in that the time a infant spends in his mommys tummy is very warm and peaceful...similar to where he is now.
Link Posted: 7/31/2001 2:07:44 AM EST
Sympathies. I can't imagine what it's like. I'd suggest going to see your friends, assuming they're the supportive kind -- for me, that would help more than just "vacationing". The support group really depends on your personality and the personalities in the group you find. My experience with one was that it wasn't worthwhile, but there's no way for me to guess how you might feel about the one(s) you find.
Link Posted: 7/31/2001 3:33:29 AM EST
Oh man.......... The anger that you feel is depression, it frequently manifests itself as anger in men. I should know. In the last three years I have been in tow head-on collisions, can't work, etc. What most don't know is my 12 yr old daughter is retarded and mentally ill. We took her to a major teaching hospital, and largely due to the fact that I got in an arguement with her doctor, she was taken from us and placed in a therapuetic foster home. We also lost a child thru miscarriage, several years ago. God only knows why He does some of the things He does. I'm not going to spout Bible verses at you, I only wnat to say that loss of a child has to be the one of the hardest things to bear, with the exeption of having a child with severe mental problems. It's like going to a funeral every day. The relief to this is our little boy, a ray of sunshine if there ever was one. Most 'support grooups' are bitch sessions, and they don't change the facts. Some are run by shrinks that have an agenda, and do more harm then good. I'd talk first with your pastor, and then see what is available. Don't expect to get over this in a week or two. This will take time, and you never really get over it. You DO learn to live with it, and that takes time. I doubt that Disney is a good idea. you will need to take some time to be with your wife now, and it's not the number of friends, it's the quality. God be with both of you, I know how hard this is.
Link Posted: 7/31/2001 3:44:35 AM EST
.................... My condolences to you and your wife, the dots above I type because I was speechless at first, I cant even begin to fully understand the hardship you and your wife are going trough. Again my deepest sympathies Kuiper
Link Posted: 7/31/2001 4:44:06 AM EST
I am so sorry Happyshooter. We lost our son Jared, March 1998. She was 31 weeks along and he basiclly caught a cold. I have never gone through anything as horrible. we now help with a support group for parents that have lost a child. You do survive. There is nothing to say as each of us will deal way. I still cry, am doing it now because I of your pain, but it did get better. If you need us we are there
Link Posted: 7/31/2001 4:57:13 AM EST
My daughter was born with a hole in her heart so I can relate to that part. She lived and had surgery, everyone on here, AK-47.net, and fn-fal.com prayed for her and God has healed her and she is doing great. I could not imagine what you are going through, all I can say is find the people that love you and stay close to them. Goto church and pray. I will be praying for you. My church (800+ people) has a prayer chain, you will be remembered there also.
Link Posted: 7/31/2001 5:44:22 AM EST
You all have my deepest sympathies and prayers. I wish you both the very best.
Link Posted: 7/31/2001 6:12:39 AM EST
Well, I can't totally relate to losing a child, but I did lose my brother a few years ago and I think it is very similar. I had just turned 21 at the time and he was still 17 and was killed in a single car accident. We were very close. I can't imagine hurting any worse than that even if it was one of my own children. It has been almost 4 years now and I still get choked up sometimes from looking at pictures or just thinking about him. The hardest thing for me afterwards, was just sitting around doing nothing. I had to stay busy going out and doing stuff. Sitting around gives you a lot of time to think about things and that wasn't what I wanted to do at the time. I just wish I could have seen him one last time. He was killed almost instantly so he was there all by himself in the rain. That is one of the hardest things for me to think about. I still haven't been back to his grave since the day of the funeral, I just can't bring myself to do it yet. My suggestions would be to just try to get out a little more than you did before. If you wife wants to go to Disneyland then start planning it. There is going to be no way to get around the small child aspect, you would have to get rid of the tv, not go to the mall etc. Its just something that both of yall are going to have to accept and it might take a long time, but that is just the way it goes. It hurts really bad and there is nothing you can do about it. Just stay strong and you both will make it through this. My condolences go out to you. Michael
Link Posted: 7/31/2001 5:03:12 PM EST
Thanks. It is good to hear from some folks who had advice from experience. I just don't know ayone who had lost a child, and people don't talk much about miscarriages, which I think is pretty close. I am thinking about looking at Sandals options for pricing and such, and then bringing it up next week or the week after, depending on how she is doing. She went to the doctor, and all the running around is effecting the operation area. I really want her to stay down after the funeral tomorrow. Anyway, I was thinking about something over Thanksgiving, close enough to make plans sarting in September, but far enough away to heal 110% plus, and also so that I can take the time without losing much money. Thanks everyone.
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