Has the Army gotten rid of the "Grease Gun?"

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Has the Army gotten rid of the "Grease Gun?"

Posted: 9/25/2005 7:46:11 PM EDT

I remember seeing some paratrooper-tankers having them back in 1990. They were Sheridan crewmen from the eighty-deuce in JRTC (when it was still in AR). I admit, it was a bit surprising to see them even back then.

Were they retired shortly afterward or are they still in service?

Posted: 9/25/2005 7:50:07 PM EDT

[#1]

according to wikipedia you are correct:

It remained in limited use with US forces as a tank crew arm into the 1990s, until replaced by the M4 Carbine.

Posted: 9/25/2005 7:51:33 PM EDT

[#2]

Are you watching the History Channel right now ?

Tales of the Gun -WWII firearms porn galore. If you took a shot of liquor everytime they said "John Browning" you would be dead 30 minutes into the show

Posted: 9/25/2005 7:51:37 PM EDT

[#3]

Still in use by tankers for a close-range weapon.

Posted: 9/25/2005 7:53:00 PM EDT

[#4]

Quoted:
Still in use by tankers for a close-range weapon.

You're shittin' me. Really?

Posted: 9/25/2005 7:54:14 PM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:
Are you watching the History Channel right now ? Tales of the Gun -WWII firearms porn galore. If you took a shot of liquor everytime they said "John Browning" you would be dead 30 minutes into the show

That's what reminded me. Man-oh-man, that's some SERIOUS gun pr0n!

Posted: 9/25/2005 7:54:21 PM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:
Still in use by tankers for a close-range weapon.

I remember seeing at least one in photos from Iraq.

Posted: 9/25/2005 7:54:41 PM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Still in use by tankers for a close-range weapon.

You're shittin' me. Really?

They are not obsolete. Sure, an M4 is almost as compact and the ammo is lighter but some still like it.

And I wouldn't shit you 'cause you are my favorite turd

Posted: 9/25/2005 7:55:05 PM EDT

[#8]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Still in use by tankers for a close-range weapon.

I remember seeing at least one in photos from Iraq.

No kidding?!

Posted: 9/25/2005 7:55:29 PM EDT

[#9]

Quoted:
according to wikipedia you are correct:
It remained in limited use with US forces as a tank crew arm into the 1990s, until replaced by the M4 Carbine.

Thank you for the link, sir.

Posted: 9/25/2005 7:57:05 PM EDT

[#10]

Send an IM to Big_country_in_TX or whatever his name is. He is active duty in big tanks..

Posted: 9/25/2005 7:58:16 PM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Still in use by tankers for a close-range weapon.

You're shittin' me. Really?

They are not obsolete. Sure, an M4 is almost as compact and the ammo is lighter but some still like it.

And I wouldn't shit you 'cause you are my favorite turd

That's pretty damn cool. I hope they stay in service for a long time (the 1911 needs some competition)

Posted: 9/25/2005 8:00:29 PM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
Send an IM to Big_country_in_TX or whatever his name is. He is active duty in big tanks..

I think he's deployed again recently too.

Posted: 9/25/2005 8:03:14 PM EDT

[#13]

I always thought the grease gun was a cool lookin' sum bitch!

Posted: 9/25/2005 8:04:05 PM EDT

[#14]

John Browning --- > DRINK!!!

Posted: 9/25/2005 8:13:36 PM EDT

[#15]

The M3 is VERY obsolete. For anything beyond rock-throwing distance, it isn't worth a shit. The Army needs to shit-can it once and for all, and replace them with M4's, or at the very least, MP5's.

Posted: 9/25/2005 8:15:32 PM EDT

[#16]

Quoted:
The M3 is VERY obsolete. For anything beyond rock-throwing distance, it isn't worth a shit. The Army needs to shit-can it once and for all, and replace them with M4's, or at the very least, MP5's.

MP5s, as I understand it, are no longer in production.

UMPs perhaps?

- BG

Posted: 9/25/2005 8:20:40 PM EDT

[#17]

Quoted:
Quoted:
The M3 is VERY obsolete. For anything beyond rock-throwing distance, it isn't worth a shit. The Army needs to shit-can it once and for all, and replace them with M4's, or at the very least, MP5's.

MP5s, as I understand it, are no longer in production.

UMPs perhaps?

- BG

Even better.

Posted: 9/25/2005 8:22:10 PM EDT

[#18]

In GW1 I was with an artillery unit in the 24th ID. Some of our mechanics had M3A1s.

Posted: 9/25/2005 8:26:00 PM EDT

[#19]

Quoted:
The M3 is VERY obsolete. For anything beyond rock-throwing distance, it isn't worth a shit. The Army needs to shit-can it once and for all, and replace them with M4's, or at the very least, MP5's.

They had a feature that would allow them to fire German 9mm.

Posted: 9/25/2005 8:27:50 PM EDT

[#20]

Quoted:
In GW1 I was with an artillery unit in the 24th ID. Some of our mechanics had M3A1s.

Gun Bunny. Thanks for your service. Were you on a gun crew?

Posted: 9/25/2005 8:29:59 PM EDT

[#21]

Quoted:
The M3 is VERY obsolete. For anything beyond rock-throwing distance, it isn't worth a shit. The Army needs to shit-can it once and for all, and replace them with M4's, or at the very least, MP5's.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
Just cause it is stamped steel, 50 years old, and ugly doesn't mean its no good.
People said the same thing about the 1911, M14, et al and they have always been wrong.

Posted: 9/25/2005 8:31:48 PM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:
The M3 is VERY obsolete. For anything beyond rock-throwing distance, it isn't worth a shit. The Army needs to shit-can it once and for all, and replace them with M4's, or at the very least, MP5's.

Some tankers in the mid 90's were actuully issued MP5's prior to the adoption of the M4. Most tankers are issued M4's at this point and AFAIK from some armor friends the M3 is no longer being used, although I am sure there are plenty of M3's still in the Armories back in the states....

Posted: 9/25/2005 8:32:21 PM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:
Quoted:
The M3 is VERY obsolete. For anything beyond rock-throwing distance, it isn't worth a shit. The Army needs to shit-can it once and for all, and replace them with M4's, or at the very least, MP5's.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
Just cause it is stamped steel, 50 years old, and ugly doesn't mean its no good.
People said the same thing about the 1911, M14, et al and they have always been wrong.

That's true, but an awful lot of the M3A1's (at least those that I saw) had bores that were so worn, they were very nearly smoothbores, and there aren't many (if any) new M3 barrels to be had.

Posted: 9/25/2005 8:32:42 PM EDT

[#24]

I was armed with one in a chemical unit as late as 1993.

Posted: 9/25/2005 8:55:18 PM EDT

[#25]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The M3 is VERY obsolete. For anything beyond rock-throwing distance, it isn't worth a shit. The Army needs to shit-can it once and for all, and replace them with M4's, or at the very least, MP5's.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
Just cause it is stamped steel, 50 years old, and ugly doesn't mean its no good.
People said the same thing about the 1911, M14, et al and they have always been wrong.
That's true, but an awful lot of the M3A1's (at least those that I saw) had bores that were so worn, they were very nearly smoothbores, and there aren't many (if any) new M3 barrels to be had.

That is a LOT of use, considering the .45 ACP bore has a lifespan od something like 250,000 rounds. Or so says Kevin Thomas of Sierra Bullets. Their .45 ACP test barrel has lasted for several decades of extensive testing.

Posted: 9/25/2005 9:01:24 PM EDT

[#26]

M3s have been dead and gone for a while. I'd be surprised to see one in the most backwards ass Guard unit around.

I see DATs more often than I care too, and I doubt that most of them could even tell you what a grease gun is.

Tankers are all about M4s and M9s these days.

Posted: 9/25/2005 9:03:00 PM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The M3 is VERY obsolete. For anything beyond rock-throwing distance, it isn't worth a shit. The Army needs to shit-can it once and for all, and replace them with M4's, or at the very least, MP5's.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
Just cause it is stamped steel, 50 years old, and ugly doesn't mean its no good.
People said the same thing about the 1911, M14, et al and they have always been wrong.
That's true, but an awful lot of the M3A1's (at least those that I saw) had bores that were so worn, they were very nearly smoothbores, and there aren't many (if any) new M3 barrels to be had.

That is a LOT of use, considering the .45 ACP bore has a lifespan od something like 250,000 rounds. Or so says Kevin Thomas of Sierra Bullets. Their .45 ACP test barrel has lasted for several decades of extensive testing.

Well, look at how long the guns have been around, for one thing. Add to that the fact that units going to the range generally draw 4 times the ammo they actually need (mainly so we could go hog-assed wild with the rest, once qualifying's over with

), and it's easy to see how they would rack up an assload of ammo through them.

Posted: 9/25/2005 9:04:36 PM EDT

[#28]

back in 2000 i was in a unit that was shutting down and i got put on the detail to inventory and clean out the armory. among other forgotten treasures we found 2 NIB greaseguns. still in the foil/paper wrapping complete with the 9mm barrel assemblies.

Posted: 9/25/2005 9:12:03 PM EDT

[#29]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The M3 is VERY obsolete. For anything beyond rock-throwing distance, it isn't worth a shit. The Army needs to shit-can it once and for all, and replace them with M4's, or at the very least, MP5's.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
Just cause it is stamped steel, 50 years old, and ugly doesn't mean its no good.
People said the same thing about the 1911, M14, et al and they have always been wrong.
That's true, but an awful lot of the M3A1's (at least those that I saw) had bores that were so worn, they were very nearly smoothbores, and there aren't many (if any) new M3 barrels to be had.

That is a LOT of use, considering the .45 ACP bore has a lifespan od something like 250,000 rounds. Or so says Kevin Thomas of Sierra Bullets. Their .45 ACP test barrel has lasted for several decades of extensive testing.

That may be the lifespan of the barrel Kevin Thomas is using, but you have to remember the M3 cost something like $7.50 each, complete. That Sierra Bullet test barrel isn't having the shit abused out of it for 60 years in the Army either.

The M3 isn't the best SMG I've ever shot. It worked, and it was better than the Sten by far, but it wasn't close to the MP-40. I've shot all three, and by far the MP-40 was the best of the trio. The M3 was alot of things, but accurate isn't one of them. The bolt is WAY too heavy. Since it's open-bolt, the gun tends to jump around alot while it's firing because of the bolt mass moving around. It gave the Army the slow cyclic rate it wanted, but I would have much preferred a lighter bolt and a slightly higher rate of fire. The M3 was something like 450rpm, compared to the normal 750rpm that almost everything else that's full-auto has. Chug...chug...chug it goes, though it is a fun gun.

We bought the Grease Gun for one reason, that was cost. At 30% the cost of a pistol, it was a no-brainer to build them for WWII. We kept them for the same reason. Because it was cheaper to keep them, than buy something else because we made so many of them.

It wasn't a bad gun, but there's far better ways to go today.

Posted: 9/25/2005 9:13:44 PM EDT

[#30]

Quoted:
back in 2000 i was in a unit that was shutting down and i got put on the detail to inventory and clean out the armory. among other forgotten treasures we found 2 NIB greaseguns. still in the foil/paper wrapping complete with the 9mm barrel assemblies.

NIB greaseguns...damn. People would kill for those.

Posted: 9/25/2005 9:16:47 PM EDT

[#31]

Quoted:
back in 2000 i was in a unit that was shutting down and i got put on the detail to inventory and clean out the armory. among other forgotten treasures we found 2 NIB greaseguns. still in the foil/paper wrapping complete with the 9mm barrel assemblies.

There's an amazing amount of museum pieces hiding in plain sight all over the military. Years and years ago, they were clearing out a storage room at Naval Weapons Station Yorktown and found a crate of muzzle-loaders.

The Smithsonian lost track of the B-29 Enola Gay for something like 25 years because they had no idea where they had put it. They found it again in the late 80's boxed up in crates sitting in a wherehouse.

Hell, they've probably found and misplaced the Lost Ark five times already.

Posted: 9/25/2005 9:27:56 PM EDT

[#32]

I want one.

Posted: 9/25/2005 9:34:30 PM EDT

[#33]

I know in the '70's spec-ops had M3 or M3A1s with cans on them. A subsonic .45 trumps a subsonic 9mm.

Posted: 9/25/2005 9:39:20 PM EDT

[#34]

that what delta used before they got MP5s, said it was unbeatable silenced.

Posted: 9/25/2005 9:42:50 PM EDT

[#35]

As a Navy buddy of mine was issued a XM-16A1 (guard duty in the rear) last year NOTHING would surprise me.

Posted: 9/25/2005 9:52:46 PM EDT

[#36]

Quoted:
that what delta used before they got MP5s, said it was unbeatable silenced.

Well there ya go

Posted: 9/25/2005 10:05:16 PM EDT

[#37]

Quoted:
that what delta used before they got MP5s, said it was unbeatable silenced.

Don't even have to change ammo to silence the ole .45acp round.....

Kewl.

Ok, have to add it to the list of must haves..

Posted: 9/25/2005 10:22:33 PM EDT

[#38]

Quoted:
that what delta used before they got MP5s, said it was unbeatable silenced.

Aren't you 11?

Posted: 9/25/2005 10:55:03 PM EDT

[#39]

Quoted:
Quoted:
back in 2000 i was in a unit that was shutting down and i got put on the detail to inventory and clean out the armory. among other forgotten treasures we found 2 NIB greaseguns. still in the foil/paper wrapping complete with the 9mm barrel assemblies.

There's an amazing amount of museum pieces hiding in plain sight all over the military. Years and years ago, they were clearing out a storage room at Naval Weapons Station Yorktown and found a crate of muzzle-loaders.

The Smithsonian lost track of the B-29 Enola Gay for something like 25 years because they had no idea where they had put it. They found it again in the late 80's boxed up in crates sitting in a wherehouse.

Hell, they've probably found and misplaced the Lost Ark five times already.

Somebody's obviously seen Raiders of the Lost Ark recently.

Heck, the army's misplaced entire BASES. Back in the 50's they buried a bunch of army bases across the U.S., along with stockpiles of tanks, jeeps, and weapons. They kept people employed for a while doing all the burying and figured if another war came up they could just unbury their "secret stockpiles". Unfortunately, since a lot of those bases were makeshift ones made solely for WWII, many weren't on the map and several were actually lost entirely.

One guy, while hunting, found a blob of cosmoline the size of a basketball and took it home. When he got it broken up, there seven 1911's inside. He went back to the area on a second hunting trip and photographed a tank eroding out of a creek bed.

Unfortunately, he was killed in a car accident on the way home from the second trip, and he never told anybody where he hunted.

Posted: 9/25/2005 10:55:19 PM EDT

[#40]

Quoted:
M3s have been dead and gone for a while.

June 2005...not me btw.

Posted: 9/25/2005 11:39:54 PM EDT

[#41]

Quoted:
Quoted:
In GW1 I was with an artillery unit in the 24th ID. Some of our mechanics had M3A1s.

Gun Bunny. Thanks for your service. ----Thank you!---- Were you on a gun crew?

Nope, not a gun bunny. I was an 82C. I gave the gun crews position and azimuth via sixteen digit grid coordinate. Fun job but it's been phased out by GPS capable Paladins.

Posted: 9/26/2005 5:27:34 AM EDT

[#42]

Quoted:
Quoted:
M3s have been dead and gone for a while.

June 2005...not me btw.

tinypic.com/dzuvdz.jpg

Where did they find that?!

By all published sources FightingHellfish is right. The M3 has been "officially" gone since 1996. Where did that guy get one nine years later!

Posted: 9/26/2005 5:37:47 AM EDT

[#43]

Quoted:
I know in the '70's spec-ops had M3 or M3A1s with cans on them. A subsonic .45 trumps a subsonic 9mm.

Those were leftovers from WWII. The Grease Gun was built in a silenced version for the OSS in .45 and 9mm. Some of the silenced 9mms were the only Grease Guns in that caliber actually known to have seen combat- most of the other 9mm kits never left store, after Normandy the need for a gun that could use captured German ammo dropped greatly, and the Japanese didn't use 9mm Para.

And yes the Silenced M3 in .45 worked without special ammo. But they were still replaced by the MP5SD in the early 80s in the Army, though the USMC Force Recon and the MEU/SOCs had some untill the early 90s till they finally got MP5N's with cans off of the USN. (SEALs for some reason preferred the MP5N with a detachable can while the Army SF preferred the integrally suppressed MP5SD)

Considering the age in which it was made the silenced barrel on the suppressed M3 was quite effective. But it beng a .45 did not make up for terrible sights and a horrid stock design and a total inability to mount anything better on them without a total redesign of the gun.

Posted: 9/26/2005 5:40:04 AM EDT

[#44]

NG Mech inf unit I inventoried out of Paris Texas has one in the armory. (along with over a hundred mags and an entire box of cleaning rods) I have no idea why. . [%|

Posted: 9/26/2005 5:43:11 AM EDT

[#45]

I had to qualify with the grease gun. Qualification was no more than familiarization. In other words, you did not have to hit the target to complete the lane. I watched the grease gun be taken from our MTOE and to be shipped off, to where I cannot say. I can say we have quantities of the weapon althought they are not issued to troops as part of a regular MTOE. rather special purpose as needed, sorry, that's all I can tell ya.

Posted: 9/26/2005 5:46:03 AM EDT

[#46]

Quoted:
[
Where did they find that?!

By all published sources FightingHellfish is right. The M3 has been "officially" gone since 1996. Where did that guy get one nine years later!

In the early 70s I ran an arms room for an ARTY battery. You'd be astonished at the shit that was still floating around. We had a guy that owned an '03 Springfield privately. One day he said he needed some small part, so I gave the Maintainance Bn guys a jingle.

The next day a Staff Sergeant I knew there called me back.

Bingo.

Think about that. We were an M16 army, had been through the Garand and the m14. The Springfield had been declared obselete decades beforehand and yet, there were still aprts floating around the system.

I asked him sarcastically if he could drum up a part for a .30/40 Krag and he seriously said that if he worked on it he could probably find a part for a .45/70 somewhere.

I shook my head.

Posted: 9/26/2005 5:53:12 AM EDT

[#47]

John Browning would be a criminal today. There is no room for machinegun developers that aren't on the .gov payroll.

Posted: 9/26/2005 7:57:26 AM EDT

[#48]

Quoted:
sorry, that's all I can tell ya.

I understand. You don't want to have to kill me.

Posted: 9/26/2005 8:13:15 AM EDT

[#49]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
back in 2000 i was in a unit that was shutting down and i got put on the detail to inventory and clean out the armory. among other forgotten treasures we found 2 NIB greaseguns. still in the foil/paper wrapping complete with the 9mm barrel assemblies.

There's an amazing amount of museum pieces hiding in plain sight all over the military. Years and years ago, they were clearing out a storage room at Naval Weapons Station Yorktown and found a crate of muzzle-loaders.

The Smithsonian lost track of the B-29 Enola Gay for something like 25 years because they had no idea where they had put it. They found it again in the late 80's boxed up in crates sitting in a wherehouse.

Hell, they've probably found and misplaced the Lost Ark five times already.

Somebody's obviously seen Raiders of the Lost Ark recently.

Heck, the army's misplaced entire BASES. Back in the 50's they buried a bunch of army bases across the U.S., along with stockpiles of tanks, jeeps, and weapons. They kept people employed for a while doing all the burying and figured if another war came up they could just unbury their "secret stockpiles". Unfortunately, since a lot of those bases were makeshift ones made solely for WWII, many weren't on the map and several were actually lost entirely.

One guy, while hunting, found a blob of cosmoline the size of a basketball and took it home. When he got it broken up, there seven 1911's inside. He went back to the area on a second hunting trip and photographed a tank eroding out of a creek bed.

Unfortunately, he was killed in a car accident on the way home from the second trip, and he never told anybody where he hunted.

Coincidence? I think not.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Has the Army gotten rid of the "Grease Gun?"

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