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9/19/2017 7:27:10 PM
Posted: 4/11/2006 4:22:50 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/11/2006 4:49:18 PM EDT by thompsondd]
www.numbersusa.com/interests/amnesty.html


No. 1- Immigration Reform and Control Act Amnesty of 1986:
The Immigration Reform and Control Act of 1986 (IRCA) was enacted by Congress in response to the large and rapidly growing illegal alien population in the United States. The final bill was the result of a dramatic compromise between those who wanted to reduce illegal immigration into the United States and those who wanted to "wipe the slate clean" for those illegals already living here by granting them legal residence. As enacted, IRCA included a massive amnesty program for two main categories of illegal aliens:

1) those who could show that they had resided illegally in the United States continuously since at least January 1, 1982; and

2) those who had worked as agricultural workers for at least 90 days between May 1, 1985 and May 1, 1986.

As a "balance" to this huge amnesty, IRCA also included several provisions designed to: strengthen the enforcement of immigration laws (including sanctions for employers who knowingly hire illegal aliens); increase border controls; and create a program to verify the immigration status of aliens applying for certain welfare benefits.

The IRCA amnesty has been tied to terrorism. Mahmud Abouhalima, a leader of the 1993 World Trade Center bombing, was legalized as a seasonal agricultural worker as part of the 1986 IRCA amnesty. This allowed him to travel abroad, including several trips to Afghanistan, where he received terrorist training.

NOTE: In the 1990 Immigration Act, an additional 160,000 spouses and minor children of aliens amnestied under IRCA were granted amnesty as well. These 160,000 aliens are not included in the total numeric impact of the amnesty.

In addition, another 350,000 illegal aliens who were initially disqualified from the 1986 IRCA amnesty because they had traveled abroad while in the U.S. illegally may qualify for amnesty under proposed settlements in lawsuits resulting after the 1986 amnesty.

The 10-year impact of both the SAW and general amnesty in the Immigration Reform and Control Act was 2,684,892. For the computation of the total number of immigrants to be added by this amnesty, click here.

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No. 2 - Section 245(i) Amnesty of 1994
Section 245(i) was added to immigration law when Congress passed this de facto amnesty as part of the FY 1995 Commerce, Justice, State Appropriations bill. Section 245(i) went into effect at the beginning of FY 1995 and was scheduled to sunset at the end of FY 1997 (Sep. 30, 1997).

In nearly all cases, a person must be an illegal alien to benefit from Section 245(i). There are two major kinds of illegal aliens who benefit: (1) Those who entered the country illegally. (2) Those who entered legally on visas but then violated the terms of their visa. Read what Section 245(i) actually does.

The INS estimates that at the end of FY 1997, Section 245(i) applications had resulted in an increase of 578,000 in the adjustment of status application backlog. This does not include Section 245(i) applicants whose status had already been adjusted as the INS does not track that separately.

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No. 3 - Section 245(i) Extension Amnesty of 1997
President Clinton twice signed continuing resolutions to extend the September 30, 1997 expiration date of Section 245(i). The first continuing resolution extended the deadline until October 23, 1997 and the second continuing resolution extended Section 245(i) until November 7, 1997. Section 245(i) was then further extended until January 14, 1998 by Congress as part of the conference report to H.R. 2267.

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No. 4 - NACARA Amnesty of 1997
The Nicaraguan Adjustment and Central American Relief Act (NACARA) is an amnesty program for certain Nicaraguans and Cubans, and a de facto amnesty for certain Salvadorans, Guatemalans and Eastern Europeans.

The original bills that were introduced in the House and the Senate, H.R. 2302 and S. 1976, would have benefited only certain Nicaraguans, Salvadorans and Guatemalans. Cubans and Eastern Europeans were added later to mollify the anti-Communist sentiments of some members of Congress. At the same time, opponents of the amnesty tried to negotiate a requirement that the number of aliens granted legal residence under NACARA be subtracted from legal immigration ceilings, but managed only to secure minor reductions in the unskilled worker and lottery categories. In order to avoid lengthy debate on the costs and benefits of the amnesty and to ensure adequate support for it, the bill language was added as an amendment to the appropriations bill for the District of Columbia (H.R. 2607) and passed as part of that bill.

Nicaraguans and Cubans who have lived in the United States illegally since 1995, along with their spouses and unmarried children, were automatically granted legal resident status under NACARA, as long as they apply by April 1, 2000.

The 10-year impact of the NACARA Amnesty on U.S. population growth is estimated to be 966,480. For the computation of the total number of immigrants to be added by this amnesty, click here.

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No. 5 - HRIFA Amnesty of 1998
The Haitian Refugee Immigration Fairness Act (HRIFA) is an amnesty program for Haitians. It was passed in the aftermath of the Nicaraguan Adjustment and Central American Relief Act (NACARA), when representatives of a long list of nationalities not included in NACARA claimed that it was discriminatory to refuse them the same special treatment. Haitians are the first group to succeed with this claim. As with NACARA, proponents of HRIFA sought to avoid a full congressional debate of the bill and so added it as an amendment to the omnibus appropriations bill for fiscal year 1999 (H.R. 4328), which was passed by both houses of Congress.

HRIFA grants permanent resident status to any Haitians who have been in the United States since December 1995, along with their spouses and children, as long as they apply before April 1, 2000. Haitians granted amnesty under HRIFA will not be counted against legal immigration ceilings, and no legal immigration ceilings will be reduced to make up for the extra number of permanent immigrants.





Another perfect example of the effectiveness of the gubernment!!! Yeah, that really fixed the f&*^%$#! problem didn't it guys!!!! Why don't you guys quit doing lip service up there and actually start dealing with problems rather than the damned symptoms.



From Boortz today: boortz.com/

Fifteen million illegals enter the country. Then we have an amnesty agreement from Washington. Nothing is done to control the borders. Another 11 to 12 million illegals cross, expecting history to repeat itself. History then repeats itself. Again, nothing is done to close the border. What do you expect the outcome to be?

OK .. just for the sake of argument, let's just imagine for a moment that they get their way. Let's just go ahead and grant all 12 million illegal aliens in this country permission to stay here. Green cards for all! What do you think would happen?

Those 12 million would not just live happily ever after. No, those 12 million would get on the horn and start calling all of their friends in Mexico...and 12 million more would stream across the border. The invasion would become even more brisk. The point here is that our first job is to close the borders. Walls, troops ... whatever it takes, close the borders. Then we can start talking about what to do with the illegals already here.

We have a 2,000 mile long border with Mexico...that is largely unguarded. We could secure it, yet we choose not to. Why? Because politicians don't want to. They're either in the pocket of business that wants to maintain the free flow of cheap labor, or are trolling for votes in the Hispanic community.

At the end of the day, if nothing is done about illegal immigration, more and more are going to keep coming and coming. How much is enough? How much before we stand up and stop the madness?

You are watching our country undergoing a profound change ... a change that will be very costly. Our elected officials lack the political will to do anything about it.


If we give any kind of amnesty (which I totally oppose) without including some form of complete and comprehensive border control, we are doomed to see this happen AGAIN AND AGAIN.

Link Posted: 4/11/2006 4:23:59 PM EDT
SHHH!!! these illegals are fighting for their RIGHTS that have been denied to them for so long...
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 4:28:37 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Napoleon_Tanerite:
SHHH!!! these illegals are fighting for their RIGHTS that have been denied to them for so long...



Yeah yeah, I know. And all the white people owe all black people money for the work the slaves did that they never got paid for.
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 4:33:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/11/2006 4:33:20 PM EDT by azhammer]

Originally Posted By thompsondd:

Originally Posted By Napoleon_Tanerite:
SHHH!!! these illegals are fighting for their RIGHTS that have been denied to them for so long...



Yeah yeah, I know. And all the white people owe all black people money for the work the slaves did that they never got paid for.



They didnt get paid?!........But where did they live ......and what did they eat?
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 4:37:16 PM EDT
They are fucking racists. Every country in the world has immigration laws. What they are arguing is that they should have preference in emigrating over someone from South Africa, for example, simply because they are Mexican (Aztlan and all that bullshit).

So yes, they are correct and it IS about race, but THEY are the ones making it about race, and feel that they should be able to come here en masse without the controls that apply to others. They might as well be the KKK.

Link Posted: 4/11/2006 4:59:19 PM EDT
No enforcement of present laws, no potential for enforcement of any new BS they pass. No borders. No controls.

Basically, benefits and voting to anyone who shows up.

Link Posted: 4/11/2006 5:03:49 PM EDT
FNC had a good piece about Mexico deporting illegals in their country immediately. Does Mexico give USA gringo illegals a free education in 'English'? Or welfare, healthcare or anything? Nope...
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 5:10:37 PM EDT
And, is mexico planning to have an amnesty for American Nationals anytime soon?

MILITARIZE THE DAMN BORDER ALREADY
STOP ALL WELFARE PAYMENTS TO ILLEGALS
NO CITIZENSHIP FOR CHILDREN OF ILLEGALS
ALL ILLEGALS ARE CRIMINALS, DEPORT THEM ALL
STOP SPITTING ON OUR COUNTRY AND CONSTITUTION
ENFORCE OUR COUNTRY'S LAWS AGAINST ILLEGALS
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 5:31:52 PM EDT
For fear of being crucified, I am going to go out on a limb here and make a few statements, take them for what you will.

1. Economic: I live in Houston. Here, almost 100% of the manual labor is done by hispanic immigrants, most of them illegal. If you have a house built, it will be by illegals more than likely. They are the cogs that keep our city moving and without them our economy would suffer majorly; I would even go as far as to say the help they give the economy outweighs any cost they present. They pay sales taxes, and they don't take jobs away from Americans because the jobs they do most Americans don't want. Newsflash- they don't come over to hop onto welfare, they get fake social security numbers and pay taxes through those. They come over to work because they are in demand as manual laborers and make alot more than they ever could in Mexico. My friend at school's mom and dad can eat back in Mexico because he lives with his uncle and they send money back to his family. Every person we have ever employed at my house is no drain to the economy; they make little money and pay sales tax on everything they buy, even if they don't have fake social security numbers.

2. Military: Our military force is comprised of MANY Mexicans who are either the sons of immigrants or immigrants themselves. Cutting off the flow of immigrants will also lower the pool of possible future soldiers, who fight hard and tough because believe it or not alot of mexican culture is based on being macho, as well as christianity. Just look at how many hispanics join the Marines; it's because the Navy, Airforce, and Army have too many women to be "macho" enough for them. If you ask me more legal Americans could have that attitude as well. I would rather deport the san francisco liberals than any hardworking illegal any day. (I know, I will be in the Army, but I think they are both macho he
3. My plan: Make everyone become a loyal, legal American, but don't make it impossible. Require english lessons and a test on our history (which unfortunately most legal Americans are too stupid to pass anyways), and give them social security numbers so you can stop whining about them "not paying taxes" despite the fact they pay more in sales taxes then they probably would on income tax because they don't make much anyways, it's just proportionately more than they would make in Mexico so they are happy as hell.

This way, we encourage immigration and also make them Americans, not just Mexicans visiting and "exploiting" the system as alot of you seem to think. Remember, we are all immigrants in this country, and it would be selfish to say "We are here and we don't want to let anyone else in to the land of opportunity...we want to hog it all for ourselves!". That is all it really sounds like at the bottom of all this bickering, at least to me.

*By the way I am a republican, but I see this as an ethical issue and actually support any side that can see the true American way that we seem to have lost sight of.
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 5:40:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/11/2006 5:41:31 PM EDT by 82ndAbn]
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 5:43:51 PM EDT

Originally Posted By 22bad:
And, is mexico planning to have an amnesty for American Nationals anytime soon?

MILITARIZE THE DAMN BORDER ALREADY
STOP ALL WELFARE PAYMENTS TO ILLEGALS
NO CITIZENSHIP FOR CHILDREN OF ILLEGALS
ALL ILLEGALS ARE CRIMINALS, DEPORT THEM ALL
STOP SPITTING ON OUR COUNTRY AND CONSTITUTION
ENFORCE OUR COUNTRY'S LAWS AGAINST ILLEGALS



22bad for PREZ!!!!
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 5:47:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/11/2006 5:51:49 PM EDT by 22bad]

Originally Posted By WestPointCadet:
For fear of being crucified, I am going to go out on a limb here and make a few statements, take them for what you will.

1. Economic: I live in Houston. Here, almost 100% of the manual labor is done by hispanic immigrants, most of them illegal. If you have a house built, it will be by illegals more than likely. They are the cogs that keep our city moving and without them our economy would suffer majorly; I would even go as far as to say the help they give the economy outweighs any cost they present. They pay sales taxes, and they don't take jobs away from Americans because the jobs they do most Americans don't want. Newsflash- they don't come over to hop onto welfare, they get fake social security numbers and pay taxes through those. They come over to work because they are in demand as manual laborers and make alot more than they ever could in Mexico. My friend at school's mom and dad can eat back in Mexico because he lives with his uncle and they send money back to his family. Every person we have ever employed at my house is no drain to the economy; they make little money and pay sales tax on everything they buy, even if they don't have fake social security numbers.

2. Military: Our military force is comprised of MANY Mexicans who are either the sons of immigrants or immigrants themselves. Cutting off the flow of immigrants will also lower the pool of possible future soldiers, who fight hard and tough because believe it or not alot of mexican culture is based on being macho, as well as christianity. Just look at how many hispanics join the Marines; it's because the Navy, Airforce, and Army have too many women to be "macho" enough for them. If you ask me more legal Americans could have that attitude as well. I would rather deport the san francisco liberals than any hardworking illegal any day. (I know, I will be in the Army, but I think they are both macho ) The more enthusiastic soldiers we have, the better, and when you have people migrateing to your country willing to fight in your military just because the macho blood in their veins and love of their new homeland, it would be foolish to cut them off and kick them out.

3. My plan: Make everyone become a loyal, legal American, but don't make it impossible. Require english lessons and a test on our history (which unfortunately most legal Americans are too stupid to pass anyways), and give them social security numbers so you can stop whining about them "not paying taxes" despite the fact they pay more in sales taxes then they probably would on income tax because they don't make much anyways, it's just proportionately more than they would make in Mexico so they are happy as hell.

This way, we encourage immigration and also make them Americans, not just Mexicans visiting and "exploiting" the system as alot of you seem to think. Remember, we are all immigrants in this country, and it would be selfish to say "We are here and we don't want to let anyone else in to the land of opportunity...we want to hog it all for ourselves!". That is all it really sounds like at the bottom of all this bickering, at least to me.

*By the way I am a republican, but I see this as an ethical issue and actually support any side that can see the true American way that we seem to have lost sight of.



Not going to crucify you, but I want to make sure you know TWO things

ONE- There is absolutely NOTHING similar or the same with the two COMPLETELY different concepts of "immigrant" and "illegals"
NOTHING..............illegals are NOT immigrants, just ask an immigrant

TWO- I don't know who told you the lies about them not being a drain on our economy or NOT taking jobs Americans want
(or NOT coming here to JUMP on welfare)
Go to a local school, hospital or jail. Ask THEM who is causing the most problems for them
After they tell you that it is the illegals THEN think about who is paying the bills for the illegals
Whatever you do, don't bet anyone about the illegals not taking jobs that Americans want, you will lose

AND FOR PETE'S SAKE, THEY DON'T PAY TAXES, ALMOST ALL OF THEM ARE INDEPENDENT CONTRACTORS
THAT MEANS THAT THEY DON'T HAVE ANY WITHHOLDING TAKEN OUT OF THEIR CHECKS
AND THEY SURE DON'T FILE A RETURN AT THE END OF THE YEAR TO PAY THEM
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 5:51:39 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/11/2006 5:56:09 PM EDT by AR-10]

Originally Posted By WestPointCadet:

This way, we encourage immigration and also make them Americans, not just Mexicans visiting and "exploiting" the system as alot of you seem to think. Remember, we are all immigrants in this country, and it would be selfish to say "We are here and we don't want to let anyone else in to the land of opportunity...we want to hog it all for ourselves!". That is all it really sounds like at the bottom of all this bickering, at least to me.

*By the way I am a republican, but I see this as an ethical issue and actually support any side that can see the true American way that we seem to have lost sight of.





There is one little detail you are overlooking here...REALITY.



Here in The Sticks, we are being outnumbered, and they aren't all paying their own way. My county is dropping an assload of taxpayer money on education, health care, and housing. Want to know how much it costs to have an interpreter at every hospital,grade school, high school, bank, etc.? See above reference to assload.

And here's a newsflash for you. They are taking jobs away from needy white folk, like me.
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 5:56:25 PM EDT

Originally Posted By 22bad:
And, is mexico planning to have an amnesty for American Nationals anytime soon?

MILITARIZE THE DAMN BORDER ALREADY
STOP ALL WELFARE PAYMENTS TO ILLEGALS
NO CITIZENSHIP FOR CHILDREN OF ILLEGALS
ALL ILLEGALS ARE CRIMINALS, DEPORT THEM ALL
STOP SPITTING ON OUR COUNTRY AND CONSTITUTION
ENFORCE OUR COUNTRY'S LAWS AGAINST ILLEGALS



NO NO NO NO NO!!!

All of that requires spine and integrity.

It's much easier to cave in to foreigners than to look out for your own countrymen and stand by your oath of office.
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 5:57:18 PM EDT
About 80% of the drug and alien smugglers I apprehended on the Southern Border were amnesty holders from 1986.
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 5:59:19 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BlueEyedEvil:

Originally Posted By 22bad:
And, is mexico planning to have an amnesty for American Nationals anytime soon?

MILITARIZE THE DAMN BORDER ALREADY
STOP ALL WELFARE PAYMENTS TO ILLEGALS
NO CITIZENSHIP FOR CHILDREN OF ILLEGALS
ALL ILLEGALS ARE CRIMINALS, DEPORT THEM ALL
STOP SPITTING ON OUR COUNTRY AND CONSTITUTION
ENFORCE OUR COUNTRY'S LAWS AGAINST ILLEGALS



22bad for PREZ!!!!



It WOULD be an improvement
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 5:59:53 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AR-10:

Originally Posted By WestPointCadet:

This way, we encourage immigration and also make them Americans, not just Mexicans visiting and "exploiting" the system as alot of you seem to think. Remember, we are all immigrants in this country, and it would be selfish to say "We are here and we don't want to let anyone else in to the land of opportunity...we want to hog it all for ourselves!". That is all it really sounds like at the bottom of all this bickering, at least to me.

*By the way I am a republican, but I see this as an ethical issue and actually support any side that can see the true American way that we seem to have lost sight of.





There is one little detail you are overlooking here...REALITY.



Here in The Sticks, we are being outnumbered, and they aren't all paying their own way. My county is dropping an assload of taxpayer money on education, health care, and housing. Want to know how much it costs to have an interpreter at every hospital,grade school, high school, bank, etc.? See above reference to assload.

And here's a newsflash for you. They are taking jobs away from needy white folk, like me.



I respectfully disagree, both with you and 22bad because in my opinion, from what I have seen, the benefits they offer here do more for our country than detract from it.

BTW- IF they were made legal and forced to pay taxes like everyone else, where would the problem be? Then they would be pulling their own weight without question.
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:00:24 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:01:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By boltmaster:

Originally Posted By 22bad:
And, is mexico planning to have an amnesty for American Nationals anytime soon?

MILITARIZE THE DAMN BORDER ALREADY
STOP ALL WELFARE PAYMENTS TO ILLEGALS
NO CITIZENSHIP FOR CHILDREN OF ILLEGALS
ALL ILLEGALS ARE CRIMINALS, DEPORT THEM ALL
STOP SPITTING ON OUR COUNTRY AND CONSTITUTION
ENFORCE OUR COUNTRY'S LAWS AGAINST ILLEGALS



NO NO NO NO NO!!!

All of that requires spine and integrity.

It's much easier to cave in to foreigners than to look out for your own countrymen and stand by your oath of office.



All it would take would be an executive order nullifying "special order 40" and some comment
like: we appreciate our friends and neighbors from the south, but we have to secure our border
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:03:25 PM EDT
Hay, Your violating their rights to suck on the nipple of the USA
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:05:34 PM EDT
They are a slap in the face of every person who ever imigrated here legally.

I know, I've heard a few pissed off old Germans discuss the issue.

They are breaking the law.

There are reasons we have imigration quotas. There are other requirements as well, like taking a written test in english to express your knowledge of American history and the Constitution.

The reason for stuff like that is so they are not a burden on society.
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:08:12 PM EDT

Originally Posted By WestPointCadet:

Originally Posted By AR-10:

Originally Posted By WestPointCadet:

This way, we encourage immigration and also make them Americans, not just Mexicans visiting and "exploiting" the system as alot of you seem to think. Remember, we are all immigrants in this country, and it would be selfish to say "We are here and we don't want to let anyone else in to the land of opportunity...we want to hog it all for ourselves!". That is all it really sounds like at the bottom of all this bickering, at least to me.

*By the way I am a republican, but I see this as an ethical issue and actually support any side that can see the true American way that we seem to have lost sight of.





There is one little detail you are overlooking here...REALITY.



Here in The Sticks, we are being outnumbered, and they aren't all paying their own way. My county is dropping an assload of taxpayer money on education, health care, and housing. Want to know how much it costs to have an interpreter at every hospital,grade school, high school, bank, etc.? See above reference to assload.

And here's a newsflash for you. They are taking jobs away from needy white folk, like me.



I respectfully disagree, both with you and 22bad because in my opinion, from what I have seen, the benefits they offer here do more for our country than detract from it.

BTW- IF they were made legal and forced to pay taxes like everyone else, where would the problem be? Then they would be pulling their own weight without question.



It's so hard to teach ethics "long distance"

Do you think that they are criminals for entering the country illegally?
Do you know what people that enter legally have to go through?
Do you know that they have to go through it for YOUR safety(and mine)?

Do you think that someone that commits a crime is a problem?
Lets say that you know a bank robber, he has always been nice to you
but, in his last robbery he killed a bank teller.......is he just misunderstood
or, is he a menace to society?

They could NEVER pull their weight "expense wise" the costs of illegals runs into the BILLIONS
Thats TENS OF BILLIONS EVERY FRIGGIN YEAR, THEY DON'T CONTRIBUTE HALF THAT MUCH
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:09:39 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/11/2006 6:14:41 PM EDT by thompsondd]

Originally Posted By WestPointCadet:


I respectfully disagree, both with you and 22bad because in my opinion, from what I have seen, the benefits they offer here do more for our country than detract from it.

BTW- IF they were made legal and forced to pay taxes like everyone else, where would the problem be? Then they would be pulling their own weight without question.



Man, I guess those stone walls at Hudson High have gotten so thick that they are keeping you from seeing out. Do they even teach Econ 101 up there anymore?

www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalconclusion.html


It is often suggested that "matching a willing worker with a willing employer" is all that matters when it comes to immigration policy. The fiscal costs of illegal immigration indicate that focusing only on workers and employers is grossly inadequate. If the presence of large numbers of unskilled workers lowers prices for some goods and services, but at the same time increases the burden on taxpayers, then this may not be a good deal for the country. Put simply, the mere fact that employers want more workers, and foreigners wish to work in this country, does not mean that Americans necessarily benefit from their coming. This fact must be considered when formulating policy.

Low Levels of Education Create Deficit. The findings of this study show that the primary reason illegal households create a fiscal deficit at the federal level is that their much lower levels of education result in low incomes and tax payments that are only 28 percent that of other households. Thus, even though the costs they impose are estimated to be only 46 percent those of other households on average, there remains a significant net deficit. Whether one considers their use of services low is a matter of perspective. Because illegals are not even supposed to be in the country, many Americans are angered by the fact that they receive any services at all. This is especially true of transfers to households like food stamps or cash payments from the Child Tax Credit. Although many Americans are upset about their use of public services, there is little evidence that illegals come to America to take advantage of public benefits. Most illegal aliens come for jobs, and the vast majority are in fact employed. But low levels of education mean they unavoidably create large costs for taxpayers.

As Long as Illegals Remain, So Will Costs. The relatively low receipt of services by illegals is important from a policy perspective because it means that the amount of money that can be saved by further efforts to curtail their use of public services is probably very limited. As already discussed, the average illegal household is estimated to receives less than half as much in services from the federal government as do other households, even though their households are 17 percent larger on average. This, coupled with the fact that benefits are often received on behalf of their U.S.-born children who are awarded citizenship at birth under current law, means that it is very difficult to avoid many of the costs as long as the illegal aliens remain in the country. In addition, if they are allowed to stay, most of the costs they impose will be for programs whose use is difficult to prevent politically or as a practical matter. For example, denying illegals benefits such as the Women, Infants, and Children nutrition program might encounter significant political opposition. And incarcerating illegals who have been convicted of crimes is an unavoidable cost of having a large illegal population. Thus, if we want to avoid the costs, we must look to alternatives other than trying to cut them off from public services.

Amnesty Would Dramatically Increase Costs. One of the key findings of this report is that legalization would dramatically increase the costs of illegal immigration. If illegals were given green cards and began to pay taxes and use services like legal immigrants with the same education levels, the net annual fiscal deficit at the federal level would likely increase from $2,736 to $7,668 per household under the most likely scenario. Total costs could grow from $10.4 billion a year to $28.8 billion. The costs increase dramatically because unskilled immigrants with legal status, which is what most illegal aliens would become, can access government programs but still tend to make very modest tax payments. This is because the modern American economy offers very limited opportunities to those with little education, regardless of legal status. Though we estimate that household income might rise by 15 percent with legalization and average tax payments would increase by 77 percent as more illegals would be paid off the books, their average household incomes would still remain one-third below that of other households. At the same time, service use would rise dramatically because legal immigrants are eligible for most programs, and they typically have much less fear about using them than illegal aliens. This does not mean that low-income legal immigrants use more in services than low-income native-born Americans. The fiscal deficit is created by the fact that so many illegal aliens are unskilled and thus have low income.

What's Different About Today's Immigration. Many native-born Americans observe that their ancestors came to America and did not place great demands on government services. Perhaps this is true, but the size and scope of government was dramatically smaller during the last great wave of immigration -- not just means-tested programs, but expenditures on public schools and roads were only a fraction what they are today. Thus the arrival of unskilled immigrants in the past did not have the negative fiscal implications that it has today. Moreover, the American economy has changed profoundly since the last great wave of immigration, with education now the key determinant of economic success. The costs that unskilled immigrants, or unskilled natives for that matter, impose should not be seen so much as a failings on their part, but instead as a reflection of the nature of the modern American economy. Put simply, large-scale unskilled immigration is incompatible with current economic conditions and an extensive welfare state. If the fiscal costs are to be avoided, then our immigration policies need to reflect current fiscal and economic realities and the number of unskilled immigrants, legal or illegal, should be reduced.

The Bottom Line. This report has focused on only the fiscal impact of illegal aliens at the federal level. It is almost certain that they also create a large fiscal deficit at the state and local levels.36 Thus, the results in this report only deal with part of the costs of illegal immigration. On the other hand, it must be remembered that this report says nothing about the overall fiscal impact of households headed by legal immigrants. The fact that unskilled immigrants who are legal residents impose large fiscal costs on federal coffers does not mean that legal immigrants overall are a drain on federal coffers. Many legal immigrants are highly skilled. That having been said, we find strong and convincing evidence that the costs of illegal immigration are significant at the federal level and those costs would grow dramatically if illegals were legalized. Of course, there are many other issues to consider when deciding what do to about illegal immigration. But given the costs of illegal aliens and of any amnesty, it would probably make more sense to enforce immigration laws and reduce illegal immigration. Reducing the supply of unskilled labor would force employers to increase wages and invest in labor-saving devices in order to meet their labor needs.

If we instead chose to increase the number of unskilled workers in the country through immigration, then we at least have to understand that such a policy has negative fiscal consequences. Perhaps legalizing illegal aliens may be justified on humanitarian grounds, or as a way to improve relations with other countries. Conversely, enforcement might make more sense because it reduces job competition for unskilled Americans, or for national security reasons. But this analysis shows that, at least with regard to the federal budget, there is a high cost to unskilled illegal alien labor and this must be part of any policy discussion.



Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:12:52 PM EDT

And here's a newsflash for you. They are taking jobs away from needy white folk, like me.


They arent taking my Job. Just lowering the pay for it.
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:13:44 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AR-10:
They are a slap in the face of every person who ever imigrated here legally.

I know, I've heard a few pissed off old Germans discuss the issue.

They are breaking the law.

There are reasons we have imigration quotas. There are other requirements as well, like taking a written test in english to express your knowledge of American history and the Constitution.

The reason for stuff like that is so they are not a burden on society.



+1 - well put
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:16:50 PM EDT

Originally Posted By 82ndAbn:

Originally Posted By WestPointCadet:

2. Military: Our military force is comprised of MANY Mexicans who are either the sons of immigrants or immigrants themselves. Cutting off the flow of immigrants will also lower the pool of possible future soldiers, who fight hard and tough because believe it or not alot of mexican culture is based on being macho, as well as christianity. Just look at how many hispanics join the Marines; it's because the Navy, Airforce, and Army have too many women to be "macho" enough for them. If you ask me more legal Americans could have that attitude as well. I would rather deport the san francisco liberals than any hardworking illegal any day. (I know, I will be in the Army, but I think they are both macho ) The more enthusiastic soldiers we have, the better, and when you have people migrateing to your country willing to fight in your military just because the macho blood in their veins and love of their new homeland, it would be foolish to cut them off and kick them out.



Ooh es mas macho? Ricardo Mantelban, orrr.... Desi Arnez?

Ricardo Mantelban?

Ay-yi-yi. No. Ricardo Mantelban es muy macho, si. Pero Desi Arnez con "Babbaloo" est immortales! Desi Arnez es macho muy bien! Desi Arnez est mas macho.

Si, si, Desi Arnez.



Ha! someone else remebers "quien es mas macho?"

"Quien es mas macho: Lorenzo lamas - o - Ricardo montalblan....Quien es mas macho...Lamas o montalban...."

Just about on par with "Jew / Not a Jew"!
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:17:21 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:49:41 PM EDT
I still think it might be better if all those illegal aliens went back to Mexico, El Salvador, and wherever else they came from, and protest and march for their rights in THOSE countries.

They would have the personal satisfaction of knowing their protesting was helping their fellow man in their own countries, instead of running away from their problems.
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:53:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/11/2006 6:54:19 PM EDT by mytwocents]
I think most people Forgot Bush was pushing for his guest worker program/amnesty since before he was president

Campaign Videos Jorge Bush
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 7:03:49 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BlueEyedEvil:

Originally Posted By 22bad:
And, is mexico planning to have an amnesty for American Nationals anytime soon? HESTOP ALL WELFARE PAYMENTS TO ILLEGALS
NO CITIZENSHIP FOR CHILDREN OF ILLEGALS
ALL ILLEGALS ARE CRIMINALS, DEPORT THEM ALL
STOP SPITTING ON OUR COUNTRY AND CONSTITUTION
ENFORCE OUR COUNTRY'S LAWS AGAINST ILLEGALS



22bad for PREZ!!!!



Good list, though it's missing one very important thing.....Fine employers of illegals $10,000. per illegal and add to that all expenses for court and transportation to illegals country of origin.
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 7:22:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/11/2006 7:37:38 PM EDT by PeteCO]

Originally Posted By Barney_Calhoun:
Good list, though it's missing one very important thing.....Fine employers of illegals $10,000. per illegal and add to that all expenses for court and transportation to illegals country of origin.



First it might be a good idea to modify Federal Law to ALLOW employers to investigate suspected forged documents without having to pay millions of dollars in discrimination fines from the government. Yes, this happens, I have witnessed it first hand. Even the pilot program of ICE that reconciles names and SSN's prohibits employers from doing anything EVEN IF the software shows that they don't match.

Talked about some fucked up bullshit.

And speaking of forged documents, in addition to being CRIMINALS for crossing illegally, they are FELONS for forging government documents.
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 7:33:38 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Barney_Calhoun:

Originally Posted By BlueEyedEvil:

Originally Posted By 22bad:
And, is mexico planning to have an amnesty for American Nationals anytime soon?

MILITARIZE THE DAMN BORDER ALREADY
STOP ALL WELFARE PAYMENTS TO ILLEGALS
NO CITIZENSHIP FOR CHILDREN OF ILLEGALS
ALL ILLEGALS ARE CRIMINALS, DEPORT THEM ALL
STOP SPITTING ON OUR COUNTRY AND CONSTITUTION
ENFORCE OUR COUNTRY'S LAWS AGAINST ILLEGALS



22bad for PREZ!!!!



Good list, though it's missing one very important thing.....Fine employers of illegals $10,000. per illegal and add to that all expenses for court and transportation to illegals country of origin.



The bottom one should cover that
(can I count on your vote?)
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