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Posted: 1/30/2010 5:02:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/30/2010 5:03:50 PM EDT by JDC_VA_USMC]








Just wondering why I haven't seen much discussion here on the H&K MR556 that is supposed to be coming out:





http://www.hk-usa.com/civilian_products/mr556_general.asp





I did a search and couldn't find anything, and don't recall any threads.  Is it too little too late for those upset with H&K's perceived lack of interest in the civilian market?  Is everyone just assuming it's going to be at a ridiculous price point?  ARFCOM's general lack of interest in gas piston rifles?





What's the deal?  I feel like I missed a meeting or something.

 
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:05:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/30/2010 5:06:25 PM EDT by Cnacki77]
When are those supposed to be available?
eta...there are a couple threads in the HK rifle section.



http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=6&f=9&t=303657

Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:06:08 PM EDT
I bet if it costs 3k everyone will go, "sweet."
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:06:46 PM EDT
Still not compatible with standard AR lowers?  No thanks...
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:08:08 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 0612Devil:
Still not compatible with standard AR lowers?  No thanks...


They changed it, it's now compatible with standard lowers.
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:09:39 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/30/2010 5:18:00 PM EDT by RF11]
Originally Posted By 0612Devil:
Still not compatible with standard AR lowers?  No thanks...


No they changed that,I think it was chen (smglee) who commented on his pic threads on another forum that this had happened. Will try and find it.

ETA damn you beat me to it.

Here toy go: http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?172627-SMGLee-SHOT-Show-Tour-Viva-Las-Vegas-2010/page8

It is post 115 on page 8 and just under first pic.
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:11:32 PM EDT
Did I make it in before the inevitable H&K bashing begins?
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:13:03 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Uberjager:
Originally Posted By 0612Devil:
Still not compatible with standard AR lowers?  No thanks...


They changed it, it's now compatible with standard lowers.


Well in that case, might be kind of nice depending on price.
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:14:34 PM EDT
HK.. Because you suck and we... well actually now that the ACR costs so much we're laughing at you, but we still hate you.
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:15:03 PM EDT



Originally Posted By Alacran:


Did I make it in before the inevitable H&K bashing begins?


this, say what you will about HK and FN but I love their firearms




 
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:15:26 PM EDT
Not a bit interested. I'd rather have a LWRC upper.

The lower is worthless, assuming it's the same lower as a 416 –– Pmags won't work in them. The "webbing design" on the exterior of the Pmag, which doesn't interfere with regular receivers in the least, prevents full insertion on the 416.

Ask Hydguy. He actually broke a Pmag trying to slap it into the 416.

_MaH

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:18:46 PM EDT
Originally Posted By RF11:
Originally Posted By 0612Devil:
Still not compatible with standard AR lowers?  No thanks...


No they changed that,I think it was chen (smglee) who commented on his pic threads on another forum that this had happened. Will try and find it.

ETA damn you beat me to it.





Here toy go: http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?172627-SMGLee-SHOT-Show-Tour-Viva-Las-Vegas-2010/page8

It is post 115 on page 8 and just under first pic.

Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:22:42 PM EDT
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Not a bit interested. I'd rather have a LWRC upper.

The lower is worthless, assuming it's the same lower as a 416 –– Pmags won't work in them. The "webbing design" on the exterior of the Pmag, which doesn't interfere with regular receivers in the least, prevents full insertion on the 416.

Ask Hydguy. He actually broke a Pmag trying to slap it into the 416.

_MaH

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile


That's why Magpul makes the Emag.

Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:24:32 PM EDT
As much as I like HK stuff, if I can't by a set of basic spare parts for it, I'm not going there.
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:35:39 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Alacran:
Did I make it in before the inevitable H&K bashing begins?


Is that where some douchebag from HK tells us that their weapons are so awesome, us shit head civilian scum shouldn't own any of them?
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:39:23 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Alacran:
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Not a bit interested. I'd rather have a LWRC upper.

The lower is worthless, assuming it's the same lower as a 416 –– Pmags won't work in them. The "webbing design" on the exterior of the Pmag, which doesn't interfere with regular receivers in the least, prevents full insertion on the 416.

Ask Hydguy. He actually broke a Pmag trying to slap it into the 416.

_MaH

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile


That's why Magpul makes the Emag.



Okay, sure.  I'll just go ahead and buy a whole new set of Pmags to compliment my unbelievably fickle MR556.

Pass on all things HK.

Well, okay, their P30L is pretty attractive....

_MaH
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:44:02 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Orbital-Burn:
Originally Posted By Alacran:
Did I make it in before the inevitable H&K bashing begins?


Is that where some douchebag from HK tells us that their weapons are so awesome, us shit head civilian scum shouldn't own any of them?


I think George H.W. Bush and Bill Clinton said that first.

Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:44:13 PM EDT
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Originally Posted By Alacran:
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Not a bit interested. I'd rather have a LWRC upper.

The lower is worthless, assuming it's the same lower as a 416 –– Pmags won't work in them. The "webbing design" on the exterior of the Pmag, which doesn't interfere with regular receivers in the least, prevents full insertion on the 416.

Ask Hydguy. He actually broke a Pmag trying to slap it into the 416.

_MaH

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile


That's why Magpul makes the Emag.



Okay, sure.  I'll just go ahead and buy a whole new set of Pmags to compliment my unbelievably fickle MR556.

Pass on all things HK.

Well, okay, their P30L is pretty attractive....

_MaH


I think the Emag will work in any AR, it's just slightly slimmer to fit teh euro flash rifle

Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:47:44 PM EDT
If HK ever releases the .308 version, I'll probably buy one. It's been delayed over and over for a couple of years.

My Colt 6920 does just fine for me in a .223. I don't think the HK .in 223 would give me anything over and above my Colt.
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 5:53:02 PM EDT
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Originally Posted By Alacran:
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Not a bit interested. I'd rather have a LWRC upper.

The lower is worthless, assuming it's the same lower as a 416 –– Pmags won't work in them. The "webbing design" on the exterior of the Pmag, which doesn't interfere with regular receivers in the least, prevents full insertion on the 416.

Ask Hydguy. He actually broke a Pmag trying to slap it into the 416.

_MaH

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile


That's why Magpul makes the Emag.



Okay, sure.  I'll just go ahead and buy a whole new set of Pmags to compliment my unbelievably fickle MR556.

Pass on all things HK.

Well, okay, their P30L is pretty attractive....

_MaH


So, it isn't really about the Pmag after all.

Link Posted: 1/30/2010 6:00:18 PM EDT
I was interested 6 years ago when I first read about H&K piston ARs. Now, not so much. Too late H&K.
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 6:00:18 PM EDT
I was interested 6 years ago when I first read about H&K piston ARs. Now, not so much. Too late H&K.
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 6:03:18 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Alacran:
Originally Posted By Orbital-Burn:
Originally Posted By Alacran:
Did I make it in before the inevitable H&K bashing begins?


Is that where some douchebag from HK tells us that their weapons are so awesome, us shit head civilian scum shouldn't own any of them?


I think George H.W. Bush and Bill Clinton said that first.



Saved me from saying it.
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 6:05:29 PM EDT
Looks to be a good gun. I wouldn't mind having one, but I'd buy an ACR first.



Just stay clear of the bullshit the HK bashers love to sling around. HK DOES want your business despite what they will tell you.

Link Posted: 1/30/2010 6:23:49 PM EDT
"Just stay clear of the bullshit the HK bashers love to sling around. HK DOES want your business" DESPITE WHAT THEY TELL YOU".  ???? Harr Harrr!!!  Darn, Dude––Can you spin your words even more?


Link Posted: 1/30/2010 6:29:33 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Alacran:
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Originally Posted By Alacran:
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Not a bit interested. I'd rather have a LWRC upper.

The lower is worthless, assuming it's the same lower as a 416 –– Pmags won't work in them. The "webbing design" on the exterior of the Pmag, which doesn't interfere with regular receivers in the least, prevents full insertion on the 416.

Ask Hydguy. He actually broke a Pmag trying to slap it into the 416.

_MaH

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile


That's why Magpul makes the Emag.



Okay, sure.  I'll just go ahead and buy a whole new set of Pmags to compliment my unbelievably fickle MR556.

Pass on all things HK.

Well, okay, their P30L is pretty attractive....

_MaH


So, it isn't really about the Pmag after all.



The Pmag isn't the item with the problem.  It will fit in every single AR15/M4/M16 receiver out there.

But not an HK416/MR556 receiver.

You'll notice that I'm not bringing up the same grievance in regard to how a Pmag won't fit into an FN FS2000.  Why?  Because an FS2000 is an entirely different 5.56mm platform, despite that it takes regular AR15/M4/M16 mags.  The HK 416/MR556, however, is "HK's version" of an M4/M16/AR15 (respectively).

Did Colt fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did Rock River Arms fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did LaRue fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did DPMS fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did Daniel Defense fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did Del-Ton fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did Bushmaster fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did POF fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did HK fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  YES.

And you're implying that it's the Pmag that's defective??



_MaH
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 6:32:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/30/2010 6:33:18 PM EDT by HK_Shooter_03]
Meh





$3K will buy me a CMMG AR-15 and a really nice cleaning kit I can use to keep it as clean as a piston driven gun.



The HK I like died with the roller locked guns.



I'll still be shooting my 53A3 and 33E.

Link Posted: 1/30/2010 6:40:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Originally Posted By Alacran:
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Originally Posted By Alacran:
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Not a bit interested. I'd rather have a LWRC upper.

The lower is worthless, assuming it's the same lower as a 416 –– Pmags won't work in them. The "webbing design" on the exterior of the Pmag, which doesn't interfere with regular receivers in the least, prevents full insertion on the 416.

Ask Hydguy. He actually broke a Pmag trying to slap it into the 416.

_MaH

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile


That's why Magpul makes the Emag.



Okay, sure.  I'll just go ahead and buy a whole new set of Pmags to compliment my unbelievably fickle MR556.

Pass on all things HK.

Well, okay, their P30L is pretty attractive....

_MaH


So, it isn't really about the Pmag after all.



The Pmag isn't the item with the problem.  It will fit in every single AR15/M4/M16 receiver out there.

But not an HK416/MR556 receiver.

You'll notice that I'm not bringing up the same grievance in regard to how a Pmag won't fit into an FN FS2000.  Why?  Because an FS2000 is an entirely different 5.56mm platform, despite that it takes regular AR15/M4/M16 mags.  The HK 416/MR556, however, is "HK's version" of an M4/M16/AR15 (respectively).

Did Colt fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did Rock River Arms fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did LaRue fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did DPMS fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did Daniel Defense fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did Del-Ton fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did Bushmaster fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did POF fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did HK fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  YES.

And you're implying that it's the Pmag that's defective??



_MaH




Apparently, the only thing that is defective is your reading comprehension.  


Link Posted: 1/30/2010 6:45:12 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Alacran:



Apparently, the only thing that is defective is your reading comprehension.  



Not in the least.  It would just seem that one of us enjoys scotch and the other enjoys kool-aid

_MaH
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 6:55:21 PM EDT
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Originally Posted By Alacran:



Apparently, the only thing that is defective is your reading comprehension.  



Not in the least.  It would just seem that one of us enjoys scotch and the other enjoys kool-aid

_MaH


If only that were true, otherwise I wouldn't have spend so much money stocking my "refrigerator" with so many other varieties of beverages.

Link Posted: 1/30/2010 7:08:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Originally Posted By Alacran:



Apparently, the only thing that is defective is your reading comprehension.  



Not in the least.  It would just seem that one of us enjoys scotch and the other enjoys kool-aid

_MaH


I think the "pass on all things HK" line is what Alacran is pointing out, because the 416/556 dosn't accept PMAGs you believe that all HK products are failures. EMAGs work with AR/M16/M4 and you can file the 1/8 inch of polymer on the front ribs of a PMAG to make it work with the 416/556.

There is a reason why 416 won IAR, over FN, Colt, ect...

InBeforeThePolygonalBarrelHatters
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 7:10:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/30/2010 9:25:43 PM EDT by joker581]
BOTD image removed-joker581
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 7:12:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/30/2010 9:26:44 PM EDT by joker581]
Originally Posted By Doable_Bill:
BOTD image removed-joker581



OK, IBTL
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 7:14:50 PM EDT



Originally Posted By BushmasterNewb:



Originally Posted By Doable_Bill:

65/3ZKXjhmaml6opswvz5Gae2aBo1_500.jpg






OK, IBTL


Thats a serious case of WTF.



 
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 7:14:51 PM EDT
Yep, IBTL indeed.
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 7:15:56 PM EDT
because of the great customer service they are known for . The early problems they had with jamming caused by installing the rounds backwards in the mags . Not to mention the success of the XM-8 .


Link Posted: 1/30/2010 7:30:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/30/2010 7:32:19 PM EDT by mhoffman]
Originally Posted By BushmasterNewb:
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Originally Posted By Alacran:



Apparently, the only thing that is defective is your reading comprehension.  



Not in the least.  It would just seem that one of us enjoys scotch and the other enjoys kool-aid

_MaH


I think the "pass on all things HK" line is what Alacran is pointing out, because the 416/556 dosn't accept PMAGs you believe that all HK products are failures. EMAGs work with AR/M16/M4 and you can file the 1/8 inch of polymer on the front ribs of a PMAG to make it work with the 416/556.

There is a reason why 416 won IAR, over FN, Colt, ect...

InBeforeThePolygonalBarrelHatters


No, my disinclination to HK as a whole has very little to do with the Pmag/HK416 compatibility issue (though that is A major reason why I have no interest in that model) and more to do with their MSRP and customer service to the civilian market.

Now, if those two improved, I outright admit I would be all over HK.  I actually met with quite a few of their employees when I was in Northern Virginia and they're a great bunch of guys.  The quality that goes into HK firearms is, indeed, very high.

However, when an HK handgun is practically the same ratio of steel to polymer as a Glock, but malfunctions more often than a Glock and costs two to three times more than a Glock, that's a major factor to dissuade me from it.

Now the civilian customer service side.  I've never had to call HK customer support, but a handgun isn't a PC –– you can call customer support and they can respond, but if it's over a malfunction it's not like they can walk you through it on the phone.  Liability is a major issue in this regard.  

Most of the time the problem is a broken part.  A spring, a pin, something small.  I know that there's a substantial civilian customer service problem when a co-worker of mine back in NOVA, who was the second (of only two) HK certified armorers in the nation that was trained and certified as a civilian and not as an employee of HK or a LE/Military organization (connections –– they work wonders) was unable to get HK parts through the civilian side of HK, but instead had to rely on a contact of his who could get the parts through the LE side (and even then it took a long time).

My advice to HK?

1) Dramatically improve your civilian customer support, and

2) Drop your MSRP.  There is no reason at all that an HK handgun should cost two to three times as much as a Glock when they're both about the same ratio of steel and polymer (hell, the Glock slide even has a tougher finish than the HK!), and they're both manufactured in Europe and exported to the US.  Furthermore, you guys are opening (or have possibly already opened) a plant in New England to produce HK firearms domestically.  Congrats - tariffs no longer apply (not that I suspect this was a problem in the first place).

Bottom line is, if I walk into a gun shop with $1,000, and my options are (a) an HK handgun, or (b) a Glock with night sights, holster, extra magazines, and a bunch of ammo, guess which one I'm going to pick?

And before anyone dismisses me as a Glock fan-boy, my daily carry is a 1911.

_MaH
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 7:45:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/30/2010 7:47:39 PM EDT by BushmasterNewb]
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
......................................

My advice to HK?

1) Dramatically improve your civilian customer support, and

2) Drop your MSRP.  There is no reason at all that an HK handgun should cost two to three times as much as a Glock when they're both about the same ratio of steel and polymer (hell, the Glock slide even has a tougher finish than the HK!), and they're both manufactured in Europe and exported to the US.  Furthermore, you guys are opening (or have possibly already opened) a plant in New England to produce HK firearms domestically.  Congrats - tariffs no longer apply (not that I suspect this was a problem in the first place).

Bottom line is, if I walk into a gun shop with $1,000, and my options are (a) an HK handgun, or (b) a Glock with night sights, holster, extra magazines, and a bunch of ammo, guess which one I'm going to pick?

And before anyone dismisses me as a Glock fan-boy, my daily carry is a 1911.

_MaH


If your issues are with the MSRP and constomer services then I really can't defend HK

/microdiscussion

ETA to trim the quotes
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 7:52:06 PM EDT





Thread lock in 5....4...3...2...



 
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 7:57:32 PM EDT
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Originally Posted By Alacran:
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Originally Posted By Alacran:
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Not a bit interested. I'd rather have a LWRC upper.

The lower is worthless, assuming it's the same lower as a 416 –– Pmags won't work in them. The "webbing design" on the exterior of the Pmag, which doesn't interfere with regular receivers in the least, prevents full insertion on the 416.

Ask Hydguy. He actually broke a Pmag trying to slap it into the 416.

_MaH

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile


That's why Magpul makes the Emag.



Okay, sure.  I'll just go ahead and buy a whole new set of Pmags to compliment my unbelievably fickle MR556.

Pass on all things HK.

Well, okay, their P30L is pretty attractive....

_MaH


So, it isn't really about the Pmag after all.



The Pmag isn't the item with the problem.  It will fit in every single AR15/M4/M16 receiver out there.

But not an HK416/MR556 receiver.

You'll notice that I'm not bringing up the same grievance in regard to how a Pmag won't fit into an FN FS2000.  Why?  Because an FS2000 is an entirely different 5.56mm platform, despite that it takes regular AR15/M4/M16 mags.  The HK 416/MR556, however, is "HK's version" of an M4/M16/AR15 (respectively).

Did Colt fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did Rock River Arms fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did LaRue fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did DPMS fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did Daniel Defense fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did Del-Ton fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did Bushmaster fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did POF fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  No.

Did HK fuck around with the original receiver mag-well specs?  YES.

And you're implying that it's the Pmag that's defective??



_MaH


Pmags are made to fit the TDP spec which = Colt spec.  Any mfg that varies from Colt's spec may not accept Pmags.
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 8:10:28 PM EDT
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Originally Posted By BushmasterNewb:
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Originally Posted By Alacran:



Apparently, the only thing that is defective is your reading comprehension.  



Not in the least.  It would just seem that one of us enjoys scotch and the other enjoys kool-aid

_MaH


I think the "pass on all things HK" line is what Alacran is pointing out, because the 416/556 dosn't accept PMAGs you believe that all HK products are failures. EMAGs work with AR/M16/M4 and you can file the 1/8 inch of polymer on the front ribs of a PMAG to make it work with the 416/556.

There is a reason why 416 won IAR, over FN, Colt, ect...

InBeforeThePolygonalBarrelHatters


No, my disinclination to HK as a whole has very little to do with the Pmag/HK416 compatibility issue (though that is A major reason why I have no interest in that model) and more to do with their MSRP and customer service to the civilian market.

Now, if those two improved, I outright admit I would be all over HK.  I actually met with quite a few of their employees when I was in Northern Virginia and they're a great bunch of guys.  The quality that goes into HK firearms is, indeed, very high.

However, when an HK handgun is practically the same ratio of steel to polymer as a Glock, but malfunctions more often than a Glock and costs two to three times more than a Glock, that's a major factor to dissuade me from it.

Now the civilian customer service side.  I've never had to call HK customer support, but a handgun isn't a PC –– you can call customer support and they can respond, but if it's over a malfunction it's not like they can walk you through it on the phone.  Liability is a major issue in this regard.  

Most of the time the problem is a broken part.  A spring, a pin, something small.  I know that there's a substantial civilian customer service problem when a co-worker of mine back in NOVA, who was the second (of only two) HK certified armorers in the nation that was trained and certified as a civilian and not as an employee of HK or a LE/Military organization (connections –– they work wonders) was unable to get HK parts through the civilian side of HK, but instead had to rely on a contact of his who could get the parts through the LE side (and even then it took a long time).

My advice to HK?

1) Dramatically improve your civilian customer support, and

2) Drop your MSRP.  There is no reason at all that an HK handgun should cost two to three times as much as a Glock when they're both about the same ratio of steel and polymer (hell, the Glock slide even has a tougher finish than the HK!), and they're both manufactured in Europe and exported to the US.  Furthermore, you guys are opening (or have possibly already opened) a plant in New England to produce HK firearms domestically.  Congrats - tariffs no longer apply (not that I suspect this was a problem in the first place).

Bottom line is, if I walk into a gun shop with $1,000, and my options are (a) an HK handgun, or (b) a Glock with night sights, holster, extra magazines, and a bunch of ammo, guess which one I'm going to pick?

And before anyone dismisses me as a Glock fan-boy, my daily carry is a 1911.

_MaH


Comparing a USP based HK to a Glock is a little unfair.  For the most part, your same argument could be used in comparing a Sig Sauer to a Glock.  Functionally, the HK is more similar to the Sig.

I will agree that HK is usually higher priced than it's competition but with any firearm, one must weigh funtionality with price to see which fits his personal preference the best.

All three are excellent firearms and I don't regret buying either of the three.  Functionally, I prefer the Sig and the USP and I was willing to pay the extra price as both are my exclusive carry pieces.

HK's customer service is a valid complaint but I've not had to use them (yet).

Link Posted: 1/30/2010 8:28:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/30/2010 8:28:25 PM EDT by Gunnerpalace]
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Originally Posted By BushmasterNewb:
Originally Posted By mhoffman:
Originally Posted By Alacran:



Apparently, the only thing that is defective is your reading comprehension.  



Not in the least.  It would just seem that one of us enjoys scotch and the other enjoys kool-aid

_MaH


I think the "pass on all things HK" line is what Alacran is pointing out, because the 416/556 dosn't accept PMAGs you believe that all HK products are failures. EMAGs work with AR/M16/M4 and you can file the 1/8 inch of polymer on the front ribs of a PMAG to make it work with the 416/556.

There is a reason why 416 won IAR, over FN, Colt, ect...

InBeforeThePolygonalBarrelHatters


No, my disinclination to HK as a whole has very little to do with the Pmag/HK416 compatibility issue (though that is A major reason why I have no interest in that model) and more to do with their MSRP and customer service to the civilian market.

Now, if those two improved, I outright admit I would be all over HK.  I actually met with quite a few of their employees when I was in Northern Virginia and they're a great bunch of guys.  The quality that goes into HK firearms is, indeed, very high.

However, when an HK handgun is practically the same ratio of steel to polymer as a Glock, but malfunctions more often than a Glock and costs two to three times more than a Glock, that's a major factor to dissuade me from it.

Now the civilian customer service side.  I've never had to call HK customer support, but a handgun isn't a PC –– you can call customer support and they can respond, but if it's over a malfunction it's not like they can walk you through it on the phone.  Liability is a major issue in this regard.  

Most of the time the problem is a broken part.  A spring, a pin, something small.  I know that there's a substantial civilian customer service problem when a co-worker of mine back in NOVA, who was the second (of only two) HK certified armorers in the nation that was trained and certified as a civilian and not as an employee of HK or a LE/Military organization (connections –– they work wonders) was unable to get HK parts through the civilian side of HK, but instead had to rely on a contact of his who could get the parts through the LE side (and even then it took a long time).

My advice to HK?

1) Dramatically improve your civilian customer support, and

2) Drop your MSRP.  There is no reason at all that an HK handgun should cost two to three times as much as a Glock when they're both about the same ratio of steel and polymer (hell, the Glock slide even has a tougher finish than the HK!), and they're both manufactured in Europe and exported to the US.  Furthermore, you guys are opening (or have possibly already opened) a plant in New England to produce HK firearms domestically.  Congrats - tariffs no longer apply (not that I suspect this was a problem in the first place).

Bottom line is, if I walk into a gun shop with $1,000, and my options are (a) an HK handgun, or (b) a Glock with night sights, holster, extra magazines, and a bunch of ammo, guess which one I'm going to pick?

And before anyone dismisses me as a Glock fan-boy, my daily carry is a 1911.

_MaH


No argument there, I am a vapid defender of them, however, questions I have made to CS the answers are hilariously vague.
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 9:12:40 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 0612Devil:
Still not compatible with standard AR lowers?  No thanks...


This. HK still hates US civies. Fuck them.
Link Posted: 1/30/2010 9:20:13 PM EDT
Originally Posted By stealbear:
HK.. Because you suck and we... well actually now that the ACR costs so much we're laughing at you, but we still hate you.


Link Posted: 1/30/2010 9:28:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By whiskerz:
because of the great customer service they are known for . The early problems they had with jamming caused by installing the rounds backwards in the mags . Not to mention the success of the XM-8 .


Hk has been 100% for me with their cs.

Link Posted: 1/30/2010 9:30:28 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/30/2010 9:30:28 PM EDT by joker581]
There wouldn't be a lock for all of you to get in before if you hadn't all quoted a COC violating post.
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