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Posted: 6/25/2001 7:29:00 AM EST
I am buying a SEMI Auto rifle. The weapons I have a choice to buy are 7.62 X 39 or .223 calibers only. I wish my choice was a .308 or 30-06, that is not an option as I am getting a great deal but a limited choice... Do any of you use your AR-15 for hunting Deer? Elk? Heavier grain round of course!!!
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 7:31:51 AM EST
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 7:34:24 AM EST
.223 only if its under 200 yards and the shot is perfect. 7.62x39 dont know but people compare it to the 30.30 and thats only good out to like 200 yrds also...i dont know...go buy a pre scoped savage(.243, .308) for like $350 from wal-mart. (yes wal-mart is bad but good prices on savage)
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 7:36:18 AM EST
Originally Posted By The Beer Slayer: Personally neither. But if no other option i would say 7.62x39. i just don't think the .223 has enough power for big game. I'm not saying it won't take a deer but you better make that shot count or the animal is going to suffer.
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since when is deer big game?? deer to in my area are small-medium size... average size of deer in the U.S. would be medium.
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 7:36:44 AM EST
You can buy a M1 grand for about $300 and you can buy a FAL for about $400 and other ones for around about the same price.
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 7:37:39 AM EST
Ahhh, geez here we go again. My vote: .223 caliber. I say this because, even though you're not going to get a large would capacity, you will have enough power to penetrate the tissue (PLEASE use 75-80 grain bullets). I would have to go along the lines of FMJ or BTHP (it's HP but still amazingly close to FMJ), because with enough powder and bullet weight, you WILL double-lung the deer if you hit him correctly. In my humble opinion, the .223 shouldn't be used as a mushroom-expanding, soft tissue-damaging round - it should be used to pierce the lungs and leave a GOOD blood trail (which it should). Elk? Good luck - chances are better of the Elk killing you rather than you successfully shooting the beast to death. I'd go for a headshot if you've got the balls to take out an Elk with a 5.56x45mm. All this, as always, IMHO [brown]Evil Jewbroni~[/brown]
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 7:43:02 AM EST
[Last Edit: 6/25/2001 7:42:16 AM EST by The Dark Knight]
Everyone thank You.. Let me give you a little more info... I am getting a Bushmaster post ban or a post ban Russian made Veper both 20 inch plus barrels. For $400 my choice from a buddy.. Where as my dilemma
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 7:43:30 AM EST
[Last Edit: 6/25/2001 7:41:31 AM EST by The_Beer_Slayer]
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 7:46:59 AM EST
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 7:49:00 AM EST
If, as your profile indicates, you are from Washington state and plan on hunting deer here, it doesn't really matter which caliber is better. The point is moot as only one of those calibers is legal to hunt deer with in this state. And that would be the 7.62x39. Washington state requires that a rifle be at least .240/6mm caliber to be legal to hunt big game with. Personally, I don't think the 7.62x39 would be such a bad deer cartridge. Powerwise, it's about the equivalent of the Winchester 30-30. The 7.62x39 can also take advantage of pointed bullets whereas most 30-30 rifles cannot because of their tubular magazine. I've got a 7.62x39 AR15 that I am considering using for deer season this fall. Do NOT even think about using EITHER of these cartridges for elk. They are both woefully underpowered for elk. .270 Winchester is the minimum I would use for elk, and even that is on the light side for such a large, tough animal. If you want a semi-auto for elk hunting, you'd better either settle for a Remington 7400 or save up for a Browning BAR. I know it's not what you wanted to hear, but if you truly want one reasonably affordable rifle for both types of hunting, forget about the semi-auto and get a decent bolt action rifle in 7mm Remington Mag, 30-06, or .300 Winchester. Any of those three calibers will offer the versatility to handle anything you might run up against in Washington state.
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 7:50:21 AM EST
Originally Posted By The Beer Slayer:
when is deer big game?? deer to in my area are small-medium size... average size of deer in the U.S. would be medium.
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I guess that would be depending on your area. for the Southeast US Deer would be considered the larger of the game animals available. Ok it's a symantics thing. Lighten up douchebag. mike
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hey easy with the douche bag stuff.. it wasnt a flame just an observation.
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 7:52:39 AM EST
Originally Posted By The Dark Knight: I am getting a Bushmaster post ban or a post ban Russian made Veper both 20 inch plus barrels. For $400 my choice from a buddy.. Where as my dilemma
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If you can get a Bushmaster for $400, I don't understand what the dilemna is. Buy it now and get a real hunting rifle later on. Next question, please.
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 7:56:07 AM EST
Originally Posted By Boomer: If, as your profile indicates, you are from Washington state and plan on hunting deer here, it doesn't really matter which caliber is better. The point is moot as only one of those calibers is legal to hunt deer with in this state. And that would be the 7.62x39. Washington state requires that a rifle be at least .240/6mm caliber to be legal to hunt big game with. Personally, I don't think the 7.62x39 would be such a bad deer cartridge. Powerwise, it's about the equivalent of the Winchester 30-30. The 7.62x39 can also take advantage of pointed bullets whereas most 30-30 rifles cannot because of their tubular magazine. I've got a 7.62x39 AR15 that I am considering using for deer season this fall. Do NOT even think about using EITHER of these cartridges for elk. They are both woefully underpowered for elk. .270 Winchester is the minimum I would use for elk, and even that is on the light side for such a large, tough animal. If you want a semi-auto for elk hunting, you'd better either settle for a Remington 7400 or save up for a Browning BAR. I know it's not what you wanted to hear, but if you truly want one reasonably affordable rifle for both types of hunting, forget about the semi-auto and get a decent bolt action rifle in 7mm Remington Mag, 30-06, or .300 Winchester. Any of those three calibers will offer the versatility to handle anything you might run up against in Washington state.
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THANK YOU BOOMER... Now I know what to buy... I just threw the ELK question out there. No worries...You single handidly answered my question.....Did you feel that Earth Quake this morning.. It rocked my home. I thought we were back in LA....
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 8:00:37 AM EST
Buy them both, sell the Bushmaster for a nice profit and buy a nice Savage.
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 8:09:22 AM EST
Originally Posted By tayous1: You can buy a M1 grand for about $300 and you can buy a FAL for about $400 and other ones for around about the same price.
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Where can I get a Garand for $300? Even the beat up milsurplus ones go for $600, and the cleaned up ones go for about $1000.
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 8:27:48 AM EST
Originally Posted By Armitage22:
Originally Posted By tayous1: You can buy a M1 grand for about $300 and you can buy a FAL for about $400 and other ones for around about the same price.
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Where can I get a Garand for $300? Even the beat up milsurplus ones go for $600, and the cleaned up ones go for about $1000.
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I bought a pretty nice Garand from a buddy for $300 about 10 years ago. I probably wouldn't have a problem getting at least twice that these days. [:)] I though about the Garnd as a hunting rifle, too. But it's so damn heavy and i don't know how well it would handle some of the hotter 180gr loads. The last thing I want to do is beat an honorable old veteran death by abusing it like that.
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 8:46:58 AM EST
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD MAN DO NOT BUY A 7.62 AR!!!! you would be better off with a sling shot and a few rocks. if you want to hunt deer with an ar armalite has a .243 and of course a .308, in the right conditions a .223 is just fine for deer but your marksmanship has to be good. if you want to hunt with 7.62x39 buy an sks. 7.62 ar's are just too much trouble i have one now that is going to be a trade in for my next gun. THEY ARE JUNK
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 9:46:42 AM EST
7.62x39 would be ok for deer...as mentioned above it is often compared to a 30-30 round. ELK with a .223???? good luck.
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 10:18:12 AM EST
Here in Minnesota, .223 is illegal for big game so, I don't have any personnel experience. I did drop two "average" sized does a few years back with my SKS. Two shots, two Deer. Range was 60-75yds. First Deer was hit right above left shoulder, and hit the spine. She dropped instantly. The other doe was hit in the neck, and it also caught the spine. She dropped in her tracks also. My cousin, also shot a small spike Buck that year with his SKS. Hit him through the lungs about 50yds away. The Buck ran about 40yds, then piled up. All bullets had complete pass through. The SKS makes a wonderful brush gun, and I wouldn't hesitate to use it on any Deer less than 100-150yds away.
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 10:34:49 AM EST
Originally Posted By superdav: FOR THE LOVE OF GOD MAN DO NOT BUY A 7.62 AR!!!! You would be better off with a sling shot and a few rocks. 7.62 AR's are just too much trouble. I have one now that is going to be a trade in for my next gun. THEY ARE JUNK
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Correction. That should read: [i][b]I[/b] would be better off with a sling shot and a few rocks. [b]My[/b] 7.62 AR is just too much trouble. I have one now that is going to be a trade in for my next gun. [b]MINE[/b] IS JUNK[/i] I'm glad I didn't heed that sort of advice before buying mine. It runs like a Swiss watch and is a riot to shoot, too. I love it. I would wholeheartedly recommend one. Just out of curiosity, what kind of 7.62x39 AR do you have? A factory gun or a hodgepodge of parts semi-assembled into some sort of franken-gun? I'm curious what your problems are. The biggest pain with this combination is getting reliable hi-cap mags, but even that is no big deal. Certainly nothing insurmountable.
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 10:40:09 AM EST
Originally Posted By GeoffM24: Buy them both, sell the Bushmaster for a nice profit and buy a nice Savage.
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I agree once again buying them both is the best and only logical answer :) Good price on the Bushmaster. Georgia Arms special loads deer ammunition for 7.62X39. Two weapons for the price of one bushmaster.
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 10:42:56 AM EST
Originally Posted By tayous1: You can buy a M1 grand for about $300 and you can buy a FAL for about $400 and other ones for around about the same price.
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where can you buy a fal for 400 bucks? ron
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 7:05:05 PM EST
you can buy an old german mauser for $100 in great condition from CDNN investments http://www.CDNNinvestments.com shoots an 8mm mauser. powerful enough crtidge for deer or elk i think. remington makes some good loads for it I think. [sniper] Chuck
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 7:17:45 PM EST
[Last Edit: 6/25/2001 7:20:23 PM EST by Ramses]
Better check the game laws in your state as well... Kansas requires a minimum of [b].23[/b] cal. for big game. Supposedly to keep out the dopes trying to hunt deer or elk with .22 shorts, but it rules out the AR in .223. If you're after varmints like coyote or prarie dogs that's a different story... go with the .223 Edited twice.... my spelling sucks tonight.
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 7:45:41 PM EST
No doubt, your friend is making you an extremely good deal. In spite of that I would have to say that neither rifle is very suitable for hunting. I'd grab up the bushmaster and use it to shoot paper or milk jugs and then buy a caliber that puts meat on the table. I would second taking the surplus bolt action route. 8mm Yugo Mausers (in like new condition) are going for around $100. Ishapore Enfields in .308 are in that range also. Tack driving Finnish M39s in 7.62 x 54 can be had in good condition for about $100. In my opinion if you want the best deer caliber available...go with a Swedish 6.5mm Mauser ($160 for a milsurp that has the quality of a custom-built rifle) All of these guns are powerful and extremely accurate. If you don't like iron sights, scope mounts are available. My personal choice would be a Russian M44 Mosin Nagant carbine. The saying is "it kills on one end and cripples on the other". Hey you don't even have to be a good shot with one of these things. Your average whitetail will die from shock when he sees the basketball sized fireball that comes out of the end. You can finish him off with the handy bayonet.
Link Posted: 6/26/2001 12:59:18 AM EST
[Last Edit: 6/26/2001 12:58:27 AM EST by superdav]
boomer its an oly arms factory gun, not the hodgepoge you assume. ive tried triple k , usa, and colt mags all with the same problem they nose dive in the mag, the usa and colt were remarkably terrible at feeding the colt wanted to throw 3 rounds in the chamber at once NO BIG DEAL? [?] [?] [?]
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