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Posted: 9/10/2005 1:47:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/10/2005 1:48:23 PM EDT by WindGapAR15]
I got in a nice sized argument with my wifes liberal asshole friend about Katrina and the lack of government assistance. I used the "feds had the stuff ready to go but the governor wouldnt okay it quick enough" What are the facts on the issue of the federal government being ready to help but the state dragging ass on asking for help?

ETA: anyone got word on where the death toll is now?
Link Posted: 9/10/2005 1:50:59 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/10/2005 1:52:25 PM EDT by Max_Mike]
Well for starts throw this little tidbit at him… from the Red Cross. The Governor also kept out the Salvation Army.

www.redcross.org/faq/0,1096,0_682_4524,00.html


Disaster FAQs

Hurricane Katrina: Why is the Red Cross not in New Orleans?

* Acess to New Orleans is controlled by the National Guard and local authorities and while we are in constant contact with them, we simply cannot enter New Orleans against their orders.

* The state Homeland Security Department had requested--and continues to request--that the American Red Cross not come back into New Orleans following the hurricane. Our presence would keep people from evacuating and encourage others to come into the city.

* The Red Cross has been meeting the needs of thousands of New Orleans residents in some 90 shelters throughout the state of Louisiana and elsewhere since before landfall. All told, the Red Cross is today operating 149 shelters for almost 93,000 residents.

* The Red Cross shares the nation’s anguish over the worsening situation inside the city. We will continue to work under the direction of the military, state and local authorities and to focus all our efforts on our lifesaving mission of feeding and sheltering.

* The Red Cross does not conduct search and rescue operations. We are an organization of civilian volunteers and cannot get relief aid into any location until the local authorities say it is safe and provide us with security and access.

* The original plan was to evacuate all the residents of New Orleans to safe places outside the city. With the hurricane bearing down, the city government decided to open a shelter of last resort in the Superdome downtown. We applaud this decision and believe it saved a significant number of lives.

* As the remaining people are evacuated from New Orleans, the most appropriate role for the Red Cross is to provide a safe place for people to stay and to see that their emergency needs are met. We are fully staffed and equipped to handle these individuals once they are evacuated.

Link Posted: 9/10/2005 2:20:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/10/2005 2:21:18 PM EDT by DaveS]
WindGapAR15,

just da-da-damn.

Today, on the radio, Herman Cain had the time-line all laid out as to how GW handled it and how LA's beotch, I mean, govn'r gaffed him off.............days before and up to HK's landfall.
Link Posted: 9/10/2005 4:05:15 PM EDT
Good summary

In case you aren't familiar with how our government is SUPPOSED to work:
The chain of responsiblity for the protection of the citizens in New
Orleans is:
1. The Mayor
2. The New Orleans director of Homeland Security (a political appointee
of the Governor who reports to the Governor)
3. The Governor
4. The Head of Homeland Security
5. The President
What did each do?
1. The mayor, with 5 days advance, waited until 2 days before he
announced a mandatory evacuation (at the behest of the President). The
he failed to provide transportation for those without transport even
though he had hundreds of buses at his disposal.
2. The New Orleans director of Homeland Security failed to have any plan
for a contingency that has been talked about for 50 years. Then he
blames the Feds for not doing what he should have done. (So much for
political appointees)
3. The Governor, despite a declaration of disaster by the President 2!
DAYS BEFORE the storm hit, failed to take advantage of the offer of
Federal troops and aid. Until 2 DAYS AFTER the storm hit.
4. The Director of Homeland Security positioned assets in the area to be
ready when the Governor called for them
5. The President urged a mandatory evacuation, and even declared a
disaster State of Emergency, freeing up millions of dollars of federal
assistance, should the Governor decide to use it.
Oh and by the way, the levees that broke were the responsibility of the
local landowners and the local levee board to maintain, NOT THE FEDERAL
GOVERNMENT.
The disaster in New Orleans is what you get after decades of corrupt
(democrat) government going all the way back to Huey Long.
Funds for disaster protection and relief have been flowing into this
city for decades, and where has it gone, but into the pockets of the
politicos and their friends.
Decades of socialist government in New Orleans has sapped all self
! reliance from the community, and made them dependent upon government for
every little thing.
Political correctness and a lack of will to fight crime have created the
single most corrupt police force in the country, and has permitted gang
violence to flourish.
The sad thing is that there are many poor folks who have suffered and
died needlessly because those that they voted into office failed them.
For those who missed item 5 (where the President's level of
accountability is discussed), it is made more clear in a New Orleans
Times-Picayune article dated August 28:
NEW ORLEANS (AP) — In the face of a catastrophic Hurricane Katrina, a
mandatory evacuation was ordered Sunday for New Orleans by Mayor Ray
Nagin.
Acknowledging that large numbers of people, many of them stranded
tourists, would be unable to leave, the city set up 10 places of last
resort for people to go, including the Superdome.
The mayor called the order unprecedented and sa! id anyone who could leave
the city should. He exempted hotels from the evacuation order because
airlines had already cancelled all flights.
Gov. Kathleen Blanco, standing beside the mayor at a news conference,
said President Bush called and personally appealed for a mandatory
evacuation for the low-lying city, which is prone to flooding. (emphasis
mine)
The ball was placed in Mayor Nagin's court to carry out the evacuation
order. With a 5-day heads-up, he had the authority to use any and all
services to evacuate all residents from the city, as documented in a
city emergency preparedness plan. By waiting until the last minute, and
failing to make full use of resources available within city limits,
Nagin and his administration f**ked up.
Mayor Nagin and his emergency sidekick Terry Ebbert have displayed
lethal, mind boggling incompetence before, during and after Katrina.
[…]
As for Mayor Nagin, he and his profile in pathetic leadership police
chief should resign as well. That city's government is incompetent from
one end to the other. The people of New Orleans deserve better than this
crowd of clowns is capable of giving them.
If you're keeping track, these boobs let 569 buses that could have
carried 33,350 people out of New Orleans–in one trip–get ruined in
the floods. Whatever plan these guys had, it was a dud. Or it probably
would have been if they'd bothered to follow it.
As for all the race-baiting rhetoric and Bush-bashing coming from
prominent blacks on the left, don't expect Ray Nagin to be called out on
the carpet for falling short. You want to know why? Here's why:
It's more convenient to blame a white president for what went wrong than
to hold a black mayor and his administration accountable for gross
negligence and failing to fully carry out an established emergency
preparedness plan.
To hold Nagin and his administration accountable for dropping the ball
amounts to letting loose the shouts and cries of "Racism!". It's sad,
it's wrong, but it's standard operating procedure for the media and
left-wing black leadership.
Mark my words: you will not hear a word of criticism from Jesse Jackson
Sr., Randall Robinson, the Congressional Black Caucus, the NAACP, or
Kanye West being directed toward Clarence Ray Nagin Jr. Why? Because he
is just another black politician instead of a responsible elected
official who happens to be black. In the mindset of
more-blacker-than-thou blacks, black politicians who are on their side
can do no wrong.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Link Posted: 9/10/2005 4:51:21 PM EDT
He begged our cunt of a gov to bring in the feds before the storm hit.
I'm not even going into it. A few weeks to months from now you will see the facts and why our state will continue to suck.
Link Posted: 9/10/2005 5:03:38 PM EDT
Before bitching about what the feds did and didn't do, she should read what the state government was supposed to do. Send her here www.loep.state.la.us/plans/eopindex.htm

also some reading material

On Friday night before the storm hit Max Mayfield of the National Hurricane Center took the unprecedented action of calling Nagin and Blanco personally to plead with them to begin MANDATORY evacuation of NO and they said they’d take it under consideration. This was after the NOAA buoy 240 miles south had recorded 68’ waves before it was destroyed.

President Bush spent Friday afternoon and evening in meetings with his advisors and administrators drafting all of the paperwork required for a state to request federal assistance (and not be in violation of the Posse Comitatus Act or having to enact the Insurgency Act). Just before midnight Friday evening the President called Governor Blanco and pleaded with her to sign the request papers so the federal government and the military could legally begin mobilization and call up. He was told that they didn’t think it necessary for the federal government to be involved yet. After the President’s final call to the governor she held meetings with her staff to discuss the political ramifications of bringing federal forces. It was decided that if they allowed federal assistance it would make it look as if they had failed so it was agreed upon that the feds would not be invited in.

Saturday before the storm hit the President again called Blanco and Nagin requesting they please sign the papers requesting federal assistance, that they declare the state an emergency area, and begin mandatory evacuation. After a personal plea from the President Nagin agreed to order an evacuation, but it would not be a full mandatory evacuation, and the governor still refused to sign the papers requesting and authorizing federal action. In frustration the President declared the area a national disaster area before the state of Louisiana did so he could legally begin some advanced preparations. Rumor has it that the President’s legal advisers were looking into the ramifications of using the insurgency act to bypass the Constitutional requirement that a state request federal aid before the federal government can move into state with troops – but that had not been done since 1906 and the Constitutionality of it was called into question to use before the disaster.

Throw in that over half the federal aid of the past decade to NO for levee construction, maintenance, and repair was diverted to fund a marina and support the gambling ships. Toss in the investigation that will look into why the emergency preparedness plan submitted to the federal government for funding and published on the city’s website was never implemented and in fact may have been bogus for the purpose of gaining additional federal funding as we now learn that the organizations identified in the plan were never contacted or coordinating into any planning – though the document implies that they were.

The suffering people of NO need to be asking some hard questions as do we all, but they better start with why Blanco refused to even sign the multi-state mutual aid pack activation documents until Wednesday which further delayed the legal deployment of National Guard from adjoining states. Or maybe ask why Nagin keeps harping that the President should have commandeered 500 Greyhound busses to help him when according to his own emergency plan and documents he claimed to have over 500 busses at his disposal to use between the local school busses and the city transportation busses – but he never raised a finger to prepare them or activate them.

This is a sad time for all of us to see that a major city has all but been destroyed and thousands of people have died with hundreds of thousands more suffering, but it’s certainly not a time for people to be pointing fingers and trying to find a bigger dog to blame for local corruption and incompetence. Pray to God for the survivors that they can start their lives anew as fast as possible and we learn from all the mistakes to avoid them in the future.


www.insidebayarea.com/ci_3001032

White House shifts blame
Administration points to state, local officials

By Manuel Roig-Franzia and Spencer Hsu, WASHINGTON POST

NEW ORLEANS Tens of thousands of people spent a fifth day awaiting evacuation from this ruined city, as Bush administration officials blamed state and local authorities for what leaders at all levels have called a failure of the country's emergency management.

President Bush authorized the dispatch of 7,200 active-duty ground forces to the area the first major commitment of regular ground troops in the crisis and the Pentagon announced an additional 10,000 National Guard troops will be sent to Louisiana and Mississippi, raising the total Guard contingent to about 40,000.

Authorities reported progress in restoring order and electricity and repairing levees, as a hospital ship arrived and cruise ships were sent to provide temporary housing for victims. As Louisiana officials expressed confidence that they had begun to get a handle on the crisis, a dozen National Guard troops broke into applause late Saturday as Isaac Kelly, 81, the last person to be evacuated from the Superdome, boarded a school bus.

But there remained an overwhelming display of human misery on the streets of New Orleans, where the last 1,500 people were being evacuated from the Convention Center amid an overpowering odor of human waste and rotting garbage.

The evacuees, most of them black and poor, spoke of violence, anarchy and family members who died for lack of food, water and medical care.

About 42,000 people had been evacuated from the city by Saturday afternoon, with roughly the same number remaining, city officials said. Search-and-rescue efforts continued in flooded areas of the city, where an unknown number of people wait in their homes, on rooftops or in makeshift shelters.

Hundreds of thousands of people have been displaced by the flooding 250,000 have been absorbed by Texas alone, and local radio reported that Baton Rouge will have doubled in population by Monday. Federal officials said they have begun to collect corpses but could not guess the total toll.

Behind the scenes, a power struggle emerged, as federal officials tried to wrest authority from Louisiana Gov. Kathleen Babineaux Blanco, D. Shortly before midnight Friday, the Bush administration sent her a proposed legal memorandum asking her to request a federal takeover of the evacuation of New Orleans, a source within the state's emergency operations center said Saturday.

The administration sought unified control over all local police and state National Guard units reporting to the governor. Louisiana officials rejected the request after talks throughout the night, concerned that such a move was comparable to a federal declaration of martial law. Some officials in the state suspected a political motive behind the request.

“Quite frankly, if they'd been able to pull off taking it away from the locals, they then could have blamed everything on the locals,” said the source, who does not have the authority to speak publicly.

Bureaucracy blamed by feds

A senior administration official said that Bush has clear legal authority to federalize National Guard units to quell civil disturbances under the Insurrection Act and will continue to try to unify chains of command split among the president, Louisiana governor and New Orleans mayor. Louisiana did not reach out to a multistate mutual aid compact for assistance until Wednesday, three state and federal officials said. As of Saturday, Blanco still had not declared a state of emergency, the senior Bush official said.

“The federal government stands ready to work with state and local officials to secure New Orleans and the state of Louisiana,” White House spokesman Dan Bartlett said. “The president will not let any form of bureaucracy get in the way of protecting the citizens of Louisiana.”

Blanco made two moves Saturday that protected her independence from the federal government: She created a philanthropic fund for the state's victims and hired

James Lee Witt, Federal Emergency Management Agency director in the Clinton administration, to advise her on the relief effort. Bush, who has been criticized, even by supporters, for the delayed response to the disaster, used his weekly radio address to put responsibility for the failure on lower levels of government. The magnitude of the crisis “has created tremendous problems that have strained state and local capabilities,” he said. “The result is that many of our citizens simply are not getting the help they need, especially in New Orleans. And that is unacceptable.”

In a Washington briefing, Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff said one reason federal assets were not used more quickly was “because our constitutional system really places the primary authority in each state with the governor.”

Chertoff planned to fly overnight to the New Orleans area to take charge of deploying expanded federal and military assets for several days, he said. Chertoff said he maintained “full confidence” in under secretary and FEMA Director Michael D. Brown, the federal officer in charge of the Katrina response.

Brown, a frequent target of New Orleans Mayor C. Ray Nagin's wrath, said Saturday that “the mayor can order an evacuation and try to evacuate the city, but if the mayor does not have the resources to get the poor, elderly, the disabled, those who cannot, out, or if he does not even have police capacity to enforce the mandatory evacuation, to make people leave, then you end up with the kind of situation we have right now in New Orleans.”

Official says FEMA unprepared

New Orleans City Council President Oliver Thomas acknowledged that the city was surprised by the number of refugees left behind, but said FEMA should have been prepared to assist.

“Everybody shares the blame here,” said Thomas. “But when you talk about the mightiest government in the world, that's a ludicrous and lame excuse. You're FEMA, and you're the big dog. And you weren't prepared either.” State officials had planned to turn to neighboring states for help with troops, transportation and equipment in a major hurricane. But in Katrina's case, Mississippi, Alabama and Florida were also overwhelmed, said Denise Bottcher, a Blanco spokeswoman. Bush canceled a visit with Chinese President Hu Jintao that had been scheduled for Wednesday and made plans to return to the Gulf Coast on Monday. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld and Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice scheduled visits to the region, as troops continue to pour in.

Top Bush administration officials met at the White House with African-American leaders amid criticism that the federal response to Hurricane Katrina has neglected impoverished victims, many of them black.

Chertoff, Housing Secretary Alphonso Jackson, White House domestic policy adviser Claude Allen and Pentagon homeland security official Peter Verga met for two hours with NAACP President Bruce Gordon, National Urban League President Marc H. Morial, Rep. Elijah E. Cummings, D-Md., the former chairman of the Congressional Black Caucus, and its current chairman, Rep. Melvin Watt, D-N.C., who participated by phone.

“I think they wanted to make sure that the leaders of the Congressional Black Caucus, the Urban League and the NAACP knew that they were very sensitive to trying to make sure that things went right from here on out,” Cummings said, according to his spokeswoman, Devika Koppikar.

www.newshounds.us/2005/09/04/cavuto_guests_absolve_bush_of_all_blame_claim_his_advisors_tell_him_what_to_do.php



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
CAVUTO: Well, Jim Rogers, you've been arguing as someone from this area that the levees have always been a problem and always been a corrupt source of issue for politicians there.

ROGERS: Neil. Neil. None of this had to happen. Most of this did not have to happen. Those levees have been there - the Levee Board in New Orleans in the past ten years has bought a casino, a private marina, a private plane. They have several hundred million dollars invested with their friends but they have not taken care of the levees. If somebody had protected those levees, New Orleans would not have flooded, so this is caused by local politicians and they should all resign. They're screaming at the President. They should be resigning. They brought it on themselves.
Link Posted: 9/10/2005 5:24:15 PM EDT
FWIW, I have the Powerpoint slide show given by a member of the Louisiana Office of Homeland Security and Emergency Preparedness on August 20 of last year. The slides contain the following information:

1. Slide 3: "All disaster response begins and ends at the local level". This is required by law. The federal government cannot initiate any level of response to a disaster until and unless the state governor requests it.

2. Slide 4: "Response must be beyond the resources of state and local government". Again, it's the law. The federal government cannot move a single resource until the state certifies that it has exhausted all efforts.

3. Slides 8 and 9: These slides explain the steps that must be taken before the federal government (and the DOD) can even begin a response.

4. Slide 12: This slide explains the steps that the Louisiana Office of Homeland Security and Emergency Preparedness are supposed to take when a disaster is imminent.

5. Slide 14: Discusses the Hurricane Pam Exercise in July 2004.

6. Slide 15: Exercise scenario. Please note that they expected parts of New Orleans to be flooded by 10-20 feet of water.

7. Slide 16: The SLUSH model used during the exercise.

8. Slide 17: This explains some of the damage they expected.

9. Slides 18, 19: These slides discuss the plans and "accomplishments" made as a result of the exercise.

Very interesting information.
Link Posted: 9/10/2005 11:04:42 PM EDT
taparoni
Link Posted: 9/10/2005 11:27:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ScrubJ:
FWIW, I have the Powerpoint slide show given by a member of the Louisiana Office of Homeland Security and Emergency Preparedness on August 20 of last year.



Where can I get that? Feel free to e-mail me.
Link Posted: 9/10/2005 11:28:33 PM EDT
Take my advice and save yourself alot of wasted time and energy "Don't feed the Liberal Jihadist's Anger Monkeys". You can present a Frustrated Liberal with as many Facts, Figures, and evidence that you can come up with and it will not sway them one bit.


Why? Because Facts and Truth are like Kryptonite to a Frustrated Liberal. Most are just filled with so much bitterness and outright Hatred for GWB or just Republicans in general that it consumes their very lives. I say,you just say your peace ,and end it there ,I'm telling you that "gets the goat" of a Frustrated Liberal more than anything you could do. Liberals like to call it "Starting A Dialogue", I call it "Whiney Liberal Noise Pollution".

Hell ,Liberals Hate , obsessive urge to become French, Reading their Daily purchased "New York Times" while drinking their Daily "Grande' Mocha Skinny Soy Latte's", are probably the only things that keep half these DUmmies from pulling a "Hunter S. Thompson", and We can't have that can we?................................because, then who will we have to Openly Mock, laugh at,lampoon, derided ,and have to compare to the "French" then?
Link Posted: 9/10/2005 11:30:34 PM EDT
Anything to blame Bush... ANYTHING!
Link Posted: 9/10/2005 11:37:57 PM EDT

Originally Posted By CMB69:

Originally Posted By ScrubJ:
FWIW, I have the Powerpoint slide show given by a member of the Louisiana Office of Homeland Security and Emergency Preparedness on August 20 of last year.



Where can I get that? Feel free to e-mail me.



Yes, ScrubJ, feel free to post that mofo, mofo.
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