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9/16/2019 10:09:13 PM
Posted: 1/4/2012 11:14:33 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/4/2012 11:17:59 AM EDT by tommytrauma]
Interesting newsletter from Gabe Surez;
Fred was temporarily assigned to county jail until he caught the chain for a nickel at CDC...probably Soledad. He was a convict, and the ink on his arms was a resume of murders and other miscellaneous violence. Fred worked for me. His main goal in life was to be able to write to his wife and kids while he was inside. Funny what a pad of paper and a few pencils and envelops can get you. <o:p></o:p>


I asked him once when we were out of earshot. He had stabbed plenty of enemies in his life, many never accounted for in the legal system.

"You grab the shank like this", he showed it held in forward grip close to the body. "Slap 'em in the face like this...then run it in hard and fast until he drops. Shank 'em in the guts and in the balls". He explained how that worked well against one target...specially if he was bigger than you.

"If you have two or three you need to take, grab it like this", he showed reverse grip. "Attack the face, then when they block, trap the hand and stab hard into the neck...leave that guy and go for the next one, then come back for seconds".

Most guys that study the knife study from the perceived notion of defending against the knife. They begin with the premise that they are unarmed and that the bad man has the knife. In reality that is as difficult a place to begin as facing a skilled gunman already pointed in at 5 yards, finger on the trigger, and you have no gun. Why do we do that to ourselves? If at the beginning of the fight, you are thinking, "Oh me ... oh my...I am going to get in legal hot water for this", you have already lost.

Perhaps its time to get the mind right about this subject and leave the nonsense and foolishness aside. If we change the point of view to a man armed with a knife, the entire table changes. Perhaps it is time to leave the "Unarmed Good Guy facing The Knife Armed bad Guy" illusion and look at reality through different, darker, and more violent eyes.


I'm struggling to parse any real point out of this. Don't train for unarmed vs. knife 'cause it sucks to be in that position?
Even if you are armed, a significant percentage of knife attacks are surprise events, and the trick is staying alive long enough to get your own weapon into play. That depends on unarmed combatives (and a crapload of luck). Go armed in case you're confronted by a knife wielding perp? Well it's hard to argue with that advice, but for many it's not a consistent option, and again, discounting unarmed training lessens the chance of staying alive long enough to light the guy up. Carry a knife as well as a gun? Again, not a consistent option for everyone, and you still need to stay alive and functional long enough to get it into play.

In the vast majority of stab wound patients I've seen (exempting domestic assaults), the victim didn't even know there was a knife in play until they were bleeding.

I've been studying Krav Maga for about two and a half years now. We do a lot of disarms, and we've done it with shock knives. We all know too well that it's a 'oh shit' last ditch move. Does that mean we shouldn't train in such?

So I guess I'm at a loss as to the point of this "article". Anyone?

Link Posted: 1/4/2012 11:15:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/4/2012 11:17:06 AM EDT by DRhodes]
Gabe Saurez is a doucher.
Link Posted: 1/4/2012 11:20:43 AM EDT
What I got from that is you should train to fight dirty and effectively, just like the bad guys. Going for the balls and whatnot. Maybe I'm interpreting it incorrectly?
Link Posted: 1/4/2012 11:25:07 AM EDT
Originally Posted By By_the_Bayonet:
What I got from that is you should train to fight dirty and effectively, just like the bad guys. Going for the balls and whatnot. Maybe I'm interpreting it incorrectly?

I guess I've simply never seen a decent combatives system that didn't already do so. Lord knows KM certainly does.


Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 1/4/2012 11:26:25 AM EDT
Originally Posted By tommytrauma:
Originally Posted By By_the_Bayonet:
What I got from that is you should train to fight dirty and effectively, just like the bad guys. Going for the balls and whatnot. Maybe I'm interpreting it incorrectly?

I guess I've simply never seen a decent combatives system that didn't already do so. Lord knows KM certainly does.


Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile


I agree. I guess that means either my assessment is wrong, or this writer doesn't know that.
Link Posted: 1/4/2012 11:32:47 AM EDT
I am confused.

Most guys that study the knife study from the perceived notion of defending against the knife. They begin with the premise that they are unarmed and that the bad man has the knife. In reality that is as difficult a place to begin as facing a skilled gunman already pointed in at 5 yards, finger on the trigger, and you have no gun. Why do we do that to ourselves? If at the beginning of the fight, you are thinking, "Oh me ... oh my...I am going to get in legal hot water for this", you have already lost.

Maybe the whole article or link needs to be shared, but if I am unarmed against a knife wielder, I am looking for an exit or cover. IMHO Knives are more dangerous the guns at close range. Not sure where the legal issue comes into play?

Let me see if I find the video of the maniac with the knife who kills 3 brazilian cops.

Link Posted: 1/4/2012 11:47:28 AM EDT
He is trying to lower your internal self perspective. If you are thinking about the differences of armed vs unarmed, or knife vs gun, or gun vs fists- if you are labeling catagories of weapons instead of just recognizing and fighting the threat, then you are surrendering the initiative.

The internal math to fight should be animal like. Respond to your physical fight flight response. Don't label gun -knife -fist : because if a man wants to attack you .... just... just... just....fight. Don't fuck around. Pour out your best defense immediately.

You are already dead.... Fight like hell.
Link Posted: 1/4/2012 11:51:42 AM EDT

Originally Posted By 1IV:
He is trying to lower your internal self perspective. If you are thinking about the differences of armed vs unarmed, or knife vs gun, or gun vs fists- if you are labeling catagories of weapons instead of just recognizing and fighting the threat, then you are surrendering the initiative.

The internal math to fight should be animal like. Respond to your physical fight flight response. Don't label gun -knife -fist : because if a man wants to attack you .... just... just... just....fight. Don't fuck around. Pour out your best defense immediately.

You are already dead.... Fight like hell.

The only rule, is WIN! If that means tearing off a guys ear, gouging out an eye, or biting his nose off...you do what you have to do to survive.

CVN
Link Posted: 1/4/2012 12:06:21 PM EDT

Originally Posted By 1IV:
He is trying to lower your internal self perspective. If you are thinking about the differences of armed vs unarmed, or knife vs gun, or gun vs fists- if you are labeling catagories of weapons instead of just recognizing and fighting the threat, then you are surrendering the initiative.

The internal math to fight should be animal like. Respond to your physical fight flight response. Don't label gun -knife -fist : because if a man wants to attack you .... just... just... just....fight. Don't fuck around. Pour out your best defense immediately.

You are already dead.... Fight like hell.

Ahh... he's endorsing retzev. That would fit.
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