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Posted: 11/1/2006 11:31:27 AM EST
Florida Police Chief Ousted After 'Jelly Bellies' Memo Telling Cops to Get Fit
Wednesday, November 01, 2006

E-MAIL STORY PRINTER FRIENDLY VERSION
AP


WINTER HAVEN, Fla. — Police Chief Paul Goward was tired of looking around his department and seeing blubber hanging over the belts of some of his officers. So he sent out a memo exhorting the "jelly bellies" to shape up.

In the end, the department lost 190 pounds — all of them belonging to Goward. He was forced out as chief because some of his officers took offense at the memo.

The Oct. 11 memo bruised feelings on the 80-member force, drew at least one anonymous letter of complaint from officers about the chief's management style and made his department the butt of jokes about fat cops and doughnuts.

"If they got their feelings hurt to the extent of 'Do something about it,' then I did what I was intending to do," said an unapologetic Goward, a trim 6-footer who was forced to resign his $92,000-a-year post last week.

Some of the chief's defenders said his ouster was a big overreaction.

"He offered tremendously good advice, yet he was sacked," wrote Thomas Roe Oldt, a columnist for The Ledger of Lakeland.

In his memo, titled "Are You a Jelly Belly," the chief never singled anyone out, and apart from the title, didn't call anyone names.

Instead, he provided a list of 10 reasons police officers should be in shape. He said overweight police poorly represent the profession, poop out when chasing suspects and might have to resort to "a higher level of force" if a criminal got the upper hand in a fight. He said out-of-shape cops are a liability to the city and their families.

"Take a good look at yourself," he wrote. "If you are unfit, do yourself and everyone else a favor. See a professional about a proper diet and a fitness training program, quit smoking, limit alcohol intake and start thinking self-pride, confidence and respectability. And stop making excuses for delaying what you know you should have been doing years ago. We didn't hire you unfit and we don't want you working unfit. Don't mean to offend, this is just straight talk. I owe it to you."

Winter Haven cops must pass physical examinations to be hired but are not regularly tested for fitness thereafter.

Goward, 60, said he is not a fitness freak, was not "asking for a department full of Arnold Schwarzeneggers here" and did not order his officers to stay away from fast-food restaurants or doughnut shops. In fact, the 36-year police veteran, who has also worked in Kansas and South Carolina, said Winter Haven's force is no less fit than the others he has served on.

David Greene, manager of the central Florida city of 30,000, said through a spokeswoman that he was too busy for an interview, but told the local newspapers the anonymous complaint letters made it clear the police department had a morale problem because of Goward's abrasive management style during his 2 1/2 years there.

"Emotions within the police department and the relationship with the police chief became raw," he told The Ledger.

Winter Haven officers contacted by The Associated Press said they were told not to talk to reporters about Goward's departure.

One of the anonymous complaint letters described the force as "upset to say the least" about the chief and called the "Jelly Belly" memo "the icing on the cake."

"This letter shows the type of harassment and hostile work environment we have. The chief of police is constantly 'bad talking' us in every way possible and we have had enough of his arrogance," the letter read.

Mandy Rohrbaugh, a 40-year-old nursing student and Winter Haven resident, said Goward had the right message, but perhaps could have delivered it differently.

"I think honestly our police force needs a lot of shaping up, and I think they should be fit not just when they're hired but through their time," she said.


You guys should get a kick out of this.

Link Posted: 11/1/2006 11:35:23 AM EST
Thats hillarious.

Don't offend the sweeties!


PC BS continues the rise to new levels.
Cops should not be fatasses.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 11:35:23 AM EST
Well, hate to say it but he ignored the first rule of governmental service: Its not about solving problems, its about not getting blamed for anything.

Link Posted: 11/1/2006 11:37:51 AM EST
QUESTION: Is it too much to ask that our Law Enforcement Officers are physically fit and capable of not only performing their duties, but also be able to protect themselves in the event of a physical altercation with a bad guy???

ANSWER: Hell Yes!!! Physical Fitness?? We don't need no physical fitness.


Link Posted: 11/1/2006 11:41:42 AM EST
Maybe the chief should send a Whitman Sampler as an apology to the cops he offended

(Sugar free ofcourse)
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 11:45:00 AM EST
That's crazy...it sounds like he was really trying to do something in everyones best interest (except the criminals being chased by cops might have become more fit etc).
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 11:46:30 AM EST
I'm guessing that it wasn't the fit cops who complained.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 11:47:25 AM EST

Originally Posted By extra_ammo:
QUESTION: Is it too much to ask that our Law Enforcement Officers are physically fit and capable of not only performing their duties, but also be able to protect themselves in the event of a physical altercation with a bad guy???

ANSWER: Hell Yes!!! Physical Fitness?? We don't need no physical fitness.




I suppose one could also wonder if the chief is "under-employed" if he has time to sit around authoring self help memo's.

Next, there is always a question of what "fitness" means. Is it a "runner" who can run 10 miles a day, but has very little upper body strength? A power lifter that weighs 275, can sprint like a stone wall, but can bench 450 and squat 600?

I've had more issues with the "runners" who simply don't want to chase after people, than fat guys who can't run that far. Although I have heard or witnessed some wild foot chases, that just go on, and on.

Plus I'm sure if we looked we would find memo's on parallel parking, use and care of hats, and a whole bunch of other moonbattery. This is just the final straw.

Next, he says he didn't single anyone out. Why not? Most police officers have regular reviews. Why weren't the ones that might have issues talked to in private about those issues? Instead of subjecting everyone to a dumb memo. What kind of a management does that?
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 11:51:29 AM EST
No comment....
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 11:54:08 AM EST
Bullshit.

While I certainly qualified as a "jelly belly" officer, it's total crap to can the Cheif because of this.

It's his JOB to ensure that his agency is at it's potential. If that means demanding a degree of physical fitness, he's the one in the position to call for it.

I'm sure the community lost a valuable asset here.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 11:57:20 AM EST

Originally Posted By nationwide:
Bullshit.

While I certainly qualified as a "jelly belly" officer, it's total crap to can the Cheif because of this.

It's his JOB to ensure that his agency is at it's potential. If that means demanding a degree of physical fitness, he's the one in the position to call for it.

I'm sure the community lost a valuable asset here.


I suppose one could also wonder if the chief is "under-employed" if he has time to sit around authoring self help memo's.

Plus I'm sure if we looked we would find memo's on parallel parking, use and care of hats, and a whole bunch of other moonbattery. This is just the final straw.

Next, he says he didn't single anyone out. Why not? Most police officers have regular reviews. Why weren't the ones that might have issues talked to in private about those issues? Instead of subjecting everyone to a dumb memo. What kind of a management does that?

Link Posted: 11/1/2006 11:58:16 AM EST
"..limit alcohol intake"? Well that would do it for me.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 12:00:39 PM EST

Originally Posted By OLY-M4gery:

I suppose one could also wonder if the chief is "under-employed" if he has time to sit around authoring self help memo's.


Yeah, there are lot's of Chief's who still uniform up, and go on the road, while others are very happy driving their desk.

You are probably right, there's likely more to the story.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 12:04:21 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/1/2006 12:13:14 PM EST by CWO]
The police Chief is responsible for his Department and its performance. If he chooses to write a memo on any subject in the interest of his Department's performance - then it is in his purview and his responsibility to do so. He saw a problem and chose to urge officers to consider whether their weight was an issue. I saw nothing wrong with the memo - although I would not have chosen that subject line. Mox nix.

To say that the Chief should refrain from communicating with his officer's through memos is silly.

Next police Chiefs will have to have encounter groups to get anything done.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 12:08:05 PM EST
Actually, that was good leadership. What a bunch of pussies.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 12:13:30 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/1/2006 12:14:45 PM EST by gonzo_beyondo]

Originally Posted By OLY-M4gery:

I suppose one could also wonder if the chief is "under-employed" if he has time to sit around authoring self help memo's.

Plus I'm sure if we looked we would find memo's on parallel parking, use and care of hats, and a whole bunch of other moonbattery. This is just the final straw.


You have a point here. If this guy is sending out the daily TPS report then it could easily come to a head. On the other hand, if he saw what looked more like a zoo than a department and felt disgusted, then I feel he has a point, as well as a right. He's the damn boss.

Lets continue...



Next, there is always a question of what "fitness" means. Is it a "runner" who can run 10 miles a day, but has very little upper body strength? A power lifter that weighs 275, can sprint like a stone wall, but can bench 450 and squat 600?


I'm assuming the topic of discussion here would be disgusting fatbodies.
Brick shithouses would not need apply.


I've had more issues with the "runners" who simply don't want to chase after people, than fat guys who can't run that far. Although I have heard or witnessed some wild foot chases, that just go on, and on.


Laziness is a seperate issue. Shouldn't be tolerated either.

A cop should be held to a degree of fitness, regardless of his size, he should be capable of completing a physical course based on specific criteria, like age, etc.. Provided he can pass the course, he would be deemed fit for duty. Should be an annual test at least.

That said, he should look professional, not like a slob. Appearance is a seperate issue.




Next, he says he didn't single anyone out. Why not? Most police officers have regular reviews. Why weren't the ones that might have issues talked to in private about those issues? Instead of subjecting everyone to a dumb memo. What kind of a management does that?


The kind who wants to avoid lawsuits for harassment?
Seems like the only way to be fair and non-partial is to send a memo.

For example... "The body odor in the station is making me blow chunks. You know who you are. Take a fucking shower immediately. Thank you."

Say that to a person directly, he/she/it (in the case of San Francisco) could take it as just a personal attack. Nobody wants to be singled out and "picked on".
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 12:17:39 PM EST

Originally Posted By CWO:
The police Chief is responsible for his Department and its perfromance. If he chooses to write a memo on any subject in the interest of his Department's performance - then it is in his purview and his responsibility to do so. He saw a problem and chose to urge officers to consider whether their weight was an issue. I saw nothing wrong with the memo - although I would not have chosen that subject line. Mox nix.

To say that the Chief should refrain from communicating with his officer's through memos is silly.

Next police Chiefs will have to have encounter groups to get anything done.


There's a time and a place for memo's.

The problem I have had with memo's, is that one or a few employees will do something, or not do something, or do that something in a poor way. Instead of addressing the issue immediately with the people doing it, whatever is being done will be allowed to go on, then a memo will come out, that is addressed to everyone.

Invariably some of the offenders will ignore the memo.

There's a theory in management it either 95/5 or 90/10 But 90/95 percent of an organization's problems will be caused by 10/5 percent of the workers. Many place don't directly address the 10/5%, but make rules for the ENITRE organization due to the behavior of the troublesome employees.

The better way to do it, is to make rules in the organization for the 90/95% of the employees that don't cause problems, and deal with the troublemakers directly - individually.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 12:20:10 PM EST
Didn't he see "Supersize Me"?

It's all McDonalds fault.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 12:20:42 PM EST
Why do you need semi annual or annual passing PFT scores in the military but not as a police officer?
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 12:22:41 PM EST
you should see the fat fucks at the Franklin County Sheriff's Dept here in Columbus, Oh. How the hell can they chase down a suspect without getting a cornary
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 12:23:10 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/1/2006 12:38:38 PM EST by HKocher]

Originally Posted By OLY-M4gery:
I suppose one could also wonder if the chief is "under-employed" if he has time to sit around authoring self help memo's.

Plus I'm sure if we looked we would find memo's on parallel parking, use and care of hats, and a whole bunch of other moonbattery. This is just the final straw.


Heh heh. The Assistant Chief usually send out all the 'moonbat' memos around here.

Not too long ago, there was a memo requesting POs stay off cell phones while driving, because it takes their attention off the road. (I guess in car radios and laptops are NOT distracting). The memo suggested the use of hands-free cell phone devices.

A month or so later, the same Ass. Chief sent out a memo BANNING the use of hands-free cell phone devices because they looked unprofessional (actually, I do think those silly ear pieces look like shit) and make it harder to hear radio transmissions.

*Edited to add

Before some smart ass jumps in and says: “Why do you need to waste my tax dollars chatting on the phone at work?” Let me explain that I had to shell out my own cash for a work cell phone (hate cell phones, only bought it for work), and consider it an essential tool of the trade. I often need to call victims, witnesses, fellow officers, teleprocessors, other departments/agencies, etc., and a cell phone allows me to stay in service and on the streets, instead of heading to the station when the need arrives. Not to mention making a long distance call from the station requires three forms and the chief’s signature (ok, I’m exaggerating, but it’s still a pain).

Oh, and yes, I do occasionally use it to briefly call my wife while on duty. If you’ve never made a personal call while at work, feel free to criticize me.


Link Posted: 11/1/2006 12:29:15 PM EST

Originally Posted By Paveway_:
Why do you need semi annual or annual passing PFT scores in the military but not as a police officer?


Because police officers are civilians silly.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 12:46:14 PM EST

Originally Posted By Paveway_:
Why do you need semi annual or annual passing PFT scores in the military but not as a police officer?


Paveway_, reality is a little different than a reasonable person can deduce logically. That's why we won't give up our guns, because the authorities aren't always on the ball.

Actually, the reality is that the world is stark-raving nuts and you better keep a sharp eye on it.

Granted, the popo do a good job when they do show up, and I'll happily put away my weapons when they are around, so the popo feel safe around me.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 12:47:50 PM EST
I never understood why police recuits do all that PT during their class, then from the day they graduate they never have to any PT at all for the rest of their careers.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 12:50:26 PM EST

Originally Posted By q3131:
I never understood why police recuits do all that PT during their class, then from the day they graduate they never have to any PT at all for the rest of their careers.


That all depends on the department rules. Some require it, some don't.

A lot of the departments around here require PT tests for officers transferring to their departments.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 12:54:41 PM EST
They should hire him back and fire the fat cops.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 12:57:16 PM EST
PT test once a year here. I agree there is more to the story. Somehow I think the chief gives the term "Micromanagement" a whole new meaning.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 12:58:57 PM EST

Originally Posted By Da_Bunny:

Originally Posted By Paveway_:
Why do you need semi annual or annual passing PFT scores in the military but not as a police officer?


Paveway_, reality is a little different than a reasonable person can deduce logically. That's why we won't give up our guns, because the authorities aren't always on the ball.

Actually, the reality is that the world is stark-raving nuts and you better keep a sharp eye on it.

Granted, the popo do a good job when they do show up, and I'll happily put away my weapons when they are around, so the popo feel safe around me.


Que?

I fail to see why cops can't be held to a PT standard. Its not that hard.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 1:12:29 PM EST

Originally Posted By q3131:
I never understood why police recuits do all that PT during their class, then from the day they graduate they never have to any PT at all for the rest of their careers.


Let me interject $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$­$$

If you require officers to do "PT", you have to pay to have them there. There generally aren't extra officers in a schedule. So, you pay fot the officer to do PT, as well as an officer, generally on OT, to cover that officers beat during the PT test.

Not to mention injuries.
Then the issue if someone fails, the department has to offer remdial training, guess who is getting paid then too?

Then if you actually fire, or discipline someone for failing PT, there will likely be a lawsuit, which the PD has to prove the standards they want met are fair, and relevant.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 1:23:34 PM EST
Ok guys,I work for the FD in the same city here, and maybe can shed a little extra light on the subject:

This department has been down 14 patrol officers for well over a year now, and this Chief has made NO effort to hire replacements.

The department has been plagued with bad officers getting busted fighting at bars in thier own jurisdiction, getting hookers to flash thier tits and have sex with them in the cruiser, many intra-office affairs that have ended bad for both parties, and lots of other problems that get filed under the integrity department.

The city manager has been looking for an excuse to bring in the former chief from the city he used to work for. He appointed this former buddy Chief of our PD two days after telling the former Chief to resign, without going through any formal hiring process whatsoever!

And I think that the city manager being at least 150lbs. overweight had alot to do with it!!! lol

Most of the officers that I have talked to seem happy to be getting a new chief.

556mm

p.s. sorry if my ramblings are hard to follow, i'm trying to get dinner fixed!
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 1:26:17 PM EST

Originally Posted By OLY-M4gery:

Originally Posted By q3131:
I never understood why police recuits do all that PT during their class, then from the day they graduate they never have to any PT at all for the rest of their careers.


Let me interject $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$­$$

If you require officers to do "PT", you have to pay to have them there. There generally aren't extra officers in a schedule. So, you pay fot the officer to do PT, as well as an officer, generally on OT, to cover that officers beat during the PT test.

Not to mention injuries.
Then the issue if someone fails, the department has to offer remdial training, guess who is getting paid then too?

Then if you actually fire, or discipline someone for failing PT, there will likely be a lawsuit, which the PD has to prove the standards they want met are fair, and relevant.


No they meet standards or they dont, they can stay in shape and do PT in their own time. If standards are outlined before the person is hired, and they agree, there would be little grounds for a law suit.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 1:27:24 PM EST
Damn.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 1:29:55 PM EST
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 1:30:02 PM EST
A man has only himself to blame if he is out of shape.
Fitness is a choice. Im not even going to say that working out is fun...there are things I would rather be doing...but as with most things that are worth achieving....sacrifice is involved.

Get out and do a few laps around the block...society needs to stop blaming the people that make the shitty food and start blaming the people that are shoving into their mouths. just my $0.02
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 1:30:02 PM EST

Originally Posted By OLY-M4gery:

Originally Posted By extra_ammo:
QUESTION: Is it too much to ask that our Law Enforcement Officers are physically fit and capable of not only performing their duties, but also be able to protect themselves in the event of a physical altercation with a bad guy???

ANSWER: Hell Yes!!! Physical Fitness?? We don't need no physical fitness.




I suppose one could also wonder if the chief is "under-employed" if he has time to sit around authoring self help memo's.

Next, there is always a question of what "fitness" means. Is it a "runner" who can run 10 miles a day, but has very little upper body strength? A power lifter that weighs 275, can sprint like a stone wall, but can bench 450 and squat 600?

I've had more issues with the "runners" who simply don't want to chase after people, than fat guys who can't run that far. Although I have heard or witnessed some wild foot chases, that just go on, and on.

Plus I'm sure if we looked we would find memo's on parallel parking, use and care of hats, and a whole bunch of other moonbattery. This is just the final straw.

Next, he says he didn't single anyone out. Why not? Most police officers have regular reviews. Why weren't the ones that might have issues talked to in private about those issues? Instead of subjecting everyone to a dumb memo. What kind of a management does that?



Ever been in the military?

That shit goes on all the time...
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 1:32:03 PM EST
I hate this pc world.

Link Posted: 11/1/2006 1:35:51 PM EST

Originally Posted By Paveway_:

Originally Posted By OLY-M4gery:

Originally Posted By q3131:
I never understood why police recuits do all that PT during their class, then from the day they graduate they never have to any PT at all for the rest of their careers.


Let me interject $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$­$$

If you require officers to do "PT", you have to pay to have them there. There generally aren't extra officers in a schedule. So, you pay fot the officer to do PT, as well as an officer, generally on OT, to cover that officers beat during the PT test.

Not to mention injuries.
Then the issue if someone fails, the department has to offer remdial training, guess who is getting paid then too?

Then if you actually fire, or discipline someone for failing PT, there will likely be a lawsuit, which the PD has to prove the standards they want met are fair, and relevant.


No they meet standards or they dont, they can stay in shape and do PT in their own time. If standards are outlined before the person is hired, and they agree, there would be little grounds for a law suit.



Another issue. Is the brass, most would not be able to pass a PT test.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 1:39:22 PM EST

Originally Posted By Johninaustin:
PT test once a year here. I agree there is more to the story. Somehow I think the chief gives the term "Micromanagement" a whole new meaning.


Does the PT test include brass all the way up to the Chief?
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 1:47:29 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/1/2006 1:49:49 PM EST by nchapa]
I dont know if i would consider myself a jelly belly, i like to say i have a keg instead of a six pack, or a washing macine instead of washboard abs. But having a few extra pounds means nothing when i know i can out run and outlift most of the thin guys i work with (i know cause i've done it). if its about appearance then thats a different story.

there is a guy that i work with about 6' tall 350lbs benches about 450, and has caught everysingle person that ever ran from him, we call him the flying buffalo. just imagine him running at you, and he doesnt just like to grab people he runs them over.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 1:54:53 PM EST

David Greene, manager of the central Florida city of 30,000, said through a spokeswoman that he was too busy for an interview, but told the local newspapers the anonymous complaint letters made it clear the police department had a morale problem because of Goward's abrasive management style during his 2 1/2 years there.

"Emotions within the police department and the relationship with the police chief became raw," he told The Ledger.

Winter Haven officers contacted by The Associated Press said they were told not to talk to reporters about Goward's departure.

One of the anonymous complaint letters described the force as "upset to say the least" about the chief and called the "Jelly Belly" memo "the icing on the cake."

"This letter shows the type of harassment and hostile work environment we have. The chief of police is constantly 'bad talking' us in every way possible and we have had enough of his arrogance," the letter read.


Sorry, we are now out of straws.

Link Posted: 11/1/2006 1:56:57 PM EST
Ban fat.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 2:20:53 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/1/2006 2:25:41 PM EST by southpaw67]
...

Link Posted: 11/1/2006 2:25:08 PM EST

Originally Posted By southpaw67:
so JBT is now Jelly Belly thug?


Always has been, it's been a civvy secret.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 2:55:39 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/1/2006 3:09:21 PM EST by HKocher]

Originally Posted By Paveway_:

Originally Posted By OLY-M4gery:

Originally Posted By q3131:
I never understood why police recuits do all that PT during their class, then from the day they graduate they never have to any PT at all for the rest of their careers.


Let me interject $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$­$$

If you require officers to do "PT", you have to pay to have them there. There generally aren't extra officers in a schedule. So, you pay fot the officer to do PT, as well as an officer, generally on OT, to cover that officers beat during the PT test.

Not to mention injuries.
Then the issue if someone fails, the department has to offer remdial training, guess who is getting paid then too?

Then if you actually fire, or discipline someone for failing PT, there will likely be a lawsuit, which the PD has to prove the standards they want met are fair, and relevant.


No they meet standards or they dont, they can stay in shape and do PT in their own time. If standards are outlined before the person is hired, and they agree, there would be little grounds for a law suit.


There are a few local departments around here which pay their officers to work out. I think they set aside an hour or so a day for fitness. It's a good system if you ask me. Unfortunately, this is rare, and usually only occurs in small departments in weathy municipalities.

My dept. has a yearly PT test, but it's a joke. The only folks that are paid to work out, are our HRT guys.

I keep myself in reasonably decent shape, so I'm not too worried about it. However, if you start making strict PT requirements, I think you need to start paying your POs for their workout time.

As far as 'work out in your own time', well, that's what I try to do, but it's a lot more difficult as a police officer. You schedule is never normal, so that rules out certain activities (organized sports, special classes, etc.) and certain facilities (those that aren't open 24/7). Court time, special details, manditory overtime, second jobs, etc, also eat up a lot of your free time. For example, I was off the last three days. I spent a good part of two of those days in court. The week before that, I lost days off working special details.

Not making excuses, just laying out the facts of the job.

BTW, I can't think of a single occupation that requires a certain level of fitness, but does NOT pay the employee to work out. Military, Firefighters, athletes, etc. Working out is part of their scedule, right?
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 4:09:26 PM EST

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:

Originally Posted By Johninaustin:
PT test once a year here. I agree there is more to the story. Somehow I think the chief gives the term "Micromanagement" a whole new meaning.


Does the PT test include brass all the way up to the Chief?


In theory, but I have yet to see anyone above captain on the hamster wheel. (medical stress test is part of it)
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 4:17:15 PM EST

Originally Posted By 556mm:
..... The city manager has been looking for an excuse to bring in the former chief from the city he used to work for. He appointed this former buddy Chief of our PD two days after telling the former Chief to resign, without going through any formal hiring process whatsoever!



Ahhhhh soooooo.....

Now it makes more sense.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 4:19:05 PM EST

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:

Originally Posted By Paveway_:

Originally Posted By OLY-M4gery:

Originally Posted By q3131:
I never understood why police recuits do all that PT during their class, then from the day they graduate they never have to any PT at all for the rest of their careers.


Let me interject $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$­$$

If you require officers to do "PT", you have to pay to have them there. There generally aren't extra officers in a schedule. So, you pay fot the officer to do PT, as well as an officer, generally on OT, to cover that officers beat during the PT test.

Not to mention injuries.
Then the issue if someone fails, the department has to offer remdial training, guess who is getting paid then too?

Then if you actually fire, or discipline someone for failing PT, there will likely be a lawsuit, which the PD has to prove the standards they want met are fair, and relevant.


No they meet standards or they dont, they can stay in shape and do PT in their own time. If standards are outlined before the person is hired, and they agree, there would be little grounds for a law suit.



Another issue. Is the brass, most would not be able to pass a PT test.


Is that going to be a bad thing
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 4:22:21 PM EST
I wonder what happened to the Chief that HE replaced? Did the department get away with "murder" all the time? Did he come in to the Chief position and actaully do his job? I bet there is MUCH more to this story
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 4:43:48 PM EST

Originally Posted By AKJEFF:
I wonder what happened to the Chief that HE replaced? Did the department get away with "murder" all the time? Did he come in to the Chief position and actaully do his job? I bet there is MUCH more to this story


See 556's post about half a page up.

He says 14 officer short, no hiring process to find replacements.

Misconduct issues, and criminal acts.

Meanwhile Lt Commander Queeg is writing memo's about physical fitness.

Sounds like he was doing a bang up job, if ignoring the real problems and making up problem is what the job entails.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 4:50:50 PM EST
Sounds like a good chief to me. The CHP pays a fitness incentive to every officer. The officer must take quarterly physical exams to keep receiving that pay. If they fail four quarters, they are deprived of their pay and their job. Buh-bye to the lard-arses.
Link Posted: 11/1/2006 4:57:02 PM EST

Originally Posted By Paveway_:
No they meet standards or they dont, they can stay in shape and do PT in their own time. If standards are outlined before the person is hired, and they agree, there would be little grounds for a law suit.

Contractural issue.
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