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Posted: 1/6/2006 9:58:05 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/7/2006 5:33:13 PM EDT by rdblan2]
Original thread here:

www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=8&f=29&t=219580&page=1

What a bunch of crap. The ammo is legal but they won't send it to him because he lives to close to DC?

If any of you guys could take the time and send an e-mail off to
custservnotices@sportsmansguide.com the MD arfcommers would appreciate it.

Thanks...
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 11:52:12 AM EDT
IIRC this isnt the first time this company has "shown thyself"
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 11:54:45 AM EDT
Literally 90% of the items that they say are not legal to ship to Kali are, and they know that. They just choose to "play it safe". I finally told them to stop sending me their various catalogs.

fug'em
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 11:59:09 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Lon_Moer:
Literally 90% of the items that they say are not legal to ship to Kali are, and they know that. They just choose to "play it safe". I finally told them to stop sending me their various catalogs.

fug'em



I did the same thing when they refused to ship legal ammo to me. A letter to them may help you feel better but they could care less. Save the stamp.
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 12:05:31 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 12:06:56 PM EDT

Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:
they are protecting themselves from litigation. don't blame them, blame dumbass laws and trial lawyers.

i wouldn't sell anything gun related to those areas either.

Link Posted: 1/6/2006 12:10:37 PM EDT
I have their url in my "Favorites/ammo." I've never ordered from them, but check their site from time to time, so I won't swing much weight. However, I'll send an email requesting verification of their policy and let them know they lost a POTENTIAL customer if it is as described.

"We must all hang together, or assuredly we shall all hang separately."

B. Franklin- At the signing of the Declaration of Independence
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 12:52:04 PM EDT
That sucks, but usually there are better ammo deals out there other then sportsmans guide. Or you could do what everyone said to the Kali people who have had gun/ammo problems... MOVE.

Link Posted: 1/6/2006 1:09:57 PM EDT
I've made the mistake of ordering from them on three seperate occasions over five years.

Every time the screwed up something in the order.

I should have learned my lesson but sometimes they have a deal that's "too good to be true".

And I fall for it.
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 1:12:37 PM EDT

Originally Posted By mandingo:
I've made the mistake of ordering from them on three seperate occasions over five years.

Every time the screwed up something in the order.

I should have learned my lesson but sometimes they have a deal that's "too good to be true".

And I fall for it.



I dunno, i got 100 AK mags for $2.22 each.

It sounded to good to be true.but did it anyway.

They are almost new mags.
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 1:25:21 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 3:30:28 PM EDT
btt
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 3:33:59 PM EDT
My exchange with their customer service dept:

=========
Message:
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Greetings,

I am a Club member and specifically joined in order to save money on future ammunition purchases from your catalog. It is my understanding that you will make no ammunition shipments to zip code 21401. Can you confirm this policy?


----------------------------------------------------------------------

On Jan 6, 2006, at 7:04 PM, Sportsmans Guide CS wrote:



Dear Paul,
Thank you for the E-mail.

Yes, this is true. Our lawyers have made a decision to place restrictions to protect our company. There have been too many lawsuits regarding the location, and it was a company decision to protect our investors, employees and stockholders. I'm sorry for any inconveniences.

If you have any other questions please contact us.

Enjoy the Outdoors,

Cari Scott
Customer Service

Visit our Website at www.sportsmansguide.com
Please retain your Customer ID Number for order status and fast Express Internet Checkout.
Top sellers: http://www.sportsmansguide.com/section/section.asp?s=2283
SPG Email sign up: http://www.sportsmansguide.com/email/specials_form.asp
Buyers Club Sign-up: http://www.sportsmansguide.com/club/club_tour.asp
Customer Service Phone Number 1-800-888-5222
Customer Service Fax Number 1-651-552-5305

The Sportsman's Guide
411 Farwell Ave
So St Paul, MN 55075

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Cari,

Thank you for the prompt response.

It is a shame that your company will be losing many loyal customers over the short sighted belief by your legal advisors that it would open a door for potential legal action.

The fact remains that it is legal in the state of Maryland for us to receive shipments of ammunition and that your company is playing into the hands of the anti-gun lobby. This is the same lobby that would seek to prevent your company from selling any ammunition or gun-related items whatsoever. It is apparent that your company does not care about doing the right thing.....merely separating us from our money while posturing as an All-American outdoors company.

To illustrate the absurd over reaction of your legal department, I will be taking the $200 that I was going to spend on ammo with Sportsman's Guide and spend it with the Civilian Marksmanship Program. If you are not aware, the CMP is a government established organization with the mandate to enhance safe marksmanship activities for the American public. They also happen to sell government surplus ammunition and rifles. The rifles are shipped directly to my doorstep.

I, and my fellow gun owners, will not do business with companies that discriminate against customers based on their zip code.

Kind remove my name from all of your mailing lists and cancel my club subscription immediately.


Link Posted: 1/7/2006 12:50:23 AM EDT
Yeah, I tried to get a Samuri Sword from them and they wouldn't ship it to Arizona where everything is legal except nunchucks (or however it's spelled)... So, I canceled that order.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 1:56:36 AM EDT
Very little sympathy from me. We're used to folks in the lower 48 arbitrarily deciding not to ship to Alaska.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 2:10:38 AM EDT
TALLNORTON

That wuz really good, do you think a petition could tweak thier asses ? ? ? I'll gladly sign one for you guys
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 2:26:40 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/7/2006 2:28:05 AM EDT by Skammy]

Originally Posted By Big_Bear:
I just hope the thousands of Californians getting "off list" lowers remember where NOT to buy uppers and accessories from.



Don't forget most of the dealers on this site also ..

The only people to say yes really we're

Talon Arms
and
Defensive Edge / SLR15
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 4:36:41 AM EDT

Originally Posted By TallNorton:

Dear Paul,
Thank you for the E-mail.

Yes, this is true. Our lawyers have made a decision to place restrictions to protect our company. There have been too many lawsuits regarding the location, and it was a company decision to protect our investors, employees and stockholders. I'm sorry for any inconveniences.

If you have any other questions please contact us.

Enjoy the Outdoors,

Cari Scott
Customer Service

Visit our Website at www.sportsmansguide.com
Please retain your Customer ID Number for order status and fast Express Internet Checkout.
Top sellers: http://www.sportsmansguide.com/section/section.asp?s=2283
SPG Email sign up: http://www.sportsmansguide.com/email/specials_form.asp
Buyers Club Sign-up: http://www.sportsmansguide.com/club/club_tour.asp
Customer Service Phone Number 1-800-888-5222
Customer Service Fax Number 1-651-552-5305

The Sportsman's Guide
411 Farwell Ave
So St Paul, MN 55075

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Cari,

Thank you for the prompt response.

It is a shame that your company will be losing many loyal customers over the short sighted belief by your legal advisors that it would open a door for potential legal action.

The fact remains that it is legal in the state of Maryland for us to receive shipments of ammunition and that your company is playing into the hands of the anti-gun lobby. This is the same lobby that would seek to prevent your company from selling any ammunition or gun-related items whatsoever. It is apparent that your company does not care about doing the right thing.....merely separating us from our money while posturing as an All-American outdoors company.

To illustrate the absurd over reaction of your legal department, I will be taking the $200 that I was going to spend on ammo with Sportsman's Guide and spend it with the Civilian Marksmanship Program. If you are not aware, the CMP is a government established organization with the mandate to enhance safe marksmanship activities for the American public. They also happen to sell government surplus ammunition and rifles. The rifles are shipped directly to my doorstep.

I, and my fellow gun owners, will not do business with companies that discriminate against customers based on their zip code.

Kind remove my name from all of your mailing lists and cancel my club subscription immediately.



Bravo! Someone voting with his wallet.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 5:11:00 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Az_Redneck:
Yeah, I tried to get a Samuri Sword from them and they wouldn't ship it to Arizona where everything is legal except nunchucks (or however it's spelled)... So, I canceled that order.

WOW! That is the first time of I ever heard of any weapon not being able to be shipped to AZ. We can have .50 sniper rifles to hit targets out past a mile, but don't let us have a sword. No that would be downright rude.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 5:21:23 AM EDT
1-888-844-0667

Customer Service

Closed on weekends but feel free to leave a message.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 5:26:30 AM EDT
It has probably been a year since I ordered anything from SPG. Seems kind of strange since this is where everyone ordered the 2700 round tubs of SA 5.56 a few years ago.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 5:29:33 AM EDT
Arbitrary restrictions on ammunition shipments - you lose another customer


SG,

It is my understanding you have recently refused to deliver ammunition to a Maryland resident living in Annapolis, Maryland because he was "too close to Washington D.C." The ammunition is perfectly legal and there are no restrictions sending the ammunition to this state. When asked to reply to his message with a Maryland law you said that it was not illegal, but something you were doing on your own.

If this is the case, please remove my name from all mailing lists and rest assured I will spend the hundreds of dollars I spend with you elsewhere. I will conduct no business with a company that makes and imposes it's own laws on law-abiding gun owners when you have no basis or right to do so. You were not elected, you don't get to make your own laws. Your communism is not appreciated by the residents of this state.


BTW - you've shipped me over 10,000 rounds of ammunition to my house in Columbia, MD, which is just as close as Annapolis.

Your response is appreciated.

Thanks...

Paul Britton
ID # xxxxxx

A copy of your response to this individual is included for your reference below...
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 5:30:53 AM EDT
I've been really lucky with SPG, they've been superb with all my orders and with all the club discounts and coupons I usually do better there than anywhere else.

However, because I'm not completely selfish, I did send them an email expressing my dissatisfaction at this kind of policy, and stated I would tend to shop at vendors who were not so weak-spined.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 5:46:03 AM EDT
I have done a fair amount of business with them in the past.

However, I just sent them an email telling them to take me off their catalog mailing list and I won't be doing business with them in the future.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 5:49:50 AM EDT
Just sent them this one:

Customer Service

I have recently been made aware, along with thousands of others online, that you refused to ship legal ammunition to a customer in MD because the ZIP Code was "too close to DC".

That you would refuse to send a legal product to a paying customer because they happen to reside near a state whose crime rate can more than likely be attributed to its refusal to allow its citizens the right to keep and bear arms is appalling. Considering a large portion of your product line is related in some way to the shooting sports, I find that you are, in fact, no friend to the gun community.

Please remove me from your mailing list immediately. I refuse to patronize any establishment that further suppresses the rights and liberties of fellow gun owners.

Thank You



IMAGINE IF EVERYONE ON THIS BOARD SENT ONE
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 5:51:41 AM EDT
If you call, if you email, and tell them you want to be removed as a customer, be sure and tell them WHY.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 6:04:15 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Triumph955i:

I dunno, i got 100 AK mags for $2.22 each.

It sounded to good to be true.but did it anyway.

They are almost new mags.



But they refused to sell them to me, in free state with no restrictions on anything.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 6:06:22 AM EDT
Email sent,along with my info and buyers club customer number.I spent quite a bit with them over the holidays,I would be hesitant to buy anymore if this policy stands

PS, anyone know of a way to reach Gary Olen and express our displeasure with this horseshit right to the top
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 6:07:18 AM EDT
rdblan2, you need to edit the title of this thread to start a "Fire Mission".

All AR15.com board members, please take this to the other gun boards you visit.

Only an organized boycott of pussy companies like SG will stop this madness.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 6:09:55 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 6:11:20 AM EDT
Yea,can we get a pin at the top for this Mods?I am not even saying everyone has to ask to be taken off their mailing lists,just let them know we are pissed and MAY take our money elsewhere.IMHO this is due to a weasly fuckhead lawyer that maybe ought to be chasing ambulances instead of working for a gun accessories retailer
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 6:15:05 AM EDT
Problem is unless the lawyer owns the company, he only made a recommendation. It is the owner who made the call.

Spotted, one sports and outdoor company owner with no balls!

Link Posted: 1/7/2006 6:18:26 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/7/2006 6:19:05 AM EDT by sydney7629]



Gunowners like this are the reason restrictive gun laws get passed
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 6:21:59 AM EDT
Is it just me or does he resemble the late,great Billy Ruger,may his soul be roasting in hell
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 6:54:39 AM EDT
Through the years I have bought and recieved over 20,000 rounds of various ammo from SG. I live in Reno, Nevada. One day I ordered some more and recieved an e-mail saying that they can't ship to my zip code. I sent them a nasty gram and recieved no satisfactory answer. I never cancelled their catalog because I enjoy throwing them away without reading them. Let them spend their money sending me catalogs for the next decade or until they go under. I will never buy from them again.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 9:34:35 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 10:04:15 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/7/2006 10:05:17 AM EDT by brillo]

Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:
it's called private industry guys. No one is legally obligated to sell you anything. they made a decision that they felt they needed to do to protect their business. Nothing more. You honestly beleive they don't want your business? What they don't want is some dumbass city attourney costing them thousands in bullshit legal fees in order to sell you 100.00 worth of ammo.

how much money have bushy and others lost on bullshit legal cases for selling guns in some cities? why should those of us in "free" states have to pay extra costs to cover legal fees for you guys living high risk areas for them? Don't like their business practices? CHANGE YOUR LAWS.

mike



But you're confusing their refusal to sell to a jurisdiction with highly prohibitive gun laws, i.e., the District of Columbia, with their refusal to sell to another jurisdiction because it is "too close to the District of Columbia" and "there have been too many lawsuits regarding the location", i.e., Annapolis, Maryland, the "Sailing Capital of the USA", the home of the United States Naval Academy. The laws of the state of Maryland in no way prohibit the sale and distribution of small arms ammunition - we work very hard with our elected officials to keep it that way.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 10:08:44 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 10:15:20 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/7/2006 10:16:09 AM EDT by david_g17]

Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:
it's called private industry guys. No one is legally obligated to sell you anything....




+1.

if you don't like it, you are free to open your own business and compete with them (selling to everyone you want to sell to).

I will continue to shop with them.

It's a private business; not a government organization funded by your tax dollars.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 10:18:46 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/7/2006 10:19:00 AM EDT by fight4yourrights]

Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:


it's called private industry guys. No one is legally obligated to sell you anything....





.

So I can exclude blacks from my resturant?


Gays?


Chinese?

­

No, I can't.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 10:20:21 AM EDT

Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:
no i am not.

i am standing by their refusal to do something THEY percieve <right or wrong> to be a dangerous business practice. it's their merchandise they are free to sell to whoever and wherever they want. Gun supplies and ammunition are likely a small part of their overall sales and something they don't care to get HUNG on.



Wow... I can't believe that you are defending their spineless bullshit policy.

Maybe you would change your tune if they started restricting the sale of ammo & other "verboten" items to Alabama. After all, many of these dangerous products sold in your state find their way to NYC, NJ, DC, and other collectivist shit holes where they are illegal to sell & own.

Think man...
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 10:26:24 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/7/2006 10:41:12 AM EDT by The_Beer_Slayer]
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 10:28:23 AM EDT
Sportsman Guide???? Who are these people??? Why not just support the dealers who support us?? Screw them.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 10:29:07 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/7/2006 10:30:58 AM EDT by david_g17]

Originally Posted By fight4yourrights:

Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:


it's called private industry guys. No one is legally obligated to sell you anything....





.

So I can exclude blacks from my resturant?


Gays?


Chinese?

­

No, I can't.




Statutes have been enacted to prevent discrimination based on a persons race, sex, religion, age, previous condition of servitude, physical limitation, national origin and in some instances sexual preference...Discrimination based on "race, color, religion, or national origin" in public establishments that had a connection to interstate commerce or was supported by the state is prohibited.


http://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/index.php/Civil_rights

apples and oranges.

they are free to discriminate based on the criteria they have chosen.

just like a gun store owner refusing to sell to an obvious gang banger even if the guy would pass a background check - some things are okay to discriminate against.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 10:30:38 AM EDT
Hey, that's cool. They can be spineless and I will never give them another dime.

I will support my local army surplus stores here in Houston.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 10:38:48 AM EDT

Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:
it's called private industry guys. No one is legally obligated to sell you anything. they made a decision that they felt they needed to do to protect their business. Nothing more. You honestly beleive they don't want your business? What they don't want is some dumbass city attourney costing them thousands in bullshit legal fees in order to sell you 100.00 worth of ammo.

how much money have bushy and others lost on bullshit legal cases for selling guns in some cities? why should those of us in "free" states have to pay extra costs to cover legal fees for you guys living high risk areas for them? Don't like their business practices? CHANGE YOUR LAWS.

mike



What laws?
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 10:40:08 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/7/2006 10:52:59 AM EDT by repub18]

Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:
there are more than a few vendors that don't sell to alabama. thats ther choice.




I thought you said "change your laws"?
and it's the consumers choice not to spend money and complain about the policy. That is exactly what this thread is doing.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 10:41:37 AM EDT

Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:
no i am not.

i am standing by their refusal to do something THEY percieve <right or wrong> to be a dangerous business practice. it's their merchandise they are free to sell to whoever and wherever they want. Gun supplies and ammunition are likely a small part of their overall sales and something they don't care to get HUNG on.



You have a point,I would not want a law passed forcing them to do business where they dont want,however I am all for putting pressure on them to change there bullshit policy.I am not saying I wont do business with them,however I would only order from them as a last resort,and only untill my buyers club membership is over.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 10:47:46 AM EDT
It is funny what fuels this board's rightous indignation...

<shrug>

More cheap ammo for me.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 10:48:02 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 10:49:40 AM EDT
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