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Posted: 10/7/2004 5:12:07 AM EST
Feds plan to track every car


Obscure agency working on technology to monitor all vehicles

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted: October 7, 2004
1:00 a.m. Eastern

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© 2004 WorldNetDaily.com
A little-known federal agency is planning a new monitoring program by which the government would track every car on the road by using onboard transceivers.

The agency, the Intelligent Transportation Systems Joint Program Office, is part of the Department of Transportation. According to an extensive report in the Charlotte, N.C., Creative Loafing, the agency doesn't respond to public inquiries about its activity.


According to the report, cutting-edge tracking technology will be used by government transportation management centers to monitor every aspect of transportation. Under the plan, not only will movement be monitored but it also will be archived in massive databases for future use.

The paper reports a group of car manufacturers, technology companies and government interests have worked toward implementing the project for 13 years.

States the Creative Loafing report:

"The only way for people to evade the national transportation tracking system they're creating will be to travel on foot. Drive your car, and your every movement could be recorded and archived. The federal government will know the exact route you drove to work, how many times you braked along the way, the precise moment you arrived – and that every other Tuesday you opt to ride the bus.

"They'll know you're due for a transmission repair and that you've neglected to fix the ever-widening crack that resulted from a pebble dinging your windshield."

The agency's website says its purpose is to "use advanced technology to improve the efficiency and safety of our nation's surface transportation system."

Critics believe the program will be used to line the pockets of business interests that stand to gain from the sale of needed technology and that the government will use the data collected to tax drivers on their driving habits.

Though the program has ominous privacy implications, Creative Loafing reports none of the privacy-rights organizations it contacted were aware of the government's plans.

The report states that more than $4 billion in federal tax dollars has already been spent to lay the foundation for the system, which will use GPS technology and other methods to monitor Americans' movements.

The plan includes transceivers, or "onboard units," that will transmit data from each car to the system, the first models of which are expected to be unveiled next spring. By 2010, the paper reported, automakers hope to start installing them in cars. The goal is to equip 57 million vehicles by 2015.

Creative Loafing quotes Bill Jones, technical director of the Intelligent Transportation Systems Joint Program Office, from a speech he gave in January.

"The concept," said Jones, "is that vehicle manufacturers will install a communications device on the vehicle starting at some future date, and equipment will be installed on the nation's transportation system to allow all vehicles to communicate with the infrastructure."

"The whole idea here is that we would capture data from a large number of vehicles," Jones said at another meeting of transportation officials in May. "That data could then be used by public jurisdictions for traffic management purposes and also by private industry, such as DaimlerChrysler, for the services that they wish to provide for their customers."

The plan sees the federal government working with auto manufacturers to place the transponders in vehicles at the factory, giving consumers little chance to drive a new car not tethered to transportation computers.

One of the program's visions is for transportation officials to share collected data with law enforcement, meaning a driver potentially could get a speeding ticket based on information stored in a government computer.

Proponents of the system say the safety benefits are enormous. One goal is to virtually eliminate auto accidents by having vehicles "communicate" with each other.

Neil Schuster is president and CEO of the Intelligent Transportation Society of America, a group of government and business people that's the driving force behind the program.

"When I get on an airplane everyone in the system knows where I am," Schuster told Creative Loafing. "They know which tickets I bought. You could probably go back through United Airlines and find out everywhere I traveled in the last year. Do I worry about that? No. We've decided that airline safety is so important that we're going to put a transponder in every airplane and track it. We know the passenger list of every airplane and we're tracking these things so that planes don't crash into each other. Shouldn't we have that same sense of concern and urgency about road travel? The average number of fatalities each year from airplanes is less than 100. The average number of deaths on the highway is 42,000. I think we've got to enter the debate as to whether we're willing to change that in a substantial way and it may be that we have to allow something on our vehicles that makes our car safer. ... I wouldn't mind some of this information being available to make my roads safer so some idiot out there doesn't run into me."

At least one proponent of the plan is actually using the term "Orwellian" to describe it.

At a workshop for industry and government leaders last year, the Charlotte paper reports, John Worthington, president and CEO of TransCore – one of the companies currently under contract to develop the onboard units for cars – described the system as "kind of an Orwellian all-singing, all-dancing collector/aggregator/disseminator of transportation information."

Link Posted: 10/7/2004 5:16:00 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 5:28:02 AM EST
I've been worried about this stuff every since they came out with Onstar.

Those commericals freak me out! "Hi Mr. Jones this is Mary from Onstar, I see that you are traveling south bound on I-75. I also see that you are wanted for counter revolutionary crimes. I'm going to go ahead and disable your engine, notify the authorities to your location and lock the doors until they arrive."
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 5:30:45 AM EST
Less sinister, the EPA actually started this ball rolling in wanting to have the car's engine computer report when the vehicle is emitting pollutants. Then you get a nice letter telling you to get it fixed. Toyota, for one, wants to send messages to the individual car to prompt service or recall/update appointments. (THINK ONSTAR with its two way communication).
It's been brewing for a long time.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 5:33:23 AM EST
If you're doing nothing wrong, you have nothing to fear.

Implants in people are inevitable.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 5:34:32 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 5:40:06 AM EST

Originally Posted By motown_steve:
I've been worried about this stuff every since they came out with Onstar.

Those commericals freak me out! "Hi Mr. Jones this is Mary from Onstar, I see that you are traveling south bound on I-75. I also see that you are wanted for counter revolutionary crimes. I'm going to go ahead and disable your engine, notify the authorities to your location and lock the doors until they arrive."




+1

... but hey, the sheep feel so much safer...

Link Posted: 10/7/2004 5:43:09 AM EST


Wonder how that transceiver will hold up in my microwave?
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 5:43:23 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/7/2004 5:59:41 AM EST by ovrtym]
GM has been doing it for years. Just cut the power to the black box.

Story


Airbag black box crash data recovery information for GM and Saturn vehicles.


Vetronix crash data retrieval tool (CDR) collects GM vehicle crash data via the airbag system SDM.

Nashville, Tennessee, (PRWEB) June 15, 2004 -- For many years, airplane crash investigators have had the benefit of retrieving data from the flight-data recorder. This information has proven invaluable for helping to determine what happened in the critical time before a crash. In 1997, the National Transport Safety Board (NTSB) made the recommendation that vehicle manufacturers and the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration work together to gather information on vehicle crashes using onboard collision sensing and recording devices. As a result, General Motors expanded the data downloaded to permanent memory in the air bag sensing and diagnostic module at deployment or in a near deployment collision. Since 1973, when GM first introduced air bag-equipped cars, some crash data has been recorded. As explained in the owner's manuals of GM vehicles, the amount of recorded data has expanded with time and technology. The capability to record pre-crash data was included with some 1999 GM vehicles following the NTSB's recommendation. The Vetronix CDR System helps further the NTSB's recommendation by creating a product that downloads the data stored in recordable airbag modules.


General Motors has authorized Vetronix Corporation of Santa Barbara, California, to develop software, hardware and interface cables to allow the recorded data to be downloaded to commonly used computers. Data useful to researchers and investigators, such as delta-V, driver seat belt usage, and pre-impact data is stored and displayed in an easy-to-read format. This new tool also allows the investigator to input other pertinent information, such as weather conditions, and export the data to a remote database. Interface cables that connect directly to the airbag module are available for vehicles that cannot be powered up after a crash.


www.airbagcrash.com is one company that currently offers airbag crash data retrieval via the SDM (sensing and diagnostic module aka the black box) module for General Motors (GM) vehicles. This can only be done using the Vetronix CDR equipment and a PC. The airbag SDM module recorder can offer extremely important vehicle data in the final 5 seconds leading up to an accident event. www.airbagcrash.com offers this information to individuals, insurance companies, rental car fleets, etc.


GM airbag SDM recorded data coverage includes most 1994 and newer Chevrolet, GMC, Buick, Oldsmobile, Pontiac, Cadillac, and Saturn vehicles.


GM dealers do not use the Vetronix CDR. The GM Tech 2 will not collect the crash deployment data.


AIRBAG SDM 'BLACK BOX' CRASH DATA AVAILABLE (depending on year and model)

Vehicle speed (in five one-second intervals preceding impact)
Engine speed (in five one-second intervals preceding impact)
Brake status (in five one-second intervals preceding impact)
Throttle position (in five one-second intervals preceding impact)
Driver's seat belt state (On/Off)
Passenger's airbag enabled or disabled state (On/Off)
Airbag Warning Lamp status (On/Off)
Time from vehicle impact to airbag deployment
Maximum Delta-V for near-deployment event
Delta-V vs. time for frontal airbag deployment event
Time from vehicle impact to time of maximum Delta-V
Time between near-deploy and deploy event (if within 5 seconds)


More information about GM airbag SDM black box modules and the Vetronix CDR can be seen at this website:

http://www.airbagcrash.com

Questions about the system can be emailed to:

e-mail protected from spam bots

www.airbagcrash.com
800 N. Woodstone Ln
Nashville, TN 37211
USA
Telephone 615 479 1900

Website: http://www.airbagcrash.com
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 5:58:57 AM EST

Just cut the power to the black box.

Doesn't work if the same black box also controls the engine.z
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:00:10 AM EST
The technology to do this has been in place since the mid 90's . Any vehicle with an ECM
only lacks a transmitter to send the onboard data .

As stated earlier in this thread . Any vehicle with a onboard transmitter
like OnStar in GM, Acura, Audi, Isuzu, Subaru and Volkswagen , and soon to be Ford
already does it if prompted by the owner . Or if the air bag module is triggered .

Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:05:28 AM EST
I work in this industry. We have over 50K vehicles wired. Almost all in private industry, and 90% know they are there. Just remember, electronics can be defeated
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:05:50 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/7/2004 6:10:39 AM EST by NewbHunter]

Originally Posted By zoom:

Just cut the power to the black box.

Doesn't work if the same black box also controls the engine.z



Sure it does. It may take a little more work then just cutting power to the "black box", but it will work.

The only way to make this system work is to have a totally integrated computer in the car. Well, if the car has a computer in it, it won't take long for people to hack them. Lots of people are already doing that with OBDII. If you really don't want to be found there will be ways around it.

www.mp3car.com/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=37
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:09:01 AM EST
Oh boy, the price of my pre-ban truck is going to sky rocket
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:09:38 AM EST

Originally Posted By ovrtym:
GM has been doing it for years. Just cut the power to the black box.

Story


Airbag black box crash data recovery information for GM and Saturn vehicles.




That only collects data - doesn't do real time tracking
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:10:07 AM EST

Originally Posted By chrome1:
The technology to do this has been in place since the mid 90's . Any vehicle with an ECM
only lacks a transmitter to send the onboard data .

As stated earlier in this thread . Any vehicle with a onboard transmitter
like OnStar in GM, Acura, Audi, Isuzu, Subaru and Volkswagen , and soon to be Ford
already does it if prompted by the owner . Or if the air bag module is triggered . OR IF REMOTELY ACTIVATED BY THE VENDOR.




And that's a fact.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:11:01 AM EST

Originally Posted By motown_steve:
I've been worried about this stuff every since they came out with Onstar.

Those commericals freak me out! "Hi Mr. Jones this is Mary from Onstar, I see that you are traveling south bound on I-75. I also see that you are wanted for counter revolutionary crimes. I'm going to go ahead and disable your engine, notify the authorities to your location and lock the doors until they arrive."




a big + 1

The sheep have no idea what is heading thier way.......
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:15:30 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/7/2004 6:16:40 AM EST by Red_Label]

Originally Posted By GreyGoose:
I work in this industry. We have over 50K vehicles wired. Almost all in private industry, and 90% know they are there. Just remember, electronics can be defeated



Roger that. If the "kids" can defeat CD-ROM, DVD, and other digital systems and codes, then they can defeat car computer codes too. These hackers and their mentality may just save our asses one day.


Edited to add: I'd try to find a way to remove the GPS tracking system and place it in the garage. As far as the Feds would know, my car/truck/van/bike never leaves the garage.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:15:54 AM EST

Originally Posted By ovrtym:
GM has been doing it for years. Just cut the power to the black box.





...Just make it illegal to do that.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:19:01 AM EST
I got three pre-ban shtf vehicles in my Patriot convoy designed to bypass this "skynet" intrusion into our daily lives.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:19:22 AM EST

Originally Posted By injun-ear:

Originally Posted By ovrtym:
GM has been doing it for years. Just cut the power to the black box.





...Just make it illegal to do that.



They probably already have. You'd be amazed at all the stuff that's been made illegal quietly behind our backs with no notice from anyone. We could all probably be brought up on charges of some sort right now. For instance, the laws regarding supply storage termed as "hoarding". The traitors in Washington just can't say "no" to new and more restrictive laws. We're bordline slaves right now.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:20:53 AM EST

Originally Posted By fight4yourrights:

Originally Posted By ovrtym:
GM has been doing it for years. Just cut the power to the black box.

Story


Airbag black box crash data recovery information for GM and Saturn vehicles.




That only collects data - doesn't do real time tracking



Jeez, how long do you think it is going to be before they just onstar/lo-jack everyones car and they DO real-time tracking. Police won;t have to have radar traps, you just get a ticket in the mail.

This shit IS happening, just wait until all insurance companies get black box data from wrecks and also your transciever history with your driving habits. Say bye bye to being able to drive.

There is one thing though. With politics becoming polarized, and people beginning to wake up to the fact that government is getting into every aspect of their lives.......a refreshing of the state is not far away.

BTW the feds can track your buying habits and if you start doing odd things (to them) you will get flagged and if it keeps happening you WILL get "looked into" The Feds tap into databases such as Kroger Plus cards (those shopper incentive tags) that you swipe everytime you shop. Think about that... they know how many tampons you have bought in the last year.....and when they decide to MONITOR the health of americans by their shopping habits, you might get a fine or worse if you buy too much ice cream or too much meat or too much sugar. Why do you think there is such a push for a "cashless" society. It means that EVERYTHING you purchase can be tracked and it also means that YOU are NOT in control of your PERSONAL weatlh, someone or some computer somewhere SAYS it is OK for you to spend your "money".

Scared yet?
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:25:54 AM EST

Originally Posted By phatmax:
[Scared yet?




Unfortunately, NO... the sheeple just don't scare very easily. They are too trusting of the state and too lazy and ignorant to see where it's all going. As long as they get their daily fix of internet porn, Survivor, and junk food, it's all good.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:25:55 AM EST

Originally Posted By phatmax:

Originally Posted By fight4yourrights:

Originally Posted By ovrtym:
GM has been doing it for years. Just cut the power to the black box.

Story


Airbag black box crash data recovery information for GM and Saturn vehicles.




That only collects data - doesn't do real time tracking



Jeez, how long do you think it is going to be before they just onstar/lo-jack everyones car and they DO real-time tracking. Police won;t have to have radar traps, you just get a ticket in the mail.

This shit IS happening, just wait until all insurance companies get black box data from wrecks and also your transciever history with your driving habits. Say bye bye to being able to drive.

There is one thing though. With politics becoming polarized, and people beginning to wake up to the fact that government is getting into every aspect of their lives.......a refreshing of the state is not far away.

BTW the feds can track your buying habits and if you start doing odd things (to them) you will get flagged and if it keeps happening you WILL get "looked into" The Feds tap into databases such as Kroger Plus cards (those shopper incentive tags) that you swipe everytime you shop. Think about that... they know how many tampons you have bought in the last year.....and when they decide to MONITOR the health of americans by their shopping habits, you might get a fine or worse if you buy too much ice cream or too much meat or too much sugar. Why do you think there is such a push for a "cashless" society. It means that EVERYTHING you purchase can be tracked and it also means that YOU are NOT in control of your PERSONAL weatlh, someone or some computer somewhere SAYS it is OK for you to spend your "money".

Scared yet?



Does this mean I need to be on the lookout for the trannys sneaking up on me?
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:26:09 AM EST

Originally Posted By phatmax:

Originally Posted By fight4yourrights:

Originally Posted By ovrtym:
GM has been doing it for years. Just cut the power to the black box.

Story


Airbag black box crash data recovery information for GM and Saturn vehicles.




That only collects data - doesn't do real time tracking



Jeez, how long do you think it is going to be before they just onstar/lo-jack everyones car and they DO real-time tracking. Police won;t have to have radar traps, you just get a ticket in the mail.

This shit IS happening, just wait until all insurance companies get black box data from wrecks and also your transciever history with your driving habits. Say bye bye to being able to drive.

There is one thing though. With politics becoming polarized, and people beginning to wake up to the fact that government is getting into every aspect of their lives.......a refreshing of the state is not far away.

BTW the feds can track your buying habits and if you start doing odd things (to them) you will get flagged and if it keeps happening you WILL get "looked into" The Feds tap into databases such as Kroger Plus cards (those shopper incentive tags) that you swipe everytime you shop. Think about that... they know how many tampons you have bought in the last year.....and when they decide to MONITOR the health of americans by their shopping habits, you might get a fine or worse if you buy too much ice cream or too much meat or too much sugar. Why do you think there is such a push for a "cashless" society. It means that EVERYTHING you purchase can be tracked and it also means that YOU are NOT in control of your PERSONAL weatlh, someone or some computer somewhere SAYS it is OK for you to spend your "money".

Scared yet?



He'll blow it off as "tinfoil", but I understand what you're saying.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:37:16 AM EST

Originally Posted By FLAL1A:

Originally Posted By chrome1:
The technology to do this has been in place since the mid 90's . Any vehicle with an ECM
only lacks a transmitter to send the onboard data .

As stated earlier in this thread . Any vehicle with a onboard transmitter
like OnStar in GM, Acura, Audi, Isuzu, Subaru and Volkswagen , and soon to be Ford
already does it if prompted by the owner . Or if the air bag module is triggered . OR IF REMOTELY ACTIVATED BY THE VENDOR.




And that's a fact.



Yep. If I get a warrant for someone who I know is driving a newer model GM vehicle, the first thing that I'm going to find out is if it is equipped with OnStar. If it is, I'm going to get a court order to turn it on.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:40:15 AM EST

Originally Posted By Tactical_Jew:
I got three pre-ban shtf vehicles in my Patriot convoy designed to bypass this "skynet" intrusion into our daily lives.




"pre-ban" thats how I will start to think bout my beater cars from now on.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:42:54 AM EST

Originally Posted By zoom:

Just cut the power to the black box.

Doesn't work if the same black box also controls the engine.z



True, but the signal has to leave the car in some antenna. Find it and cut the lead.

If they use the radio's antenna, go to an aftermarket radio shop and have another one installed.

There is a parry for every move.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:44:05 AM EST

Originally Posted By ilikelegs:
Looks like its time to buy an old jeep and fix it up.



+1

Track this





Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:51:56 AM EST

Originally Posted By Boomer:

Originally Posted By ilikelegs:
Looks like its time to buy an old jeep and fix it up.



+1

Track this

photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=21991

photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=15203




+2

Man, that is one nice Scrambler. I'm jealous!

On a side note, I got to take a look at the Rubicon Unlimited at the State Fair last night. Sweet...and pricey.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 7:05:23 AM EST
Intrusive technologies like this have not been market tested yet. The only way they can succeed is to have government shove them down our throats. Even then, stoplight cameras have become massively unpopular and it won't be long before their demise (after bilking literall billions of dollars out of the Amercan people). Yes, this stuff is scary, but how long are massive numbers of people going to hold back after getting a ticket in the mail for going 55 in a 45 on a road that was previously marked as 55 until sometime in the mid 90s when all the safety Nazis went nuts and lowered all the speed limits? The current scheme works only because a small minority of drivers are fleeced. Open the fleecing to everyone, and you will have a revolt on your hands. That, or speed limits will be raised to the actual speeds people drive, in which case, who cares if you are being monitored?

Look, I hate mass surveillance. But we already live in that world--much of the interstate highways and major roads already have cameras watching you. I think tracking all cars is going to be damn hard--the technology may not scale very well. You're talking A LOT of data here.

I wonder how popular OnStar really is. I don't want any of that shit in my car. I'm sure a lot of people feel the same way. As long as it is strictly voluntary, I don't have any concerns. The minute it becomes mandatory, the fight to find a way to disable or circumvent it begins. If kids can hack and XBOX, what the hell do you think they can do to a car?


On a side note, whenver the Police Benevolents Assn. calls asking for donations, I kindly tell them none are forthcoming and I think that half the police in the country should be layed off immediately. You can't have a police state without the police part.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 7:12:06 AM EST

Originally Posted By Boomer:

Originally Posted By ilikelegs:
Looks like its time to buy an old jeep and fix it up.



+1

Track this

photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=21991

photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=15203



Easy! just follow the bondo and rust flakes Joking As ive a couple CJ's myself. Nice CJ8 Bro!
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 7:20:37 AM EST

Originally Posted By SWO_daddy:

Originally Posted By zoom:

Just cut the power to the black box.

Doesn't work if the same black box also controls the engine.z



True, but the signal has to leave the car in some antenna. Find it and cut the lead.

If they use the radio's antenna, go to an aftermarket radio shop and have another one installed.

There is a parry for every move.



And probably what will happen is you'll get pulled over for an inoperative transponder. On the grid or on your feet and implants will fix that too! A little tinfoil, but give it 50 years and no one will give such shit a second thought. Soma anyone?

Link Posted: 10/7/2004 7:21:31 AM EST

Originally Posted By Boomer:

Originally Posted By ilikelegs:
Looks like its time to buy an old jeep and fix it up.



+1

Track this

photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=21991

photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=15203




Nice preban. Where's the bayonet lug though?

Link Posted: 10/7/2004 7:24:24 AM EST
Hey guys, way back, before the internet, it was reported they were working on this deal.

The rumor that went along with the tracking rumor is the devices would enable the gov't via satelites to beable to shut down every car motor within a given geographical area.

So if they need to immobilize an area due to whatever, chem/bio attack to keep it from spreading.

Just restating the rumor mill from 20 years ago.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 7:32:15 AM EST
In the next 10 years, we will see implants in newborns and old people. After that, the rest of us get them.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 7:36:50 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/7/2004 7:37:55 AM EST by Garand_Shooter]
Did you guys bother looking at the source for this? "Creative Loafing" is not exactly the hotbed of journalistic integrity and serious investigative reporting.


Besides, if it can be done with computer, it can be undone. Motorola, despite all the $$ they spend on it, can't keep guys like me from hacking thier radios do make them do things they are not supposed too.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 7:49:54 AM EST

Originally Posted By chrome1:
The technology to do this has been in place since the mid 90's . Any vehicle with an ECM
only lacks a transmitter to send the onboard data .

As stated earlier in this thread . Any vehicle with a onboard transmitter
like OnStar in GM, Acura, Audi, Isuzu, Subaru and Volkswagen , and soon to be Ford
already does it if prompted by the owner . Or if the air bag module is triggered .




Ford ahs been doing the black box thing for several years. They just recently admitted to it publicly. How you explain that my parents 1997 Expedition that was bought in Sept '96 only has 34,000 miles on it just received a card in the mail 3 weeks ago that the 36,000 mile checkup is due. They can't just guess or have figured it based on service records.


I just wonder how far this kinda of stuff will go before people stand up and say enough! Unfortunatly people have been so sheepified the .gov gets away with murder and will only get worse.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 7:54:35 AM EST
IIRC the governments "Keyhole" satellites have the ability to locate an individual vehicle simply by the color, make, model and license plate number, so disabling the electronics on your newer vehicle or drivin a older one would be moot.

If they want to locate you or your vehicle, they'll find ya.........

Mike

PS - at least my scooter is easier to conceal.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 8:03:55 AM EST

Originally Posted By Botch:
Oh boy, the price of my pre-ban truck is going to sky rocket



It will outlawed under the new AVB (assault vehicle ban). No grandfather clause. You will have to have them registered with new black box technology added.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 8:05:08 AM EST
I wonder how long it will be until there's a GPS jammer on the market. (probably black-market)
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 8:08:20 AM EST

Originally Posted By lu380:
I wonder how long it will be until there's a GPS jammer on the market. (probably black-market)



There already is...although the feds frown on such
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 8:08:30 AM EST

Originally Posted By TeuffelHunden1775:

Originally Posted By Botch:
Oh boy, the price of my pre-ban truck is going to sky rocket



It will outlawed under the new AVB (assault vehicle ban). No grandfather clause. You will have to have them registered with new black box technology added.




Damn, I lost my AV in a tragic boating accident.......
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 8:16:52 AM EST
Now let me give you a positive spin on GPS tracking. As previously stated, I work in this field for a large company. I was down on the Georgia/Alabama line in a small town, doing some repairs to a tracking unit and went to the customers office. The owner tells me he wants all the tracking data backed up on an external drive, as the court system was seizing his computer to use as evidence. Turns out, one of his employees was accused of sexually assaulting a minor while useing the company vehicle. The employee had already been arrested and was awaiting trial. We went back thru the data, to the day of the said incident, and he wasnt even in the same county as the victim claimed. Turns out, it was a daughter of an ex-gf who made the charges, all in cahoots with her mother. The employees charges were immediately dropped.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 9:16:05 AM EST

Originally Posted By ilikelegs:
Looks like its time to buy an old jeep and fix it up.



I want one anyway, so this is just all the more reason. I'll just buy one sooner than later: as soon as we move later this fall or early winter. And, isn't it just unfortunate that my current new Jeep didn't come with the latest technology. Good thing I didn/'t wait until the "latest". Oh, well, I'll just have to suffer without OnStar or any of the other trade names.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 9:42:59 AM EST

Originally Posted By Boomer:

Originally Posted By ilikelegs:
Looks like its time to buy an old jeep and fix it up.



+1

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photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=21991

photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=15203




Pretty easy with what you are showing.....


But I wont...
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 10:11:56 AM EST

Originally Posted By R-32:

Originally Posted By Boomer:

Originally Posted By ilikelegs:
Looks like its time to buy an old jeep and fix it up.



+1

Track this

photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=21991

photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=15203




Pretty easy with what you are showing.....


But I wont...



Interesting, the front plate doesn't appear to match the back plate. Using counter-measures, Boomer?
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 10:17:36 AM EST
Coming to Amerika soon.
Oh well, no worries.....I can remove or defeat any system they try add.
I have an ultimate set of tools.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 10:17:45 AM EST

Originally Posted By Garand_Shooter:
Did you guys bother looking at the source for this? "Creative Loafing" is not exactly the hotbed of journalistic integrity and serious investigative reporting.



True, but their was an editorial on this very same thing in last month's issue of "Motorcyclist" magazine. The writer was like top dog at AAA or something. A credible guy.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 10:34:06 AM EST

Originally Posted By SWO_daddy:

Originally Posted By zoom:

Just cut the power to the black box.

Doesn't work if the same black box also controls the engine.z



True, but the signal has to leave the car in some antenna. Find it and cut the lead.

If they use the radio's antenna, go to an aftermarket radio shop and have another one installed.

There is a parry for every move.



But the riposte/remise might be something a lot worse (think federal tampering laws)
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 10:35:28 AM EST
Good, maybe there will be a number to call and they will tell me where I left it the night before.
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