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Posted: 8/29/2004 10:36:45 AM EST
Sitting here watching the IRL race on ABC, the fuel guy couldn't get the hose off of the car, it broke and got fuel on him and he got on fire. Since it's alcohol you can't see the fire but they did get water on him and got the fire out. If that wasn't enough the car was still on fire where you put the fuel into it. He had to come back into the pits to have it put out. Man, racing is an exciting sport, I don't care what kind, I love racing.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 10:37:31 AM EST
which left turn did he do this pit stop on?
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 10:40:37 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/29/2004 10:42:27 AM EST by ar50troll]
It's methanol

BTW Did you catch the f1 race this AM? It was more a crash up derby. Bristol style F1 It was pretty sweet...
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 10:44:12 AM EST

Originally Posted By ar50troll:
It's methanol



And it burns clean and clear. I remember a driver burning to death at Indy when he caught fire with this stuff, they didn't know he was on fire and was hosing down the car instead of him. He finally got their attention but died some time later from his burns. Seems like they could put something into it so it'd show up when it burned. Put it on ABC, I'm sure they'll replay it again. Racing is a dangerous sport, don't care what all the "Race Haters" say about it and the danger makes it all that more exciting.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 10:45:21 AM EST
IRL has beenhaving pit incidents Just about every race it seems. I think it was Schecter last week catching on fire. And crap I think 3 drivers ran into their pit teams.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 10:58:00 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/29/2004 10:58:59 AM EST by TNFrank]
These are the guys my brother and I saw at Nashville. I forgot my ear plugs and my ears were stopped up from all the nosie for almost two days. Man, them little cars are fast. Kanaan won the race at Nashville, I was glad for him, he seems like a nice guy. When he was going to run the Indy 500 he went to visit a girl that was in a coma in the local hospital. He had a neckless that was a good luck charm of his, he took it off and gave it to her, he told her mom and dad that she needed it more then he did. A couple days later she came out of the coma. He's a hell of a guy in my book, being that he's so superstitious and all, to give up a good luck charm could have ment his life. I like ol' Tony Kanaan.

I missed the F1 race. I was watchin' "Inferno" in Sicfi.LOL
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:01:05 AM EST
IRL=Shit.

A real race is just starting on Spike right now. ChampCar.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:04:32 AM EST

Originally Posted By Janus:
IRL=Shit.

A real race is just starting on Spike right now. ChampCar.



Looks like the "same cars, different track" to me. Heck, I'll watch it after the IRL race though, like I said, I love racing, all kinds.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:05:09 AM EST
1994 Formula 1 Pit fire
Jos Verstappen on fire Hockenheim 1994


Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:06:39 AM EST
I don't even know if I should ask but I will, did he get out of that alive?
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:07:04 AM EST
He had minor burns.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:07:55 AM EST

Originally Posted By Janus:
IRL=Shit.

A real race is just starting on Spike right now. ChampCar.



I prefer Champ cars. Paul Tracy is a dick with ears though. CART has the turbo versus IRL. But CART aka Champ Car is in such piss poor financial/maganement shape. Half the damn time they can't field enough cars to maintain a TV contract with a major network. That's why they are on Spike. Don't get me wrong I got a CART bumber sticker, but no IRL. But I also wanna see a field of more then 10 freakin cars
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:10:01 AM EST

Originally Posted By Janus:
He had minor burns.



You've got to be kidding me. Dang. Of course look at the fire that Dale Jr. was in a month or so ago, he walked away with burns to his legs and that was about it. I guess those Nomex fire suites really work wonders. Back in the day a lot of drivers died form what would be minor fires today.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:12:23 AM EST
They've always fielded more than 18 cars. They are out from under the public company and owned by 3 team owners with deep pockets. They just signed a series sponsorship deal with Mcdonalds and have 2 other similiar sized sponsors about to be signed.

This years TV deal is a result of the new ownership not having enough time to get a good deal together. Look for them to be back on Speed and CBS next year.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:13:29 AM EST

Originally Posted By Janus:
IRL=Shit.

A real race is just starting on Spike right now. ChampCar.



See what I mean? Dickhead Tracy just ran Tag in the grass who took out another car in the first damn turn. Tracy sucks. His attitude sucks. He should be dropped before he kills another driver.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:17:02 AM EST

Originally Posted By Janus:
They've always fielded more than 18 cars. They are out from under the public company and owned by 3 team owners with deep pockets. They just signed a series sponsorship deal with Mcdonalds and have 2 other similiar sized sponsors about to be signed.

This years TV deal is a result of the new ownership not having enough time to get a good deal together. Look for them to be back on Speed and CBS next year.



As much as everyone seems to hate it, the soluction is to bring CART and Indy Car back together. CART going to an Indy spec engine was a start. Now the CART teams done't have to finance 2 engine programs. But if they run an Indy spec engine, shit their the same damn car essentially. I love the button(Turbo), but really the solution is one series and since Indy car owns the Indy 500, Indy car will be the only series within 5 years for certain. All the quality teams have defected from CART to Indy anyways.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:17:32 AM EST
Michael Andritti's team won 1st,2nd and 3rd. geez. Glad to see that he's doing better as an owner then he did as a driver. Switchin' over to Champ now.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:19:12 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/29/2004 11:20:24 AM EST by ar50troll]

Originally Posted By TNFrank:
Michael Andritti's team won 1st,2nd and 3rd. geez. Glad to see that he's doing better as an owner then he did as a driver. Switchin' over to Champ now.



And he did it at his home track. When Houston used to get the Grand Prix, I spend a lot of time with the Andretti family. They are great people. I was surprised to see Michael retire from the seat though. I guess that makes me a traitor since A.J. Foyt lives here!
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:20:45 AM EST

Originally Posted By TNFrank:
I don't even know if I should ask but I will, did he get out of that alive?



Yeap. The fire was very very quick.
Five mechanics and Verstappen all suffered minor burns.
Even in 1994 Formula One pit crew members carried their own personal fire extinguishers and you can see that Bennaton had well trained crew.

From the fuel spraying from the refueling nozzle to the fire being out only took about 9 seconds.

Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:21:15 AM EST
I always felt bad for him because he, like his dad, always had such bad luck with parts breaking, or something else just not working. They were both good drivers, they just never had a car that'd finish a race.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:23:23 AM EST

Originally Posted By ar50troll:
As much as everyone seems to hate it, the soluction is to bring CART and Indy Car back together. CART going to an Indy spec engine was a start. Now the CART teams done't have to finance 2 engine programs. But if they run an Indy spec engine, shit their the same damn car essentially. I love the button(Turbo), but really the solution is one series and since Indy car owns the Indy 500, Indy car will be the only series within 5 years for certain. All the quality teams have defected from CART to Indy anyways.



The only thing keep the Indycar Teams and Series in business is Toyota and Honda $$$.
They've alteady said they will stop sponsorship iafter 2005 when they make the move to Nextel Cup.

So in 2006 Tony George will left holding a bag of shit when all the teams leave for greener pastures.

Champcar will be moving to F1 like formula. Lighter cars with high revving V-10s. Their future lies in road and street courses and they won't need the heavy chasis that oval racing needs.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:25:19 AM EST

Originally Posted By ar50troll:
And he did it at his home track. When Houston used to get the Grand Prix, I spend a lot of time with the Andretti family. They are great people. I was surprised to see Michael retire from the seat though. I guess that makes me a traitor since A.J. Foyt lives here!




Mikey isn't stupid. He didn't want to end up a paraplegic from racing in a crapwagon(IRL car).
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:26:32 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/29/2004 11:43:51 AM EST by ar50troll]

Originally Posted By Janus:

The only thing keep the Indycar Teams and Series in business is Toyota and Honda $$$.



Man I have read some funny stuff on this board, but this one takes the cake. Uhhh have you ever heard of the Indy 500? Don't you think that kinda, maybe, perhaps keeps Indy car going?
Just maybe?
If Champ Car wishes to have really good racing, it needs to do away with arbitrary pit stops, be it a certain number of stops under green or pit windows; while push-to-pass is a nice innovation that continues to show off the extraordinary Ford-Cosworth XFE engine - only two failures since the spec engine came into use last year - it still is an artificial means of promoting competition.

While it really hurts to talk about the problems in Champ Car, it appears those difficulties manifest themselves in the paddock and on the track, more so than in any boardroom. Only a few cars have true sponsorship this season and the balance is coming out of owners' pockets. This is not healthy motorsports.

I am sure some Indy Racing League IndyCar Series teams have "phantom" backing like many in CCWS; it's not as prevalent. And with the League morphing to road racing next season to the cheers of most of its teams and drivers, not to mention suppliers and sponsors, the chasm grows wider between the two.

Take a look at the winners in IRL competition this year and you'll see the cast-offs from Champ Car. Indy Lights champion Tony Kanaan wasn't considered a winner and Buddy Rice, the 2000 Toyota Atlantic titleholder couldn't find a ride, even holding a contract at Team Rahal. Dario Franchitti was written off after his motorbike accident last year and the bitter bunch in Champ Car vowed he'd never return to IRL competition in 2004.

Even Sam Hornish Jr., who tried to come up the proverbial ladder to Champ Car racing through karts, F2000 and Toyota Atlantic could not get arrested, much less noticed by those team owners. He, like Kanaan, Rice, Franchitti, Bryan Herta and Alex Barron among others have found success and fame in the League.

If the Champ Car World Series doesn't make the bell in 2005, there will be room for some of its stars in the IRL, but certainly not all of them. Tracy has declared he'll not go, understandable after his victory in the 2002 Indianapolis 500 Mile Race was never acknowledged.



The others? Who knows?

Until American open wheel racing becomes whole, there will be a high road with winners in the Indy Racing League and there will be low blows and whining in Champ Car. It's an untenable state of affairs.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:34:18 AM EST

Originally Posted By ar50troll:
Man I have read some funny stuff on this board, but this one takes the cake. Uhhh have you ever heard of the Indy 500? Don't you think that kinda, maybe, perhaps keeps Indy car going?
Just maybe?




Would that be the Indy 500 that gets a lower TV ratings than the average NASCAR race?
or
The Indy 500 that draws less attendance than the Brickyard 400 or Champcar's Mexico Race?

Granted the only reason Toyota and Honda are in the Series is to run Indy.
The teams are funded largly by Toyota and Honda and to a lesser extent Chevy.

The winnings from the Indy 500 are miniscule and usualy don't cover the cost of most teams who run the race.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:40:22 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/29/2004 11:41:24 AM EST by ar50troll]

Originally Posted By Janus:

Originally Posted By ar50troll:
Man I have read some funny stuff on this board, but this one takes the cake. Uhhh have you ever heard of the Indy 500? Don't you think that kinda, maybe, perhaps keeps Indy car going?
Just maybe?




Would that be the Indy 500 that gets a lower TV ratings than the average NASCAR race?
or
The Indy 500 that draws less attendance than the Brickyard 400 or Champcar's Mexico Race?

Granted the only reason Toyota and Honda are in the Series is to run Indy.
The teams are funded largly by Toyota and Honda and to a lesser extent Chevy.

The winnings from the Indy 500 are miniscule and usualy don't cover the cost of most teams who run the race.



An American tradition is an American tradion. You almost sound like a CART team owner with the focus on money only. It's this lack of integrity that has CART in the trouble they are in. I'm not going to get in a pissing match with another ARFCOMMER. You mean the NASCAR series that had minimal tv viewership a decade ago while the Indy500 had sold out attendace for over 50 years.
Yeah I think it's that one.

We all now NASCAR is enjoying the flavor of the month moment. Do you really believe it will maintain the momentum. Likely not. NASCAR is just in the limelight right now. I enjoy NASCAR races myself. But a lumbering 2500 pound tank is only fun for so long. NASCAR will drift back into minor obscurity. It's just a matter of time.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:43:59 AM EST
OH MAN!!! Frankie Chili just highsided himself to the moon! He crashed out of the lead too. Oh by the way I am watching REAL racing.....World Superbike!!! on speed right now till 6.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:46:37 AM EST
I'd like to see a series that combinds NASCAR, IRL/CHAMP car and NHRA together. The drivers would run a, say 40 races a year, 10 of each would be in one of the different styles. You'd get 10 NASCAR races, 10 IRL oval track races, 10 CHAMP car road courses and 10 NHRA Drag races. You could mix em' up to keep it exciting for the fans. That would, once and for all, settle who the "Best" driver is. I think it'd be a hoot to see John Force run in a NASCAR race or an IRL race or see Tony Kanaan run an NHRA dragster at 330mph. I'd be willing to bet that very few racers would be competive in all racing styles.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:47:48 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/29/2004 11:48:21 AM EST by ar50troll]

Originally Posted By TNFrank:
I'd like to see a series that combinds NASCAR, IRL/CHAMP car and NHRA together. The drivers would run a, say 40 races a year, 10 of each would be in one of the different styles. You'd get 10 NASCAR races, 10 IRL oval track races, 10 CHAMP car road courses and 10 NHRA Drag races. You could mix em' up to keep it exciting for the fans. That would, once and for all, settle who the "Best" driver is. I think it'd be a hoot to see John Force run in a NASCAR race or an IRL race or see Tony Kanaan run an NHRA dragster at 330mph. I'd be willing to bet that very few racers would be competive in all racing styles.



They do have IROC, but no NHRA guys in IROC. Good racing though. Usually the NASCAR guys spank the open wheelers.
And MAN I would love to see John Force out there trading paing with those guys. Now that would be fun.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:48:14 AM EST

Originally Posted By ar50troll:
An American tradition is an American tradion. You almost sound like a CART team owner with the focus on money only. It's this lack of integrity that has CART in the trouble they are in. I'm not going to get in a pissing match with another ARFCOMMER. You mean the NASCAR series that had minimal tv viewership a decade ago while the Indy500 had sold out attendace for over 50 years.
Yeah I think it's that one.



Well, Like it or not $ makes the racing world go round. $ and control is what Tony George wanted when he formed The IRL and consquntly destroy open wheel racing in U.S.

Champ Car was outdrawing Nascar in attendance and T.V. ratings 10 years ago. The CART owners are not blameless in the downfall but Tony and the IRL certianly bear the most of the responsibily.

What is an example of a lack of integrity that the current Champcar lacks? As far as I know all the greedy irresponsible teams owner went to the IRL.

Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:52:49 AM EST
I used to love watching the IROC races. And yes, you MUST have money to race. Hendrick is charging something like 2.5Million a year for the NASCAR boys to lease an engine. For that they get an engine, a back up engine and a tech. to keep it running and that's just the engine. I guess even Drit Track racing is starting to cost a bit. Gone are the good ol' days when you could pick up a car at the junk yard, strip it down, weld the doors shut and run it in a "Stock Car" race.
Of course it's the same with shooting. Some of these IPSC guys are using $5000 dollar race guns to shoot with, it's just plain crazy anymore. People want to win and are willing to spend whatever amount it takes to do it.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:54:07 AM EST

Originally Posted By ar50troll:
[ I'm not going to get in a pissing match with another ARFCOMMER.




I don't think we are in any real disagreement. Nothing would please me more than to have 1 series back running at Indy.

It's just that I want it back to the way it was in '95. Not run by Tony George, with total crap cars.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:54:11 AM EST

Originally Posted By Janus:

Originally Posted By ar50troll:
An American tradition is an American tradion. You almost sound like a CART team owner with the focus on money only. It's this lack of integrity that has CART in the trouble they are in. I'm not going to get in a pissing match with another ARFCOMMER. You mean the NASCAR series that had minimal tv viewership a decade ago while the Indy500 had sold out attendace for over 50 years.
Yeah I think it's that one.



Well, Like it or not $ makes the racing world go round. $ and control is what Tony George wanted when he formed The IRL and consquntly destroy open wheel racing in U.S.

Champ Car was outdrawing Nascar in attendance and T.V. ratings 10 years ago. The CART owners are not blameless in the downfall but Tony and the IRL certianly bear the most of the responsibily.

What is an example of a lack of integrity that the current Champcar lacks? As far as I know all the greedy irresponsible teams owner went to the IRL.




Dude, I was a hardcare CART fan for quite a few years. It has just been managed into the ground. It's a sad state of affiars. It WAS a better series than Indy Car. But where's the sponsors? Where's the penalties for Paul Tracy being a real danger of killing another driver. Where's the full disclosure from all the backroom politicing in mgmt. CART/Champ Car, whatever you wanna call it just isn't maintaining the integrity. I'm not going to wear out my fingertips with a docudrama.


Migrating to Indy is not irresponsible. You have a commitment to the sponsor. If your sponsor is ok with low viewership and televising the race on a small cable only network then your fine. And please I could use a few of those type of sponsors. But that's not good business and it's not greed. The big sponsors want the cars on the major networks. That's not greed. That's running a successful business.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 11:55:37 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/29/2004 11:56:48 AM EST by ar50troll]

Originally Posted By Janus:

Originally Posted By ar50troll:
[ I'm not going to get in a pissing match with another ARFCOMMER.




I don't think we are in any real disagreement. Nothing would please me more than to have 1 series back running at Indy.

It's just that I want it back to the way it was in '95. Not run by Tony George, with total crap cars.



Agreed. it used to be a guy could build his own engine and chassis and actually race. Shit that is not going to happen unless you got Bill Gates money. Million dollar engines and all. [XXAnd if they got together I would prefer a turbo engine myself. The button rocks.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 12:04:20 PM EST

Originally Posted By ar50troll:
Dude, I was a hardcare CART fan for quite a few years. It has just been managed into the ground. It's a sad state of affiars. It WAS a better series than Indy Car. But where's the sponsors? Where's the penalties for Paul Tracy being a real danger of killing another driver. Where's the full disclosure from all the backroom politicing in mgmt. CART/Champ Car, whatever you wanna call it just isn't maintaining the integrity. I'm not going to wear out my fingertips with a docudrama.


Migrating to Indy is not irresponsible. You have a commitment to the sponsor. If your sponsor is ok with low viewership and televising the race on a small cable only network then your fine. And please I could use a few of those type of sponsors. But that's not good business and it's not greed. The big sponsors want the cars on the major networks. That's not greed. That's running a successful business.




The people that mis-managed CART are gone or are owners in the IRL.
The sponsors are there, and unlike the IRL where you have 2 manufacturers throwing around $ trying to buy a championship, the new Champcar teams get there budget from the sponsors they land and are able to survive on their own.

Fans? The IRL has none. They either draw nothing or get fans who are forced to buy ticets as part of a Nascar package. Marlboro, Honda and Toyota give out an average of 20K tickets per race. On TV they get lower ratings than in infomercial.

Chamcar is averagimg over 100K per race. Mexico will be the single largest attended race in America this year.

I don't disagree with you on officiating this year, it's been bad.

Backroom politicing in mgmt? That's in all racing especially the IRL with TG sponsoring various teams/drivers in the field.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 12:05:27 PM EST
I guess it's just the nature of things to split up. Look at Dirt Track, ARCA,Busch,Nextel Cup, they all started out as just plain ol' Stock Car racing but over time each broke away to form it's own "style" of racing. It a way it's kind of good because it gives the fans more of a chance to take in a race. I was able to see an IRL race at Nashville, if they were still part of F1 or some bigger organazation chances are I'd have never seen that race. Almost ever little town has a Dirt track where you can watch racing but if it was all one big group kind of deal that just might not be the case. I'm just glad to see that we've got racing to watch on TV. Also, it would be a hoot to see John Force beat and bang with Dale Jr. or see the look on Dale Jr.'s face after he got out of a Funny car that just turned a 5.50sec./320MPH run.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 12:10:23 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/29/2004 12:11:16 PM EST by KA3B]
That's why Chili is still racing WSB and not MotoGP...

WSB sucks with the spec tires and the spec bikes.
Except for Chris Vermillion and the Ten Kate Honda CBR1000RR


Originally Posted By Ungwaha:
OH MAN!!! Frankie Chili just highsided himself to the moon! He crashed out of the lead too. Oh by the way I am watching REAL racing.....World Superbike!!! on speed right now till 6.

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