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Posted: 8/21/2005 5:56:47 PM EDT
I placed a bid last night for a laptop computer. The auction was scheduled to end this afternoon. This morning, I was looking around and found a computer that will fit my needs better, but did not retract my bid for the other computer.

During the day, while I was out at the IRL race, someone bid over me on the first laptop, and I got a notice that I had been outbid. The seller cancelled that person's bid because they did not have sufficient feedback, and I got a notice that I was the high bidder again. The other bidder placed another bid, again outbidding me, but this bid was also cancelled by the seller. The auction then ended with me as the high bidder.

So, I technically won the auction, but since I found a machine that will suit me better and because I was notified twice that I had been outbid, I do not particularly want to complete the transaction.

What do you guys think?
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 5:58:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By thelastgunslinger:
I placed a bid last night for a laptop computer. The auction was scheduled to end this afternoon. This morning, I was looking around and found a computer that will fit my needs better, but did not retract my bid for the other computer.

During the day, while I was out at the IRL race, someone bid over me on the first laptop, and I got a notice that I had been outbid. The seller cancelled that person's bid because they did not have sufficient feedback, and I got a notice that I was the high bidder again. The other bidder placed another bid, again outbidding me, but this bid was also cancelled by the seller. The auction then ended with me as the high bidder.

So, I technically won the auction, but since I found a machine that will suit me better and because I was notified twice that I had been outbid, I do not particularly want to complete the transaction.

What do you guys think?



The honorable thing to do is to buy the one you bid on on Ebay.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 5:58:45 PM EDT
Legally binding bid, you won and you must pay. Sorry.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:00:53 PM EDT


if the seller specified he has the right to refuse a bid for any reason in the auction write up, then your stuck with the bid..
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:02:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/21/2005 6:06:13 PM EDT by Mauser101]
Don't want it? Don't buy it.

Don't be suprised when you get bad feedback on your ebay account from the seller.

Besides, the ethics of the seller are called into question anyway for using a phantom account to up the price and then cancel the bid shortly before the auction closed.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:02:58 PM EDT
Yep you bought it Big -1 for having to ask.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:03:14 PM EDT
You bid on it, you won the auction, you've read the terms to ebay auctions, you've bought it. Now, you should adhear to the terms of the auction and pay for it.

FWIW. The seller that canceled the auction as a bidder with insufficient "feedback" won, well, the seller is an asshat. Someone won fair and square and the seller should HONOR the contractual obligation he entered in with. (Just as YOU should since you won it the next time around.)

If you want a different computer, I suggest that when you've paid for and recieved this computer, you put it up on ebay and resell it, THEN, buy the computer you REALLY want. (You might even make a few bucks on it)

Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:03:14 PM EDT
Your bid is a contract.

Now, if you don't want to be ethical, tell him you bid on other machine when you read that you were outbid.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:07:44 PM EDT
You bid you bought it.

You said, "I offer to purchase from you at my price."

Just because the guy declined other higher offers does not take your offer off the table.

Buy the damn laptop, then sell it to the guy who was trying to outbid you.

In the future don't BID until you're done shopping.

IOW, what the F were you thinking dropping a bid if you hadn't looked around and finished your search?

Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:10:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/21/2005 6:13:30 PM EDT by krpind]
That is not quite as cut and dried to me.

It is an interesting twist.....because you ARE NOT the high bidder. You were outbid and were notified of that fact.

The seller must take into consideration that canceling a bid might have adverse effects beyond his little world.

When he cancelled the higher bid, did Ebay notify you, that you were winning again or did the seller? How long was the time lag between the time you were outbid and you got a winning notification?

ETA, In a live auction, if the buyer can't pay, just because you were second highest buyer doesn't mean you are bound to buy it. They would start the auction over. I realize it is not exactly the same, but it is close.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:11:19 PM EDT

Originally Posted By WizardOfAhs:
You bid on it, you won the auction, you've read the terms to ebay auctions, you've bought it. Now, you should adhear to the terms of the auction and pay for it.

FWIW. The seller that canceled the auction as a bidder with insufficient "feedback" won, well, the seller is an asshat. Someone won fair and square and the seller should HONOR the contractual obligation he entered in with. (Just as YOU should since you won it the next time around.)

If you want a different computer, I suggest that when you've paid for and recieved this computer, you put it up on ebay and resell it, THEN, buy the computer you REALLY want. (You might even make a few bucks on it)




That's gonna be the plan. I think that all the bid cancelling, and the resultant bouncing around of the price, may have scared off some potential bidders and let me get the computer at a pretty low price. The winning amount is almost $200 less than my max bid, so I can't be too unhappy with it.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:13:18 PM EDT

Originally Posted By GonzoAR15-1:
You bid you bought it.

You said, "I offer to purchase from you at my price."

Just because the guy declined other higher offers does not take your offer off the table.

Buy the damn laptop, then sell it to the guy who was trying to outbid you.

In the future don't BID until you're done shopping.

IOW, what the F were you thinking dropping a bid if you hadn't looked around and finished your search?




I thought that I was done shopping. But, after I had placed my bid, I was still clicking around on Google and came across that perfect machine.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:15:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By thelastgunslinger:

That's gonna be the plan. I think that all the bid cancelling, and the resultant bouncing around of the price, may have scared off some potential bidders and let me get the computer at a pretty low price. The winning amount is almost $200 less than my max bid, so I can't be too unhappy with it.



In this case it should not be an issue for you.

But it is an interresting question.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:17:06 PM EDT
Buy it, turn around and sell it on eBay for a profit, and then buy the other machine.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:17:08 PM EDT

Originally Posted By krpind:
That is not quite as cut and dried to me.

It is an interesting twist.....because you ARE NOT the high bidder. You were outbid and were notified of that fact.

The seller must take into consideration that canceling a bid might have adverse effects beyond his little world.

When he cancelled the higher bid, did Ebay notify you, that you were winning again or did the seller? How long was the time lag between the time you were outbid and you got a winning notification?

ETA, In a live auction, if the buyer can't pay, just because you were second highest buyer doesn't mean you are bound to buy it. They would start the auction over. I realize it is not exactly the same, but it is close.



First outbid notification- 8:34am

First notification that the high bid had been cancelled by the seller and that I was again high bidder- 8:41am

Second outbid notification- 9:31am

Second notification that the high bid had been cancelled again- 10:33am

Notification that I had won the auction- 1:42pm
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:17:38 PM EDT
In another twist it could have been a shill bidder to see what your max bid was.

In any case for it to happen twice, I would be VERY leary of this seller.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:23:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By krpind:
In another twist it could have been a shill bidder to see what your max bid was.

In any case for it to happen twice, I would be VERY leary of this seller.



Should I ask the seller to pay for an escrow?
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:29:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By staraero:
Yep you bought it Big -1 for having to ask.



Who the fuck are you again?
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:38:18 PM EDT
Buy it and sell it to the other guy that outbid you.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:41:17 PM EDT

Originally Posted By tyman:
Buy it and sell it to the other guy that outbid you.



The other bidder is probably the seller.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:44:25 PM EDT

Originally Posted By thelastgunslinger:

Originally Posted By staraero:
Yep you bought it Big -1 for having to ask.



Who the fuck are you again?



Hmmmm let me check must be a more honest person than you for asking that question.
.
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Oh now i remember you're the person who flushed your head in the toilet in school. WTF difference does it make.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:44:57 PM EDT
I wouldnt buy it because of the funk the seller was pulling
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:47:34 PM EDT
You being outbid, to me, canx's your bid.

Find a different one, good luck.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:47:44 PM EDT

Originally Posted By staraero:

Originally Posted By thelastgunslinger:

Originally Posted By staraero:
Yep you bought it Big -1 for having to ask.



Who the fuck are you again?



Hmmmm let me check must be a more honest person than you for asking that question.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
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Oh now i remember you're the person who flushed your head in the toilet in school. WTF difference does it make.



You think that you are more honest than me because I am questioning whether I am obligated to pay on an auction that had strange activity, or do you know me from somewhere else? Either way your "Big -1" means exactly jack shit.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:51:31 PM EDT
Nothing strange about dropping low feedback bidders. Who is jack shit? Listing on Ebay costs money , you wanted reassurance of your decision to screw someone. Also called a none paying bidder. Don't know you , I ant that way.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:55:47 PM EDT

Originally Posted By staraero:
Nothing strange about dropping low feedback bidders. Who is jack shit? Listing on Ebay costs money , you wanted reassurance of your decision to screw someone. Also called a none paying bidder. Don't know you , I ant that way.



Really, why?
EVERYONE starts with a 0 feedback rating.

If they don't pay they don't get the item.

His high bid was $200.00 higher than he paid, that means the "new guy" bid more than $200 over the existing bid.

$200 is alot to leave on the table.......it was a shill bid to see what his high bid was.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:57:04 PM EDT
The seller can choose who he wishes to sell to....or not.

You gave your word you would buy the computer.

Are you trying to put a price on your word?
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 6:58:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/21/2005 7:06:12 PM EDT by staraero]

Originally Posted By krpind:

Originally Posted By staraero:
Nothing strange about dropping low feedback bidders. Who is jack shit? Listing on Ebay costs money , you wanted reassurance of your decision to screw someone. Also called a none paying bidder. Don't know you , I ant that way.



Really, why?
EVERYONE starts with a 0 feedback rating.

If they don't pay they don't get the item.

His high bid was $200.00 higher than he paid, that means the "new guy" bid more than $200 over the existing bid.

$200 is alot to leave on the table.......it was a shill bid to see what his high bid was.



OK if what you said was true , your account is his troll account.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 7:04:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By staraero:

Originally Posted By krpind:

Originally Posted By staraero:
Nothing strange about dropping low feedback bidders. Who is jack shit? Listing on Ebay costs money , you wanted reassurance of your decision to screw someone. Also called a none paying bidder. Don't know you , I ant that way.



Really, why?
EVERYONE starts with a 0 feedback rating.

If they don't pay they don't get the item.

His high bid was $200.00 higher than he paid, that means the "new guy" bid more than $200 over the existing bid.

$200 is alot to leave on the table.......it was a shill bid to see what his high bid was.



OK if what you said was true , your account is his troll account.[moon



LMAO
Where the hell did that come from?
What makes you think some stupid shit like that?

Link Posted: 8/21/2005 7:05:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/21/2005 7:13:28 PM EDT by thelastgunslinger]

Originally Posted By krpind:

Originally Posted By staraero:
Nothing strange about dropping low feedback bidders. Who is jack shit? Listing on Ebay costs money , you wanted reassurance of your decision to screw someone. Also called a none paying bidder. Don't know you , I ant that way.



Really, why?
EVERYONE starts with a 0 feedback rating.

If they don't pay they don't get the item.

His high bid was $200.00 higher than he paid, that means the "new guy" bid more than $200 over the existing bid.

$200 is alot to leave on the table.......it was a shill bid to see what his high bid was.



The more that I think about it, the more that I think that you are right. Here is a screen shot of the bid history for the laptop:



As you can see, the first cancelled bid was for $1,125 which was cancelled VERY quickly (only 3 minutes). Then a second bid of $1,075 that took over an hour to be cancelled. I think that you may be right that the seller was trying to see how high my max bid had been set at, but decided that it wasn't worth going below $1,075 for a THIRD time.


Link Posted: 8/21/2005 7:05:56 PM EDT
Your logic is what made me think that.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 7:14:18 PM EDT
You decided what you wanted to pay for a product. Your bid was accepted. Is the item still a bargain? What is your honor worth?

FWIW, the wife may be looking for a new laptop. Lemme know if you want to sell it.

SRM
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 7:16:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By staraero:
Your logic is what made me think that.



I will take that as a compliment..........I think.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 7:28:51 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/21/2005 7:33:40 PM EDT by krpind]

Originally Posted By thelastgunslinger:

As you can see, the first cancelled bid was for $1,125 which was cancelled VERY quickly (only 3 minutes). Then a second bid of $1,075 that took over an hour to be cancelled. I think that you may be right that the seller was trying to see how high my max bid had been set at, but decided that it wasn't worth going below $1,075 for a THIRD time.



After looking at that I am almost positive it was a shill bid.
He could see your max bid as soon as his alter ego made his bid....your max bid would be the current bid minus the minimum raise.
He DROPPED his second bid and left it there for an hour, to see if you would bump it.

I would buy the computer......but just because it appears to be a great deal.
I would report him and let Ebay decide if they think it was shill bidding. (after I got the computer)

ETA..I am sure he was hoping your max bid was more than $1125. and that way he would have just made an extra $300 bucks
Either way....I think he is probably a jackass.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 7:34:29 PM EDT

Try to contact the high bidder. I bet you run into a dead end as it is probably the seller... Bust his ass if you can with E-Bay.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 11:14:54 PM EDT
Let's see... other bidder bids and is cancelled then comes back and bids again at a lower price?

Extremely fishy.

Take a look at the seller's feedback and check the items he has sold recently. Make sure to check
the bidding history for recent items to see if you see this same '0' Feedback bidder on other items.

Most of these guys are too lazy to create phantom bidders for every item.

I'm not 100% sure but IIRC even if the bid is withdrawn the history remains.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 11:53:33 PM EDT
I don;t see how you can have a problem if the price is 200 less than your max.

You just chnged your mind which is not a valid reason to cancel a bid.

If you feel he bumped up the price then he missed out on 200 bucks. And if he cancelled the other guys bid then the "shill" bidder did no damage as it did not up your bid.

Don;t put up so high max bids.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 11:58:47 PM EDT
You could always try contacting the seller, they will often work with you.

Explain the situation, and ask if the seller would be willing to relist, if you paid his fees.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 11:59:39 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/22/2005 12:24:27 AM EDT
Two words,... Bid Retraction. Learn how to use it next time at the first hint of shill bidding.

pages.ebay.com/help/buy/questions/retract-bid.html


Link Posted: 8/22/2005 12:28:16 AM EDT

Originally Posted By hawk1:
Two words,... Bid Retraction. Learn how to use it next time at the first hint of shill bidding.

pages.ebay.com/help/buy/questions/retract-bid.html





And how does this fall under their bid retraction guidelines?
Link Posted: 8/22/2005 12:31:15 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/22/2005 1:15:54 AM EDT
It is Egay. Who the hell is scared of Egay? Just don't pay. It isn't like you are stealing from him. He isn't actually going to take the time to sue you. He will just relist it. Look at how many negatives are on there. If you buy a car and can't pay for it they take the car right? Let him keep his laptop. What if he ruins your Egay credit score.
Link Posted: 8/22/2005 1:32:49 AM EDT
I find it kinda funny that people here are trying to say you have no honor, your honor has a price tag, etc...

I think you got hosed.

Easy to do, it is not their money.

Keyboard laywers.

If it is not NIB, and I can not BUY IT NOW....I do not buy anything from ebay.

Sellers have many accounts and friends to drive up the prices.
Link Posted: 8/22/2005 3:43:46 AM EDT

Originally Posted By krpind:

Originally Posted By tyman:
Buy it and sell it to the other guy that outbid you.



The other bidder is probably the seller.


hahahaha that's what i was thinking! new acct, lo feedback...seller wanted to feel out your max bid! probably not the case but it does happen. if you really didn't want it and didn't wanna go through the whole "thought i was outbid so i bid on another" you could be upfront and tell him you bought another computer but would be willing to throw a couple bucks his way for the ebay gouge, relisting fees, etc.

this is the time to buy on ebay! folks are on vacation or playing outside so you don't get so many bidders...
Link Posted: 8/22/2005 3:52:59 AM EDT
pay for it and then resell it if you are not happy.
simple.

Essayons
Link Posted: 8/22/2005 4:11:04 AM EDT
I bid once and then got an obnoxious email from the seller. Apparently she hid beneath a ton of surperflous information that she wanted shipping through EBay ($6.95). It would cost less than $1 to ship too. I took the hit instead but don't give a d***. Filed a complaint w/EBay and accused the seller of sharp practices and of obfuscating the obvious. Big deal. I'm still in good standing.
Link Posted: 8/22/2005 4:15:03 AM EDT
You bought it, not the sellers problem you didn't do the research. Don't mess up your rating.
Lesson learned..., or was it.
Link Posted: 8/22/2005 4:16:14 AM EDT


Even if it was a case of shill bidding, you got the computer you were bidding on for $200 less than you were willing to pay for it. Sounds like you saved a few bucks to me.

Use it for a little while. If you don't like it, put it up for auction and get the other one.

Link Posted: 8/22/2005 4:16:27 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Mauser101:
Don't want it? Don't buy it.

Don't be suprised when you get bad feedback on your ebay account from the seller.

Besides, the ethics of the seller are called into question anyway for using a phantom account to up the price and then cancel the bid shortly before the auction closed.



No, commonly sellers state that they will not take bids from unverified or low/poor feedback buyers. Nothing wrong with that, happens all the time for good reason.
Link Posted: 8/22/2005 4:58:25 AM EDT

Really, why?
EVERYONE starts with a 0 feedback rating.

If they don't pay they don't get the item.


Exactly. They pay before you ship, so what's the problem?

I've had much better luck with people on ebay that have very little or no feedback. They're much more likely to be honest than the professional thieves there.z
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