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Posted: 9/6/2018 6:37:07 PM EST
So hypothetically , you are on duty, watch a person blow through a red light and narrowly miss hitting a school bus full of kids. Lights sirens, full stop, person is fully awake just a crap driver. Person has prior drug arrests/convictions, currently on parole, person consents to search of vehicle, during search you find a prescribed inhaler with an albuterol cartridge(IE potential life saving asthma medication) that has been converted to a bong. (cover plastic in foil, inhale while burning, remove foil insert cartridge to stop the asthma. The bong has weed residue in it, car reeks of weed, obviously been used to smoke weed. seizing drug paraphernalia is cake walk right, BUT how do you deal with the "they took my life saving albuterol inhaler device". Is there potential legal blowback?
Link Posted: 9/6/2018 7:37:10 PM EST
Originally Posted By fsjdw2:
So hypothetically , you are on duty, watch a person blow through a red light and narrowly miss hitting a school bus full of kids. Lights sirens, full stop, person is fully awake just a crap driver. Person has prior drug arrests/convictions, currently on parole, person consents to search of vehicle, during search you find a prescribed inhaler with an albuterol cartridge(IE potential life saving asthma medication) that has been converted to a bong. (cover plastic in foil, inhale while burning, remove foil insert cartridge to stop the asthma. The bong has weed residue in it, car reeks of weed, obviously been used to smoke weed. seizing drug paraphernalia is cake walk right, BUT how do you deal with the "they took my life saving albuterol inhaler device". Is there potential legal blowback?
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Photograph as is and return it in its legal state. We photo and then dispose ALL paraphernalia at my dept otherwise we would need a separate building for crack pipes, bong etc.

Never in 23 years have I had to produce the actual paraphernalia for court.

J-
Link Posted: 9/6/2018 9:46:05 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/6/2018 9:52:44 PM EST by ColtRifle]
Wouldn't be a bong. It is a pipe.

If you use your legit medical device to smoke illegal drugs, you are stupid. Once you start using your legit device for illegal purposes, it's not a legit device any more.

If you are smoking weed, I doubt the inhaler is actually life saving. Seize, prosecute, destroy.

Life is hard but it's harder when you are stupid.
Link Posted: 9/7/2018 1:26:26 AM EST
If an arrest is made, test/photograph/seize the inhaler as paraphernalia.

As for the legal ramifications, our jail has a full medical staff to look after his asthma.
Link Posted: 9/7/2018 4:50:41 AM EST
Originally Posted By fsjdw2:
So hypothetically , you are on duty, watch a person blow through a red light and narrowly miss hitting a school bus full of kids. Lights sirens, full stop, person is fully awake just a crap driver. Person has prior drug arrests/convictions, currently on parole, person consents to search of vehicle, during search you find a prescribed inhaler with an albuterol cartridge(IE potential life saving asthma medication) that has been converted to a bong. (cover plastic in foil, inhale while burning, remove foil insert cartridge to stop the asthma. The bong has weed residue in it, car reeks of weed, obviously been used to smoke weed. seizing drug paraphernalia is cake walk right, BUT how do you deal with the "they took my life saving albuterol inhaler device". Is there potential legal blowback?
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Not at all. Once you can show that that it was used outside of its intended purpose for the consumption of weed or any other narcotic, it becomes contraband and can be seized as evidence.
Link Posted: 9/8/2018 2:07:47 PM EST
I don't think you fully 'get' what he's asking.

Dude is doing meth through his oxygen generator somehow. Clearly, one part of the law says it's been adulterated from FDA-approved method of use, and is now clearly contraband.

BUT

Is there law or regulation guiding or restricting taking someone's RX medical durable equipment for law violations?

What happens when Mister law abiding yute in a wheelchair shows up on eye in the sky 13, crying to tits mchgee on the scene about how the mean officer -wheeze- took his inhaler -croak- he cant's get no airs now -wheeze- cops trnya kill him, lyin on him about -coff coff- using his inhala to do the dopes.

They show a picture of him in his choir outfit, and then they show a picture of OP coming out of court after being provoked for thirty minutes by defense counsel while the prosecutor sat there on their tablet.

OP

Good question. Maybe as part of your patter, you ask if they presently have any symptoms, then possess a spare or backup, or advise them to go to the pharmacy and replace it at once after you cite and release. Offer an ambulance or something to have them refuse transport on body cam, too? Dunno. Betting you don't have a department policy addressing this...
Link Posted: 9/8/2018 5:31:27 PM EST
Didn't know an albuterol inhaler was also an oxygen generator.
Link Posted: 9/9/2018 7:52:34 PM EST
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Originally Posted By ColtRifle:
Didn't know an albuterol inhaler was also an oxygen generator.
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He also wasn't doing meth through it either. H Y P E R B O L E
Link Posted: 9/11/2018 1:23:26 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/11/2018 1:42:26 PM EST
Transport to ER. If he needs care he can get it while the investigation is underway.
A paramedic student from Idaho told me several inmates were causing themselves to have high blood sugar, getting a insulin dependent diabetes diagnosis and getting medicaid to pay for insulin pumps. They then would intentionally get arrested to smuggle drugs (either liquid synthetic or some kind of drug) into the jail and distribute at will all the while using this "medical device" as a defense
Link Posted: 9/12/2018 11:12:14 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jjc155:

Photograph as is and return it in its legal state. We photo and then dispose ALL paraphernalia at my dept otherwise we would need a separate building for crack pipes, bong etc.

Never in 23 years have I had to produce the actual paraphernalia for court.

J-
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I would love to be able to do that. Do you have a policy on that? We have guys that take every little thing and it just clogs up our storage. And on top of that, WY doesn't have a paraphernalia law.
Link Posted: 9/13/2018 9:09:09 AM EST
Link Posted: 9/24/2018 9:32:09 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By high_order1:
I don't think you fully 'get' what he's asking.

Dude is doing meth through his oxygen generator somehow. Clearly, one part of the law says it's been adulterated from FDA-approved method of use, and is now clearly contraband.

BUT

Is there law or regulation guiding or restricting taking someone's RX medical durable equipment for law violations?

What happens when Mister law abiding yute in a wheelchair shows up on eye in the sky 13, crying to tits mchgee on the scene about how the mean officer -wheeze- took his inhaler -croak- he cant's get no airs now -wheeze- cops trnya kill him, lyin on him about -coff coff- using his inhala to do the dopes.

They show a picture of him in his choir outfit, and then they show a picture of OP coming out of court after being provoked for thirty minutes by defense counsel while the prosecutor sat there on their tablet.

OP

Good question. Maybe as part of your patter, you ask if they presently have any symptoms, then possess a spare or backup, or advise them to go to the pharmacy and replace it at once after you cite and release. Offer an ambulance or something to have them refuse transport on body cam, too? Dunno. Betting you don't have a department policy addressing this...
View Quote
Excellent solution, i was really curious as to a "good" solution.
Link Posted: 9/24/2018 9:54:02 PM EST
Here once you are in custody any and all medical care save emergency CPR is administered by fire department medics, hospital staff, or jail nurses. You don't get to use any prescription anything in your possession at the time of arrest, unless a paramedic/doctor deems it appropriate, and I can't imagine a paramedic/doctor allowing anyone to use an obviously tampered with drug delivery device.

There are no issues with seizing it as evidence if it is evidence of a crime. If you legitimately have a condition requiring an inhaler you can explain your condition to the intake nurse at jail and they will either clear you or send you to the ER for a clearance for your condition.

Dunno. Betting you don't have a department policy addressing this...
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Any department that doesn't have a policy requiring cops to request medical aid for prisoners complaining of a health emergency is stomping around on thin fucking ice in civil court and it will crack one of these days

We have people pull the classic incarceritis bullshit of "I can't breathe cause my asthma/My diabeetus/My heart/I just swallowed drugs" literally on a daily basis. We just call FD and if the paramedic says send to the ER we take to them to the ER, otherwise they go to jail and get to whine to the jail nurse.

I get paid by the hour, absolutely no reason not to call medics to absolve me of liability for the one time in a million the whiner is actually having a heart attack.
Link Posted: 9/25/2018 4:00:19 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Mopseydocks6014:
I would love to be able to do that. Do you have a policy on that? We have guys that take every little thing and it just clogs up our storage. And on top of that, WY doesn't have a paraphernalia law.
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Yep

J-
Link Posted: 10/3/2018 1:55:48 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By SC11B:
Here once you are in custody any and all medical care save emergency CPR is administered by fire department medics, hospital staff, or jail nurses. You don't get to use any prescription anything in your possession at the time of arrest, unless a paramedic/doctor deems it appropriate, and I can't imagine a paramedic/doctor allowing anyone to use an obviously tampered with drug delivery device.

There are no issues with seizing it as evidence if it is evidence of a crime. If you legitimately have a condition requiring an inhaler you can explain your condition to the intake nurse at jail and they will either clear you or send you to the ER for a clearance for your condition.

Any department that doesn't have a policy requiring cops to request medical aid for prisoners complaining of a health emergency is stomping around on thin fucking ice in civil court and it will crack one of these days

We have people pull the classic incarceritis bullshit of "I can't breathe cause my asthma/My diabeetus/My heart/I just swallowed drugs" literally on a daily basis. We just call FD and if the paramedic says send to the ER we take to them to the ER, otherwise they go to jail and get to whine to the jail nurse.

I get paid by the hour, absolutely no reason not to call medics to absolve me of liability for the one time in a million the whiner is actually having a heart attack.
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This dude here is dead nuts on.

I'd never arrest anybody for a homemade bong anyway, and my county doesn't even arrest for marijuana possession anymore... but if I found you with a crack rock or a bag of meth and you started claiming jail aches, I get to sit on you at the hospital for an hour or two while the nurses pretend to care before kicking you loose with a few Asprin and I take you to jail anyway.

And if for whatever reason you end up actually getting admitted to the hospital while in Police custody (and the hospital knows that they're not going to get a dime out of you, and this really only happens if your bones are sticking out of your skin), then I just release you from custody and file an arrest warrant on you and hope some other cop finds you rolling around at some later date and picks you up on my charge.

Very few street level drug abusers have millions of dollars and a passport to a non-extradition country. I'm not breaking my balls or sticking my neck out to get you in jail more than the other 100 dudes before you who did more exciting stuff. You'll get charged with the crime, and the justice system will get a piece of your flesh or your time or your pocketbook eventually, I don't really care when.
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