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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/12/2005 9:28:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/12/2005 9:48:31 PM EDT by Wash-Ar15]
We have seen a barrel of crude go to new highs almost everyday. IMHO if it continues the US economy will collapse. So many thing are dependent on oil these days. From manufacturing to trucking etc,etc. Many have stated that the US went to war to perserve our oil supply. I think there is validity to it.

Should the US take the oil if it feels threatened by supply interupption?

If yes when should we react?$100 a barrel?$150?

Called me naive but I consider these thing as essential:

Food
Air
Water
Electricity
Gas

ovious­ly the first three are essential but life would be difficult without the latter two.

Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:29:04 PM EDT
AJNTSA
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:30:08 PM EDT
What percentage of our oil comes from the middle east?
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:30:14 PM EDT
It is a resource. Would you fight for pie?
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:30:37 PM EDT
I think 15%.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:31:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By NimmerMehr:
It is a resource. Would you fight for pie?


The muslims do!
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:31:17 PM EDT
Fuck 'em.


I like oil.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:31:29 PM EDT
What about Europe?
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:31:44 PM EDT
Yes.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:33:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/12/2005 9:34:06 PM EDT by Specop_007]
In a more general sense its "American Interest"
So, yes.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:34:11 PM EDT
Yes, although it would be easier if we could figure out how "our" oil got under "their" sand.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:34:54 PM EDT
You do realize we couldn't refine any more oil if they were GIVING it to us for free, right?

And we probably won't have any more significant expansion of refining capacity for at least another 5 years. Probably more like 10.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:35:42 PM EDT

Originally Posted By 1Andy2:
You do realize we couldn't refine any more oil if they were GIVING it to us for free, right?

And we probably won't have any more significant expansion of refining capacity for at least another 5 years. Probably more like 10.



Yep
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:37:37 PM EDT
Suposedly we're not supposed to fight over stuff like that... and I'd tend to agree. We should go to war with the tree huggers that say we can't drill our own country for our own oil.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:39:03 PM EDT
Yes I understand that the refineries are maxed out . I am speaking more of a supply situation. Ya can't refine what you don't have.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:40:52 PM EDT
Personally, I'd like to see some exploratory drilling in ANWR and off our northern west coast, so we can get a definitive answer regarding how much is really there, before it comes to that.

That said, I wholeheartedly support further study into the use of robotics to extract crude oil, safely and economically, from a nuclear wasteland.

Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:40:57 PM EDT
Gasoline is cheaper than it was in 1981, when adjusted for inflation.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:41:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/12/2005 9:49:26 PM EDT by Lon_Moer]

Originally Posted By PigGuy:
Suposedly we're not supposed to fight over stuff like that... and I'd tend to agree. We should go to war with the tree huggers that say we can't drill our own country for our own oil.


True, there's said to be thousand years supply here off the N. Calif coast, but we're not "allowed" to drill for it.
And, of course, the people who have prevented that are "generally" the same who oppose the war, as well.


Originally Posted By Moof:
That said, I wholeheartedly support further study into the use of robotics to extract crude oil, safely and economically, from a nuclear wasteland.


Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:44:44 PM EDT
This game was published in the early/mid 1970's:

And no, I don't think it would be justified.

Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:49:10 PM EDT
Why not we fight over just about everything. Were getting fucked on these oil prices. I dont see how something cost more to get thats sucked out of the ground for free.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:49:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Painter:
What percentage of our oil comes from the middle east?





We import 58% according to washington post. Some of the other links I saw when I looked this up said anywhere from over 50% to 57%.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:51:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By GiggleSmith:
This game was published in the early/mid 1970's:
rollerweblogger.org/resources/roller/oilwar-sm.jpg
And no, I don't think it would be justified.



LOL there was one of those in the backroom of the hobbytown i used to work at
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:53:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BigB1129:
Why not we fight over just about everything. Were getting fucked on these oil prices. I dont see how something cost more to get thats sucked out of the ground for free.




I'd like to see you put in your own water well and tell me how free it is.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:53:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By bri26064:

Originally Posted By Painter:
What percentage of our oil comes from the middle east?





We import 58% according to washington post. Some of the other links I saw when I looked this up said anywhere from over 50% to 57%.



I have heard recently, that we get about 25-30% of our oil from the middle east.

Europe gets nearly 100% of their oil from the middle east.

Seems like they need to go to war for oil.

We are fighting for something else
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 9:57:48 PM EDT

Do you think fighting for oil is ever justified?

That is about a good as an excuse as any.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 10:00:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By 1Andy2:

Originally Posted By BigB1129:
Why not we fight over just about everything. Were getting fucked on these oil prices. I dont see how something cost more to get thats sucked out of the ground for free.




I'd like to see you put in your own water well and tell me how free it is.



Bout 10 grand, give or take.
And thats at a relatively shallow 4-500 feet.

I cant imagine 4-5 THOUSAND feet, or more.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 10:54:32 PM EDT
Do you think China would find it acceptable if the ME just stopped selling oil...how about Europe or Japan?

If Iraqi oil were used to get a diverse economy started it would offer a future to their people. Same with the other ME countries. If we chose to go overwhelmingly nuclear for electricity and cut our oil purchasing it is not our economy that would collapse. If you think the ME is a hell-hole of terrorists with a lot of oil revenue supporting it, just think what a hell-hole it would be if it was destitute. Without oil they have little to offer the rest of the world. If we wait and the ME turns to radical islam and uses oil as a weapon we will see a real war and everyone will be asking why didn't we do something when we could. That was even the story in 91 when we were criticised by some for not taking out Saddam when we had a little better world opinion situation. Not much better but then the world went 10+ years and started some lazy thinking about containment and Oil for Food while Saddam stole billions and terrorists were getting things going ....Remember too, that we originally went to the ME to protect the SA oil fields as well as get Saddam out of Kuwait. It's a big picture to look at and fairly complicated but to say it's fighting for oil is simplistic. It was a gamble trying to stay out of WWI and a gamble trying to stay out of WWII. A whole lot of people died in Europe, Russia and China while the US got it in gear. This is a gamble too for a future worth fighting for. Being a pacifist nation hasn't worked out well in the past for us.

The one telling thing for me is that you hear very little criticism from other ME governments on this matter as they know damn well the terrorists are more threatening by far to their governments than the US. They have a chance for a peaceful change to more democratic governments with the assistance of the US and the other large economic powers in the world. The terrorists offer only annihilation or submission.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 10:56:19 PM EDT
I've always liked the idea of invading Saudi Arabia. Of course, Russia and maybe China would immediately respond in a less than positive matter, so I don't consider it a viable option.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 10:56:53 PM EDT
Well I DID plan on driving to work tomorrow....
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 11:15:05 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 11:44:19 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
Well I DID plan on driving to work tomorrow....




Exactly. Also its kind of nice to have some CLP around the house too.
I think killing for oil is justified ecpecially when its AQ, Hammas etc.
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 12:33:30 AM EDT
The last figure I saw showed an overwhelming majority, something like 85%, of crude is used for purposes other than fuel. Swivel your head and look at all the plastic around you.

The oil-producing countries are not producing at 100% capacity. If they wanted, they could produce several MILLION more barrels of crude each day. They have stated the demand is not there so they are not producing the additional capacity.

China and India are driving the oil market right now. Both countries are in an industrialization boom right now.

AAA just put out a report showing record driving by vacation-goers this summer. People don't seem to mind paying the higher prices to get somewhere so why should the oil companies fret the high oil futures?

I heard a talking head explain the $60/bbl stuff as an oil futures price and had nothing to do with the price in the here and now. At the that time, about a month ago, oil was still selling for $37/bbl.

Have you noticed that the oil companies are reporting record profits?

If the US went to war for the Iraqi oil, where are all the supertankers loaded with US-only oil docking and offloading?
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 12:39:51 AM EDT
Look around, everything runs on oil. Want our whole economy to shut down? No? Well then, oil is worth fighting for.
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 12:50:23 AM EDT
Most wars in history come down to freedom and control of natural resources, fighting for oil is no different, these idiots that say no blood for oil are in a fantasy land.
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 8:34:21 AM EDT
OF COURSE oil is worth fighting for, but "fighting for oil" would solve nothing right now. Like everyone said, it is a supply/demand situation.

If OPEC (yeah, they still exist) got thier act together and declared an indefinite embargo on the US and Britain and made it stick, it would be justified to prevent our national economy from being crushed.

During all the outrage and embargos against South Africa for aparthied, we still continued to trade in strategic minerals found mostly in South Africa and Russia/Red China. We could not allow the Reds to have a stranglehold on our economy. I do not find it a coincidence that Nelson Mandela was elected president after we were able to get those minerals from our ex-enemies without a fear of embargo.

There is usually a better way - wonder how WW2 would have changed if Japan bought long term contracts for oil and other raw materials instead of battleships?
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 8:40:49 AM EDT

Originally Posted By 1Andy2:
You do realize we couldn't refine any more oil if they were GIVING it to us for free, right?

And we probably won't have any more significant expansion of refining capacity for at least another 5 years. Probably more like 10.



Dont let facts get in the way of scaring the public!
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 8:41:25 AM EDT
Oil is vital to our economy, industry and technology. I would say it is the most vital commodity to our survival.

I've got no problem with taking it, if it comes to that. I'd like to see us utilize other energy sources but we are going to need oil for some time to come.
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