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Posted: 2/18/2016 8:32:21 PM EDT
Do religious people need "official" leaders to talk to god or to be spiritual?

Is it required by GOd?


Serious discussion.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:34:09 PM EDT
[#1]
Pipes are usually handy for water, gas, sewage, etc.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:37:29 PM EDT
[#2]
Quoted:
Do religious people need "official" leaders to talk to god or to be spiritual?

Is it required by GOd?


Serious discussion.
View Quote


Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:40:13 PM EDT
[#3]
We?  


Ummmm....no.

There is one mediator between God and man------Christ Jesus.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:41:28 PM EDT
[#4]
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Quoted:
We?  


Ummmm....no.

There is one mediator between God and man------Christ Jesus.
View Quote

QFT!

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:41:46 PM EDT
[#5]
The answer is no. You don't need anyone to have a personal relationship with GOD.



Before Momma started "calling" people to preach because of social status and easy job, GOD calls people to preach and teach and educate the faithful. There are somethings that requires study and teaching to understand and it's a help to some people.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:44:27 PM EDT
[#6]
It's not required, but most people couldn't handle not having someone to tell them what to do.
Look at all the religious talking heads people quote, taking their opinions as statements of fact.
Sheep will always need a shepherd...
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:45:14 PM EDT
[#7]
OP

nope, he is the elected king of a castle.  Nothing more.  He has great influence over the followers and the current pope seems to be a positive influence so that is good.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:47:28 PM EDT
[#8]
Subject matter experts to provide guidance to those who are interested is ok, but I don't see the need for a leader in that capacity.

Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:48:16 PM EDT
[#9]
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Quoted:
OP

nope, he is the elected king of a castle.  Nothing more.  He has great influence over the followers and the current pope seems to be a positive influence so that is good.
View Quote



By positive influence you mean instigating an unchecked invasion of the US?
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:49:52 PM EDT
[#10]
Well.......Those altar boys aren't going to diddle themselves.








Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:49:58 PM EDT
[#11]
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Quoted:



By positive influence you mean instigating an unchecked invasion of the US?
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Quoted:
Quoted:
OP

nope, he is the elected king of a castle.  Nothing more.  He has great influence over the followers and the current pope seems to be a positive influence so that is good.



By positive influence you mean instigating an unchecked invasion of the US?


People here love to rationalize and make excuses for the modern red pope.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:50:29 PM EDT
[#12]
No Pope or priests but still Christian = Protestant
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:50:30 PM EDT
[#13]

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Quoted:


We?  





Ummmm....no.



There is one mediator between God and man------Christ Jesus.
View Quote
Pretty much this.

I'm hardly a Christian but even I know there is only one way to the farther and its not the Pope or some preacher.



 
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:53:24 PM EDT
[#14]
This is a pretty stupid question.  The answer depends entirely on your persuasion.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:55:31 PM EDT
[#15]
No, but I would have received way worse grades in math if there hadn't been a teacher to help me learn it. Just got to make sure the teacher isn't saying 2+2=5
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:55:38 PM EDT
[#16]
If you believe in Jesus and his teachings then the answer is yes.

1) He left the Apostles in charge and gave them explicit instructions as to their duty to spread the faith.  They almost immediately appointed an additional "apostle" to make sure they had the numbers to do it.  
2) They also appointed Deacons to carry out the duties and called down the Holy Spirit upon them as an ordination (just like the new apostles)
3) When there were questions of faith and "rules" (such as should gentiles be forced to be circumscribed)  they met in Council and prayed to the Holy Spirit for guidance.  Since the Spirit had been promised by Christ as a guide, these decisions were considered binding.  
4) There is no call for a personal relationship with God in the New Testament.  It is not there.  On the contrary "Where two or more are gathered" "Take the matter to the Church" and other references seem to indicate that it is through the corporate salvation as members of the Body of Christ that we are saved adn Baptism is the method by which we become members of the Body (St. Paul).  

For these and other reasons the answer is yes.  
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:56:10 PM EDT
[#17]
Didn't some German guy nail something to a church door back in the early 1500s regarding this ?
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:57:00 PM EDT
[#18]
Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

So, no you dont.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:57:18 PM EDT
[#19]
John Pope maybe.  It was a waste how they ended that.  In fact everything after season 2 started getting wonky.


Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:57:29 PM EDT
[#20]
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Quoted:
We?  


Ummmm....no.

There is one mediator between God and man------Christ Jesus.
View Quote

Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:59:16 PM EDT
[#21]
If someone claims to have a telephone to God, I claim that he belongs in a nuthouse.  I'm a Christian, but I don't need a human spiritual power over me.

Not to knock genuinely good people who want to become "shepherds" to help people who want help, but I draw the line at anyone claiming that they speak for God.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:59:38 PM EDT
[#22]
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Quoted:
There is one mediator between God and man------Christ Jesus.
View Quote

Link Posted: 2/18/2016 8:59:50 PM EDT
[#23]
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Quoted:
Didn't some German guy nail something to a church door regarding this back in the early 1500s?
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LCMS here. No pope, no indulgences, no problem.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:00:47 PM EDT
[#24]
The Pope can sell the Vatican treasures and give it all to Mexico. Until he follows his own dogma he should butt out.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:01:24 PM EDT
[#25]
Quoted:
Do religious people need "official" leaders to talk to god or to be spiritual?

Is it required by GOd?


Serious discussion.
View Quote



No.  

Frankly, some religious leaders like to act like they are the gatekeeper to heaven.  They are not.  Your salvation is between you and God.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:02:33 PM EDT
[#26]
Quoted:
Do religious people need "official" leaders to talk to god or to be spiritual?

Is it required by GOd?


Serious discussion.
View Quote


Welcome to the Reformation. Only 500 years too late.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:04:02 PM EDT
[#27]
Well, throughout the old and new testaments there were "spiritual leaders".
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:04:11 PM EDT
[#28]
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Quoted:
No Pope or priests but still Christian = Protestant
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Ah don't need no Pope to listen to. ( Hangs on the every word of Billy Graham.)

Current Pope is a leftist liberation theologian.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:04:52 PM EDT
[#29]

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Quoted:
No.  



Frankly, some religious leaders like to act like they are the gatekeeper to heaven.  They are not.  Your salvation is between you and God.
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Quoted:



Quoted:

Do religious people need "official" leaders to talk to god or to be spiritual?



Is it required by GOd?





Serious discussion.






No.  



Frankly, some religious leaders like to act like they are the gatekeeper to heaven.  They are not.  Your salvation is between you and God.
I just want to say one time me and FedDC agree.  

 
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:05:01 PM EDT
[#30]
The spiritual realm is hierarchical--and hierarchy is part of God's sense of "order".

God chose Moses--then told Moses to select his helpers, to shepherd His people.

Christ chose 12 disciples--and to them He gave Authority--what you bind on earth, shall be bound in heaven, and what you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.


People don't like being called to account or submitting to authority--but it IS part of God's aesthetic.

Those who claim they "don't need a church" are usually deluded about the state of their own soul.  YMMV.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:05:35 PM EDT
[#31]
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Quoted:
Didn't some German guy nail something to a church door back in the early 1500s regarding this ?
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Yet Luther preserved the hierarchy of Bishops and ministers that exists still.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:05:36 PM EDT
[#32]
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Quoted:
If someone claims to have a telephone to God, I claim that he belongs in a nuthouse.  I'm a Christian, but I don't need a human spiritual power over me.

Not to knock genuinely good people who want to become "shepherds" to help people who want help, but I draw the line at anyone claiming that they speak for God.
View Quote


and the Pope does not claim that....
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:08:37 PM EDT
[#33]
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Quoted:

QFT!

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
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Quoted:
Quoted:
We?  


Ummmm....no.

There is one mediator between God and man------Christ Jesus.

QFT!

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile


This
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:09:58 PM EDT
[#34]
If Catholics believe in the position and authority of the Pope, I respect their right to that belief.

Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:11:40 PM EDT
[#35]
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Quoted:
It's not required, but most people couldn't handle not having someone to tell them what to do.
Look at all the religious talking heads people quote, taking their opinions as statements of fact.
Sheep will always need a shepherd...
View Quote


thats a good way of putting it.  I think of it as an industry that produces an imaginary product that only a fool would invest significant time or money into.

I believe in god and the 10 commandments, golden rule and thats about it.  All the other nonsense required to be a good christian doesn't interest me
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:14:40 PM EDT
[#36]
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Quoted:


and the Pope does not claim that....
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Quoted:
Quoted:
If someone claims to have a telephone to God, I claim that he belongs in a nuthouse.  I'm a Christian, but I don't need a human spiritual power over me.

Not to knock genuinely good people who want to become "shepherds" to help people who want help, but I draw the line at anyone claiming that they speak for God.


and the Pope does not claim that....


Well, he "leads" the catholic denomination, right?
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:14:45 PM EDT
[#37]
Ain't nobody got time for commie pope.


Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:15:00 PM EDT
[#38]
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Quoted:


thats a good way of putting it.  I think of it as an industry that produces an imaginary product that only a fool would invest significant time or money into.

I believe in god and the 10 commandments, golden rule and thats about it.  All the other nonsense required to be a good christian doesn't interest me
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Quoted:
Quoted:
It's not required, but most people couldn't handle not having someone to tell them what to do.
Look at all the religious talking heads people quote, taking their opinions as statements of fact.
Sheep will always need a shepherd...


thats a good way of putting it.  I think of it as an industry that produces an imaginary product that only a fool would invest significant time or money into.

I believe in god and the 10 commandments, golden rule and thats about it.  All the other nonsense required to be a good christian doesn't interest me



I don't find it to be nonsense at all.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:18:08 PM EDT
[#39]
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Quoted:
Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

So, no you dont.
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OK.  So why did Jesus have Disciples?
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:19:48 PM EDT
[#40]
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:20:34 PM EDT
[#41]
It depends if you believe in the eucherist.
 





That said, the second issue is moral relativism.  Without a formal church, the believer ultimately will invent their own religion, choosing only what they want.


 
---

The Pope is the Bishop.  Most of his "authority" comes only from speaking in union with existing docterine and in union with the Bishops.  Other than that, the Vatican is mostly administrative.  The other big thing the Pope does is approve the ordination of Bishops and select the Cardinals (which in recent history has been from the Bishops).




In all fairness, I suspect the writings of most Bishops are not as well published as the Popes, but outside of their own dioceses-are probably as authoritative.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:21:15 PM EDT
[#42]
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Quoted:



OK.  So why did Jesus have Disciples?
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Quoted:
Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

So, no you dont.



OK.  So why did Jesus have Disciples?


Disciples are his followers.

The better question is why did He have apostles, and specifically refer to Peter as "the Rock" upon which He will build His church...

Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:23:30 PM EDT
[#43]
It's in the SOPs.

You can't bring up any changes to the SOPs until the next contract negotiation.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:25:53 PM EDT
[#44]
Nope.  Acceptance of Christ is all you need.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:29:08 PM EDT
[#45]
There is no god so it really does not mater.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:30:51 PM EDT
[#46]
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Quoted:
There is no god so it really does not mater.
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Wow. I just cut myself on that edge.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:31:40 PM EDT
[#47]
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Quoted:


Well, he "leads" the catholic denomination, right?
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
If someone claims to have a telephone to God, I claim that he belongs in a nuthouse.  I'm a Christian, but I don't need a human spiritual power over me.

Not to knock genuinely good people who want to become "shepherds" to help people who want help, but I draw the line at anyone claiming that they speak for God.


and the Pope does not claim that....


Well, he "leads" the catholic denomination, right?


yes, he does. Do you know who Dr Ronnie Floyd is?
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:36:50 PM EDT
[#48]
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Quoted:


yes, he does. Do you know who Dr Ronnie Floyd is?
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
If someone claims to have a telephone to God, I claim that he belongs in a nuthouse.  I'm a Christian, but I don't need a human spiritual power over me.

Not to knock genuinely good people who want to become "shepherds" to help people who want help, but I draw the line at anyone claiming that they speak for God.


and the Pope does not claim that....


Well, he "leads" the catholic denomination, right?


yes, he does. Do you know who Dr Ronnie Floyd is?


No, and I probably don't give a crap who he is, because this sounds like it's going to be a complete non-sequitor.
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:38:15 PM EDT
[#49]
"pope thread"
Link Posted: 2/18/2016 9:39:07 PM EDT
[#50]
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"pope thread"
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Does a bear pope in the woods?
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