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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/5/2005 10:53:10 AM EDT
It was obviously forbidden to the Jews, and I thought Jesus Christ came to confirm the law, not abolish it. So where is this dietary law removed in th N.T.? Thanks in advance!
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 10:57:42 AM EDT
Jesus came to free us from the law that none could uphold. In Corinthiens are around there somewhere it says something like its not what you put in your body that defiles you its what comes out of your heart.
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 10:58:14 AM EDT
Most do, some don't.

Paul wrote some about dietary restrictions and liberties. It will take me a bit to look up references, and I have a suspicion a couple people will beat me to it.
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 11:00:06 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/5/2005 11:02:12 AM EDT by david_g17]
as stated above, Mathew 15:11

"Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man. "
             -Jesus
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 11:01:35 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 11:08:26 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/5/2005 11:09:08 AM EDT by Brohawk]
Eat anything sold in the meat market without raising questions of conscience, for, "The earth is the Lord's, and everything in it."
If some unbeliever invites you to a meal and you want to go, eat whatever is put before you without raising questions of conscience. But if anyone says to you, "This has been offered in sacrifice," then do not eat it, both for the sake of the man who told you and for conscience' sake—the other man's conscience, I mean, not yours. For why should my freedom be judged by another's conscience? If I take part in the meal with thankfulness, why am I denounced because of something I thank God for?
So whether you eat or drink or whatever you do, do it all for the glory of God. (Corinthians 10:25-31)



About noon the following day as they were on their journey and approaching the city, Peter went up on the roof to pray. He became hungry and wanted something to eat, and while the meal was being prepared, he fell into a trance. He saw heaven opened and something like a large sheet being let down to earth by its four corners. It contained all kinds of four-footed animals, as well as reptiles of the earth and birds of the air. Then a voice told him, "Get up, Peter. Kill and eat."
"Surely not, Lord!" Peter replied. "I have never eaten anything impure or unclean."
The voice spoke to him a second time, "Do not call anything impure that God has made clean." (Acts 10:9-15)


The bottom line, follow your conscience (See Romans 14).
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 11:10:35 AM EDT
More weird history lessons :

During Nero's reign, sausages were associated with the Roman festival called Lupercalian held on February 14th to 15th. The Lupercalian Festival is the predecessor of today's St. Valentine's Day and was held in honor of the pastoral god Lupercus. The celebration included a sexual initiation rite. The early Catholic Church outlawed the Lupercalia Festival and made eating sausage a sin. The main reason was not that sausage was high in fat, but that sausage was a favored, and possibly ritualistic food of the pagan Lupercalia festival.

When Constantine The Great (274-337), the first Christian emperor of Rome, embraced Christianity, he also banned sausage consumption. This prohibition remained in force throughout the reigns of several emperors, but because of popular protest and illicit trading, it was finally repealed.

Not all pork, just sausage. Weird.
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 11:13:18 AM EDT

Originally Posted By TexasSIG:
This prohibition remained in force throughout the reigns of several emperors, but because of popular protest and illicit trading, it was finally repealed.

Not all pork, just sausage. Weird.



Hah! I can see people going to sausage "speak easys" during the Prohibition!

That just begs for parody!
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 11:26:34 AM EDT
Thanks everyone. Very insightful. One further question. Someone at work stated that the above scripture ""Do not call anything impure that God has made clean" is really not talking about food, but instead refers to the Jews dealings with the Gentiles. So how do you decide what to take literally, and what to take as a metaphor?
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 11:28:18 AM EDT
I think it is my duty as a Christian to eat anything I want.
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 11:29:41 AM EDT
MMmmmmmm.....pork.

Link Posted: 8/5/2005 11:36:43 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 11:37:47 AM EDT

Originally Posted By jcncc:
Jesus came to free us from the law that none could uphold.



??? So none of the Jews in the O.T. were capable of upholding the law? Then why would God wait thousands of years to alter the law?
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 11:40:16 AM EDT

Originally Posted By MRW:
Ok meaning you're not automatically going to hell? yes. as are all the other"laws" No one goes to hell because of breaking any particular law, folks go to hell because they reject Christ's offer to have his death pay for thier sins and decide to pay the debt themselves.

okay meaning it's a healthy thing to do? NO. Why do you want to eat an animal that lives in and eats its own crap?




So do you believe God commands the Christians to obstain from pork?
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 11:56:51 AM EDT
I believe the Lord put all animals on this earth for us to eat. (now I would believe some dog and cat lovers wouldn't be happy with that statment), but you asked for my opinion.





let the blazing begin
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 12:04:28 PM EDT
I eat dog and cat all the time at China Bay, just not pork.
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 12:13:58 PM EDT
I would not be considered a "devout" Christian but I definitely have never practiced any other
religion. For the record, I love Pork!


LB
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 2:05:26 PM EDT
As long as it's not on friday.
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 4:41:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/5/2005 4:47:04 PM EDT by TheWind]
MrsWind says I am the only Jew she knows that doesn't eat pork. She works for and with Jews. It is hard alot that is forbidden is connected to pagan worship. If a pagan does it a Jew should not, but they were tied totrites of paganism. at the time we had some weak Jews, look at when Moshe went up to Sinai, Modern Reform is based on getting rid of the superstition.
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 4:50:59 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/5/2005 4:53:19 PM EDT by WildBoar]

Originally Posted By BiggerStick47:
Thanks everyone. Very insightful. One further question. Someone at work stated that the above scripture ""Do not call anything impure that God has made clean" is really not talking about food, but instead refers to the Jews dealings with the Gentiles. So how do you decide what to take literally, and what to take as a metaphor?



Well in the case of the scripture you sort of quoted had EVERYTHING to do with food, so its all in context.

Actually scripture forbids us in some places to make laws to abstain from cetain foods and ordinances.
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 5:29:05 PM EDT
Piss off a Haji and eat a BLT!
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 6:13:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By RABIDFOX50:
Piss off a Haji and eat a BLT!



There's the anti-muslim comment for the thread. Idiot.
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 6:18:07 PM EDT
I won't.
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 10:44:41 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/5/2005 11:15:42 PM EDT by RABIDFOX50]

Originally Posted By BiggerStick47:

Originally Posted By RABIDFOX50:
Piss off a Haji and eat a BLT!



There's the anti-muslim comment for the thread. Idiot.



You know what, I had wrote a huge come back for you but in doing a double take a missied something. You are correct. I am an idiot for posting this in the religon section. I keep thinking I am in GD. My comment was meant to be a stab at humor but it is not appropriate for here and neither would my comback. I stand corrected. I must admit I have a deep hate for the ROP. I will say no more in here and save it for GD.

You may want to think about a Team member ship. We could use a few more level headed folks around here.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 5:34:26 AM EDT
I attended a conference at a Seventh Day Adventist church during high school, and we always had food after our Saturday meetings.

Pork was NEVER on the menu; they taught against eating pork.

This is part of the 27 fundamental beliefs of Adventists on the subject of "unclean foods":

The Blessing of Nutritious Food. To the first couple, the Creator gave the ideal diet: "'I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food'" (Gen. 1:29, NIV). After the Fall, God added to their diet "'the plants of the fields'" (Gen. 3:18, NIV).

Today's health problems tend to center on the degenerative type of diseases that are directly traceable to diet and lifestyle. The diet God planned, consisting of grains, fruits, nuts, and vegetables, offers the right nutritional ingredients to support optimum health.

1. The original diet. The Bible does not condemn the eating of clean animals. But God's original diet for man did not include flesh foods because He did not envision the taking of any animal's life and because a balanced vegetarian diet is the best for health—a fact for which science offers mounting evidence.20 People consuming animal products that contain bacteria or viruses that cause disease may have their

285

health impaired.21 It is estimated that every year, in the United States alone, millions suffer from poultry food poisoning because inspection fails to detect contamination by salmonella and other microorganisms.22 Several experts feel that "bacterial contamination poses a far greater risk than chemical additives and preservatives in food" and expect the incidence of the diseases caused by these bacteria to rise.23

Furthermore, studies conducted in recent years indicate that increased meat consumption can cause an increase of atherosclerosis, cancer, kidney disorders, osteoporosis, and trichinosis, and can decrease the life expectancy.24

The diet God ordained in the Garden of Eden—the vegetarian diet—is the ideal, but sometimes we cannot have the ideal. In those circumstances, in any given situation or locale, those who wish to stay in optimum health will eat the best food that they can obtain.

2. Clean and unclean flesh foods. Only after the Flood did God introduce flesh as food. With all vegetation destroyed, God gave Noah and his family permission to eat flesh foods, stipulating that they were not to eat the blood in the meat (Gen. 9:3-5).

Another stipulation Scripture implies that God gave Noah was that he and his family were to eat only what God identified as clean animals. It was because Noah and his family needed the clean animals for food as well as for sacrifices (Gen. 8:20) that God instructed Noah to take seven pairs of each kind of clean animal, in contrast to only one pair of each kind of unclean, with him into the ark (Gen. 7:2, 3). Leviticus 11 and Deuteronomy 14 provide extensive expositions on clean and unclean foods.25

By nature, unclean animals do not constitute the best food. Many are either scavengers or predators—from the lion and swine to the vulture and the bottom-dwelling, sucker-type fish. Because of their habits they are more apt to be carriers of disease.

Studies have revealed that "in addition to the moderate amounts of cholesterol found in both pork and shellfish, both foods contain a number of toxins and contaminants which are associated with human poisoning."26

By abstaining from unclean foods, God's people demonstrated their gratefulness for their redemption from the corrupt, unclean world around them (Lev. 20:24-26; Deut. 14:2). To introduce anything unclean into the body temple where God's Spirit dwells is less than God's ideal.

The New Testament did not abolish the distinction between the clean and unclean flesh foods. Some believe that because these dietary laws are mentioned in Leviticus, they are merely ceremonial or ritualistic, and so are no longer valid for Christians. Yet the distinction between clean and unclean animals dates back to Noah's day—long before Israel existed. As principles of health, these dietary laws carry with them an ongoing obligation. 27

Link Posted: 8/6/2005 6:19:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BiggerStick47:
Thanks everyone. Very insightful. One further question. Someone at work stated that the above scripture ""Do not call anything impure that God has made clean" is really not talking about food, but instead refers to the Jews dealings with the Gentiles. So how do you decide what to take literally, and what to take as a metaphor?



Right you are! I bet Jesus NEVER put pork in his mouth. He was talking about defiling the spirit NOT the body. Pork is bad for you even if you didn't belive in God.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 9:23:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/6/2005 9:52:53 PM EDT by BiggerStick47]

Originally Posted By RABIDFOX50:

Originally Posted By BiggerStick47:

Originally Posted By RABIDFOX50:
Piss off a Haji and eat a BLT!



There's the anti-muslim comment for the thread. Idiot.



You know what, I had wrote a huge come back for you but in doing a double take a missied something. You are correct. I am an idiot for posting this in the religon section. I keep thinking I am in GD. My comment was meant to be a stab at humor but it is not appropriate for here and neither would my comback. I stand corrected. I must admit I have a deep hate for the ROP. I will say no more in here and save it for GD.

You may want to think about a Team member ship. We could use a few more level headed folks around here.



I am considering a team membership. As a Muslim I am struggling with the idea of supporting a site that is so anti-Muslim. BTW, why would "Haji's" care what you eat? It's your body. Also, I apologize for calling you an idiot. But that is exactly the kind of stuff that is making me second guess a membership here.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 9:32:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 3:29:18 AM EDT by VA-gunnut]
****Deleted****<va-gunnut>
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 9:32:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BiggerStick47:

I am considering a team membership. As a Muslim I am struggling with the idea of supporting a site that is so anti-Muslim. BTW, why would "Haji's" care what you eat? It's your body. Also, I apologize for calling you an idiot. But that is exactly the kind of stuff that is making second guess a membership here.



Well here is your chance to dispell anxieties against your faith. Hang around more, post more.

I will admit I am less than impressed with Islam as a whole. I really think you guys need a reformation. your PR department needs some cleaning.

I didnt post this as an anti Islamic piece. Just an opinion not intended to flame.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 9:40:50 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/6/2005 9:41:45 PM EDT by BiggerStick47]

Originally Posted By WildBoar:


Well here is your chance to dispell anxieties against your faith. Hang around more, post more.

I will admit I am less than impressed with Islam as a whole. I really think you guys need a reformation. your PR department needs some cleaning.

I didnt post this as an anti Islamic piece. Just an opinion not intended to flame.



Understood. And i don't take that as anti-Islamic. The reason I started this thread is because my daughter is a Christian. She asked me about eating pork. I don't want to guide her with my faith unless she accepts it. So from time to time I must look to some Christian brothers and sisters for help. I am trying to honor her decision to be a Christian, and at the same time not let my faith dictate the way I interpret her faith. Thank you all for your help, and God bless you all.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 9:41:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 3:25:06 AM EDT by VA-gunnut]

Originally Posted By WildBoar:

Originally Posted By BiggerStick47:

I am considering a team membership. As a Muslim I am struggling with the idea of supporting a site that is so anti-Muslim. BTW, why would "Haji's" care what you eat? It's your body. Also, I apologize for calling you an idiot. But that is exactly the kind of stuff that is making second guess a membership here.



Well here is your chance to dispell anxieties against your faith. Hang around more, post more.

I will admit I am less than impressed with Islam as a whole. I really think you guys need a reformation. your PR department needs some cleaning.

I didnt post this as an anti Islamic piece. Just an opinion not intended to flame.



****Deleted****<va-gunnut>
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 9:46:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/6/2005 9:48:37 PM EDT by BiggerStick47]

Originally Posted By Dusty_C:

Well to believe what I've been told Islam doctrine says that biting the big one for your religion is the only absolute way to get into heaven. If that's not true tell me. If it is, then I'll continue you to view islam, as an ignorant, terrist orginization and nothing more. Here is your chance to change my views.



Try www.free-minds.org I doubt very seriously I can change your mind about an entire religion in the confines of this thread.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 9:59:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BiggerStick47:

Originally Posted By Dusty_C:

Well to believe what I've been told Islam doctrine says that biting the big one for your religion is the only absolute way to get into heaven. If that's not true tell me. If it is, then I'll continue you to view islam, as an ignorant, terrist orginization and nothing more. Here is your chance to change my views.



Try www.free-minds.org I doubt very seriously I can change your mind about an entire religion in the confines of this thread.



I think you should start a thread and intoduce yourself and keep it in this section. Even though I bet 99.9% of us in the religion section (including myself) already have a bias against your religion, we will abide by the rules. Take advantage of it. Seriously.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 10:11:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By WildBoar:
I think you should start a thread and intoduce yourself and keep it in this section. Even though I bet 99.9% of us in the religion section (including myself) already have a bias against your religion, we will abide by the rules. Take advantage of it. Seriously.



I may. I do not want to make mistakes and misrepresent my faith. That's why I suggested www.free-minds.org Christians aren't the only people who do not understand Islam. IMHO, most Muslims have been led astray.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 10:20:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 3:25:44 AM EDT by VA-gunnut]
****Deleted****<va-gunnut>
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 10:28:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 3:26:16 AM EDT by VA-gunnut]

Originally Posted By Dusty_C:
****Deleted****<va-gunnut>



The only way in Islam to enter Heaven is for God to let you in. And if you were refering to suicide bombers and the like, the Quran strictly forbids the killing of innocent people. So if a Muslim walks onto a bus full of Jews and blows himself up, he is a murderer and no longer a Muslim (One who submits himself to the will of God) Plain and simple. I can't make the decision of whether that murderer get's into Heaven, but I wouldn't want the last thing I did to be murder. I refered you to the site because it's a wealth of info, and you can read at your own pace.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 1:13:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 3:26:50 AM EDT by VA-gunnut]

Originally Posted By Dusty_C:

Originally Posted By WildBoar:

Originally Posted By BiggerStick47:

I am considering a team membership. As a Muslim I am struggling with the idea of supporting a site that is so anti-Muslim. BTW, why would "Haji's" care what you eat? It's your body. Also, I apologize for calling you an idiot. But that is exactly the kind of stuff that is making second guess a membership here.



Well here is your chance to dispell anxieties against your faith. Hang around more, post more.

I will admit I am less than impressed with Islam as a whole. I really think you guys need a reformation. your PR department needs some cleaning.

I didnt post this as an anti Islamic piece. Just an opinion not intended to flame.



****Deleted****<va-gunnut>


Lmao, name one religion where self sacrifice isn't considered the ultimate show of faith....

simply having absolute faith and know one on this board has that, or alive for that matter and being a god fearing and god following man will not get you into heaven, god gives no guarantee he will let you into heaven. So wtf are you talking about, sounds like your simply trying to bash a religion.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 3:30:13 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/8/2005 2:46:28 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BiggerStick47:
Thanks everyone. Very insightful. One further question. Someone at work stated that the above scripture ""Do not call anything impure that God has made clean" is really not talking about food, but instead refers to the Jews dealings with the Gentiles. So how do you decide what to take literally, and what to take as a metaphor?



Yes, that vision was sent to prepare Peter for his gentile visitors. However, I believe that in context with verses I mentioned above (scripture interprets scripture) the principle is far-reaching.

Consider the words of Yeshua:


"Are you still so dull?" Jesus asked them. 17"Don't you see that whatever enters the mouth goes into the stomach and then out of the body? 18But the things that come out of the mouth come from the heart, and these make a man 'unclean.' 19For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false testimony, slander. 20These are what make a man 'unclean'; but eating with unwashed hands does not make him 'unclean.' " (Matthew 15:16-18)


There are those who find great pleasure in restricting the liberty we have been given. That's liberty to live, not to sin.


28It seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us not to burden you with anything beyond the following requirements: 29You are to abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality. You will do well to avoid these things. Farewell. (Acts 15:28-29)

Link Posted: 8/9/2005 2:02:45 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BlueEyedEvil:

Originally Posted By BiggerStick47:
Thanks everyone. Very insightful. One further question. Someone at work stated that the above scripture ""Do not call anything impure that God has made clean" is really not talking about food, but instead refers to the Jews dealings with the Gentiles. So how do you decide what to take literally, and what to take as a metaphor?



Right you are! I bet Jesus NEVER put pork in his mouth. He was talking about defiling the spirit NOT the body. Pork is bad for you even if you didn't belive in God.



You're right in that Christ never ate pork during His time on the earth because He lived as a Jew, obeying and fulfilling the Law. I disagree with the above intrepetation of Acts 10 because I think it does include foods as well as Jew/Gentile dealings. In 1 Timothy 4:3-5 it is written:

"... forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from foods which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth. For every creature of God is good, and nothing is to be refused if it is received with thanksgiving; for it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer."

I believe all foods are good but should be eaten in "moderation." This includes pork IMO.
Link Posted: 8/9/2005 8:58:43 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BiggerStick47:
...
I am considering a team membership. As a Muslim I am struggling with the idea of supporting a site that is so anti-Muslim. BTW, why would "Haji's" care what you eat? It's your body. Also, I apologize for calling you an idiot. But that is exactly the kind of stuff that is making me second guess a membership here.



Please be assured that this site is not "anti-Muslim."

Be aware, thought, that many of us have given up participating in the threads where stuff starts getting real stupid, as many ignorant people are all too happy to remain that way.
Link Posted: 8/9/2005 9:10:49 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/9/2005 9:11:27 AM EDT by BiggerStick47]

Originally Posted By Adam_White:

Please be assured that this site is not "anti-Muslim."

Be aware, thought, that many of us have given up participating in the threads where stuff starts getting real stupid, as many ignorant people are all too happy to remain that way.



You know, it's kind of funny. I find myself spending most of my time in the religious forum, not gun forums where I started. The reason is because I am seeing there are alot of great people here. Thanks for the reassurance Adam_White, and for the rest of you guys here.
Link Posted: 8/9/2005 9:16:48 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/9/2005 1:01:37 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BiggerStick47:

Originally Posted By RABIDFOX50:

Originally Posted By BiggerStick47:

Originally Posted By RABIDFOX50:
Piss off a Haji and eat a BLT!



There's the anti-muslim comment for the thread. Idiot.



You know what, I had wrote a huge come back for you but in doing a double take a missied something. You are correct. I am an idiot for posting this in the religon section. I keep thinking I am in GD. My comment was meant to be a stab at humor but it is not appropriate for here and neither would my comback. I stand corrected. I must admit I have a deep hate for the ROP. I will say no more in here and save it for GD.

You may want to think about a Team member ship. We could use a few more level headed folks around here.



I am considering a team membership. As a Muslim I am struggling with the idea of supporting a site that is so anti-Muslim. BTW, why would "Haji's" care what you eat? It's your body. Also, I apologize for calling you an idiot. But that is exactly the kind of stuff that is making me second guess a membership here.



Even though there are some (me included) who wind up with their foot in theri mouths on certain issues (see above) we here a ARFCOM are not that bad. My indiscression was uncalled for here in the religon forum and you do not need to apologise. I should have known better. Alot of what is said in GD is BS anyway. Dont take it to heart. I've learned that a thick shin goes a long way in certain areas of ARFCOM. In the end we are all here for the love of the black rifles and all the goodies that goes with them. Please enjoy our site and remember, what is said on the internet is mostly crap anyway.

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