Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Site Notices
1/25/2018 7:38:29 AM
Posted: 8/11/2002 7:49:16 PM EST
I no longer will be subscribing to Directv, I'll be switching to Dish Network VERY shortly. Today I received a FedEx letter from Directv......well, just read it here...[url]http://www.legal-rights.org/DTV/DTVEUDG.html[/url]. My 72 year old neighbor received the same letter, I doubt he even knows what a computer looks like. I do not now and have never received free satellite TV, nor do I have knowledge of how to reprogram ANYTHING! I guess I have to watch what I say until this is settled, but has anyone else received this letter?? Any suggestions?
Link Posted: 8/11/2002 8:07:56 PM EST
Switching may be like going from frying pan to the fire since Dish Network and DirecTV are planning to merge.... [url]http://64.70.92.10/DTVAPP/aboutus/Merger.jsp[/url]
Link Posted: 8/11/2002 8:14:29 PM EST
That letter is a ruse. They cannot touch you if you don't sign it. Let them take you to court. The only way they can prove anything is if they catch you red-handed, and that would be hard to prove no matter what the circumstances. Take them to court for harrassment and threatening an harrassing lawsuit.
Link Posted: 8/11/2002 8:14:51 PM EST
i have heard of these, supposedly you only get them from buying sat. equipment over the net. equipment company gets busted or threatend, they turn over names/addresses of customers and get off the hook putting you on the hook. a co worker of mine used to have one of these cards and he said it was more trouble than its worth because they get zapped every few days.
Link Posted: 8/11/2002 8:14:57 PM EST
Get a lawyer now!! False accusations are known as libel. Get together with your neighbor and retain a lawyer together. Serve them papers. If you have any luck at all, you could win a pretty big settlement.
Link Posted: 8/11/2002 8:15:06 PM EST
If you don't know what the hell their talking about,I'd tell em to get fucked.I'd call and right a letter telling them that I don't appreciate paying a premium price for a service and getting what amounts to a criminal indictment in the mail.Ask em to be specific,and see what happens.
Link Posted: 8/11/2002 8:25:22 PM EST
Damn! And all this time I've been bugging myself to get a satellite dish so I can get the YES network to watch the Yankees.
Link Posted: 8/11/2002 8:51:31 PM EST
Originally Posted By Airwolf: Switching may be like going from frying pan to the fire since Dish Network and DirecTV are planning to merge....
View Quote
Actually, it's less of a merger and more of DirectTV agreeing to let Dish Network buy them out and run things. If the government decides to let them go ahead with the "merger", all DirectTV customers will have to change out their equipment as Dish Network uses a different technology(better actually). The good news is Dish Network has stated that they will replace the equipment free of charge. I am a Dish Network customer and I can't wait for the two companies to combine. The number of channels, features and quality of signal that will be available will be awesome. USPC40 [img]www.ar15.com/members/albums/USPC40/line.gif[/img] [url=www.nra.org][b][red]NRA[/red][/url] [url=www.nra.org][blue]Life Member[/blue][/url] [url=www.gunowners.org][b][red]GOA[/red] [/url] [url=www.gunowners.org][blue]Life Member[/blue][/url] [url=www.saf.org][red]SAF[/red][/url] [url=www.saf.org][blue]Supporter[/blue][/url] [url=sas-aim.org][red]SAS[/red][/url] [url=sas-aim.org][blue]Supporter[/blue][/b][/url] [img]www.ar15.com/members/albums/USPC40/alabamaflag.gif[/img]
Link Posted: 8/11/2002 9:17:00 PM EST
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 5:56:09 AM EST
It was suggested not to contact them at all, until I find an attorney. I believe they want $3500.00 to "settle", fuch you and the horse you rode in on!! Directv ASS-U-ME's that if someone purchased a programmer, that they would use it to reprogram Directv equipment. What kind of bullsh!t is that!!! Either way, this is a pain in my ass and I'am going to pay alot of money, which I don't have, to an attorney. OR would it be cheaper to pay Directv $3500.00? Still scratching my head...............
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 5:59:23 AM EST
Palmer, Did you buy a programmer or not?
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 6:05:40 AM EST
The short answer, yes. I'm still looking for an attorney who knows or is handeling these suits, no luck so far.
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 6:07:26 AM EST
Who cares if he bought a programmer. Programmers and emmulators are legal to use and own. DirectTV is not the only company that uses, or is allowed to use, smart card technology. They have the burden of proof, and just owning equipment is not enough to prove anything.
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 6:16:49 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 6:23:43 AM EST
Shoulda gota programmer from Canada. They have no laws against programming the cards to intercept DTV or Dish programming. They sell you the hardware with now software so they are no liable and on top of that they are not gona get busted and will not be turning over your names to anyone. I used to work with a guy that programmed the cards. He actually was from Canada and when he quit here he moved back. Quick search in google and you come up with allot of places that sell this stuff like: www.satuniverse.com Good luck with your battle, you shouldn’t have any problems. Just tell them that you bought the programmer because you wanted to play around with smart cards (pretty much what the satellite cards are) and that this was cheaper that buying an actual programmer that was selling as a smart card programmer. They have no way to prove that you were stealing any satellite signal other than if you left your phone line plugged into your receiver after programming the card. Diesel
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 6:45:19 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/12/2002 6:51:14 AM EST by jrzy]
I'm not a laywer but i do know about what i am going to tell you,If they file a law suit it will be in federal court,you have 20 days to file an answer,if you do not file the answer a default judgement will be entered against you. It can cost between $2000.00 and $5000.00 just to file an answer in federal court for lawyers fees. Find an atorney that is familar with satalite and cable theft laws ,that will cut down your expences because he will already know how to file the answer. The law suit they will file is already printed and they will adjust some information on it to fit you,they do this all day long to innocent and guilty people. Now this is very important!!!! DO NOT CONTACT THIS COMPANY ,YOU WILL TRIGGER WHATS CALLED CHASE RESPONSE FROM THEM. Do not return phone calls and do not respond at all until and if a law suit is filed. What someone said here is true ,purchase of an item does not prove guilt,but it does give them the right to sue you. Until you actually use the item and they can prove you did,there was no theft of service. My friend bought a cable box from an online company and they got busted and turned his name and credit card info over to the lawyer for the cable co. the box never worked and the co. would not refund his money and he could prove the thing never worked,with a little help from a lawyer we beat the shit out of the cable co. and they withdrew their law suit when faced with a high dollar couter suit. You see if the thing "NEVER WORKED" where is the damages they suffered? NONE! They will sue for the lost revenue and statuatory damages that are prescribed by law,if no theft occured then no damages,right?
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 6:46:55 AM EST
By the way canada just enacted satalite laws and busted a bunch of guys up there and that is where all this info is coming from on customers.
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 8:22:43 AM EST
Originally Posted By dieselpwer: Shoulda gota programmer from Canada. They have no laws against programming the cards to intercept DTV or Dish programming. They sell you the hardware with now software so they are no liable and on top of that they are not gona get busted and will not be turning over your names to anyone. I used to work with a guy that programmed the cards. He actually was from Canada and when he quit here he moved back. Quick search in google and you come up with allot of places that sell this stuff like: www.satuniverse.com Good luck with your battle, you shouldn’t have any problems. Just tell them that you bought the programmer because you wanted to play around with smart cards (pretty much what the satellite cards are) and that this was cheaper that buying an actual programmer that was selling as a smart card programmer. They have no way to prove that you were stealing any satellite signal other than if you left your phone line plugged into your receiver after programming the card. Diesel
View Quote
You don't have to tell them anything, and you should NOT tell them anything. Even if you were programming the cards illegally-- they have absolutely NO proof. I bet they sent out these letters in an attempt to "scare you" into destroying any potential hacking equipment or programs, whether or not you were able to hack satellite or not.
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 8:25:35 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/12/2002 8:29:22 AM EST by Energizer]
remember this-- you can't really prove intent, unless they actually caught you in the act, using a hacked card. (but that would not be intent-- since you were caught red-handed) did you ever plug your unit into the phone line? ------------- Intenet: (Law) The state of one's mind at the time one carries out an action. Now how do they know the "state" of your mind anyway???? This isn't Minoroty Report...
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 8:42:45 AM EST
Originally Posted By Energizer: remember this-- you can't really prove intent, unless they actually caught you in the act, using a hacked card. (but that would not be intent-- since you were caught red-handed) did you ever plug your unit into the phone line? ------------- Intenet: (Law) The state of one's mind at the time one carries out an action. Now how do they know the "state" of your mind anyway???? This isn't Minoroty Report...
View Quote
I couldn't use a "programmer" to save my life. And I have never used a "hacked" card. BTW, thanks for all the advise. At this point I'm thinking of paying the fee, even though it kills me to do so. They also want any hacking equipment, which I never had to begin with. Attorneys fees could far exceed the $3500.00 "settlement" fee. I'am sooo pissed right now. The letter said I have to respond by August 21st. or they'll start the suit.
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 8:53:18 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/12/2002 8:55:11 AM EST by trickshot]
Originally Posted By USPC40:
Originally Posted By Airwolf: Switching may be like going from frying pan to the fire since Dish Network and DirecTV are planning to merge....
View Quote
Actually, it's less of a merger and more of DirectTV agreeing to let Dish Network buy them out and run things. If the government decides to let them go ahead with the "merger", all DirectTV customers will have to change out their equipment as Dish Network uses a different technology(better actually). The good news is Dish Network has stated that they will replace the equipment free of charge. I am a Dish Network customer and I can't wait for the two companies to combine. The number of channels, features and quality of signal that will be available will be awesome. USPC40
View Quote
USPC40, that has to be one of the most naive outlooks I have ever heard! Do you really think that when Dish Network fully attains their monopoly that you will suddenly receive better service at lower prices? It hasn't happened in the cable biz, and I bailed out of Time Warner in favor of the dish because of it. Now Dish Network is pulling the same bunch of baloney. Don't let them pull the wool down over your eyes--competition is good, not bad. It forces companies to provide an honest service at honest prices. Without that incentive, the customer has only two choices--pay through the nose or walk away completely. Say NO with big letters to this proposed merger.
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 9:02:53 AM EST
Originally Posted By palmer:
Originally Posted By Energizer: remember this-- you can't really prove intent, unless they actually caught you in the act, using a hacked card. (but that would not be intent-- since you were caught red-handed) did you ever plug your unit into the phone line? ------------- Intenet: (Law) The state of one's mind at the time one carries out an action. Now how do they know the "state" of your mind anyway???? This isn't Minoroty Report...
View Quote
I couldn't use a "programmer" to save my life. And I have never used a "hacked" card. BTW, thanks for all the advise. At this point I'm thinking of paying the fee, even though it kills me to do so. They also want any hacking equipment, which I never had to begin with. Attorneys fees could far exceed the $3500.00 "settlement" fee. I'am sooo pissed right now. The letter said I have to respond by August 21st. or they'll start the suit.
View Quote
Please tell me that you're joking. Ignore them, and if it becomes necessary, THEN tell them to go fuck themselves. EVEN IF YOU DID IT, there's no way to prove it. They're just fishing, and you're about to bite. Ditch the programmer and emu setup, since I'm sure that's what you were doing(no response required!) and give them the finger. QS
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 9:23:30 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/12/2002 9:35:13 AM EST by Energizer]
Originally Posted By palmer: I couldn't use a "programmer" to save my life. And I have never used a "hacked" card. BTW, thanks for all the advise. At this point I'm thinking of paying the fee, even though it kills me to do so. They also want any hacking equipment, which I never had to begin with. Attorneys fees could far exceed the $3500.00 "settlement" fee. I'am sooo pissed right now. The letter said I have to respond by August 21st. or they'll start the suit.
View Quote
How much is the fee?? by paying the fee, you will peobably be admitting guilt, and the REAL DirecTV could press charges and sue for more damages. Did you have to sign for the FED-EX package? Just ignore them. I don't think there is any law that says you have to respond to, or even read, someone's Fed-ex letter. Just shred & burn it. If you have a programmer-- make sure you do not have it hooked up to their card, and that all H-card & HU-card software is removed, in case they serve a warrant, which they really have no :real: probable cause anyway. You have a legitimate card with service, correct? if so, then obviously you are paying for their services, so, in your defnese, why would you steal services that you are already paying for? If you don't have service, they still have nothing on you!
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 9:26:50 AM EST
By the way-- I do not have cable or satellite. You know why? THERE IS NOTHING ON-- EVER!!! I just buy DVDs and watch TV with rabbit ears and mostly snowy channels!
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 9:36:24 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 9:38:22 AM EST
Throw it in the garbage, it is a worthless piece of paper DO NOT SIGN it, people have been getting these for some time now, and nothing has happened. They may have got your name from data-bases recovered in legal action directv took against "dealers". You might want to find out how your name got on there list, but one way if you did not buy any dss gear is some of these "dealers" also sold legit stuff like electronics, cables, dishes etc.... Directv is a profitable business, and they have the right to go after all U.S. illegal dealers, but it is a big mistake to start calling their customers thieves. If I were you I would raise hell and ask them why they are treating their paying customers like shit? Even if you did purchase "dss hardware" they would never prosecute you, to expensive, and any half wit lawyer could get you off, unless you admitted guilt and even then?
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 9:39:55 AM EST
You can have equipment to program smart cards. It only becomes "signal theft equipment" if you actually use it to steal their signal and they can prove it... [b][size=6]DO NOT DEAL WITH THEM! STAND UP FOR YOUR RIGHTS.[/size=6][b] Think about it-- if you don't have any hacking equipment to "turn into them" and you pay their fee, then they will nail you since you did not come through on all steps of their bargain... (and why should you be forced to sign their agreement???)
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 9:48:27 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/12/2002 9:57:21 AM EST by Energizer]
Originally Posted By Gloftoe: But now it seems that they found out that you bought some kind of satellite programmer, which you say you did buy. Reserving judgement, -Gloftoe [>:/]
View Quote
This "satellite programmer" you speak of is not a satellite-only programmer. Its a smart card programmer, or it could be an emmulator. If he had one, there is nothing DirecTV can do about it. You have to use it to steal DirecTV's signals for it to actually become signal theft. These programmers can also be used for other cards, not just DirecTV. By them asking to turn your "hacking" equipment over to them, that would be STUPID. That would provide them with evidence to press criminal charges and sue for more damages since they asked for HACKING EQUIPMENT!
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 9:50:35 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 9:58:16 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/12/2002 10:01:29 AM EST by antiUSSA]
I'm with Gloftoe on this one, we need more DETAILED information on the "allegedly purchased" items... What they were, and what they were usd for. A couple of weeks ago, I received a new set of DTV cards in the mail, with a letter stating that they have had to change out, due to a rash of illegal cards floating around. The letter also stated that they have to do this every so often, but this was the first time ever ([i]over 3 years[/i]), that I have received anything.
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 9:58:16 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/12/2002 9:59:48 AM EST by Energizer]
Oh, and one more thing-- we all are using "hacking equipment" while reading this thread! Its called a computer! and it can be a cheapy 486! (or slower!) By turning in all of your hacking equiment, you will have to give them your computer, your house (has an electrical connection, internet connection, etc.), your girlfriend, etc...
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 10:03:12 AM EST
Do not cooperate with them! If you have not "stolen" the signal, you have done nothing wrong. Do not contact them or sign anything. If they pursue, find a hungry young lawyer and start a class action. On a side note: check for misspellings in your name/address on the documents they sent you.
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 10:46:04 AM EST
OK i called the lawyer we used for my friend and asked him a couple of questions and here is some very good advice. Do not settle with this collection company that is working on a commission basis (most likely) Wait until DSS files suit and after they do you can make a settlement offer of say $200.00 and if they reject your offer under federal law if you prevail they are responsible for all your legal bills after the offer. That is federal law and they don't want you to know about that little goody. You have to wait until the suit is actually filed to make them libel for your legal bills. And you have to prevail and I think you can,don't give up so easy,the other thing you should know is that DSS shares info with other satalite company's and you could be labled an easy "mark" if you give op that easy this might be the tip of the ice berg.
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 8:31:11 PM EST
Originally Posted By Gloftoe: Okay. I'm confused. Now I know nothing about this situation other than what I've read here. So:
Originally posted by palmer: I do not now and have never received free satellite TV, nor do I have knowledge of how to reprogram ANYTHING!
View Quote
Originally posted by Aggie1: Palmer, Did you buy a programmer or not?
View Quote
Originally posted by palmer: The short answer, yes. I'm still looking for an attorney who knows or is handeling these suits, no luck so far.
View Quote
Originally posted by palmer: I couldn't use a "programmer" to save my life. And I have never used a "hacked" card. BTW, thanks for all the advise. At this point I'm thinking of paying the fee, even though it kills me to do so. They also want any hacking equipment, which I never had to begin with.
View Quote
So. You don't know how to use a programmer (or whatever). Asked if you bought one, you say yes. Then, they want your hacking equipment, which you "never had to begin with." I'm just wholly confused about the whole matter. I first read about this, and condemned DTV for them being assholes. But now it seems that they found out that you bought some kind of satellite programmer, which you say you did buy. Reserving judgement, -Gloftoe [>:/]
View Quote
I purchased a "programmer" for my previous neighbor(I've since moved) about two years ago from a website. But I never received the programmer and my credit card was charged. My neighbor gave me the money for the programmer and I told him I never got the programmer shipped to me and I would call to complain. I called the company three times with no answer. I told my neighbor I got no answer and he told me don't worry about. So I just forgot about the whole thing. I don't even know what the hell these things look like!
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 8:48:46 PM EST
Originally Posted By trickshot: USPC40, that has to be one of the most naive outlooks I have ever heard! Do you really think that when Dish Network fully attains their monopoly that you will suddenly receive better service at lower prices?
View Quote
Better service, didn't say anything about service. I said "number of channels, features and quality of signal". If they obtain the satellites that DirctTV uses, that means higher bandwidth. Higher bandwidth means more channels, more features, and better signal. I wouldn't exactly call it a monopoly since they would still have less than 10% of the market. Don't forget, cable is their competition. Also, I didn't say the price would go down. It would stay the same and be the same for every customer.
It hasn't happened in the cable biz, and I bailed out of Time Warner in favor of the dish because of it. Now Dish Network is pulling the same bunch of baloney. Don't let them pull the wool down over your eyes--competition is good, not bad. It forces companies to provide an honest service at honest prices. Without that incentive, the customer has only two choices--pay through the nose or walk away completely. Say NO with big letters to this proposed merger.
View Quote
Again, cable TV is their competition. If they don't provide what people want, they will go with cable TV. I still say it will be a good thing and not the end of the world. USPC40 [img]www.ar15.com/members/albums/USPC40/line.gif[/img] [url=www.nra.org][b][red]NRA[/red][/url] [url=www.nra.org][blue]Life Member[/blue][/url] [url=www.gunowners.org][b][red]GOA[/red] [/url] [url=www.gunowners.org][blue]Life Member[/blue][/url] [url=www.saf.org][red]SAF[/red][/url] [url=www.saf.org][blue]Supporter[/blue][/url] [url=sas-aim.org][red]SAS[/red][/url] [url=sas-aim.org][blue]Supporter[/blue][/b][/url] [img]www.ar15.com/members/albums/USPC40/alabamaflag.gif[/img]
Link Posted: 8/12/2002 9:05:40 PM EST
If you bought a DTV system from Bellingham, Wa north to the Canadian boarder you had to sign an agreement saying that the system was not going into Canada and you were only allowed to purchase one system at a time. I heard that the Canadian market for US DTV systems was hopping a few months ago. I also heard that you could buy programed cards for your USA system at various places in Vancouver, BC. I have had my DTV system for a little over a year and I have never had it plugged into to a phone jack. I am dumping it for ATT Cable since I can have two digital converter boxes for the price of one and pay no extra fees PLUS I can plumb in the non-digital signals to my TV in the garage. Oh how I long for the days when I could pay to get one cable line into the house and buy as many splitters as I wanted and be able to watch one channel on the TV, another on the PIP and be recording on the VRC, PLUS being able to run out to the garage to clean a gun and being able to watch yet another channel.
Link Posted: 8/13/2002 2:29:48 AM EST
Whoever heard of such a thing, that mere possession of an item constituted a crime? (Rolling eyes). Sounds like the very thing that has been plaguing firearms owners is seeping into other areas of society. Possession of a card, even if not actually installed in a descrambler/receiver/decoder constitutes an illegal macine gu ... oops ... descrambler. All the self righteous, "innocent" people who looked with disdain on firearms owners and questioned their rights will now have the same principle working against themselves. I guess the firearms issue is just an analogue for the rest. Get a lawyer and sue them for libel, harassment, and whatever else he/she can think of. With enough people involved, it can become class-action.
Top Top