I don't mean to disrespect anyone's beliefs, but after suffering a divorce I never thought possible, I have a very hard time with the concept of marriage. It no longer seems to make any sense to me.

If my best friend of 14 + yrs could so viciously turn on me & stab me in the back the way she did, how can I ever believe another woman would be honest or trustworthy?

I know it may seems really cynical of me, but I just can't seem to see marriage as permanent anymore. I feel like any woman who would make a vow to God with me, would just as easily dump me, for someone who appeals to them more later, when or if the time comes when some guy shows interest in them, or has more money than me, or anything else that makes them appear to be a better catch for whatever reason.

A wink, a smile, some sweet words, & a promise of something better, & whoosh! She's gone, gone, gone, crying won't bring her back. That's how I see women now.

I have a real hard time even liking woman, or respecting them at this time in my life, & even though I feel lonely allot, I have no interest in dating, or even talking to a female right now, & I don't know if that will ever change.

My ex had her boyfriend move in with her 4 days after our divorce, & told me they planed on getting married asap, even though it took them nearly 5 months.

I have been working on a temporary restraining order for her from our son who turned 8 on Tuesday. My issue is knowing the criminal background of her new fellow, so I can feel ok about my boy spending time with them once in a while, as I have parental custody of my wonderful boy.

Today she called to tell us she is moving to Flagstaff AZ this weekend & won't be back for 6 months to 1 yr. Her new hubby's co. is relocating him from Houston to AZ. She already has terribly neglected Asher for over 1.5 yrs, but at least was starting to come around to trying to have visitation with him. She is such a screwed up person, I am glad she won't be able to affect him with her stupidness. I still feel really bad for him, in that he really is losing something I can't imagine losing myself at his tender age. :(

I feel glad she's going to be out of the picture, but sad for my son not getting what he deserves in a whole  family. I told him it's me & him as a team now, & he seemed good with that, but said mom leaving makes him sad way in his heart.

Damn, brrother. Sorry to hear that now.

It sounds like you'll be better off longterm.

I know that doesn' t help now.

Your wife is screwing up.

Sin is a common phenomenon in America.

Don't blame yourself, God or the institution of marriage.

Quoted: Your wife is screwing up. Sin is a common phenomenon in America. Don't blame yourself, God or the institution of marriage.

I don't blame God, I just am very cynical about marriage now. It seems like a disaster waiting to happen, from my view.

When I divorced my 1st wife, I was 34 and had been with her since junior high...or 18 1/2 years of my life.  She cheated twice and the 2nd time I kicked her to the curb.  I hurt like hell for quite some time.  I had been told that it takes about 1 month for every year you've been together to get over it, and damn if that wasn't just about the perfect prediction.  My ex has been married/divorced 3-4 times now, and I'll betcha Romeo and your ex don't last 3 years.

I'm very happily married now with a beautiful daughter and wouldn't change anything.  

Things WILL get better..it's just so hard to see it right now.  

Best of luck!

HH

It's all part of the natural process of you getting your head straight.  I think we'd wonder more about you if you said, especially this soon after the divorce, that you were ready for another marriage.

Just keep concentraiting on taking care of your kid, that's more important anyway.  Obviously, you already know that.  You'll be fine.

Let it hurt but DON’T dwell on it. Take this time to be the best father you can.

Be there for him, teach him values, respect, show him as many positive things in life and reality as you can,  but as tempting as it may be, try to keep your bitterness of this out of his life. He is having to deal with it in his own way. He is very impressionable at this age. If at 8 he gets hit hard with bitterness and negative energy it can cause him to live a hard life growing up. If the two of you spend positive time with each other, you  should find you will both come through this much quicker then you may think.

I hope this makes sense, and I wish the best for you both.

After my divorce it took me seven years to trust another woman.  

I know the feeling.  After my divorce I used to catch myself scowling at people who embraced in public or showed signs of affection.  My gf pointed it out to me once when I sneered, "Oh yea call him honey now, wait until he screws some b*tch in your bed" under my breath!  Yikes, its amazing how time heals those wounds.

My kids haven't seen their Dad in 9 years.  Its for the best do to his violent and abusive behavior but it breaks my heart everytime he breaks their heart.  As they [my kids] get older, its amazing what little things trigger it.

Just be the best Dad you can be.  Pray for forgiveness and the power to forgive.  Love your son and don't let yourself get too bitter.

Patty

Go to a lawyer and have her parental rights terminated while you can. You don't want her in your children's life.

For the future: www.nomarriage.com

Did you ever feel like this?

Yeah.

Quoted: I know the feeling.  After my divorce I used to catch myself scowling at people who embraced in public or showed signs of affection.  My gf pointed it out to me once when I sneered, "Oh yea call him honey now, wait until he screws some b*tch in your bed" under my breath!  Yikes, its amazing how time heals those wounds. My kids haven't seen their Dad in 9 years.  Its for the best do to his violent and abusive behavior but it breaks my heart everytime he breaks their heart.  As they [my kids] get older, its amazing what little things trigger it. Just be the best Dad you can be.  Pray for forgiveness and the power to forgive.  Love your son and don't let yourself get too bitter. Patty

...sounds like me at the coffee shop tonight....nothing pisses me off more than some "lovey dovey" couple.  

Quoted: Did you ever feel like this?   Yeah.

+2, by the way......keep your chin up, Search, it takes time.  

Quoted: I know the feeling.  After my divorce I used to catch myself scowling at people who embraced in public or showed signs of affection.  My gf pointed it out to me once when I sneered, "Oh yea call him honey now, wait until he screws some b*tch in your bed" under my breath!  Yikes, its amazing how time heals those wounds. My kids haven't seen their Dad in 9 years.  Its for the best do to his violent and abusive behavior but it breaks my heart everytime he breaks their heart.  As they [my kids] get older, its amazing what little things trigger it. Just be the best Dad you can be.  Pray for forgiveness and the power to forgive.  Love your son and don't let yourself get too bitter. Patty

Easier said than done.

Quoted: When I got separated and divorced I didn't date for two and a half years.  Just needed that long to make peace with what was and be okay with taking chances with what might be.   One thing that is pretty cool is this... I know I can have my heart broken and life will go on and I will be fine.   That's a very valuable lesson.  I can be courageous with my heart.... although I try not to be foolish. My ex got remarried a couple of years ago.  I'm not opposed to the idea if it involved children.   I always say I loved being married... just not who I was married to at the end.

I don't understand what the red sentance means. Do you mean you want to have kids?

I'm glad your doing better Miss Magnum.

Quoted: Quoted: I know the feeling.  After my divorce I used to catch myself scowling at people who embraced in public or showed signs of affection.  My gf pointed it out to me once when I sneered, "Oh yea call him honey now, wait until he screws some b*tch in your bed" under my breath!  Yikes, its amazing how time heals those wounds. My kids haven't seen their Dad in 9 years.  Its for the best do to his violent and abusive behavior but it breaks my heart everytime he breaks their heart.  As they [my kids] get older, its amazing what little things trigger it. Just be the best Dad you can be.  Pray for forgiveness and the power to forgive.  Love your son and don't let yourself get too bitter. Patty Easier said than done.

Sure, give it time and rerad the sentence befor that one a few times.  Patty

Quoted: Quoted: I know the feeling.  After my divorce I used to catch myself scowling at people who embraced in public or showed signs of affection.  My gf pointed it out to me once when I sneered, "Oh yea call him honey now, wait until he screws some b*tch in your bed" under my breath!  Yikes, its amazing how time heals those wounds. My kids haven't seen their Dad in 9 years.  Its for the best do to his violent and abusive behavior but it breaks my heart everytime he breaks their heart.  As they [my kids] get older, its amazing what little things trigger it. Just be the best Dad you can be.  Pray for forgiveness and the power to forgive.  Love your son and don't let yourself get too bitter. Patty Easier said than done.

Sure, give it time and reread the sentence befor that one a few times.  Patty

After reading all of this I feel lucky

You never know what someone is going to do until they do it.


Don't sell yourself short.  It wasn't you, it was her.

Never really saw the point in marriage, just from seeing me and all my friends' parents breaking up over the year.  It's been to me "Why bother?"

The old necessities of marriage are gone.  A single parent can make it work.  Wouldn't be fun, but not impossible like in 1800 or something. So the reasons to continue with it are out of the spouses' personal happiness, which from what I have see never lasts.

So why?  Especially as a man, when she'll get all the property, the kids, and a cut of wat you earn afterwards?

Makes no sense to me.

Quoted: I don't mean to disrespect anyone's beliefs, but after suffering a divorce I never thought possible, I have a very hard time with the concept of marriage. It no longer seems to make any sense to me. If my best friend of 14 + yrs could so viciously turn on me & stab me in the back the way she did, how can I ever believe another woman would be honest or trustworthy? I know it may seems really cynical of me, but I just can't seem to see marriage as permanent anymore. I feel like any woman who would make a vow to God with me, would just as easily dump me, for someone who appeals to them more later, when or if the time comes when some guy shows interest in them, or has more money than me, or anything else that makes them appear to be a better catch for whatever reason. A wink, a smile, some sweet words, & a promise of something better, & whoosh! She's gone, gone, gone, crying won't bring her back. That's how I see women now. I have a real hard time even liking woman, or respecting them at this time in my life, & even though I feel lonely allot, I have no interest in dating, or even talking to a female right now, & I don't know if that will ever change.

I never had kids, so I'll only address this much of your post.

I walked out on my xwife, for many many reasons.  It is still the most difficult thing I've ever done.

I have been single by choice for a very long time now, and I know exactly what you mean.  I've been divorced for 3 years now and alot of the immediate pain has faded but I still find it nearly impossible to trust or respect females.

You have two choices: womanizing, which is typical when you lose all respect for females; or you can choose to stay single until you get things figured out for yourself and you're in the right frame of mind to start dating again.

I chose to stay single until I got my head together.  Time will make the pain, at least, fade.  The rest is pyschological, and I would recommend thearpy, but it's not something that I do.

Stay strong.  When you have those strong emotions going through you, do something--lift weights, go for a drive, a hike or a run, do pushups, situps, whatever.  Clean the house, wash your car, iron your clothes.  Do it until those emotions go away.  Do it until you aren't thinking about that stuff that's bothering you anymore.  When you finish a task, remember that there is always one more thing you can do to keep your mind off those thoughts and feelings, and this is better than drinking, hitting things or breaking things (if you have the urge to do those things).  As tough as it may seem right now, enroll to take dancing lessons or to learn a new language (I wouldn't recommend getting Advanced Tactical Carbine Training or Kung Fu at this point ), or maybe even Yoga or some kind of relaxation class.  This is a good time to start reading books, and maybe start a new hobby.

Get back in contact with your family if you're not already.  It's OK to lean for support now and then.

Keep the faith--in yourself.

Frankly, I'd plan on flying solo if I were you.


Plenty of pleasure units out there that don't involve a committment.

To sum it up... Women love drama and they hate other women maybe not relevant to this thread.

America is full of sin now a days. It's seen left and right, so often that people even forget that it is sin.

I will never get married, IMHO, in this age it's not worth it. If you love someone, and I mean "love", not that false feeling you have with your g/f. I'm talking about the feeling you have with your children and family... If you love someone, be with them for the rest of your life without marriage. Being married doesn't change how much you love someone but, the 'stuck with you' feeling your spouse may have can.

Time goes on, enjoy your life and forget about your troubles.

Quoted: I will never get married, IMHO, in this age it's not worth it. If you love someone, and I mean "love", not that false feeling you have with your g/f. I'm talking about the feeling you have with your children and family... If you love someone, be with them for the rest of your life without marriage. Being married doesn't change how much you love someone but, the 'stuck with you' feeling your spouse may have can.

That's what I'm talkin about.

My divorce was finalized about 8 months ago (I guess... Don't even remember). I thought I had found someone since then I could love with all my heart, but apparently not.

I never lost hope that someday I will find the woman meant for me, get married, and start another family. I still have that hope.

I'm just going to be VERY picky next time around.

Quoted: My divorce was finalized about 8 months ago (I guess... Don't even remember). I thought I had found someone since then I could love with all my heart, but apparently not. I never lost hope that someday I will find the woman meant for me, get married, and start another family. I still have that hope. I'm just going to be VERY picky next time around.

You can be lax in how picky you are, just don't give away your heart so easily.

Quoted: My divorce was finalized about 8 months ago (I guess... Don't even remember). I thought I had found someone since then I could love with all my heart, but apparently not. I never lost hope that someday I will find the woman meant for me, get married, and start another family. I still have that hope. I'm just going to be VERY picky next time around.

Roger that Zap!

As far as marriage I feel it's a public form of making a commitment to stay when you don't want to stay, & be faithfull when you don't want to be faithfull. It's a commitment to stay when the marriage sucks, & you want to run away & hide. Things/emotions/feelings change from moment to moment & without commitment it's much easier to just walk away from a relationship when things go south.

I know/hope sometime I will not feel the way I feel about woman. I know there are some really fantastic females out there. But they are all in hiding, probably from the really bad guys they have delt with.

Quoted: If my best friend of 14 + yrs could so viciously turn on me & stab me in the back the way she did, how can I ever believe another woman would be honest or trustworthy?

She sinned against you. Here you see the terrible nature of sin.

But...

Not trusting any woman cuz of the sin of one woman is like not trusting any gun owner cuz of the actions of one gun owner.

Take some time to let the hurt subside, and then convince yourself of the truth above.

Quoted: In my opinion, marriage is not just for you or her... it's for the security and development of the children born in that household. All this talk of "single parents being able to do it alone just fine" is bullshit.  I was raised by a single parent.  Did she do okay?  Yes, but we both acknowledge that it would have been better had I had a two parent family with a father around.   Marriage isn't about being selfish... quite the opposite... it's about being self-LESS.

It seems appropriate that I take this opportunity to give a big +1 to Miss Magnum here.

It is a rare moment indeed.

Quoted: Quoted: In my opinion, marriage is not just for you or her... it's for the security and development of the children born in that household. All this talk of "single parents being able to do it alone just fine" is bullshit.  I was raised by a single parent.  Did she do okay?  Yes, but we both acknowledge that it would have been better had I had a two parent family with a father around.   Marriage isn't about being selfish... quite the opposite... it's about being self-LESS. It seems appropriate that I take this opportunity to give a big +1 to Miss Magnum here. It is a rare moment indeed.

I agree as well. I thought my ex did too, but apperently she didn't. Towards the end she said all kinds of things she had never said before. She even told me she was now a democrat! So her her way of thinking was reversed to suite her new type of lifestyle.

Quoted: I have a very hard time with the concept of marriage. It no longer seems to make any sense to me.

Hey, I have a hard time with the concept of marriage; it no longer makes any sense to me, and I'm married.

Honestly, I just don't see the point to it. I agree with Miss_Magnum and garandman that marriage is a must if you're having kids....  but otherwise, why?

Who gains?

What can I add that wasnt already said... i followed your story since practically DAY 1 and I feel i know you already.

You did what you had to. SHE was the "moonbat" and you had NO control. Doesnt mean the next one will be as bad or worse... or even better... You are still gonna have to finish your "healing" process.

but one day, when you least expect it, cupid strikes again.  

Marriage is tough when the economic, social, legal reality says there's nothing wrong or logistically incapable of single parenthood through divorce.  Not sayonmg OUTLAWING divorice would make make it better.

My parents and almost all of my friends' parents divorced.  Made me think marriage is a crock.

It does get better, I'm 29 and I've been raising my son by myself since he was a year... The ex has been in and out of the picture, she doesn't find real life very exciting and takes off. So I've kept her out of his life entirely, it's definitely for the best. I'm sure it'll bite me in the ass someday, but the alternative is even worse. Maybe thinking a parent doesn't care about you is one thing, KNOWING they really don't care about you is another! It's made a more competent parent and person out of me.  Raising my son is the most difficult task I've ever taken on, but absolutely the most rewarding. It Does get better, but it takes time....Sometimes lots of it.  It's funny though, I see more and more single dad's...Does this mean that more men are taking responsibility, or are there more screwed up women.

I do feel for you, was there a long time ago, time heals all ( I know that doesnt do anything now, but it does) I think it is very important now to realize that not everything is with in your control people will do things you will never understand or perhaps shouldnt. The thing to be very weary of kicking yourself to death. ( of course I dont know what is going on here but for sake of argument I will take your side) it can become a downward spiral rather quick and you have a boy who looks up to you for guidance and strenght, you need to be a pillar  for that young man.

It is kind of like being born or starting from scratch in time you will trust again, good luck.

Drop an IM if you want to chat. I am by no means qualified in a professional way just been there and could share my experience if it would help.

Quoted: Honestly, I just don't see the point to it. I agree with Miss_Magnum and garandman that marriage is a must if you're having kids....  but otherwise, why? Who gains?

The MISuse of something DOES NOT delegitimize the proper use of something.

Fisrt of all, the whole idea is that marriage creates the stable platform for the raising of children. Co-habitation without marriage increases the likelihood of bringing children into the world WITHOUT the stable platform.

Those unwilling to make the simple commitment of marriage are too unstable to be engaging in pro-creative behaviour. Just like people unwilling to get safety training are too immature to ahndle guns.

That said, its my experience that most divorces result from amrrying too young, or too casually. Which is a MISuse of marriage.

Having been married over 15 years now, even with no kids, I can tell you marriage is the BEST way to go.

And besides, statistically, married people get laid ALOT more. Its true. Look it up.

Round here, that seems to be reason enuf.  

Quoted: Quoted: In my opinion, marriage is not just for you or her... it's for the security and development of the children born in that household. All this talk of "single parents being able to do it alone just fine" is bullshit.  I was raised by a single parent.  Did she do okay?  Yes, but we both acknowledge that it would have been better had I had a two parent family with a father around.   Marriage isn't about being selfish... quite the opposite... it's about being self-LESS. So an unhappy couple needs to stay together for the sake of the children?

Yes. The world does NOT turn on your (or my) personal happiness.

AND they need to do some introspection and self -assessment and quit being selfish and start giving to the relationship rather that just taking from it.

Selfishness is the  #1 cause of marital disharmony (money merely being the anvil that the hammer of selfishness beats upon) .

I was married for about two years, but have been divorced for around 15 now. I still have the same distrust in long term relations ships you have Searcher. But I'm not bitter. I don't mind seeing happy couples, young or (especially) older ones, holding hands and being happy with each other. Guess I'm a romantic. )Does that make me ghey? ) I've just decided it wasn't meant for me.

I've been on only one outing that could be construed as a date. Several years ago a girl I was working with was moving back to the DC area. So daughter (then ~5-ish) and I got all dressed up and took her to a nice Italian restaurant for dinner. I was nervous as heck, even knowing there would never be anything between us. So it must have been a first date.

My ex- left me for a guy who makes more money. And that's just how she's been ever since. It's all about the $$$$$.

Unfortunately I haven't seen a single woman who doesn't seem to have the same view. And at 45 I've come to find out there's a reason the single women my age in this town are still single. Their psycho's or their sluts. And the worst of the bunch are the psycho sluts.

My long term outlook? I'll forever be single.

Quoted: In my opinion, marriage is not just for you or her... it's for the security and development of the children born in that household. All this talk of "single parents being able to do it alone just fine" is bullshit.  I was raised by a single parent.  Did she do okay?  Yes, but we both acknowledge that it would have been better had I had a two parent family with a father around.   Marriage isn't about being selfish... quite the opposite... it's about being self-LESS. I got married at 22 fully expecting to stay married and have children with my ex.  Turns out I married a man who was incredibly passive aggressive and lazy.  That was what weakened our marriage but the dealbreaker was when he decided to admit that he didn't want to have anymore kids (he had a child from a previous relationship and was a crappy father, I found out).   I can fall in love and be faithful to a man without being married.  But if we are going to bring kids into this world it will be because we plan to be together to raise them.

+1. Way to many people these days are brought up being selfish and to put themselves first. It has spilled over to every group in society to include seniors ["free" healthcare and drugs are NOT free and you know it, you just want someone else to pay for it] long term welfare recipients, the rich, middleclass, business, CEOs, minority groups etc. The sad thing is that all too many politicians have learned to use that to their advantage, and to our loss. Being married anymore is just more of the same.

Quoted: And besides, statistically, married people get laid ALOT more. Its true. Look it up.

That hasn't been my experience at all. As far as looking it up, I wouldn't even begin to know what to Google for. "Marital sex statistics"?


So I've done that, and these are the results:

marriage.about.com/cs/sexualstatistics/a/sexstatistics.htm


According to the Durex Survey (2001):

• Americans appear to have the most sex at 132 times a year, with the Russians close behind at 122 times a year, the French at 121, and the Greeks at 115.


• The countries with the lowest frequency of sex are Japan (37 times per), Malaysia (62) and China (69).


• Couples living together report having sex 146 times per year.


• Married couples make love 98 times per year.

Have I ever felt the same way?  Yeah, bro, lots of times.  I am 34 and my wife left me when I was ETSing from the Army in 93.  Because of my injury and the financial bind, I haven't even SEEN my two sons (13 and 17) in 3 years +.  I'm sure she thinks that makes me a horrible, selfish father.  It is my kids I feel for, with some well-deserved self-pity for missing my boys like someone ripped my heart out.  Maybe if she allowed them to fly, versus the cost and inability to get from AZ to KS and back, twice, for a two-week visit here...

Just reading this thread hurts and reminds me of how lonely I can feel.  And no, the booze don't help.  I really feel for you, and I am sorry you're hurting the way you are.  I know as guys we are not supposed to feel anything, but I also think that's horseshit and keeping it in just makes it worse.

Why don't  you PM me, bro, and I'll shoot you my phone number.  It's always nice to have a friend who can just listen and pray for you.  

As far as marriage?  I honestly don't believe I can ever have that amount of trust ever again.  I'm not grouping all ladies into the category of distrust, just that the time and effort to prove to me their integrity would probably not be worth their time and they'd move on.  I'll never father another child - they are just weapons less-than-scrupulous significant others use to make a little more pain in life as they get off watching others suffer.  And the kids are the real ones who suffer.

Pardon me.  Help or no help, I'm going to go get drunk and try to forget what just got re-surfaced.  Sometimes there's a reason a guy eats his gun.  

Call me bro...  Support is the best thing.  Knowing EXACTLY what you are feeling right now, I can be a damn good listener.  God bless.  

The Good News: She's gonna be out of your life ( good riddance to bad rubbage )
More Good News: You've got custody of your son

Hang in there
In regards to your feelings and being hurt just remember an old Chinese Proverb "This Too Shall Pass"

Alot of us here have gone thru it ( 50% of all marriages wind up in Divorce )
Myself over 10 years ago

It's hard to come to the realization that someone who you thought was your one Most Trusted
friend could be so deceitful

My Ex actually told me that "you did nothing wrong, it 's me"

Don't beat up on yourself  you were the one that was faithful
You can look at yourself in the mirror everyday and know you did the right thing
Explain it to your son he'll understand


Jeremiah  17:9 "The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked; Who can know it ?

Martin Lloyd-Jones said something like  "When a man's life is guided just by his instincts he is worse than an animal, he is a beast "

This is what people do when they have no moral compass or beliefs to anchor them

Sorry to hear of your loss...it will get better. Just remember that. In the mean time...take care of yourself - first and always. (eat right, exercise, focus and stay the course.)

I went through a similar issue when my ex of 34 mos. left me with my 9 month old son. (funny thing is she quit taing the pill and took it upon her self to make the decision to have our son...by herself...) I do my part and have yet to miss a child support payment...

I too have never gotten over being bitter. And two relationships later...it shows. I have a real short give-a-damn-string with women.

She makes sure I receive little information and my parents less...no thank you notes from her for gifts, etc. I am afraid she is going to raise my son the way she turned out - and she is pure Texas Trash!

Most ( nearly ALL) US women I have encountered are trash....in it for their needs - until something better comes along...always angle-merchants...always shopping for more money, better situations, a better home, instant gratification, etc.

Marriage is leagalized prostitution and the courts reward women who exhibit cut-and-run behavior. Its a womens court, plain and simple. Divorce proves it.

I now treat them like step children and they seem to like it better than treating them like ladies. Never had more tail in my life - and its great. Not abusive or hateful...just take what I want and move on.

I have adopted the FIDO stance... Fuck it and drive on - and it works, especially well. Just remember women are like dog crap - the older they get the easier it is to pick them up and - they are just like busses, miss one and another will be along ASAP.

Hang tough, get tough and move on!

Quoted: I agree that too many people take from a marriage and don't give back.  The fact of the matter is, people change.

But the responsibility to the child created NEVER changes.

There's little difference between teh abortion crowd and the cut and run crowd. They just manage a different way of avoiding teh personal responsibility.

Who we were when we married are not the people we'll be down the road.  Sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn't.  If a person is unhappy in a  marriage and there is no possible reconciliation, then a divorce is necessary.

ALL relationships can be reconciled - IF peole would act like humans instead of animals.

Especially if children are involved.  Too many people stay together for the sake of the children.  Kids are perceptive creatures, and they see that their parents aren't happy.  It has a profound effect on them, contrary to what some may think.  Skewed views on marriage, guilt from knowing that their parents only stayed together because of them, instead of moving on with their lives and finding happiness elsewhere.

That's just the most screwed up thinking I've ever seen.

MY parents fought like cats and dogs - but stayed together. And I grew up knowing they loved me, and I have a very positive view of marriage as a whole. In fact, I know they loved me BECAUSE they stayed together. Cutting and running says they ONLY love themselves. THAT is what children understand. Your view of things is just MEGA screwed up.

And AGAIN I say - the are more important thing than happiness. If you spread your legs and make a kid, you've HAD your happiness. NOW its time to look to the happiness of the life you created.

Its time for personal responsibility.