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Posted: 10/19/2004 9:54:57 AM EST
This is freaking hilarious! It really scares me that the rest of the world wants to change our politics…it scares me even more that some in this country would love to see it happen. I only hope that England will give us a say in their next elections

www.guardian.co.uk/uselections2004/story/0,13918,1329858,00.html


Dear Limey assholes

Last week G2 launched Operation Clark County to help readers have a say in the American election by writing to undecided voters in the crucial state of Ohio. In the first three days, more than 11,000 people requested addresses. Here is some of the reaction to the project that we received from the US

Monday October 18, 2004
The Guardian

Dear wonderful, loving friends from abroad,
We Ohioans are an ornery sort and don't take meddling well, even if it comes from people we admire and with their sincere goodwill. We are a fairly closed community overall. In my town of Springfield, I feel that there are some that consider people from the nearby cities of Columbus or Dayton, as "foreigners"- let alone someone from outside our country.
Springfield, Ohio
Have you not noticed that Americans don't give two shits what Europeans think of us? Each email someone gets from some arrogant Brit telling us why to NOT vote for George Bush is going to backfire, you stupid, yellow-toothed pansies ... I don't give a rat's ass if our election is going to have an effect on your worthless little life. I really don't. If you want to have a meaningful election in your crappy little island full of shitty food and yellow teeth, then maybe you should try not to sell your sovereignty out to Brussels and Berlin, dipshit. Oh, yeah - and brush your goddamned teeth, you filthy animals.
Wading River, NY

Right on! Just wanted to say thanks from California for your effort and concern. This IS a very important election ... There are so many people here in the States that care about the impact America has on the rest of the world. I am personally saddened for the loss of all innocent lives. The best statement Americans can make to the rest of the world is to not elect Bush for president. Thank you so much for getting involved in our world.
California

Consider this: stay out of American electoral politics. Unless you would like a company of US Navy Seals - Republican to a man - to descend upon the offices of the Guardian, bag the lot of you, and transport you to Guantanamo Bay, where you can share quarters with some lonely Taliban shepherd boys.
United States

I am a student and life-long resident of Clark County, Ohio. I just wanted you to know that this is a wonderful idea you've initiated; people here love and respect the United Kingdom, especially the prime minister. I hope this campaign will be successful for your newspaper and for us voters.
Springfield, Ohio

KEEP YOUR FUCKIN' LIMEY HANDS OFF OUR ELECTION. HEY, SHITHEADS, REMEMBER THE REVOLUTIONARY WAR? REMEMBER THE WAR OF 1812? WE DIDN'T WANT YOU, OR YOUR POLITICS HERE, THAT'S WHY WE KICKED YOUR ASSES OUT. FOR THE 47% OF YOU WHO DON'T WANT PRESIDENT BUSH, I SAY THIS ... TOUGH SHIT!
PROUD AMERICAN VOTING FOR BUSH!

Shame on you for using the people of Ohio like this. The US presidental election isn't just about foreign policy, it's about healthcare, taxes, education, transportation, natural resources and all manner of issues with little to no impact on the people of Britain.

We live in a globalised, interconnected world. If China shuts its borders to US imports, you better believe American companies, shareholders and workers are affected. Should US citizens therefore have a direct say in Chinese policies? No - Americans should demand that their own elected leaders address the issues with their Chinese counterparts. The British have a similar voice in US policies - through your own elected representatives who have any number of diplomatic, economic and military tools at their disposal. You vote for your leaders and we'll vote for ours. Your problem is with your leaders, not ours.
Washington DC

Real Americans aren't interested in your pansy-ass, tea-sipping opinions. If you want to save the world, begin with your own worthless corner of it.
Texas, USA

Thank you, thank you, thank you! What a wonderful idea! I am a US citizen who is scared to death that Bush and Klan will get back in. We need all the help we can get to ditch this bunch of maniacs.
United States

I just read a hilarious proposal to involve your readership in the upcoming US presidential election. At least, I'm hoping that it is genius satire. Nothing will do more to undermine the Democratic cause in Ohio than having patronising Brits wander around Clark County telling people how to vote. Just, for a second, imagine if the Washington Post sent folks from Ohio to do the same in Oxfordshire. I'm saying this as a Democrat, and as someone who has spent the last few years in the UK. That is, with all due respect. Please, please, be rational, and move slowly away from the self-defeating hubris.
United States

I enjoy reading your paper and agree with your politics, but this is really too much.Your plan, if carried out, will hurt the Bush opposition TERRIBLY. We cannot afford to have this associated with John Kerry or anyone else. It will be; the press is going in for a kill, days before the election.
United States

Your idea is superb and frankly, we need a little help over here right now.
Ohio

My dear, beloved Brits,
I understand the Guardian is sponsoring a service where British citizens write to Americans to advise them on how to vote. Thank heavens! I was adrift in a sea of confusion and you are my beacon of hope!

Feel free to respond to this email with your advice. Please keep in mind that I am something of an anglophile, so this is not confrontational. Please remember, too, that I am merely an American. That means I am not very bright. It means I have no culture or sense of history. It also means that I am barely literate, so please don't use big, fancy words.

Set me straight, folks!
Dayton, Ohio

Hey England, Scotland and Wales,
Mind your own business. We don't need weenie-spined Limeys meddling in our presidental election. If it wasn't for America, you'd all be speaking German. And if America would have had a president, then, of the likes of Kerry, you'd all be goose-stepping around Buckingham Palace. YOU ARE NOT WANTED!! Whether you want to support either party. BUTT OUT!!!
United States

Please be advised that I have forwarded this to the CIA and FBI.
United States

As an American who is very anti-Bush, I applaud your letter-writing campaign. I have read some of the letters that you published, and while I agree with most of the content, I also believe they will not be persuasive. This is because they are too aggressive and, as stated on your website, you don't know anything about these voters. If they happen to be leaning toward Bush, these letters will not put them off.
New York

THE AMERICAN TAXPAYERS HAVE SPENT TRILLIONS OF DOLLARS PROTECTING THE PEOPLES OF THE EU, AND WHAT DO WE GET IN RETURN. BETRAYAL, BETRAYAL, BETRAYAL. I HAVE BEEN TO YOUR COUNTRY, THE COUNTRY OF MY ANCESTORS, AND I KNOW WHY THEY LEFT.

MAY YOU HAVE TO HAVE A TOOTH CAPPED. I UNDERSTAND IT TAKES AT LEAST 18 MONTHS FOR YOUR GREAT MEDICAL SERVICES TO GET AROUND TO YOU. HAVE A GREAT DAY.
Harlan, Kentucky

We all enjoyed this at work. Cheers.
United States

Thank you for taking such an active interest in the elections here in America. I appreciate what the Guardian is doing. Your effort to reach out to "swing states" and make a difference is commendable. I hope that many of your readers will take your challenge to help make a change in Washington by contacting voters.
Clarke County, Georgia

Keep your noses out of our business. As I recall we kicked your asses out of our country back in 1776. We do not require input from losers and idiots on who we vote for in our own country. Fuck off and die asshole!!!!!
Knoxville, Iowa

Gentle folks at the Guardian,
In your plea to get your non-American readers to write to voters in Clark County, Iowa, you are correct that events in the US have had, and will have, effects on world events. For example, we have pulled your chestnuts out of the fire in two world wars that were occasioned by European diplomacy. Maybe you'd like a vote in which American president will oversee the next rescue. The next time you have elections in Great Britain, I shall endeavour to send names of your citizens to people in France, Iraq, India, the United Arab Emirates, Botswana, Pakistan, China and Argentina so that they may attempt to influence your election. It's only fair that everybody in the world should have a say in the selection of the prime minister.
California

Mind your own flipping business.
United States

Dear Guardian folks,
While I empathise with your plight, this attempt to influence voters by sending letters from foreigners will have a negative effect on your ultimate goal. You will cause people to empathise with the president, not the other way around. People will read these letters and say, "John Le who? Never heard of him, but who is he to tell me who to vote for?"
Ohio

I am a registered voter in Clark County, Ohio, and am very much interested in hearing what our overseas friends have to say about our election. You are correct in assuming that this election in the US is the most important election in memory. The threat of terrorism is a very real threat, not just in our country, but all over the world. In this day and age there must be worldwide unity against these fanatical groups who just hate. Not just Americans, but all western civilisation.
United States

Thanks for running this initiative. It may be the only way I get to have an impact on the American election, despite the fact that I'm a registered American voter. See, I vote in New York, which is solidly Democratic. Due to the electoral college system, once a majority is secured in any state, subsequent votes don't really matter. Whether NY goes 51% or 99%, the impact on who actually wins is the same. So thanks for the opportunity to impact somebody else's vote, where it may really matter.
Amsterdam, Holland

Who in the hell do you think you are??? Well, I'll tell you, you're a bunch of meddling socialist pricks! Stay the hell out of our country and politics. And another thing, John Kerry is a worthless lying sack of crap so it doesn't surprise me that a socialist rag like yours would back him. I hope your cynical ploy blows up in your cowardly faces, you bunch of mealy-mouthed morons!
United States

I used to visit the UK every year. I love the history and culture of your country. But after I heard about your campaign to influence our elections, I've decided that neither myself, nor my family will ever visit again. I'm offended by your campaign and because of it, I'm remembering more of the negative aspects I've seen in the UK than the positive ones. Though I still love the castles!
Detroit

Dear British friends,
I think you have an interesting idea to encourage international grassroots efforts, but I sincerely doubt most Springfielders are going to be influenced by letters from a country they probably can't even point to on a map. I wish you luck with your campaign, but I warn you that you're not likely to accomplish much.
Dayton, Ohio

You radical leftwingers are worse than the Taliban. I suggest you stand back and take a good hard look at yourselves.

PS: When do you propose to add Michael Moore to your staff of lunatics?
United States

I suggest that if a particular reader of the Guardian would like to vote in America - would really like to influence the American election, say - that reader should move to America, become a citizen of the United States. Everyone is welcome here. Even the readers of the Guardian. But if you don't wish to be an American, to live in Ohio, for instance, and participate in the American political process, that is too bad. Perhaps there is something wrong with you. Perhaps it is your teeth.
New York

Go back to sipping your tea and leave our people alone.
Ohio

As an American who is afraid of the terrible ramifications if Bush is elected, I commend your efforts to try to get Britons involved. Although many Americans would be critical of British people "meddling" with our politics and elections, all the world will share in the disaster if Bush is re-elected. Many of us are very concerned. I teach young adults, most of whom have been very uninvolved in voting and politics. Many of them are going to vote. We need all the help we can get.
United States

As a US citizen, I want to advise you that you and anyone that participates in subverting the US presidential election can be criminally charged and perhaps even charged as spies.
California

Thank God above for you English! Just when I was beginning to despair at the thought of Bush being re-elected, you come along with a strategy to help us! Your invitation to your readership and rationale for offering it are provocative at the least, and laudable at best.
Springfield, Ohio


Link Posted: 10/19/2004 9:56:45 AM EST
Ohh yeah, don't be votin' for Bush or you'll be in for a bit of the Barney. Roight? 'Cuz 'eez not right in the gulliver wot. Roight?
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 10:03:54 AM EST

Originally Posted By Dolomite:
Ohh yeah, don't be votin' for Bush or you'll be in for a bit of the Barney. Roight? 'Cuz 'eez not right in the gulliver wot. Roight?



Link Posted: 10/19/2004 10:08:09 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 10:10:34 AM EST
Actually, knew a couple of guys from England (green carders) that voted back in 2000.

In Wisconsin all you really need to do is show up at the polls with a driver's license or a utility bill.
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 10:15:29 AM EST

WOW! Some of those letters are hilarious! Thanks for post M4arc!
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 10:26:12 AM EST
Since the current state of afairs in Iraq, Iran, Sudan , Israel, Afghanistan, Pakistan, etc. can all be directly linked to hundreds of years of British empire building I say they have a lot of nerve telling us how to choose a governmet. I have British friends and they do just love to revel in their smug, self-hating hypocracy!

and while where talking about the brits... I want my money back on that CRAP RG5.56 "NATO" ammo I got stuck with! Damn limeys! As Thanksgiving (a unique U.S. holiday) approaches we should all remember this is exactly why our ancestors packed all their shit onto little wooden boats and braved a long and dangerous sea voyage to get away from the ancestors of the f###ing letter writers!
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 10:27:25 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/19/2004 10:29:18 AM EST by vito113]
As a resident of England, (although I'm actually an Irish Citizen), I'd just like to say… I have no wish to interfere in your Presidential Election… you go right ahead and vote for whoever you want……



­

<­BR>





­


As long as it's George Bush, not the f**ker Kerry.


Andy
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 10:31:21 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/19/2004 10:32:15 AM EST by QP031]

Originally Posted By vito113:
As a resident of England, (although I'm actually an Irish Citizen), I'd just like to say… I have no wish to interfere in your Presidential Election… you go right ahead and vote for whoever you want……


img.photobucket.com/albums/v133/macandy/138233.jpg
As long as it's George Bush, not the f**ker Kerry.


Andy

Link Posted: 10/19/2004 10:32:41 AM EST

Originally Posted By vito113:
As a resident of England, (although I'm actually an Irish Citizen), I'd just like to say… I have no wish to interfere in your Presidential Election… you go right ahead and vote for whoever you want……


img.photobucket.com/albums/v133/macandy/138233.jpg
As long as it's George Bush, not the f**ker Kerry.


Andy




Wondering when you'd show up!
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 10:37:58 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 10:38:46 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 10:40:52 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 10:47:14 AM EST

Originally Posted By vito113:
As a resident of England, (although I'm actually an Irish Citizen), I'd just like to say… I have no wish to interfere in your Presidential Election… you go right ahead and vote for whoever you want……


img.photobucket.com/albums/v133/macandy/138233.jpg
As long as it's George Bush, not the f**ker Kerry.


Andy



You're alright for a Brit! I bet you even drink coffee like us real men over here in the States.
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 10:47:55 AM EST
Well, you know, they English have done so well administering Northern Ireland for the last 80 years or so, I'm sure they're ready for another crack at US. Pedantic Pommie Fucks...I'm pretty steamed over this.

And of course it's the farging bleeding heart liberals over there who are all up in arms over Iraq...funny they didn't seem to mind when their own goverment was conspiring to murder it's own citizens in NI. Talk about hypocrites.

/rant off. It's okay...my meds will kick back in here directly.
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 11:19:40 AM EST
Andy owns one of the few ARs on the island as well. I am going over there next Sunday and can't wait for the pub brawl when I tell everyone I am voting for GB. I plan to just go ahead and start the bar fight with "Yeah, hopefully we can get George back in this time so we can go for complete world domination in '04. Your little island would make a nice 51st or 52nd state...." Then watch the pint glasses fly.

See ya next week Andy
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 11:22:24 AM EST

Originally Posted By Dolomite:
Actually, knew a couple of guys from England (green carders) that voted back in 2000.

In Wisconsin all you really need to do is show up at the polls with a driver's license or a utility bill.




That's not right!!!



Isn't that a pretty severe crime - to vote when you're not allowed to?


I mean, I would LIKE to have a vote - since I pay taxes and all (a LOT of them ) - but but I certainly don't feel entitled to a vote over here.
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 11:31:32 AM EST
Yeah - it's a system ripe for abuse, it really is.

And my two limey friends used the "but I pay mad taxes!" excuse to justify it. They're both gun nuts and one of them in the NRA so I was ambivalent about the whole thing.

Though I'd of probably called the INS/Guantanamo Bay airline company on them if I found out they voted for Gore.
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 11:32:17 AM EST
.
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 11:36:51 AM EST

Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
Amen brother Vito.


When you coming over man???



I work for the Royal Navy… can't be for another 6 years.

The Guardian Newspaper… they are a totally left wing upper class socialist paper… it's far left even by our standards! It's the Socialist Politicians 'must read' and interfereing in another countries election is just there sort of thing… they are 100% pro Kerry and Anti WOT.

So here are the details to let them know how you feel… I regularly do.

Letters to the Editor… letters@guardian.co.uk

Political Editor… politics@guardian.co.uk

Foreign Editor… Foreign@guardian.co.uk

They have also got an online forum… register and have some fun with the English left wing socialistas…

talk.guardian.co.uk/WebX?14@53.uYjTca7gqGZ.0@.ee74cb9

Best of luck for the 2/11

ANdy
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 11:41:38 AM EST

Hey just a thought.

Didn't we kick these tea drinkin', tea cake eating, frilly cuff shirt wearin', land rover drivin', bad teeth havin', dumpy women likein', umbrella wavein', oxford shoe wearin', derby hat havin', queen worshipin', parlimentary havin', limey bastards out of country about two hundred years ago????

Yeah, ..... I thought so.

Zen






"This is my rifle, there are many like it, but this one is mine"
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 11:42:56 AM EST

Originally Posted By jasondcrum:
Andy owns one of the few ARs on the island as well. I am going over there next Sunday and can't wait for the pub brawl when I tell everyone I am voting for GB. I plan to just go ahead and start the bar fight with "Yeah, hopefully we can get George back in this time so we can go for complete world domination in '04. Your little island would make a nice 51st or 52nd state...." Then watch the pint glasses fly.

See ya next week Andy



Sure will! Although I've been 'volunteered' for a trip to sea that week… 29th

Andy
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 11:47:42 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 11:54:41 AM EST
Gawrsh, I wuz gunna vote Bush until that there English feller sent me one-a them thar new fangled emals saying ta vote for Kerry.

Really changed my mind! An Englishman! Emailing ME! Imagine!
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 11:55:50 AM EST

Originally Posted By vito113:
As a resident of England, (although I'm actually an Irish Citizen), I'd just like to say… I have no wish to interfere in your Presidential Election… you go right ahead and vote for whoever you want……

img.photobucket.com/albums/v133/macandy/138233.jpg
As long as it's George Bush, not the f**ker Kerry.


Andy



You're a good man Andy!
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 11:58:50 AM EST

Originally Posted By jasondcrum:
Andy owns one of the few ARs on the island as well. I am going over there next Sunday and can't wait for the pub brawl when I tell everyone I am voting for GB. I plan to just go ahead and start the bar fight with "Yeah, hopefully we can get George back in this time so we can go for complete world domination in '04. Your little island would make a nice 51st or 52nd state...." Then watch the pint glasses fly.

See ya next week Andy




Just make sure you are wearing a soccer jersey from a rival region....LOL
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 12:00:48 PM EST

Originally Posted By Dolomite:
Actually, knew a couple of guys from England (green carders) that voted back in 2000.

In Wisconsin all you really need to do is show up at the polls with a driver's license or a utility bill.



And they broke federal law in doing so. If I were you I would keep REAL quiet about that.
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 12:00:54 PM EST
Tagged
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 12:22:40 PM EST

Originally Posted By jasondcrum:
Andy owns one of the few ARs on the island as well.



There's more than a few


I am going over there next Sunday and can't wait for the pub brawl when I tell everyone I am voting for GB. I plan to just go ahead and start the bar fight with "Yeah, hopefully we can get George back in this time so we can go for complete world domination in '04. Your little island would make a nice 51st or 52nd state...." Then watch the pint glasses fly.


Just wondering what kind of hospital food you prefer
Actually if you were to say something like that, you'd probably just get called a sad wanker

Mark
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 12:32:03 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 12:41:07 PM EST
Should I start some real big shit by saying..."Now you know how some other countries feel when the U.S. starts medling in their politics/problems without an invite." ? No I better not because someone might take it too seriously.
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 12:52:48 PM EST

Originally Posted By Fast351:

Originally Posted By Dolomite:
Actually, knew a couple of guys from England (green carders) that voted back in 2000.

In Wisconsin all you really need to do is show up at the polls with a driver's license or a utility bill.



And they broke federal law in doing so. If I were you I would keep REAL quiet about that.



So? They probably broke federal laws on a weekly basis - who doesn't in this country?

Their favorite thing was to go into a pizza resteraunt and get the waitress to say "hand tossed".

Yep, they were real bad boys.
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 12:54:11 PM EST

Originally Posted By Dolomite:


Their favorite thing was to go into a pizza resteraunt and get the waitress to say "hand tossed".



Link Posted: 10/19/2004 1:38:31 PM EST

Originally Posted By streetfighter:

Originally Posted By jasondcrum:
Andy owns one of the few ARs on the island as well.



There's more than a few


Mark



More than a 'few' but not 'many', It is a very rare weapon…I doubt if there are more than 1000 AR's in the whole country.

ANdy
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 2:52:25 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/19/2004 2:53:02 PM EST by OMETZ]
The only one that's worse is www.independent.co.uk.

I hope since Fisk likes the Arabs so much he should be the next kidnapping victim. He and Zarquawi can discuss "The Religion of Peace" as he gets his head sawed off.
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 2:56:12 PM EST

Originally Posted By vito113:

Originally Posted By streetfighter:

Originally Posted By jasondcrum:
Andy owns one of the few ARs on the island as well.



There's more than a few


Mark



More than a 'few' but not 'many', It is a very rare weapon…I doubt if there are more than 1000 AR's in the whole country.

ANdy



BTW, what guns are allowed. Are any pistols allowed at all, or are they completely banned.

Also, what about bolt-action rifles? Are tthey heavily restricted or completely banned as well.

Finally is the ban sort of like the MG "ban" here where current owners who register, etc. can keep them, or was it a zero-tolerance type ban where everyone's guns were confiscated? If so, did they get compensation?

Just curious.
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 3:26:49 PM EST
They could take a lesson from this Iraqi who has tasted just an ounce of freedom and allowed it to take hold.

From the Iraqi blog site: www.messopotamian.blogspot.com/


Hi Friends,

Actually, the American elections are rather more crucial for us at the moment than our own . That is not to belittle the importance of the latter, but taking a really hard look at the present situation, one cannot escape this conclusion. This statement may annoy a lot of people, but we are not particularly concerned about sensitivities at the moment. The thing is that we have to admit that despite the fact that most emphatically, the majority of the Iraqi people are for the new Iraq, and that the “insurrectionists” do not represent but a small minority, nevertheless the balance of forces on the ground would be seriously upset were it not for the support of the American and allied forces and nations. This small minority is dangerous, desperate, ruthless and absolutely prepared to commit any kind of atrocity to further their aims and vent their spleen, as has been clearly demonstrated almost everyday. They are well financed and connected with parties and interests beyond the border who consider it a matter of life and death to thwart all U.S. efforts and abort this attempt at creating a democratic state in the area. There are even larger international forces at work behind the regional players. So with all these foes it cannot be expected that the fledgling new Iraqi state and the largely peaceful and unarmed people can withstand the assault on their own in the present stage of development. It is a foregone conclusion that any abandonment or retreat would result in the most catastrophic consequences both for the Iraqi people as well as within the context of the wider global war on terrorism. Having said that, it is also important, to ease the burden on the Multi National Forces and keep them as much as possible out of harms way and stop the losses altogether. This can be done by transferring as much of the routine tasks to the Iraqis while keeping the MNF in secure bases from which they can be deployed for strategic tasks. For us, they are a most valuable asset and must be shielded and used only with the utmost care and parsimony. I believe it is possible to devise such a strategy and that it can be implemented.

Now, do we have a right, as Iraqis to express our opinion about the U.S. elections, which are of course an entirely internal affair for the American people? Or are they?
It seems to me, that since this matter is going to have a direct impact on our lives and very existence and since the U.S. government and people have seen fit to intervene and initiate this profound revolution in our country; it would not be extravagant nor incorrect for us even to demand to take part in those elections, rhetorically speaking of course.

So, I have been, personally very attentive to the debates and positions of both candidates, and I have some thoughts which I would like to share with you, my American friends. To start with, Senator Kerry may be a very good man and quite patriotic. Also we have to respect the almost 50% of the American people who lean towards the democrats. I don’t know much about domestic issues in the States so naturally, as might be expected, the position of any Iraqi would be mainly influenced by the issue that most concerns him. Thus, regardless of all the arguments of both candidates the main problem is that President Bush now represents a symbol of defiance against the terrorists and it is a fact, that all the enemies of America, with the terrorists foremost, are hoping for him to be deposed in the upcoming elections. That is not to say that they like the democrats, but that they will take such an outcome as retreat by the American people, and will consequently be greatly encouraged to intensify their assault. The outcome here on the ground in Iraq seems to be almost obvious. In case President Bush loses the election there would be a massive upsurge of violence, in the belief, rightly or wrongly, by the enemy, that the new leadership is more likely to “cut and run” to use the phrase frequently used by some of my readers. And they would try to inflict as heavy casualties as possible on the American forces to bring about a retreat and withdrawal. It is crucial for them to remove this insurmountable obstacle which stands in their way. They fully realize that with continued American and allies’ commitment, they have no hope of achieving anything.

On the other hand if President Bush is reelected, this will prove to them that the American people are not intimidated despite all their brutality, and that their cause is quite futile. Yes there is little doubt that an election victory by President Bush would be a severe blow and a great disappointment for all the terrorists in the World and all the enemies of America. I believe that such an outcome would result in despair and demoralization of the “insurgent elements” here in Iraq, and would lead to the pro-democracy forces gaining the upper hand eventually. Note that we are not saying that President Bush is perfect, nor even that he is better than the Senator, just that the present situation is such that a change of leadership at this crucial point is going to send an entirely wrong message to all the enemies. Unfortunately, it seems to me that many in the U.S. don’t quite appreciate how high the stakes are. The challenge is mortal, and you and we are locked in a War, a National Emergency; and in such circumstances partisan considerations must be of secondary importance. If you lose this war, you are no more, and you will have to withdraw within you boundaries cringing and waiting for terror to strike you in your homeland, afraid to move around, afraid to travel, afraid to do business abroad. You will have to see all your friends abroad annihilated and intimidated and nobody will have any confidence or trust in you anymore. And you will have to watch from far with bitterness the forces of darkness and evil taking over in many parts of this earth, with feelings of impotence and inability to do anything about it. In other words you would lose all credibility, and the fiends of terror and obscurantism would go triumphantly dancing the macabre dance of mayhem and death, and darkness would descend and obliterate the light and the hope. You think I am exaggerating, you think I am being paranoid? I just pray that destiny would not prove all these things; I pray that these horrors will not come to pass. And all this for what? For failing to confront few thousands ex-baathists and demented religious fanatics and some common criminals, concentrated in some rural areas of a country of the size of just one of your states; and that for a nation that has defeated Natzism, Imperial Japan and the Soviet Empire!

Well if Senator Kerry is such a good man, and he may well be, then it would be prudent to wait just another four years to elect him, after the job is done. And if this is interference in your national affairs by a foreigner, I am not going to give you any apology for it.

Salaam

Link Posted: 10/19/2004 3:35:42 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 3:38:51 PM EST

Originally Posted By BayEagle:

Originally Posted By Dolomite:
Ohh yeah, don't be votin' for Bush or you'll be in for a bit of the Barney. Roight? 'Cuz 'eez not right in the gulliver wot. Roight?



www.cinemaopiniao.hpg.ig.com.br/hobbies/105/laranja2.jpg





A Clockwork Orange

Link Posted: 10/20/2004 4:37:46 AM EST

Originally Posted By thompsondd:
They could take a lesson from this Iraqi who has tasted just an ounce of freedom and allowed it to take hold.

From the Iraqi blog site: www.messopotamian.blogspot.com/




Thanks for posting that thompsondd, I love reading that blog!
Link Posted: 10/20/2004 4:45:09 AM EST

Originally Posted By Fast351:

Originally Posted By Dolomite:
Actually, knew a couple of guys from England (green carders) that voted back in 2000.

In Wisconsin all you really need to do is show up at the polls with a driver's license or a utility bill.



And they broke federal law in doing so. If I were you I would keep REAL quiet about that.



So I cant rock up in a couple of years and vote for the republican?
Link Posted: 10/20/2004 5:34:49 AM EST
Didn't the NRA run a 'send rifles and handguns to Britian' during WW2, because of their stupid ass policies, and the threat of HItler, who thier idiot King,supported, before he got caught with a divorced woman, not to say that their almost king wasn't as stupid with that Camille woman, who is a dog compared to Diana, and also not as nice, but rememberthat the British Royal family is German....not even British, but thatis another story, who cares about heir counrty, well except for Scotland, which should just kick thheir scocialst asses out, but I don't care what they think, and my sister, who watches so much stuoid British TV, oh lets have tea...f tea, lets have whisky and kick ass.....never mind, just a rant, I like the British, they backed us but their leaders are too socialist, they need agood dental plan...
Link Posted: 10/20/2004 7:18:38 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/20/2004 7:29:08 AM EST by Fenian]

Originally Posted By TheWind:
Didn't the NRA run a 'send rifles and handguns to Britian' during WW2, because of their stupid ass policies, and the threat of HItler, who thier idiot King,supported, before he got caught with a divorced woman, not to say that their almost king wasn't as stupid with that Camille woman, who is a dog compared to Diana, and also not as nice, but rememberthat the British Royal family is German....not even British, but thatis another story, who cares about heir counrty, well except for Scotland, which should just kick thheir scocialst asses out, but I don't care what they think, and my sister, who watches so much stuoid British TV, oh lets have tea...f tea, lets have whisky and kick ass.....never mind, just a rant, I like the British, they backed us but their leaders are too socialist, they need agood dental plan...



Scotland is a separate country dude...technically part of the "United" Kingdom...but give it time lol. Alba Saor, Sinn Fein, and Plaid Cymru, baby!! My hope is by about 2025, the Saxons will be mighty lonely...first Scotland, then NI, then Wales.

Nice rant, though.

"For as long as but a hundred of us remain alive, never will we on any conditions be brought under English rule. It is not for glory, nor riches, nor honours that we are fighting, but for freedom — for that alone, which no honest man gives up but with life itself."

From The Declaration of Arbroath 1320.
Link Posted: 10/20/2004 7:37:53 AM EST
True a seperate Country...but what Highlander would give up his rifle?
Link Posted: 10/20/2004 8:05:30 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/20/2004 8:19:32 AM EST by vito113]

Originally Posted By OMETZ:

Originally Posted By vito113:

Originally Posted By streetfighter:

Originally Posted By jasondcrum:
Andy owns one of the few ARs on the island as well.



There's more than a few


Mark



More than a 'few' but not 'many', It is a very rare weapon…I doubt if there are more than 1000 AR's in the whole country.

ANdy



BTW, what guns are allowed. Are any pistols allowed at all, or are they completely banned.

Also, what about bolt-action rifles? Are tthey heavily restricted or completely banned as well.

Finally is the ban sort of like the MG "ban" here where current owners who register, etc. can keep them, or was it a zero-tolerance type ban where everyone's guns were confiscated? If so, did they get compensation?

Just curious.



Permitted weapons…
Shotguns with a barrel over 26" long
Semi auto and pump action .22 rifles
Bolt action rifles in any calibre
Gallery Rifles… lever action rifles in 'Pistol' calibres
Air rifles under 12ft/lb energy and air pistols under 6ft/lb energy


Banned…
All centerfire semi auto and pump action rifles
All handguns… even .22 ISU free pistols…
Shotguns under 26" barrel length
Rifles under 12" barrel length

All firearms are registered you have to have a licence and permission for each and every weapon on that licence, and all ammo purchases logged on your firearms licence.

When they ban a weapon… thats it… When they banned handguns and semi auto centrefires they all had to be handed in and compensation was paid…

The latest Ban was of Brocock air pistols that use a .38 size compressed air cartridge with a pellet in the end. They wanted to ban them and confiscate the lot without compensation, but the EU said that was illegal. So they banned them without compensation… owning one will get you a mandatory 8 years as will possesion of any 'Banned' weapon. But here is the crazy shit… if you owned a Brocock you could aplpy for a Firearms Permit to keep it so as to get the Government off the hook about compensation, (I did as I already have a Licence), but we now have the insane situation that I have a Permit to own a banned weapon!!! If I let anybody other than myself even hold it they will go to jail! I can't sell it on, if I want to get rid of it I have to hand it in for destructon without compensation…

ANdy
Link Posted: 10/20/2004 8:16:46 AM EST
Well, I've got seven, my friend Dave has eight, Fred has six.......most people I know have at least three.
We've sold about 30-40 over the last year.
Southern gun sold 350 last year. Savage sells a few. Olympic too.
I would put the numbers closer to 2000.

Still not many in comparison to the US but that's to be expected but not bad though.

I just wish that those who'vr got them would actually get out and compete with them.

As for the US presidential elections....it doesn't really matter to us who wins because it's gonna affect us whichever way it turns out, somehow.

I think the choice is pretty poor judging by the pair of them.

Then again, it's not my place to interfere. It's for America to decide and my opinions don't matter so I won't get into them.

Mark
Link Posted: 10/20/2004 8:18:57 AM EST

Originally Posted By SteyrAUG:
While I agree with the general sentiment I think we should be a bit more considerate of our most faithful ally.



I have to agree with SteyrAUG on this one. If there's one country that the US has been able to count on when the chips are down it's Great Britian. And the same is certainly true for Great Britian as well. There is too much that binds our two nations together to allow a temporary rift to seperate us.

There are one hell of a lot of my fellow Americans whom I not too fond of right at the moment. I'm not about to condemn the whole country because of them.

Despite the misguided efforts of the terminally clueless both here and abroad, we'll still do the right thing and re-elect George Bush in two weeks....and save all those timid apologists from themselves, whether they like it or not.
Link Posted: 10/20/2004 8:27:55 AM EST

Originally Posted By TheWind:
True a seperate Country...but what Highlander would give up his rifle?



actually, that was the true stroke of genius on the part of the English..following Prince Charlies disasterous defeat at Colluden, the ONLY way that the highlanders could keep their cultural heritage...the bagpipes, the wearing of traditional dress, and the ability to bear arms...was to join the Enlish Army. Many did...and the rest is history, as they say.
Link Posted: 10/20/2004 8:41:48 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/20/2004 8:44:10 AM EST by vito113]

Originally Posted By streetfighter:
I would put the numbers closer to 2000.
Mark



It's not many Mark and all those .223's are 'straight pull' not semi auto… the serial number on my semi auto .22 AR is ……101!

Any more bans on firearms in the UK and I will be strongly tempted to move back to Ireland… then I can own a 9mm pistol to shoot in Northern Ireland!

Andy
Link Posted: 10/20/2004 8:47:57 AM EST
From Brit Hume's page on Foxnews.com.....nice bloody grill mate

Link Posted: 10/20/2004 8:56:55 AM EST
OMFG! Have'nt laughed this hard in a long time! Those Brits really don't understand our 'mentality' at all. Maybe if they understood that whatever the world does we do the opposite, Metrics, Soccer, No-guns, no-bathing, Talking French, high taxes, nanny state BS bad food, lax immigration towards Muslims, etc etc. This will just make it worse for the Dems.
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