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Posted: 12/10/2013 6:15:25 AM EST
In the monthly e-newsletter for the Justice Department's Community Oriented Police Services (COPS) program, Senior Policy Analyst Karl Bickel sounds the alarm about the militarization of America's domestic police forces. Here's his conclusion:

Police chiefs and sheriffs may want to ask themselves—if after hiring officers in the spirit of adventure, who have been exposed to action oriented police dramas since their youth, and sending them to an academy patterned after a military boot camp, then dressing them in black battle dress uniforms and turning them loose in a subculture steeped in an "us versus them” outlook toward those they serve and protect, while prosecuting the war on crime, war on drugs, and now a war on terrorism—is there any realistic hope of institutionalizing community policing as an operational philosophy?

Given that a number of federal agencies are responsible for incentivizing and providing the hardware for police militarization, it's interesting -- and encouraging - to see a federal agency publish a piece like this.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/12/09/doj-agency-warns-of-polic_n_4412377.html
View Quote

That's some profound irony right there, I don't care who you are. - TS
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:19:53 AM EST
This ray of hope has seen his last promotion.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:21:14 AM EST
Originally Posted By Troubl3shooter:
In the monthly e-newsletter for the Justice Department's Community Oriented Police Services (COPS) program, Senior Policy Analyst Karl Bickel sounds the alarm about the militarization of America's domestic police forces. Here's his conclusion:

Police chiefs and sheriffs may want to ask themselves—if after hiring officers in the spirit of adventure, who have been exposed to action oriented police dramas since their youth, and sending them to an academy patterned after a military boot camp, then dressing them in black battle dress uniforms and turning them loose in a subculture steeped in an "us versus them” outlook toward those they serve and protect, while prosecuting the war on crime, war on drugs, and now a war on terrorism—is there any realistic hope of institutionalizing community policing as an operational philosophy?

Given that a number of federal agencies are responsible for incentivizing and providing the hardware for police militarization, it's interesting -- and encouraging - to see a federal agency publish a piece like this.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/12/09/doj-agency-warns-of-polic_n_4412377.html
View Quote

That's some profound irony right there, I don't care who you are. - TS
View Quote


I agree......WTH is going on.

Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:21:42 AM EST
IN.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:22:47 AM EST
That's just the DOJ trying to make the police look bad. Meanwhile it still supports the FBI, ATF, Postal Police, Federal Marshall's, ect all being militarized.
Frankly, I think they are scared that there a police departments and sheriffs offices telling the fed to pound sand, and they have the firepower and training to back it up.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:23:19 AM EST
That guy's days are numbered .
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:24:16 AM EST
Look, the anti-police troll is back.

Us vs. Them doesn't mean the community. It's Us vs. Criminals and other malicious individuals who harm the community they protect.

But go on, I'm sure there's a nice soap box beneath you.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:24:19 AM EST
Bring back hats, ties, shiney shoes and revolvers
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:24:52 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By chmodx:
Look, the anti-police troll is back.

Us vs. Them doesn't mean the community. It's Us vs. Criminals and other malicious individuals who harm the community they protect.

But go on, I'm sure there's a nice soap box beneath you.
View Quote


Popcorn.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:26:00 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By 1911SFOREVER:
This ray of hope has seen his last promotion.
View Quote
Yep. Bro just kissed his career goodbye.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:26:05 AM EST
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:26:08 AM EST
Here we go
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:26:14 AM EST
US Police bought and wrought by fed.gov since 1920.

Now one amongst them notices their monstrosity, and he will be raped by the very minions he questions.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:28:16 AM EST
Huh! And here I was led to believe that being concerned about the militarization of the police force was just something GD mouth breathers dreamed up .
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:28:42 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By DV8:
Irony.

DOJ warns of police militarization while the DOJ arms and distributes military hardware to the police Mexican drug lords.
View Quote

adjusted for temporal relevance.

ar-jedi
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:29:06 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By chmodx:
Look, the anti-police troll is back.

Us vs. Them doesn't mean the community. It's Us vs. Criminals and other malicious individuals who harm the community they protect.

But go on, I'm sure there's a nice soap box beneath you.
View Quote


Us vs Them is the reality.

All you have to do is look at any LEO funeral.

When you have cops driving publicly owned vehicles 1500 miles or more to attend. Yeah there is an Us vs Them component.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:31:13 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By garwj:
Bring back hats, ties, shiney shoes and revolvers
View Quote


I think they should. The NC troopers with their mirror shined shoes and huge hats are straight pimp.

Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:31:53 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By garwj:
Bring back hats, ties, shiney shoes and revolvers
View Quote


CARGOOOOO PANNNNTSSSSSS
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:38:35 AM EST
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:40:49 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By chmodx:
Look, the anti-police troll is back.

Us vs. Them doesn't mean the community. It's Us vs. Criminals and other malicious individuals who harm the community they protect.

But go on, I'm sure there's a nice soap box beneath you.
View Quote

LOL.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:41:22 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By MonkeyFist:


Us vs Them is the reality.

All you have to do is look at any LEO funeral.

When you have cops driving publicly owned vehicles 1500 miles or more to attend. Yeah there is an Us vs Them component.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By MonkeyFist:
Originally Posted By chmodx:
Look, the anti-police troll is back.

Us vs. Them doesn't mean the community. It's Us vs. Criminals and other malicious individuals who harm the community they protect.

But go on, I'm sure there's a nice soap box beneath you.


Us vs Them is the reality.

All you have to do is look at any LEO funeral.

When you have cops driving publicly owned vehicles 1500 miles or more to attend. Yeah there is an Us vs Them component.

Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:44:37 AM EST
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:44:53 AM EST
[Last Edit: 12/10/2013 6:45:49 AM EST by Justice23]
There are several subsets in LEO work. Patrol, Traffic, Investigations, School Resource Officers, Community Policing, SWAT, Marine Patrol, Forensics, ETC Etc Etc

The author is a community policing guy. CP guys goes to meetings and talk to residents about their concerns at neighborhood meetings, and hand out lollipops, and go to community events to let the public know we care. Win the hearts and minds for lack of a better term. (I did CP work for 6 years and it was good to interact with good people that cared about their community).

Some Patrol guys and most SWAT cops use aggressive tactics and some even dress in scary black outfits.

His opinion is him pointing his finger at another subset of policing (SWAT) and thinking his opinion about his area of policing is more important than others.


Now I agree that some agencies use SWAT way too much.

But this is just one guys opinion. It's worth what you paid for it.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:49:02 AM EST
[Last Edit: 12/10/2013 6:49:15 AM EST by Extorris]
Originally Posted By Troubl3shooter:
Police chiefs and sheriffs may want to ask themselves—if after hiring officers in the spirit of adventure, who have been exposed to action oriented police dramas since their youth, and sending them to an academy patterned after a military boot camp...
View Quote
View Quote

Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:50:18 AM EST
[Last Edit: 12/10/2013 6:50:50 AM EST by Plattekill]
What is happening here is a differentiation of our society into colonial and royalist analogs.

Like the Revolutionary war period, we will be re-fighting the British; but since the British are back in England, its the would-be kings' men among us that are the enemy.

The trend is authoritarian; police, government clerks, and elected so-called Representatives are under the most pressure to turn Royal. Royal. Thats the best terminology I can come up with. They think they are entitled to be our rulers. Some cops are like this, more will be so, and a few will realize what is going on, and come over to our side. Then the war begins.

In the cycle, we are half way between the French & Indian Wars and the Revolution. Say about 1765-66. 2014 will be bad, but 2024 is the grand finale.

History repeats itself, almost.

Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:51:04 AM EST
[Last Edit: 12/10/2013 6:51:19 AM EST by Extorris]
Originally Posted By Justice23:
The author is a community policing guy. CP guys goes to meetings and talk to residents about their concerns at neighborhood meetings, and hand out lollipops, and go to community events to let the public know we care. Win the hearts and minds for lack of a better term. (I did CP work for 6 years and it was good to interact with good people that cared about their community).
View Quote

Community Policing only works in areas where residents actually give a shit.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:52:17 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By VooDoo3dfx:

CARGOOOOO PANNNNTSSSSSS
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By VooDoo3dfx:
Originally Posted By garwj:
Bring back hats, ties, shiney shoes and revolvers

CARGOOOOO PANNNNTSSSSSS

I want to see if NYPD is going to go ahead with their proposed ban on them them for patrol now that Bratton's taking over.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:52:28 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By hooligan223:


I think they should. The NC troopers with their mirror shined shoes and huge hats are straight pimp.

http://i1.ytimg.com/vi/zoGIp02gfj8/hqdefault.jpg
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By hooligan223:
Originally Posted By garwj:
Bring back hats, ties, shiney shoes and revolvers


I think they should. The NC troopers with their mirror shined shoes and huge hats are straight pimp.

http://i1.ytimg.com/vi/zoGIp02gfj8/hqdefault.jpg
Love our troopers. They are definitely squared away.

Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:53:16 AM EST
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:54:40 AM EST
Probably trying to create some fear in order to thin the crop of post-military oathkeeper types hired into the civilian police force.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:55:04 AM EST
In!
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:55:06 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By chmodx:
Look, the anti-police troll is back.

Us vs. Them doesn't mean the community. It's Us vs. Criminals and other malicious individuals who harm the community they protect.

But go on, I'm sure there's a nice soap box beneath you.
View Quote

And what's the current definition of "criminal"?
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:55:27 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By hooligan223:


I think they should. The NC troopers with their mirror shined shoes and huge hats are straight pimp.

http://i1.ytimg.com/vi/zoGIp02gfj8/hqdefault.jpg
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By hooligan223:
Originally Posted By garwj:
Bring back hats, ties, shiney shoes and revolvers


I think they should. The NC troopers with their mirror shined shoes and huge hats are straight pimp.

http://i1.ytimg.com/vi/zoGIp02gfj8/hqdefault.jpg

Not when their behind you on 40 or 85
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:56:13 AM EST
[Last Edit: 12/10/2013 6:58:58 AM EST by IowaRenegade]



Or, one that probably better reflects GD:

Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:57:48 AM EST
Where's the "Not this shit again" pic?
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 6:58:35 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By SirSmeggle:
That's just the DOJ trying to make the police look bad. Meanwhile it still supports the FBI, ATF, Postal Police, Federal Marshall's, ect all being militarized.
Frankly, I think they are scared that there a police departments and sheriffs offices telling the fed to pound sand, and they have the firepower and training to back it up.
View Quote

That was my immediate thought.

but I'm only a civilian. I'll hang for some LEO input.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 7:00:05 AM EST
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 7:00:38 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By VooDoo3dfx:


Popcorn.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By VooDoo3dfx:
Originally Posted By chmodx:
Look, the anti-police troll is back.

Us vs. Them doesn't mean the community. It's Us vs. Criminals and other malicious individuals who harm the community they protect.

But go on, I'm sure there's a nice soap box beneath you.


Popcorn.


HEY! Did you bring enough for everyone?
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 7:03:06 AM EST
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 7:03:20 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
Translation: We might want to rethink all that training we are giving the locals because they are not towing the line on federal actions such as gun control.
View Quote


That's the message I got. Keep those local yokels writing speeding tickets while the centralized fed keeps the heavy artillery.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 7:03:24 AM EST
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Originally Posted By Shenanigunz:
Originally Posted By MonkeyFist:
Originally Posted By chmodx:
Look, the anti-police troll is back.

Us vs. Them doesn't mean the community. It's Us vs. Criminals and other malicious individuals who harm the community they protect.

But go on, I'm sure there's a nice soap box beneath you.


Us vs Them is the reality.

All you have to do is look at any LEO funeral.

When you have cops driving publicly owned vehicles 1500 miles or more to attend. Yeah there is an Us vs Them component.

http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/this-cannot-be-real.gif.pagespeed.ce.IdAKBEfpjN.gif


You're so cheeky, and fun!
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 7:05:07 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Extorris:

Community Policing only works in areas where residents actually give a shit.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Extorris:
Originally Posted By Justice23:
The author is a community policing guy. CP guys goes to meetings and talk to residents about their concerns at neighborhood meetings, and hand out lollipops, and go to community events to let the public know we care. Win the hearts and minds for lack of a better term. (I did CP work for 6 years and it was good to interact with good people that cared about their community).

Community Policing only works in areas where residents actually give a shit.


This is true. And 90% of the crime takes place in 10% of the country where they don't care.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 7:06:34 AM EST
I trust the police more than the DOJ under idiot, racist Holder.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 7:07:10 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
Translation: We might want to rethink all that training we are giving the locals because they are not towing the line on federal actions such as gun control.
View Quote
I hope you are right. I also think leadership plays a huge role in how the police conduct themselves with their toys. In college in one of my CJ

classes, I remember hearing that the attitude of the chief towards kickbacks and little "favors" plays a huge role in how the police conduct them-

selves. I would imagine it is the same with equipment etc. When you have police chiefs saying things like "I've got the biggest gang." or in one

case a Chief referring to his force as an "army", it encourages that line of thought. I have no problem with every police officer in this country

having individual access to a 556 carbine with a red dot sight, because I have one. If I can legally buy an MRAP, then I have no trouble with the

police having them, even if I can not afford one. It isn't the governments fault that I don't make enough money to buy an armored vehicle, but if

I am legally denied the ability, then police shouldn't have it either.

As far as community, there is more to community than multiple people living in the same area. If police drive through an area and see people

having conversations and waving at neighbors, community policing might work. Otherwise, community policing is just a way for agitators to

try to limit the ability of police to deal with troublemakers in an area.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 7:07:21 AM EST
How long before the authors of said piece are terminated from gov't employment?
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 7:07:49 AM EST
[Last Edit: 12/10/2013 7:11:43 AM EST by ultramagbrion]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By VA-gunnut:
I don't see this thread ending well.
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Originally Posted By VA-gunnut:
I don't see this thread ending well.
Do they ever ?

Stereotypes on both sides , broad-brush innuendo masterpieces in vivid technocolor , dripping with assumptions, accusations and stale statistics.... and stacked as deep as the site's CoC will allow .

Remind us again why the site started hiding the tin star icons ?


Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
Translation: We might want to rethink all that training we are giving the locals because they are not towing the line on federal actions such as gun control.
That's a high possibility , right there .
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 7:08:13 AM EST
In before the We-Need-MRAPs crowd.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 7:08:29 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By garwj:
Bring back hats, ties, shiney shoes and revolvers
View Quote


Seeing how 99% of policing activity in the vast majority of America's middle class suburbs consists of breaking up teenage parties and responding to false ADT alarms, what you propose would probably be quite sufficient. The problem lies in the crime ridden big cities, urban ghettos, and poor rural meth areas where police work is more akin to patrolling an Afghanistan war zone.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 7:09:09 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
4 out of his six listed sources are either himself or Radly Balko.

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Agreed that anything citing Balko needs to be looked at thrice, I don't see the two cites here being all that contentious:


The current drift toward militarization has its roots in the 1960s and the responses to the social unrest that swept the nation at the time. The development of Special Weapons And Tactics (SWAT) teams in reaction to the Watts riots in Los Angeles began a movement in policing that relied more and more on military tactics, training, and equipment. 2


There was unquestionably a need for the SWAT team approach in handling serious violent emergency situations, particularly those involving hostage taking and terrorist related incidents, and that was their primary use from their inception through the 1970s. 3
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 7:11:12 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By xxprince:


I agree......WTH is going on.

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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By xxprince:
Originally Posted By Troubl3shooter:
In the monthly e-newsletter for the Justice Department's Community Oriented Police Services (COPS) program, Senior Policy Analyst Karl Bickel sounds the alarm about the militarization of America's domestic police forces. Here's his conclusion:

Police chiefs and sheriffs may want to ask themselves—if after hiring officers in the spirit of adventure, who have been exposed to action oriented police dramas since their youth, and sending them to an academy patterned after a military boot camp, then dressing them in black battle dress uniforms and turning them loose in a subculture steeped in an "us versus them” outlook toward those they serve and protect, while prosecuting the war on crime, war on drugs, and now a war on terrorism—is there any realistic hope of institutionalizing community policing as an operational philosophy?

Given that a number of federal agencies are responsible for incentivizing and providing the hardware for police militarization, it's interesting -- and encouraging - to see a federal agency publish a piece like this.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/12/09/doj-agency-warns-of-polic_n_4412377.html

That's some profound irony right there, I don't care who you are. - TS


I agree......WTH is going on.



The DoJ does not like it when the state and locals are well equipped if not appropriately accounted for by the Feds. All power must be kept at the national level and only doled out as the Feds see fit.
Link Posted: 12/10/2013 7:12:13 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
Translation: We might want to rethink all that training we are giving the locals because they are not towing the line on federal actions such as gun control.
View Quote

This. They're learning they can't control all of the Local LE Agencies.
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