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Posted: 3/28/2009 5:15:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/28/2009 5:16:02 AM EDT by son_of_76]
http://www.cnsnews.com/public/content/article.aspx?RsrcID=45698

Government Should Compel Consumers to Use Alternative Energy, Congressman Says
Friday, March 27, 2009
By Josiah Ryan, Staff Writer

House Democratic Conference Chairman John Larson (D-Conn.) (Photo courtesy of Larson's Web site)(CNSNews.com) - Government policy should be crafted to raise the price of carbon-emitting energy sources so consumers are compelled to choose alternative energy, House Democratic Conference Chairman John Larson (D-Conn.) told CNSNews.com on Thursday.

Larson agreed that such a policy would likely result in higher electricity prices for consumers but said this is needed to protect the environment from the possible “catastrophic results” of not implementing a pro-green energy policy.

Some Republicans who spoke with CNSNews.com at the Capitol agreed that electricity prices would go up, and they dismissed President Barack Obama’s cap-and-trade plan as little more than a large tax on energy producers, the cost of which is passed onto consumers.

With cap and trade, the amount of carbon an energy company can emit is capped. If it exceeds that limit, the company can purchase credits (“trade”) that would go towards investment in green or alternative energy firms.

“I think the government should serve as an impetus to do so, because as I said at the outset, not doing anything –– the catastrophic results that can come from that – are what drives this issue,” Larson told CNSNews.com when asked if boosting electricity prices through government policy to drive consumers to green energy was a good idea.

“We ought to do it in a way that both enhances our economy and our economic opportunity and also preserves the universe and the earth,” said Larson.

At a press conference Tuesday, Obama told reporters that a good cap-and-trade system for carbon emissions should be designed to “protect consumers from huge spikes in electricity prices.”

"I think cap-and-trade is the best way, from my perspective, to achieve some of those gains, because what it does is it starts pricing the pollution that's being sent into the atmosphere,” Obama said.

"The way it's structured, it has to take into account regional differences. It has to protect consumers from huge spikes in electricity prices. So there are a –– a lot of technical issues that are going to have to be sorted through," he added.

But in an interview with the San Francisco Chronicle back on Jan. 17, 2008, then-candidate Obama said his plan for cap and trade would tax every unit of carbon emitted, which would in turn create an expanded market for new technologies.

Sen. George Voinovich (R-Ohio) (Photo courtesy of Voinovich's Web site)“I was the first to call for a 100% auction on the cap-and-trade system, which means that every unit of carbon or greenhouse gases emitted would be charged to the polluter,” said Obama. “That will create a market in which whatever technologies are out there that are being presented, whatever power plants that are being built, that they would have to meet the rigors of that market and the ratcheted down caps that are being placed, imposed every year.”

Eventually, these taxes would ruin the U.S. coal industry, added Obama.

“So if somebody wants to build a coal-powered plant, they can,” said Obama. “It's just that it will bankrupt them because they're going to be charged a huge sum for all that greenhouse gas that's being emitted.”

Republicans said that Obama’s plan to cap and trade carbon emissions would result in a massive tax hike on the companies and American consumers who have to pay for energy to heat and light their homes, and drive their cars, and to run myriad aspects of their daily lives.

“Of course” Obama’s plan will drive up energy costs, Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) told CNSNews.com. “The president’s proposal is unacceptable, because it’s just being used as a source of revenue.”

Sen. George Voinovich (R-Ohio) told CNSNews.com: “Of course the cost is going to rise. When people think of cap and trade, they are going to think of a giant tax increase.”

Larson also said he is concerned about “what happens down the food chain.”

“My concern specifically is what happens down the food chain, so to speak, to the consumer who ultimately bears the cost,” he said. “I think that no matter what we do, I have to be in favor of a carbon-tax approach, because I think that it just levels with people right from the outset. But I believe completely in passing the savings back down the stream to have an impact on the consumer.”
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 5:16:40 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 5:19:44 AM EDT
The end user will pay for ALL costs incurred, PERIOD. Double or triple your utilty bill if they get what they want.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 5:20:40 AM EDT
Yeah, because government mandates have historically been successful in influencing the consumer..

Link Posted: 3/28/2009 5:22:48 AM EDT
Let them do it as soon as possible. Then the GOP could run their campaign on that single issue, unfucking everyone's $1000 a month power bill if they get the majority/presidency back.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 5:23:43 AM EDT
Next stop nationalization of utilities industry through public furor over cost of energy?
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 5:41:48 AM EDT
I was watching Fox News last night and saw a piece on this. The Democrats are going to do what they can to make Cap and Trade happen even bypass some of the House and Senate rules to prevent a Republican filibuster.

A large part of Obama's future budget depends on money coming in from Cap and Trade......and in order to shore up Obama and the Democrat's big budget wishes and not bankrupt us tomorrow they need that money.

So what does that mean? It means if Carbon, or CO2 emissions are going to be taxed and traded and power companies have to buy these shares to emit these "evil polluting gasses." Since this is now an added cost of production they will pass that cost onto all of us. They can clean up more and sell their extra credits to someone else but to clean up more requires millions of dollars of equipment which means they will pass that cost on to us anyway. Either way we the consumer get stuck with paying more.

The lefties and Environmentalists that want this see it as the only way to force companies to reduce emissions. If it costs more to "pollute" than to be clean then capitalism says they will eventually be cleaner to save money, make more profit, and move on. However clean air is already a big factor in how we make things already. Go to any manufacturing plant with a stack and you'll find it already has ESP units, scrubbers, dedusters, etc. Now they are saying that more catalyst devices must be installed in order to let them produce or they buy a bunch of carbon credits.

So if you are a manufacture here in the US and with the current economy do you decide to invest millions of dollars to build this new environmental system (that may not be good enough in say ten to twenty years) or do you just call up China and find some land for your factory there where you don't need ANY environmental controls?

This will move the pollution from our soil to somewhere else. Additionally Americans lose their jobs and more manufacturing moves overseas. The pollution is not here but over there and you aren't going to force China, India, or most of those countries to clean up their act; actually right now you could say they don't have to listen to anything we say.

So manufacturing goes down the toilet even more while all of our power bills go up through the roof to pay for Obama and the Democrat's projects. The environmentalists are partially happy as they don't have to look at smoke stacks here and worry about feeding plants (CO2) with exhaust. Its just another move to redistribute wealth and backdoor taxes.

This and the upcoming global warming conference in Copenhagen will be interesting. We avoided Kyoto in the 1990s and earlier in this decade. We may not avoid Kyoto type rules run by the UN with Obama. That was the news story right after the cap and trade one on Fox News last night as well. I feel that we are being put in a position to forcibly sell out our #1 economy top spot because of environmentalism or better known as socialist control. One way or the other the lefties are going to control us either through economic rules or through environmental rules.

Link Posted: 3/28/2009 5:43:14 AM EDT
the government should be compelled to work for the people, not hte other way around.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 5:45:10 AM EDT
Originally Posted By AeroE:

They're getting pretty damn cocky, in my considered opinion.


mighty high horse too.

id say someones riding for a fall.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 5:48:25 AM EDT
As far as coal plants go, why don't they just tell the government to fuck off. What are they gonna do, shut them down? That's gonna go over like a turd in a punchbowl when it's 100* in the shade with 50% humidity. Around here, coal has the monopoly on electricity creation. They can't shut the plants down as there is nothing else to take up the slack. They need to get some balls and tell those fuckers "No thanks" and go on as before.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 6:00:31 AM EDT
What is this alternative they speak of?
If doesn't exist!!!!!!! Therefore you will have no choice but to continue to use existing energy sources
that will be taxed at about 40% putting more money into the guberment coffers and more strain on you and your
families resources and income.
It's all about money through taxes, the Demorats and even the Repubicans don't want to solve anything, they
just want POWER!

These people don't read, don't care about the constitution.

Our forefathers kicked the King and British out of here due to these very things.
Our forefathers warned us about this.
Washington D.C. is a viper pit of evil. There are very few Americans there.
It might as well be a foreign country.

It's time.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 6:02:22 AM EDT
He's right, the .gov would have to compel me to participate in any of their crack-pot environmentalist schemes.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 6:05:48 AM EDT
I have been saying it for a long time.

Cap-n-trade is going to destroy this country big time. I am in manufacturing and our production costs are very low, even almost on par with Asian parts(minus tooling) however 50% of the cost of our parts is energy. If we lose our energy cost we lose parity.

Then, We all lose business.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 6:41:25 AM EDT
fuck this shit.

capitol hill really ought to be tried and convicted for treason, and then drug into the street and publicly executed.


Link Posted: 3/28/2009 6:43:42 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/28/2009 6:44:39 AM EDT by jbombelli]
Cap and Trade will absolutely wreck this country. Which is why I am sure it will eventually pass. This wouldn't even be an issue if they (Congress) would just pull their fucking heads out of each others' fucking asses, and approve the construction of new nuclear plants. But they won't. Why? It would actually make sense.


If the opposite of Pro is Con, then the opposite of Progress must be Congress. And our "esteemed" elected officials have proven this time and time again.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 6:48:30 AM EDT
2010 VOTE THE BASTARDS OUT OF OFFICE

if they voted for cap and trade, spout the greenie bullshit, kiss the ass of Pelosi or Reid, VOTE THEM OUT OF OFFICE
Dem or Repub,,we need change,,HOPE MAY Well be out window but maybe we can block total socislist take over.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 6:51:42 AM EDT
Just wait and see what happens to milk prices if cap and trade goes into effect. Can you say $10 a gallon. Five dollars or more for a loaf of bread. These democrats need to be thrown out of congress on their back sides. The 2010 elections are just around the corner. That is our chance to remake the US House and the US Senate as all members of the House are up for re election and 1/3 of the Senate is up for re election. If we fail in 2010 kiss your guns goodbye..
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 6:54:03 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/28/2009 6:56:53 AM EDT by ABNAK]
And, as always, the "non-contributors" in our society will not suffer the cost increases like the rest of us. Granny, Shanequa, and Jose oughta get the price increase too, and when they freeze to death or suffer heat stroke THEN the outcry will be thunderous. If it's just you and me shelling out for it there won't be a peep. Of course keeping it painless for the "non-contributors" keeps them hitting the "D" lever.

Oh, and a fucking BRILLIANT move for an ailing economy......
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 6:55:54 AM EDT
I can barely afford my electricity bill now...I guess I'll start using candles and "coal oil" lamps like my grandparents did....
AlGore is a douche bag....
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 6:56:24 AM EDT
How about we cap & trade politicians?
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 6:57:01 AM EDT
Ok he is saying: Americans are stupid and they have to be duped to switch, even alternatives are nil; build the fucking nuclear plants you dipshiets libtards!
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 7:04:35 AM EDT
Fuck you sideways with your President, Mr Larson.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 7:06:45 AM EDT
They truly know what is best for us . I would like to thank the Dems For trying to do what is right to protect their flock from themselves .These men and women are truly American heroes.
I wish one of these brave men would have the balls to stand up and Ban TP do you know how many trees can be saved ! Besides your fingers are a renewable resource if you only have 2 they will last your entire life

Thank you Congressman you are truly what makes America Great !
















Link Posted: 3/28/2009 7:08:54 AM EDT
The democrats want this country to fail.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 7:22:36 AM EDT
Anymore all this just compells me to buy ammo
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 7:29:12 AM EDT
If they pass this our country will look like North Korea when viewed at night from the space station. Lights Out!
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 7:47:04 AM EDT
So how do they tell if your electricty is coming from the coal plant or the solar one 100mi away? OH ,I see, they just raise the rate for everybody X2 and call it good....
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 7:52:58 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/28/2009 7:53:29 AM EDT by foxherb53]
There are 5 hydro dams up river from my location and a few years ago the state of Washington reclassified hydro as NON-RENEWABLE What a bunch of crap. Electricity will cost 5 times what it is today if they pass crap like this...









DON'T FORGET TO TURN ON ALL YOUR LIGHTS TONIGHT.........
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 7:57:18 AM EDT
Originally Posted By dablues:
The democrats want this country to fail.


Sutler: I want this country to realize that we stand on the edge of oblivion. I want everyone to remember *why* they need us!



Link Posted: 3/28/2009 7:58:28 AM EDT
The other day during one of his press conferences Obama stated that he was in favor of backing an attempt to pass legislation for the purpose of installing devices in each home to regulate the use of electricity. You will have your energy uses rationed by government. Electricians from utilities companies may be made responsible for installing the devices at no cost to you-isn't that nice.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 7:59:18 AM EDT
Originally Posted By avenger44:
What is this alternative they speak of?
If doesn't exist!!!!!!! Therefore you will have no choice but to continue to use existing energy sources
that will be taxed at about 40% putting more money into the guberment coffers and more strain on you and your
families resources and income.
It's all about money through taxes, the Demorats and even the Repubicans don't want to solve anything, they
just want POWER!

These people don't read, don't care about the constitution.

Our forefathers kicked the King and British out of here due to these very things.
Our forefathers warned us about this.
Washington D.C. is a viper pit of evil. There are very few Americans there.
It might as well be a foreign country.

It's time.



This ^ ^ ^
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:00:20 AM EDT


“We ought to do it in a way that both enhances our economy and our economic opportunity and also preserves the universe and the earth,” said Larson.


Now global warming threatens the existence of the entire fucking universe?
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:01:32 AM EDT
Originally Posted By LANCEMAN:
Let them do it as soon as possible. Then the GOP could run their campaign on that single issue, unfucking everyone's $1000 a month power bill if they get the majority/presidency back.


You give the GOP way too much credit. Until the "old" blood is replaced with some folks that are hungry for change and uncorrupted by DC, we're gonna get more of the same weak-assed "moderate" bullshit.

Currently, we have no Newt speaking of or leading a "contract with America" type of movement. Even Newt sold out to the left with his left-wing position on energy and the 2A.

Fuck these people. Professional politicians have to go. Right now we're stuck with the worst of the worst. The absolute bottom of the barrel.

Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:04:46 AM EDT
Originally Posted By son_of_76:
The other day during one of his press conferences Obama stated that he was in favor of backing an attempt to pass legislation for the purpose of installing devices in each home to regulate the use of electricity. You will have your energy uses rationed by government. Electricians from utilities companies may be made responsible for installing the devices at no cost to you-isn't that nice.


That isn't what that item does. It may allow the utility to control some items in your house, but that is to level the load. The end result of a smart meter is 6% reduced consumption and 27% reduced peaking. Which means cheper power in a lot of ways.

It allows less power to be consumed and flattens out peaks which are the most expensive sources of power, like natural gas, and it integrates wind and solar more effectively.

Italy already switched over, and others are working on it.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:05:51 AM EDT
Originally Posted By USMCTanker:
Originally Posted By LANCEMAN:
Let them do it as soon as possible. Then the GOP could run their campaign on that single issue, unfucking everyone's $1000 a month power bill if they get the majority/presidency back.


You give the GOP way too much credit. Until the "old" blood is replaced with some folks that are hungry for change and uncorrupted by DC, we're gonna get more of the same weak-assed "moderate" bullshit.

Currently, we have no Newt speaking of or leading a "contract with America" type of movement. Even Newt sold out to the left with his left-wing position on energy and the 2A.

Fuck these people. Professional politicians have to go. Right now we're stuck with the worst of the worst. The absolute bottom of the barrel.



I feel the same way you do but there isn't a viable third party choice in 2010 or 2012 I'm aware of. The GOP is the lesser of two evils, just saying IF they were smart the would use that angle.

Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:11:09 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:
Originally Posted By son_of_76:
The other day during one of his press conferences Obama stated that he was in favor of backing an attempt to pass legislation for the purpose of installing devices in each home to regulate the use of electricity. You will have your energy uses rationed by government. Electricians from utilities companies may be made responsible for installing the devices at no cost to you-isn't that nice.


That isn't what that item does. It may allow the utility to control some items in your house, but that is to level the load. The end result of a smart meter is 6% reduced consumption and 27% reduced peaking. Which means cheper power in a lot of ways.

It allows less power to be consumed and flattens out peaks which are the most expensive sources of power, like natural gas, and it integrates wind and solar more effectively.

Italy already switched over, and others are working on it.


sounds good but sounds expensive how long do you think it will take to realize any substantial savings ? how long for the payoff ?
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:13:51 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:
Originally Posted By son_of_76:
The other day during one of his press conferences Obama stated that he was in favor of backing an attempt to pass legislation for the purpose of installing devices in each home to regulate the use of electricity. You will have your energy uses rationed by government. Electricians from utilities companies may be made responsible for installing the devices at no cost to you-isn't that nice.


That isn't what that item does. It may allow the utility to control some items in your house, but that is to level the load. The end result of a smart meter is 6% reduced consumption and 27% reduced peaking. Which means cheper power in a lot of ways.

It allows less power to be consumed and flattens out peaks which are the most expensive sources of power, like natural gas, and it integrates wind and solar more effectively.

Italy already switched over, and others are working on it.


Does this mean that if, for instance, you would use your kitchen oven at 5:30 pm the device would prevent it from working, or would it cut back the energy supplied to another appliance such as a central air unit?
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:21:32 AM EDT

Originally Posted By son_of_76:
Next stop nationalization of utilities industry through public furor over cost of energy?

Scary. That has an ominous tone to it. Wouldn't surprise me, though, now that you mention it.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:23:21 AM EDT
And who the fuck is obama and the dems going to blame when there are regular power outages across the country like there were in CA a while back. because companies don't build new powerplants, upgrade the old ones and don't make improvements to the grid because making power just became unprofitable.......Well Bush of course.

These people are fucking brain dead.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:25:54 AM EDT
What are we saving the earth and the universe from? More and more, science is moving away from man made global warming. If these a$$holes would bother to read, or even cared, they would start to doubt the world of the annointed one.

As said before...grest plan for a failing economy
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:26:57 AM EDT


The government knows best.




Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:27:28 AM EDT
Time for solar. Is that new technology out yet? The more efficient, less expensive more durable panels for residential use.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:29:35 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:
Originally Posted By son_of_76:
The other day during one of his press conferences Obama stated that he was in favor of backing an attempt to pass legislation for the purpose of installing devices in each home to regulate the use of electricity. You will have your energy uses rationed by government. Electricians from utilities companies may be made responsible for installing the devices at no cost to you-isn't that nice.


That isn't what that item does. It may allow the utility to control some items in your house, but that is to level the load. The end result of a smart meter is 6% reduced consumption and 27% reduced peaking. Which means cheper power in a lot of ways.

It allows less power to be consumed and flattens out peaks which are the most expensive sources of power, like natural gas, and it integrates wind and solar more effectively.

Italy already switched over, and others are working on it.


Good for Italy. I don't live in Italy and I don't want the Utility company rationiong or controlling MY energy use, period. This is the United States of America not Italy.

Don't get me wrong, I'm pretty frugal when it comes to utility usage, but letting a utility manipulate my use is BS.

Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:29:57 AM EDT
can we compel people on public assistance to work
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:31:54 AM EDT
Originally Posted By fxntime:
The end user will pay for ALL costs incurred, PERIOD. Double or triple your utilty bill if they get what they want.


Scary, but true.

None of this a surprise at all. Obama said on multiple occasions that he will make life very difficult for owner's/operators of coal fired power plants. Someone has to pay for the extra expenses and that will be you and me.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:43:03 AM EDT
First of all, since when is CO2 a pollutant? Since we all exhale it all day and all night. ( am wrong? it's been ahwile since grade school ! ) The Environment is a money and power SCAM period. They will use the environment to further solidify their agenda. I guess I'm a tinfoiler but looking at the whole picture going back to the Clinton admin there is a playbook to bring this country down. They have turned a number of pages in that book and are getting towards the back cover. FUCK THEM..
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:44:12 AM EDT
Originally Posted By blueinterceptor:
can we compel people on public assistance to work


This.


Don't spread my wealth. SPREAD MY WORK ETHIC.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:47:27 AM EDT


Democrats are really a piece of work.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:50:06 AM EDT
http://www.larson.house.gov/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=595&Itemid=35

About John
U.S. Representative John B. Larson began serving in the U.S. House of Representatives in 1999, and is presently in his sixth term serving the people of Connecticut's First Congressional District.

Larson was recently elected by his colleagues to serve as Chair of the House Democratic Caucus for the 111th Congress, making him the fourth-ranking Democrat in the House. As Caucus Chair he will work to build consensus among his colleagues on the key issues of the day. He also served as Vice-Chair of the Caucus for more than two years.

In 2005, Larson was named to the influential Ways and Means Committee, which has jurisdiction over the nation's tax code, trade policy, Social Security, and Medicare. He sits on the Subcommittee on Trade and the Subcommittee on Select Revenue Measures. He formerly served on the Armed Services Committee, Science Committee, and as Ranking Minority Member of the House Administration Committee.

Larson has been a leader in the effort to end U.S. dependence of foreign oil through advancing fuel cell technology produced in the United States that will also grow the economy and improve our environment. During his tenure in Congress, Larson has introduced the Energy Independence Act and the Hydrogen and Fuel Cell Technology Authorization Act to fund and promote fuel cell. He is also a founder and co-chair of the House Hydrogen and Fuel Cell Coalition.

Larson has opposed the policies of preemption and unilateralism and the war in Iraq since its inception and has focused his concerns on the threats of terrorism, protecting the homeland, and supporting first responders. However, he has vigorously supported the troops, visited Iraq three times, and succeeded in passing legislation to reimburse family members who purchased body armor for soldiers who had not been adequately equipped by the military.

Larson is committed to preserving Social Security and Medicare and securing a true prescription drug benefit for seniors. He has introduced legislation to allow the federal government to directly negotiate lower drug prices for over 40 million Medicare beneficiaries.

Among his efforts to promote development in Hartford, Larson successfully led the effort to initiate a feasibility study of the Coltsville section of Hartford as a first step in gaining a National Park designation for the area from the Department of the Interior.

Larson was born on July 22, 1948 in Hartford, Connecticut. He and his seven brothers and sisters were raised in Mayberry Village, a public housing project in East Hartford by their parents, Raymond and Pauline.

He graduated from East Hartford High School in 1967 and from Central Connecticut State University (CCSU) in 1971. Larson was later selected by Dr. Edward Zigler, the creator of Head Start, to be a Senior Fellow at the Yale Bush Center for Child Development.

Before entering Congress, Larson was a high school history teacher and athletic coach until he became an owner of Larson & Lysik insurance company. He served on the East Hartford Board of Education and the East Hartford Town Council. In 1982, he was elected to the Connecticut State Senate, beginning a 12-year tenure representing the 3rd Senate District until 1995. Larson served as Senate President Pro Tempore for eight years from 1987 to 1995.

The Congressman and his wife Leslie have three children (Carolyn, Laura, and Raymond) and are life-long residents of East Hartford.


History teacher, insurance salesman, professional political hack.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Larson <<< He married one of his students!

Larson married Leslie Best, one of his former students from his high school teaching days at George J. Penney High School.


http://www.larsonforcongress.org/




Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:53:49 AM EDT
I'm investing in bullet futures now.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:59:31 AM EDT
Do every available option EXCEPT build more power plants.

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