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1/25/2018 7:38:29 AM
Posted: 7/26/2002 12:15:08 PM EST
The return of debtors prisons is not too far off. Give it 5 years and you will see people incarcerated in the United States of America over their inability to pay their debt. If you are contemplating filing bankruptcy for any reason, you better get it done now. Your right to file individual Chapter 7 may be gone in weeks. [url]http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&ncid=716&e=5&u=/nyt/20020726/ts_nyt/negotiators_agree_on_bill_to_rewrite_bankruptcy_laws[/url]
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 12:22:48 PM EST
Hmmm, lets see, run up all kinds of debt you can't possibly afford to pay back or have no intentions of paying it back and you go to jail !?!?!? Sounds good to me !!! [:D] Let them work the chain gang picking up trash or make BIG rocks into small ones for minimum wage untill its paid back. It's waaaay to easy to get out of your obligations today and that cost is passed on to those of us who work our ASSES off to pay our bills.
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 12:30:23 PM EST
I hope it is coming back. A guy I know ran up a huge debt in his early 20's, many thousands in credit card debt, as he would just see something and buy it if he wanted it, and went through the bankruptcy process with relativly little harm in the end. Really p'd me off that someone could do this.
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 12:30:33 PM EST
This is an embarrassment for the Republic. Nothing, but absolutely nothing, is being done about the abuses of corporate bankruptcies, just those bankruptcies filed by individuals whose debts are primarily consumer, credit card debts. When Mom and Pop file for bankruptcy, how many jobs are lost? When Enron or World.com file? Let me give you the skinny, though, for those of you who believe that this is a great victory for personal financial responsibility! It doesn't affect bankruptcies where the total income from the Debtor is less than median average family income for the state in which he resides. In Texas, for a family of four, unless you make more than $37,000.00, these laws will not affect you. Gone are the State exemptions that would protect your homesteads from seizure, only the first $17,000.00 of the equity in your home will be protected! Now this is a shorthand view of the changes, but they will not impact low income Americans or wealthy Americans, but, as always, the great Middle Class will pay the price for all! Eric The(Outraged)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 12:30:42 PM EST
hhhmmmm spectre...I guess the correct thing for me to do after my divorce was to just go on welfare and not try to pay my credit card debts that skyrocketed with late fees and over-runs and white bunny charges. I guess it would make you happier to have me in jail than out here paying for schools and arenas and concert halls and road fees and gas taxes so people like you can sit with a golden spoon in their mouth and look down on the peasants.....How about this....why don't we lock up the people who crashed the economy and laid off 10% of the workforce and forced them to live on a credit card?
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 12:32:43 PM EST
message to spectre...that was too rough and too pointed ----I apologize for poking at you...let's stick together and poke at all the others, OK?
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 12:38:03 PM EST
Originally Posted By SPECTRE: Hmmm, lets see, run up all kinds of debt you can't possibly afford to pay back or have no intentions of paying it back and you go to jail !?!?!? Sounds good to me !!! [:D] Let them work the chain gang picking up trash or make BIG rocks into small ones for minimum wage untill its paid back. It's waaaay to easy to get out of your obligations today and that cost is passed on to those of us who work our ASSES off to pay our bills.
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Sounds good to me[^]
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 12:38:12 PM EST
Maybe the credit card companies should stop handing credit cards out like there candy. I think they have created their own problems. They give credit to people they know can't afford to pay back the money.
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 12:39:19 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/26/2002 12:39:35 PM EST by Aimless]
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 12:46:58 PM EST
Originally Posted By hound: message to spectre...that was too rough and too pointed ----I apologize for poking at you...let's stick together and poke at all the others, OK?
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No problem hound, I was mainly referring to those leaches who knowingly run up huge amounts of debt and then bail. I certainly don't think people who have fallen on hard times should face this, just those who flagrantly abuse the credit system. Hell, there's a whole industry now that caters to the "credit challenged" it used to be going bankrupt was a scarlet letter and something to be ashamed of and avoided at all costs. Now its a way out with no social stigma. I remember my grandfather telling us how he took 3 or more jobs and worked seven days a week to pay his obligations after the stock crash of 29 to avoid the scorn of bankruptcy.
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 12:50:14 PM EST
I heard this morning on the radio (take with a grain of salt) that over half of individual bankruptcy filings are due to medical expenses. Seeing what a single week's stay in a hospital costs, I can well believe it. Perhaps we should not be so quick to judge [i]everyone[/i] by the irresponsible acts of some? And if ETH is correct about no longer having homestead protection, then I would be meeting the Sherriff coming to evict me with the single firearm I retained. Period.
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 12:57:31 PM EST
I have up to this point refused to file...I continue to pay and I will NEVER be able to catch up....so maybe they will lock me up and give me three squares and I can watch Oprah...
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 1:00:34 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 1:18:46 PM EST
Now I'am going through bankruptcy because I was laid off more time's than i cared to even talk about plus when i needed a car I was Lied too right in my face about refinacing; pay $19,000 on a $9.000 car, then some dumbass drove out in front of me totaled the car "His fault" then the state farm Ins company only wanted to pay $6.000 for our car that there dumbass totaled out plus we had to take all of our savings and had to buy a new car. then the dick heads at the bank one DID NOT WANT TO LOWER OUR PAYMENT'S they did not give a f%$# they wanted there money now or garnish my wages all we got was threat's. now tell me we are living off the system. some of us just got f%$%. there is more! but I just gave you a small amout of B.S. We had no Choice.
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 1:20:01 PM EST
Originally Posted By hound: hhhmmmm spectre...I guess the correct thing for me to do after my divorce was to just go on welfare and not try to pay my credit card debts that skyrocketed with late fees and over-runs and white bunny charges. I guess it would make you happier to have me in jail than out here paying for schools and arenas and concert halls and road fees and gas taxes so people like you can sit with a golden spoon in their mouth and look down on the peasants.....How about this....why don't we lock up the people who crashed the economy and laid off 10% of the workforce and forced them to live on a credit card?
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Tell me, which evil doer held a gun to yuor head and ordered you to charge all your "neccessary crap"? How about doing away with your credit cards and doing the novel thing, paying with cash for the things you can afford, and doing without for the things you can't? WTF ever happened to personal responsibility?
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 1:27:25 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/26/2002 1:30:50 PM EST by shooter69]
Credit card companies charge such high interest rates (and are allowed to by law) supposedly to offset all the deadbeats. I wonder will the people who carry balances be charged less than rates like 18% if MBNA (as aimless pointed out) gets their way... [img]http://bestanimations.com/Animals/Mammals/Pig-01.gif[/img]
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 1:28:11 PM EST
Post from hielo -
WTF ever happened to personal responsibility?
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When did we ever have it? Bankruptcy laws are as old as the Constitution. Thomas Jefferson took 'personal bankruptcy' at least seven times during his lifetime, and yet, when he died on July 4, 1826, his estate consisted of debts of more than $100,000.00, which his heirs were unable to pay. BTW, $100,000.00 in those days was a considerable sum, as you may well imagine. There is nothing in this reform act that will promote 'personal responsibility', and certainly nothing that would promote corporate financial responsibility. Eric The(Wise)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 1:32:18 PM EST
Glad to see somebody here's getting some work. [;)]
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 1:40:57 PM EST
Originally Posted By hielo: Tell me, which evil doer held a gun to yuor head and ordered you to charge all your "neccessary crap"?
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I don't know hound or his situation and I'm not attacking you hielo, just offering up my .02. The evil doer may have been an divorce order specifiying: - an unreasonable division of marital assets - - an unreasonable amount of alimony - an unreasonable of child support You still have to cover the - attorney costs - court costs - finding a new place to live
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 1:41:23 PM EST
Well, [b]shooter69[/b], I suppose that I will never have to file for personal bankruptcy! [:D] These idiots in Washington DC sure know how to chase folks into bankruptcy! This story made the front page of the Dallas Morning News and I've gotten five new clients today alone! Oh well, just more ARs and AKs to help when the [b]SHTHunFarm![/b] Eric The(LaughingAllTheWayToTheBankruptcyCourt)Hun­[>]:)]
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 1:46:07 PM EST
I think it stinks. I think it is one of the subversive ways to further impose control over the masses. Sometimes people lose their jobs or encounter circumstances beyond their control. ESPECIALLY in trying economic times. The other issue that has not been addressed in all of this is the credit reporting agencies. They quietly wield control over all aspects of your life with that little Beacon Score. What is really crappy is the fact they sell your personal information to financial institutions who run preliminary credit checks against you for prequalification for a promotional credit card campaign. Then they penalize you for firms checking your credit because the analysis rules state that if you are actively seeking credit (ie. you have recent credit checks) you are a higher risk. They have complete control of the closed loop process and penalize you in the end for a card promotion you may ultimately not accept. It's completely one sided and it is something that will spell political suicide for GWB should he pen the bill into law during these economic times. Time is drawing short. I hope everyone here is ready for the armed overhaul that will invariably occur in the next 10 years.
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 2:19:11 PM EST
Wow, I actually agree with something the Hunny Bunny wrote. What's the world coming to.. Regardless, he's spot-on with the reply. Anyone who thinks filing bankruptcy is a walk in the park is mistaken. Sure some people are stupid and buy a bunch of crap they can't afford, but so what? The bank was stupid for extending them more credit than they should have and letting it become a problem. (i.e., it's hard to get into too much trouble if the bank will only loan you $500) Among other reasons, that's why banks and credit card companies charge most people ridiculous interest rates and fees for the services they provide. Do you really think they're going to lower them if the bankruptcy rates go down? Dream on Pollyanna. Besides, you're looking at it from the wrong perspective, these kinds of bills are just one more example of letting corporations off the hook for *their* irresponsible behavior but throwing the book at individual citizens. If this bill goes through (and there's no reason to think that it won't) it's just one more straw on the creaking back of the middle class. I think there needs to be a 'safety valve' like bankruptcy because sometimes things happen that are totally beyond your control (medical expenses, accidents to yourself or family, natural disasters, etc.). There are sometimes totally legitimate reasons to throw in the cards and try to start over. That our elected representatives are slowly eroding that ability is shameful. Full disclosure-I've never filed for bankruptcy or even had anyone close that did so.
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 2:26:32 PM EST
Originally Posted By illinois: Maybe the credit card companies should stop handing credit cards out like there candy. I think they have created their own problems. They give credit to people they know can't afford to pay back the money.
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This is one of Hillary Clinton's major issues. She believes that, even though no one is forced to use a credit card, the card issuer is responsible for the personal choices of the card user.
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 2:35:27 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 2:35:47 PM EST
This is going to cause a new Great Depression. People will simply stop making purchases and stop taking out credit. Then nothing will get bought and more people will out of work, default. We will be back to the 1920's and 30's with banks holding all sorts of property they cant get rid of, and so they will fail too.
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 2:47:12 PM EST
Originally Posted By Avtomat:
Originally Posted By illinois: Maybe the credit card companies should stop handing credit cards out like there candy. I think they have created their own problems. They give credit to people they know can't afford to pay back the money.
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This is one of Hillary Clinton's major issues. She believes that, even though no one is forced to use a credit card, the card issuer is responsible for the personal choices of the card user.
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I loved watching Visa, Mastercard, and Discover with little booths setup on the sidewalk across Guadalupe from the UT campus begging people to apply for their cards. Don't make any money? No problem, put your parent's income down. Don't need one? Just keep it for emergencies. But if you do spend, you'll get a refund, or better yet airline miles so you can go to Florida for Spring Break! And each one of those accounts is insured so that when destitute student can't pay, and puts a big black mark on their credit, the credit company still gets paid. Credit is a suckers game. The only people that really win with credit cards are the issuers, but it's a sad fact that unless you're independantly wealthy you need credit to buy things like cars and houses. My credit cards are paid off and have low limits. My wife's, unfortunately, are not. Remember the Alamo, and God Bless Texas...
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 2:54:03 PM EST
It's about time!!!!
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 2:56:38 PM EST
Ultimately, the credit card companies are responsable. Just look at the card apps. you get in the mail each week. I get lots. You can get as many cards as you want and the more you use em the higher the limit goes. Just go to a bank and try and get that much credit. WOULDNT HAPPEN!!!!! Why not make a law that you can only have three cards with a 500 or 1000 dollar limit. Put the responability on the CC company to check that the person doesnt already have three cards and make them responsable for the debt. I have four cards, one of each of the majors except Amex. I never have more than I can afford to pay on any of them. I dont carry a balance and pay interest, I use them for the convenience, not loans. They must hate me. If the money isnt in the bank to pay for it I dont buy it, that simple. Some people cant handle credit. Who needs to charge more than a grand at any one time anyway! Then you could put some on your other card(s). JMHO BP
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 3:18:10 PM EST
This is just payback for campaign contributions, on both sides of the isle. I think GWB's biggest single contribution was from MBNA. CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM is needed now!. All the credit card companies make gob's of cash, even if bankruptcies went up 20%, they would still make a killing. Before credit cards and easy loans people were able too manage. Credit cards can create a false economy and they pose one of the biggest threats to the free market and to western lifestyle. Personal responsibilities? How about corporate responsibilities and leadership instead of just dollar signs and blind folds. This is not so much an individual problem as it is a leadership and corporate problem.
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 3:22:33 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/26/2002 3:31:53 PM EST by cretescreeder]
1992 lost job of 20 years with my last paycheck. (company went out of business) 1993 wife got sick - no insurance - $300k hospital bill. $300k bill - $37k pr.yr. job - no insurance = bankruptcy. Actually it was the hospitals idea for me to file so they could get it off the books. Bad thing was, we didn't owe a sole in the world a dime at the time. Edited to say I started getting credit card apps in the mail 2 weeks after I filed. Still to this day I don't have any. Way Way not wanting to step out of line here but have I heard Mr. Hun on the radio? P.S. the wife is fine now.
Link Posted: 7/26/2002 3:24:55 PM EST
We have paid off my wifes car, three credit cards and one loan. We owe less than a grand on my truck and we have a small balance on the Sears card (just gotta have them Craftsman tools, although I found the on-line order site for Snap-On Tools through AR15.com..). We got a credit report for me and the wife (all clean) and then cancelled every old card that was listed on the report and called some that we wern't too sure of. That was two months ago, and withing the last month the ammount of money that the banks and credit card companies are tossing our way in the form of MORE credit cards and cahs loans is insane! Last week the offers I received totaled out to $62,000! One card offered me $25,000!! My wife's offers are at $35,000!! And they wonder why people go into det. Sheese.
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