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Posted: 11/21/2008 12:54:15 AM EDT
Something tells me that Congress wont allow it, but its still interesting.

Link

Are China Vultures Circling General Motors and Chrysler?

Date posted: 11-20-2008
GUANGZHOU, China — The largest state-owned Chinese automakers may be poised to buy assets from General Motors and Chrysler, a government official said here.

According to the Chinese publication 21st Century Business Herald, state-owned companies such as Shanghai Auto and Dongfeng have the intention and the capability to acquire assets from the troubled Detroit automakers. The remarks were attributed to a senior official of China's Ministry of Industry and Information Technology, which regulates the auto industry.

Shanghai Auto, also known by the acronym SAIC, is China's largest automaker and is partnered with GM and Volkswagen. Dongfeng, the country's third largest carmaker, has no direct links with Chrysler, but has alliances with Kia, PSA Peugeot Citroën and Honda.

Earlier this week, Automotive News China reported that Chrysler's long-simmering deal with Chery Automobile appears to be disintegrating and that there now is little prospect that Chery will supply small cars to the U.S. company.

Inside Line says: At this point, nothing much would surprise us about the possible fate of GM and Chrysler. — Paul Lienert, Correspondent
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 12:55:42 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:06:19 AM EDT
yeah,....just what we need. some other country making shit for us.  What happened to good ole fashioned AMERICAN made.  Free capitalism.  Free to FAIL if thats what it takes.  Free to prosper.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:07:46 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:08:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/21/2008 1:09:58 AM EDT by Frost7]
NO. NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO.

I would rather they keep the UAW than go to the fucking Chinese government, and that's saying something.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:09:56 AM EDT
As much as lessons needed to be learned, we (the USA) can't afford to let another LARGE segment of our manufactoring sector go away.

Restructure, Bite the Bullet & Bear the Pain so Detroit can re-emerge stronger and able to compete internationally.

BIGGER_HAMMER
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:12:38 AM EDT
This editorial gives a bit more background.



Chinese Automakers may buy GM and Chrysler

by Bertel Schmitt
 

Chinese carmakers SAIC and Dongfeng have plans to acquire GM and Chrysler, China’s 21st Century Business Herald reports. LINK A National Enquirer the paper is not. It is one of China's leading business newspapers, with a daily readership over three million]. This newspaper cites a senior official of China’s Ministry of Industry and Information Technology– the state regulator of China’s auto industry– who dropped the hint that “the auto manufacturing giants in China, such as Shanghai Automotive Industry Corporation (SAIC) and Dongfeng Motor Corporation, have the capability and intention to buy some assets of the two crisis-plagued American automakers.” These hints are very often followed with quick action in the Middle Kingdom. The hints were dropped just a few days after the same Chinese government gave its auto makers the go-ahead to invest abroad. And why would they do that?

A take-over of a large overseas auto maker would fit perfectly into China’s plans. As reported before, China has realized that its export chances are slim without unfettered access to foreign technology. The brand cachet of Chinese cars abroad is, shall we say, challenged. The Chinese could easily export Made-in-China VWs, Toyotas, Buicks. If their joint venture partner would let them. The solution: Buy the joint venture partner. Especially, when he’s in deep trouble.

At current market valuations (GM is worth less than Mattel) the Chinese government can afford to buy GM with petty cash. Even a hundred billion $ would barely dent China’s more than $2t in currency reserves. For nobody in the world would buying GM and (while they are at it) Chrysler make more sense than for the Chinese. Overlap? What overlap? They would gain instant access to the world’s markets with accepted brands, and proven technology.

The editors of 21st Century Business Herald, obviously with input from higher-up, writes that Chinese industry must change and upgrade. China wants their factories to change from low-value-added manufacturing to technically innovative and financially-sound high-value-add industries. Says the paper: “It would be much easier now for strong Chinese automakers to go global by acquiring some assets of their U.S. counterparts in times of crisis.”

Deloitte & Touche sees a trend: “Chinese automakers can start with buying out the OEM projects and Chinese ventures of some global carmakers such as GM and Chrysler.”

The Chinese appear to have bigger plans than an accounting firm can imagine. 21st Century Business Herald acts and writes as if its already a done deal, and the beginning of more to come. “In the coming two years China is likely to see a few of its large Chinese automakers and other manufacturing enterprises set a precedent for achieving globalization by acquiring global companies, just like SAIC or Dongfeng’s possible acquisition of troubled GM or Chrysler.”

Just in case you missed it, the Shanghai Automotive Industry Corporation (SAIC) is China’s largest auto manufacturer. In 1984, the company entered a joint venture with Volkswagen. A decade later, SAIC entered a joint venture with General Motors. In 2007, SAIC bought the Nanjing Automobile Corporation, which had acquired British MG Rover in 2005.

Dongfeng Motor Corporation is a public company, although 70 percent of their shares are reported to be in government hands. They also are one of China’s Big Three. The company has numerous joint venture partners, such as Nissan, Peugeot-Citroen, Honda, and Kia. Dongfeng (which means “East Wind”) was founded at the behest of Mao Zedong himself in 1968.

Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:12:43 AM EDT
Will they start serving rice and noodles at NASCAR races?
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:17:32 AM EDT
Reading this I could only shake my head. We put ourselves in this situation. As a nation, we need to get ourselves out of this mess. Dissolving the unions would be a start.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:18:36 AM EDT
I can see it happening…

China, Japan and Russia are sitting on mountains of cash while the West goes tits up. What better time for them to buy up the West in the firesales we're currently holding?
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:30:26 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Citabria7GCBC:
yeah,....just what we need. some other country making shit for us.  What happened to good ole fashioned AMERICAN made.  Free capitalism.  Free to FAIL if thats what it takes.  Free to prosper.


Uhh...

Free capitalism says that if the Chinese auto company has the cash, then they can buy the stock....
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:31:14 AM EDT
Originally Posted By ikor:
Ya think the UAW will like working for $12 a day minus benefits?


Poetic. Justice.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:34:12 AM EDT
Think they'll use lead paint??


Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:34:19 AM EDT
.... that is all.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:43:04 AM EDT
The Chinese are the masters of reverse engineering so the cars will still look the same for a few years They make everything else we buy nowadays and they have made leaps and bounds with car manufacturing and design stealing. Welcome Chynsler, Fornese and Communist Motors

Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:43:09 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/21/2008 1:43:28 AM EDT by Akula_Hunter]
my first double tap

Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:44:44 AM EDT
US government should never allow that to happen.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:46:53 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/21/2008 1:47:25 AM EDT by Frost7]
Originally Posted By Dave_A:
Originally Posted By Citabria7GCBC:
yeah,....just what we need. some other country making shit for us.  What happened to good ole fashioned AMERICAN made.  Free capitalism.  Free to FAIL if thats what it takes.  Free to prosper.


Uhh...

Free capitalism says that if the Chinese auto company has the cash, then they can buy the stock....

Not really. That's not free capitalism either. A Chinese company saying, "I want an American company" and the Chinese government pouring money into their pockets to acquire it (and you KNOW what's where this capital is going to come from) is no different from the US government acting to prevent that.

Free capitalism would be a Chinese company buying an American company with money they actually made. It would also be the American company not being at risk of bankruptcy or buyout because they could toss unionized labor out on their asses and rehire without worrying about anything bigger than angry unions.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 2:19:17 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Frost7:
Originally Posted By Dave_A:
Originally Posted By Citabria7GCBC:
yeah,....just what we need. some other country making shit for us.  What happened to good ole fashioned AMERICAN made.  Free capitalism.  Free to FAIL if thats what it takes.  Free to prosper.


Uhh...

Free capitalism says that if the Chinese auto company has the cash, then they can buy the stock....

Not really. That's not free capitalism either. A Chinese company saying, "I want an American company" and the Chinese government pouring money into their pockets to acquire it (and you KNOW what's where this capital is going to come from) is no different from the US government acting to prevent that.

Free capitalism would be a Chinese company buying an American company with money they actually made. It would also be the American company not being at risk of bankruptcy or buyout because they could toss unionized labor out on their asses and rehire without worrying about anything bigger than angry unions.




Almost spot on... Chinese government money comes from the same place OUR Government's money comes from–– The People.
Let foreign capital, of any form, migrate here.  The ultimate reply will (can) be, when the body politic needs (in the name of strategic national interest), to cry "NATIONALIZE."  Just as the Saudis did with ARAMCO... The net effect of the 'Bailouts' is nationalization.  Government equity, as is now the case for much of the banking system, is nationalization.  BUT- all of that doesn't package well in the collective American perception of capitalism and the 'free market.'  There really isn't a "free market" in the truest form of meaning.  And, with company values down (and going lower daily)–– enter the bottom feeders- whoever they are...
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 2:36:19 AM EDT
It's a neat closed cycle…

China > WAL*MART > US Consumers > China > GM > US Consumers > China
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 2:43:24 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Frost7:
Originally Posted By Dave_A:
Originally Posted By Citabria7GCBC:
yeah,....just what we need. some other country making shit for us.  What happened to good ole fashioned AMERICAN made.  Free capitalism.  Free to FAIL if thats what it takes.  Free to prosper.


Uhh...

Free capitalism says that if the Chinese auto company has the cash, then they can buy the stock....

Not really. That's not free capitalism either. A Chinese company saying, "I want an American company" and the Chinese government pouring money into their pockets to acquire it (and you KNOW what's where this capital is going to come from) is no different from the US government acting to prevent that.

With the present stock price of many US car companies... I wouldn't be suprised to find that there's enough private equity in China (or Dubai) to buy one or more of them, W/O foreign govt assistance...


Free capitalism would be a Chinese company buying an American company with money they actually made. It would also be the American company not being at risk of bankruptcy or buyout because they could toss unionized labor out on their asses and rehire without worrying about anything bigger than angry unions.

Agreed on all parts... Fuck the UAW


Link Posted: 11/21/2008 2:47:16 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/21/2008 2:47:59 AM EDT by ultramagbrion]
Thats allowing capitalism to go a bit too far...........never gonna happen.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 2:59:24 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Dave_A:
Originally Posted By Frost7:
Originally Posted By Dave_A:
Originally Posted By Citabria7GCBC:
yeah,....just what we need. some other country making shit for us.  What happened to good ole fashioned AMERICAN made.  Free capitalism.  Free to FAIL if thats what it takes.  Free to prosper.


Uhh...

Free capitalism says that if the Chinese auto company has the cash, then they can buy the stock....

Not really. That's not free capitalism either. A Chinese company saying, "I want an American company" and the Chinese government pouring money into their pockets to acquire it (and you KNOW what's where this capital is going to come from) is no different from the US government acting to prevent that.

With the present stock price of many US car companies... I wouldn't be suprised to find that there's enough private equity in China (or Dubai) to buy one or more of them, W/O foreign govt assistance...


Free capitalism would be a Chinese company buying an American company with money they actually made. It would also be the American company not being at risk of bankruptcy or buyout because they could toss unionized labor out on their asses and rehire without worrying about anything bigger than angry unions.

Agreed on all parts... Fuck the UAW







IIRC, China's foreign currency reserves are @ $2 Trillion
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 3:18:38 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Frost7:
NO. NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO.

I would rather they keep the UAW than go to the fucking Chinese government, and that's saying something.


Can you say "Technology Flight"?
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 3:27:59 AM EDT
For years our Politicians have told us to embrace Globalization, So any job that could be outsourced overseas was . While the coporate elite profited it drained the wealth from the middle class, causing a bigger gap between the wealthy elite and the shrinking middle class.   If this trend continues we will become just like every other third world shithole .      

Link Posted: 11/21/2008 3:35:06 AM EDT
I wish china would just nuke us and get the ball rolling.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 3:37:27 AM EDT
Originally Posted By FORTFOTO:
I wish china would just nuke us and get the ball rolling.




No need, they will buy the U.S. one company at a time and eventually own us.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 3:40:26 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/21/2008 3:41:35 AM EDT by Naja]
The sooner people realize we are in an economic war the better.  There is no Free Market.  China is a top to bottom communist country with government control and influence in everything.  Most business are PLA (people liberation Army) backed and  run.

We are loosing the war look around you as there second great depression kicks in.  We were sold out under the guise of capitalism.  It only benefited a few at the top that is the truth not class envy.  Look at any chart or graph.  The one worlders set globalism up with various trade agreements NAFTA etc  as get on board or get run over.

Bankstas steal 5 trillion dollars and people are worried about supporting the last of our strategic heavy industry.  There is no free market in a world of slaves and slave wages.

http://www.forbes.com/wallstreet/2008/11/12/paulson-bernanke-fed-biz-wall-cx_lm_1112bailout.html?feed=rss_business_wallstreet
Washington's $5 Trillion Tab
Elizabeth Moyer, 11.12.08, 05:15 PM EST
Fighting the financial crisis has put the U.S. on the hook for some $5 trillion a report says. So far.

For all the fury over Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson's $700 billion emergency economic relief fund, it seems downright puny when compared to the running total of the government's response to the credit crisis.


According to CreditSights, a research firm in New York and London, the U.S. government has put itself on the hook for some $5 trillion, so far, in an attempt to arrest a collapse of the financial system.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 3:40:40 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Jacketch:
Will they start serving rice and noodles at NASCAR races?



Can envision the "Ching Dow" banner over the entrance and the 'Ching Dow Car".  
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 3:48:10 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Citabria7GCBC:
yeah,....just what we need. some other country making shit for us.  What happened to good ole fashioned AMERICAN made.  Free capitalism.  Free to FAIL if thats what it takes.  Free to prosper.


Unions.

Link Posted: 11/21/2008 3:50:55 AM EDT
Let'em have it! I would only wish the UAW on my worst enemy! Then we can quit buying GM, Ford and Chrysler because they are a Chinese company!
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 3:52:02 AM EDT
Originally Posted By vito113:
It's a neat closed cycle…

China > WAL*MART > US Consumers > China > GM > US Consumers > China



Selling us the rope to hang us.

Link Posted: 11/21/2008 3:54:06 AM EDT
The puppeteers are pulling our strings again with this shit.  Another tactic to sway public opinion.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 4:15:04 AM EDT
Originally Posted By kpel308:
[WillSmith]Oh, HELL no![/WillSmith]


Are you kidding?  If the PRC wants to buy those two stinkers, let them have at it.

It's actually the best solution to the problem.  The PRC is sitting on huge USD$ Reserves and they can actually afford the restructuring costs plus taking on the legacy cost obligations.

It's really Win-Win.

Link Posted: 11/21/2008 4:30:33 AM EDT
Originally Posted By vito113:
It's a neat closed cycle…

China > WAL*MART > US Consumers > China > GM > US Consumers > China


It's even more of a closed cycle than that.  GM has moved their Supply Base and Product Design and Development resources to the PRC and ROK.  The PRC is really the party that rightly should finance a Bail Out of GM (and Chrysler).  They're the future of GM.

But I agree with another poster.  This is just a rumor to stampede the lemmings.  The PRC is too smart to buy this when they already have the portion of the business they want (Product Engineering and Component Manufacturing).

Link Posted: 11/21/2008 4:32:14 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 4:43:38 AM EDT
The Chinese buying GM et al is both a status thing and a marketing thing. Status, because making GM a subsidiary of SIAC shows the world that China has succeeded America as the world's greatest industrial power (regardless of the truth, the symbolism is what is important here) and marketing, because whilst the world wont buy a SIAC car, they'll buy a GM. Lenovo is a good example. IBM ThinkPads were all Chinese built, but they were still IBM ThinkPads. Nothing changed when they became Lenovo ThinkPads. Most consumers never even noticed the change at the time. Now they don't remember IBM. This time round they'll be even smarter and wont even change the brand name.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 4:54:36 AM EDT
Originally Posted By kpel308:
[WillSmith]Oh, HELL no![/WillSmith]


/golf clap

Well played sir, well played.


That would be quite funny to see however...
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 4:58:39 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 5:00:19 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Frost7:
Originally Posted By Dave_A:
Originally Posted By Citabria7GCBC:
yeah,....just what we need. some other country making shit for us.  What happened to good ole fashioned AMERICAN made.  Free capitalism.  Free to FAIL if thats what it takes.  Free to prosper.


Uhh...

Free capitalism says that if the Chinese auto company has the cash, then they can buy the stock....

Not really. That's not free capitalism either. A Chinese company saying, "I want an American company" and the Chinese government pouring money into their pockets to acquire it (and you KNOW what's where this capital is going to come from) is no different from the US government acting to prevent that.

Free capitalism would be a Chinese company buying an American company with money they actually made. It would also be the American company not being at risk of bankruptcy or buyout because they could toss unionized labor out on their asses and rehire without worrying about anything bigger than angry unions.



What you wrote has nothing to do with it.

A buyer has the money, a seller has a product. They come to terms with each other and a sale is made.

Link Posted: 11/21/2008 5:38:42 AM EDT
Interesting.
I have been considering boycotting all amercan made vehicles due to the UAW lockstep support of socialism but this may allow me to actually consider a ford/chevy/mopar next time around.


Link Posted: 11/21/2008 5:40:12 AM EDT
Originally Posted By ikor:
Ya think the UAW will like working for $12 a day minus benefits?




HH

Link Posted: 11/21/2008 5:42:31 AM EDT


They're welcome to it!



You people remind me of those who said "the Japs are buying our country!!"

Link Posted: 11/21/2008 5:43:38 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 5:45:15 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Citabria7GCBC:
yeah,....just what we need. some other country making shit for us.  What happened to good ole fashioned AMERICAN made.  Free capitalism.  Free to FAIL if thats what it takes.  Free to prosper.


That is capitalism, FREE trade. I for one would love this idea, if of course the Chinese weren't red.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 5:46:35 AM EDT
Unions = Middleman

Middleman = Inefficiency

FAIL!

PS i DO LIKE FRIED RICE.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 5:47:24 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 5:49:16 AM EDT
Originally Posted By RileyS:
Originally Posted By Citabria7GCBC:
yeah,....just what we need. some other country making shit for us.  What happened to good ole fashioned AMERICAN made.  Free capitalism.  Free to FAIL if thats what it takes.  Free to prosper.


That is capitalism, FREE trade. I for one would love this idea, if of course the Chinese weren't red.


That's what makes it a perfect fit.  The UAW is so fired up for Socialism and State Owned Industry.  Well, there's a Country in the world that fits their ideology to a tee.

Marriage made in heaven as far as I'm concerned.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 5:53:36 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/21/2008 5:53:47 AM EDT by NeoProtege]
why are you guys against this? what happened to the free market your all for?

Link Posted: 11/21/2008 5:56:06 AM EDT
Congress won't allow it?  Ha, that's a good one!  You crack me up!  They already gave our banker bailout money to foreign banks, why would they care about us now?
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 5:58:20 AM EDT
UAW better wake up, China doesn't allow for unions
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