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Posted: 4/17/2006 9:57:57 AM EST
Ok that title is a shameless attention getter, but since you're here........

I saw a segment on 60 minutes last night about the growing gender imbalance in China's population (more males than females). I listened intermittently but the gist of the discussion centered around the "unintended consequences" of China's one child policy. Many families when faced with only being able to have one child, selectively abort female fetuses in favor of having male babies. This preference is not uncommon in many parts of the world.

The upshot of this is that there are now tens of millions of Chinese males who may never be able to find spouses and if the demographic tilt continues, this will just get worse and worse.

So, my question is: will the presence of so many young men without any prospects of marriage result in so much unrest that the Chinese government may be more inclined towards war as an outlet/distraction for the world's biggest case of "blue balls"?

Or will they just go gay?

Booming business for Bangkok's brothels?

Other permutations?

Discuss.............................
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 10:00:54 AM EST
The French (been gay for centuries) and the Chinese will join forces.


Link Posted: 4/17/2006 10:02:23 AM EST
They'll take a cue from Mexico and start sending illegal immigrants into the US for the butt sex Americans won't do.
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 10:02:45 AM EST
I heard that there is a huge market for importing wives from other countries in the region.

This could lead to a huge drop in their population as this generation runs its course.

Or the government will rethink the one child policy.
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 10:07:23 AM EST

Originally Posted By Brohawk:
I heard that there is a huge market for importing wives from other countries in the region.

This could lead to a huge drop in their population as this generation runs its course.

Or the government will rethink the one child policy.



This will help to destabilize their homogonous culture. I wonder if these foreign brides (and their children) have a 2nd class status if they are round eyed?

Bob

Link Posted: 4/17/2006 10:08:28 AM EST
In the past, one of the motives for war has been to aquire women. I'm interested in this angle.

Are there asian countries with an excess of females?

Link Posted: 4/17/2006 10:10:50 AM EST
They will just come here and steal our women

and the whores will make a killing

Invisi­blesoul
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 10:11:52 AM EST
[Last Edit: 4/17/2006 10:12:50 AM EST by st0newall]

Originally Posted By Captain_Picard:
In the past, one of the motives for war has been to aquire women. I'm interested in this angle.

Are there asian countries with an excess of females?




funny that you bring it up that way but there are concerns amongst some that a large percentage of young males of fighting age with no women make for a restive and dangerous world situation in china at a time of growing unrest throughout the world. throw in shortage in oil and other natural resourcs for a growing nation....

wont matter after 2012..
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 10:20:18 AM EST
It is almost as bad in India. The aborting of female babies is the sort of short-sighted behavior you would expect from lesser cultures.

GunLvr
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 10:24:03 AM EST
Sheboys.
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 10:25:05 AM EST

Originally Posted By Captain_Picard:
In the past, one of the motives for war has been to aquire women. I'm interested in this angle.

Are there asian countries with an excess of females?




YOu don't need to find a country with an excess of females. Just find a country with the natural resources you want, and after invasion it will have an excess of femals. (as the young males would have been killed in battle defending the country).
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 10:40:48 AM EST
Reminds me of a joke:

Old west, goldrush days. Little town springs up, thousands flock there to cash in. Guy who's new in town goes to the local saloon, orders a beer. Says to the bartender, "where can you get some action around here".

Bartender says, "well, the town spran up so fast, we're sorta short on women who aren't attached, and they ran the last hooker outta town on rail." Then he pauses for a moment, and says,"but we got this Chinaman..."

Guy says, "no way...I don't go for that shit". Barkeep says "ok".

Next month, guy comes back to town, asks the same question. Barkeep says still no women in town, but says "we still got the Chinaman". Once again, guy says "nope, I don't go for that shit".

This plays out every month. Finally the guy says, "ok...after 9 months w/o women, I'm thinking the Chinaman doesn't sound so bad now...but I want to make sure NO ONE else know about it." Barkeep says, "don't worry, there's only 8 people in town who need to know."

Guy says incredulously, "8 PEOPLE??"

Barkeep says, "yep...8 people...you, me, the Chinaman, and the 5 guys it takes to hold him down 'cos he don't go for that shit either".

Bada BING.
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 10:42:07 AM EST

Originally Posted By Forest:

Originally Posted By Captain_Picard:
In the past, one of the motives for war has been to aquire women. I'm interested in this angle.

Are there asian countries with an excess of females?




YOu don't need to find a country with an excess of females. Just find a country with the natural resources you want, and after invasion it will have an excess of femals. (as the young males would have been killed in battle defending the country).



Like Taiwan maybe?
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 10:42:17 AM EST

Originally Posted By st0newall:


wont matter after 2012..



Are you on the Mayan calendar?
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 10:47:20 AM EST

Originally Posted By GunLvrPHD:
It is almost as bad in India. The aborting of female babies is the sort of short-sighted behavior you would expect from lesser cultures.

GunLvr



What do all the excess hindu/sikh/muslim males do if they can't find wives? immigrate?
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 10:49:39 AM EST
I have seen this discussed before as a major rational for the Chinese to start a war, supposedly its tens and tens of millions of single men of fighting age.
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 10:53:27 AM EST

Originally Posted By Captain_Picard:

Originally Posted By Forest:

Originally Posted By Captain_Picard:
In the past, one of the motives for war has been to aquire women. I'm interested in this angle.

Are there asian countries with an excess of females?




YOu don't need to find a country with an excess of females. Just find a country with the natural resources you want, and after invasion it will have an excess of femals. (as the young males would have been killed in battle defending the country).



Like Taiwan maybe?



Taiwan, Korea, Panama etc. It really doesn't matter.
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 10:53:35 AM EST
What if China and India had a war with eachother for weeding out all the extra men?
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:01:12 AM EST

Originally Posted By Captain_Picard:

Originally Posted By GunLvrPHD:
It is almost as bad in India. The aborting of female babies is the sort of short-sighted behavior you would expect from lesser cultures.

GunLvr



What do all the excess hindu/sikh/muslim males do if they can't find wives? immigrate?



It is more a Hindu phenom than Muslim or even Sikh. And it hits the poorest men hardest--those are the guys without the skills or cash to migrate.

GunLvr
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:01:50 AM EST
I doubt if a lack of women would turn a normal hetero male into a practicing gay. Personally, coming from a hetero standpoint, the palm of my hand is more attractive than some guy's hairy ass.

But that's just me, maybe Chinese guy's are different, but I doubt it.
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:02:42 AM EST

Originally Posted By Shane333:
What if China and India had a war with eachother for weeding out all the extra men?



They wouldn't. That is the trap of the tiny family. If you only have one child, a single son, the entire family's future rides on that kid. A war is bad because lots of couples become childless. Unthinkable for a democracy, China's dictatorship could pull it off but it would cause much instability.
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:05:05 AM EST

Originally Posted By GunLvrPHD:
It is almost as bad in India. The aborting of female babies is the sort of short-sighted behavior you would expect from lesser cultures.

GunLvr



I wouldn't call India or China "lesser" cultures as they have been around far longer than European cultures and American culture... and guess what, they will still be here after this nation of ours commits suicide via immigrations and multiculturalism. The smartest thing to do is have just enough females being born that you increase your male population, the portion of the population that in most countries is actually useful in work, without sacrificing net population growth.
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:13:56 AM EST
Good!! Maybe thier society will die off before they can attack us.
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:16:16 AM EST

Originally Posted By Scar1:
I have seen this discussed before as a major rational for the Chinese to start a war, supposedly its tens and tens of millions of single men of fighting age.



ABSOLUTLY RIGHT..... The more men the more fighting machines.................
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:19:36 AM EST

Originally Posted By MBOFFICER:

Originally Posted By Scar1:
I have seen this discussed before as a major rational for the Chinese to start a war, supposedly its tens and tens of millions of single men of fighting age.



ABSOLUTLY RIGHT..... The more men the more fighting machines.................



still like to see them attack us... they don't have the logistical support necessary to launch an invasion of the US at any scale.
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:22:03 AM EST

Originally Posted By PreMed_Gunner:

Originally Posted By GunLvrPHD:
It is almost as bad in India. The aborting of female babies is the sort of short-sighted behavior you would expect from lesser cultures.

GunLvr



I wouldn't call India or China "lesser" cultures as they have been around far longer than European cultures and American culture... and guess what, they will still be here after this nation of ours commits suicide via immigrations and multiculturalism. The smartest thing to do is have just enough females being born that you increase your male population, the portion of the population that in most countries is actually useful in work, without sacrificing net population growth.



So fucking what. They've been around longer, which means they have no excuse for practicing caste and sex discrimination that we dropped decades or centuries ago. Nice to see you share their view on the role of women, too.
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:28:01 AM EST

Originally Posted By Fenian:
Reminds me of a joke:

Old west, goldrush days. Little town springs up, thousands flock there to cash in. Guy who's new in town goes to the local saloon, orders a beer. Says to the bartender, "where can you get some action around here".

Bartender says, "well, the town spran up so fast, we're sorta short on women who aren't attached, and they ran the last hooker outta town on rail." Then he pauses for a moment, and says,"but we got this Chinaman..."

Guy says, "no way...I don't go for that shit". Barkeep says "ok".

Next month, guy comes back to town, asks the same question. Barkeep says still no women in town, but says "we still got the Chinaman". Once again, guy says "nope, I don't go for that shit".

This plays out every month. Finally the guy says, "ok...after 9 months w/o women, I'm thinking the Chinaman doesn't sound so bad now...but I want to make sure NO ONE else know about it." Barkeep says, "don't worry, there's only 8 people in town who need to know."

Guy says incredulously, "8 PEOPLE??"

Barkeep says, "yep...8 people...you, me, the Chinaman, and the 5 guys it takes to hold him down 'cos he don't go for that shit either".

Bada BING.



Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:29:03 AM EST
[Last Edit: 4/17/2006 11:30:44 AM EST by PreMed_Gunner]

Originally Posted By mmx1:

Originally Posted By PreMed_Gunner:

Originally Posted By GunLvrPHD:
It is almost as bad in India. The aborting of female babies is the sort of short-sighted behavior you would expect from lesser cultures.

GunLvr



I wouldn't call India or China "lesser" cultures as they have been around far longer than European cultures and American culture... and guess what, they will still be here after this nation of ours commits suicide via immigrations and multiculturalism. The smartest thing to do is have just enough females being born that you increase your male population, the portion of the population that in most countries is actually useful in work, without sacrificing net population growth.



So fucking what. They've been around longer, which means they have no excuse for practicing caste and sex discrimination that we dropped decades or centuries ago. Nice to see you share their view on the role of women, too.



What, in general, men make better workers because they have greater physical endurance, equal intellectual capacity, and lack the ability of getting knocked up, thereby increasing workdays. They are not even practicing sex discrimination, they treat the women that are alive well, but they just don't "need" any more women at the current time.

EDIT: Thus, in countries that wish to achieve economic advantage over other countries, having few women born, and increasing the male percentage of the population is beneficial for atleast a few generations. Then you have them kill themselves off until the gender ratio is right again.
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:34:05 AM EST
there are bureaus is China that organise trips for Chinese (business)men to Europe and possibly US as well, to meet women. I saw a documentary about such a group who had a organized meeting with a bunch of Dutch women. The questions they asked those women were hilarious
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:37:25 AM EST

Originally Posted By Madis:
there are bureaus is China that organise trips for Chinese (business)men to Europe and possibly US as well, to meet women. I saw a documentary about such a group who had a organized meeting with a bunch of Dutch women. The questions they asked those women were hilarious



Are Dutch women that hard up?
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:38:15 AM EST
Couldn't happen to a nicer country!
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:40:37 AM EST

Originally Posted By Captain_Picard:
In the past, one of the motives for war has been to aquire women. I'm interested in this angle.

Are there asian countries with an excess of females?




Thailand should send all their ladyboys.
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:43:43 AM EST
They already have some state brothels. In a culture that does not value women as highly, they will simply increase the # of women "drafted" into the brothels for the benefit of the state. Rape camps are not a new concept to China.
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:45:17 AM EST

Originally Posted By PreMed_Gunner:

Originally Posted By GunLvrPHD:
It is almost as bad in India. The aborting of female babies is the sort of short-sighted behavior you would expect from lesser cultures.

GunLvr



I wouldn't call India or China "lesser" cultures as they have been around far longer than European cultures and American culture... and guess what, they will still be here after this nation of ours commits suicide via immigrations and multiculturalism. The smartest thing to do is have just enough females being born that you increase your male population, the portion of the population that in most countries is actually useful in work, without sacrificing net population growth.



PreMed_Gunner,

For many centuries China was a very real world superpower. However, they became complacent in their "cultural" superiority and sat on their laurels for many, many years.

The result was that they fell behind, badly. The West took some of their technological/scientific discoveries, such as black powder, and improved on them. The next thing you know a small country the size of Britain blockades and controls much of China. Later, Japan seizes control of massive areas of China.

Communism certainly didn't do China any favors in the race to catch up in technology or culture.

While I personally wouldn't use the term "lesser culture", China certainly has some catching up to do. Increases in communication technology have helped to some degree.
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:46:08 AM EST

Originally Posted By scrum:
They already have some state brothels. In a culture that does not value women as highly, they will simply increase the # of women "drafted" into the brothels for the benefit of the state. Rape camps are not a new concept to China.



That is a creepy thought. Very, very creepy.
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:52:18 AM EST

Originally Posted By Shane333:

Originally Posted By PreMed_Gunner:

Originally Posted By GunLvrPHD:
It is almost as bad in India. The aborting of female babies is the sort of short-sighted behavior you would expect from lesser cultures.

GunLvr



I wouldn't call India or China "lesser" cultures as they have been around far longer than European cultures and American culture... and guess what, they will still be here after this nation of ours commits suicide via immigrations and multiculturalism. The smartest thing to do is have just enough females being born that you increase your male population, the portion of the population that in most countries is actually useful in work, without sacrificing net population growth.



PreMed_Gunner,

For many centuries China was a very real world superpower. However, they became complacent in their "cultural" superiority and sat on their laurels for many, many years.

The result was that they fell behind, badly. The West took some of their technological/scientific discoveries, such as black powder, and improved on them. The next thing you know a small country the size of Britain blockades and controls much of China. Later, Japan seizes control of massive areas of China.

Communism certainly didn't do China any favors in the race to catch up in technology or culture.

While I personally wouldn't use the term "lesser culture", China certainly has some catching up to do. Increases in communication technology have helped to some degree.



If they manage to get their shit together, they will be a true force, economic and otherwise, to be reckoned with.

Who's going to supply all the cheap labor when the standard of living rises in China and India?
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 11:53:22 AM EST
Link Posted: 4/17/2006 12:06:55 PM EST
So they have a million (billion?) men all employed with the government (communist country) with no women. Does this sound like an invasion force into wating to happen or what?
Link Posted: 4/18/2006 8:44:02 AM EST

Originally Posted By PreMed_Gunner:
I wouldn't call India or China "lesser" cultures as they have been around far longer than European cultures and American culture... and guess what, they will still be here after this nation of ours commits suicide via immigrations and multiculturalism. The smartest thing to do is have just enough females being born that you increase your male population, the portion of the population that in most countries is actually useful in work, without sacrificing net population growth.



I disagree. Regarding their cultures, they seem to do best when isolated from the rest of the world and worst when exposed to it. They also ape western culture to an extent that would embarass most Americans. But their current policy and culture is self-destructive and short-sighted. In the modern world women can earn as much as men, so a female child can be as useful as a male child. In addition, a female child can bring the family more wealth because a Chinese or Indian girl can marry out of the country into the US or Europe.

GunLvr
Link Posted: 4/18/2006 10:15:29 AM EST
I thought the whole point of the exersize was to control there population growth so that in the future they will be able to feed their people.?


Also in your opinion what is the best way to control a population explosion? higher standard of living?
Link Posted: 4/18/2006 10:57:42 AM EST

Originally Posted By OregonShooter:
I thought the whole point of the exersize was to control there population growth so that in the future they will be able to feed their people.?


Also in your opinion what is the best way to control a population explosion? higher standard of living?



I'm not sure who your question is directed at but I'll put my two cents in. I think China's one child policy has had an effect on their population. According to the women Leslie Stall talked to on 60 minutes, China would have 300 million more people had they not instituted the one child program. I'm not necessarily endorsing it, but it seems to have worked.

A less draconian method might be through education (propaganda in China) and yes by economic development which raises the standard of living. In this country, highly educated and economically successful people tend not to have large broods of children. That can create problems of its own when immigrants (of all stripes) and folks on the lower end of the socioeconomic scale do just the opposite resulting in a growing imbalance and demographic drift.

The real question is what are the ramifications of having whole generations, tens of millions of young men who can't find wives? Unrest and possibly war IMHO.
Link Posted: 4/19/2006 10:19:58 AM EST

Originally Posted By OregonShooter:
I thought the whole point of the exersize was to control there population growth so that in the future they will be able to feed their people.?

Also in your opinion what is the best way to control a population explosion? higher standard of living?



What they forgot is that more people help to feed the population. With young workers and a growing economy you can buy food. With a shrinking population and economy and social unrest that will be difficult.

GunLvr
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