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Posted: 10/26/2004 2:39:57 PM EST
So the fuel pump died on my 96 burb. that sucks, and will get fixed, but the shop i took it to also said I should get the following things repaired as well:

Valve covers are leaking oil
Oil Filter adapter is leaking oil
Power steering high pressure hose is leaking.

Including the pump, tranny service (100k, time for it to get done), coolant service, oil change, and A/C recharge, it's looking towards $1600.

Any advice? I'm tempted to just get it all done.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 2:49:21 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/26/2004 2:52:55 PM EST by chrome1]

Originally Posted By ProfessorEvil:
So the fuel pump died on my 96 burb. that sucks, and will get fixed, but the shop i took it to also said I should get the following things repaired as well:

Valve covers are leaking oil
Oil Filter adapter is leaking oil
Power steering high pressure hose is leaking.

Including the pump, tranny service (100k, time for it to get done), coolant service, oil change, and A/C recharge, it's looking towards $1600.

Any advice? I'm tempted to just get it all done.



I'd do everything but the Tranny service ..... GM trannys have a 80% failure rate at 100K miles whether you service them or not .

ETA

Intake gaskets are also a high fail rate item on that engine and year also , but you have probably
had that done already
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:05:22 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/26/2004 3:06:18 PM EST by Dragracer_Art]
Get the bad fuel pump replaced, and consider doing the power steering hose now, or at least soon.

The rest of the "suggested service" is just that... A shop trying to sell work.

Look at the "oil leaks" in question... Often times if a shop is trying to sell work, they will look really hard for problems that really aren't problems. A tiny bit of oil seepage will be labled as a needed repair. Most of the time, simply snugging down the bolts will stop an oil leak. The newer Chevy motors (87-up) use a silicone valve cover gasket, and they last damn near forever. Tighten down the 4 valve cover bolts, and degrease the engine. Check it again in a week or two...
4WD Chevy trucks use an offset oil filter adapter and a compact oil filter. Every time the filter is replaced, it dumps oil on the driveshaft and undercarriage. This is often sold as an oil leak to unsuspecting customers...

A general rule of thumb is this...
Whenever a shop trys to sell you a laundry list of shit that's completely unrelated to your original complaint or problem, you should be very suspicious... Yes, you very well may need the suggested items, but don't let the mechanic scare you into an impulsive "panic repair"...
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:09:54 PM EST
Find a new mechanic......................I own a 96 and a 95 replaced fuel pumps in both under $250 each time, as for the other work..............be careful with the transmission. I'd get a second opinion on that one. The others you can fix yourself, by the way I never heard of an oil filter adapter
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:13:12 PM EST
Stop spending so much time here and learn to spin a wrench?

$1,600??? TO FIX A TRUCK????

I do believe you'd get your ass kicked for spending that around my "associates'

$1,600 will get you:

A VERY good set of Craftsman tools

PLUS all the parts you need for your repairs.

Maybe you should STAY in Kommiforniaican'tfixmyowncarastan. You blend well.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:13:42 PM EST
$1600?!?!? You can't be fucking serious...do it yourself for a quarter of that.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:13:58 PM EST
I said no to most everything but the fuel pump for now. Thanks.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:14:12 PM EST
Go with the fuel pump, and replace the gaskets and hose yourself.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:15:04 PM EST

Originally Posted By ProfessorEvil:
I said no to most everything but the fuel pump for now. Thanks.




What about the reach around? The $1,600 did include a reach around. RIGHT?!?!
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:15:09 PM EST

Originally Posted By nationwide:
Stop spending so much time here and learn to spin a wrench?

$1,600??? TO FIX A TRUCK????

I do believe you'd get your ass kicked for spending that around my "associates'

$1,600 will get you:

A VERY good set of Craftsman tools

PLUS all the parts you need for your repairs.

Maybe you should STAY in Kommiforniaican'tfixmyowncarastan. You blend well.



AMEN!
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:15:38 PM EST

Originally Posted By 19suburban96:
by the way I never heard of an oil filter adapter



The 4WD trucks, and any that have an external oil cooler, use an oil filter adapter. It goes between the filter and the block. Normally on a 2WD Chevy V8, the oil filter mounts vertical. On 4WD's, the driveshaft runs right under that part of the engine, requiring an adapter to turn the filter horizontally. On trucks with external oil coolers, the adapter is where the plumbing (oil lines) connect...
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:17:38 PM EST

Originally Posted By nationwide:
Stop spending so much time here and learn to spin a wrench?

$1,600??? TO FIX A TRUCK????

I do believe you'd get your ass kicked for spending that around my "associates'

$1,600 will get you:

A VERY good set of Craftsman tools

PLUS all the parts you need for your repairs.



And space and knowledge? Those aren't cheap to acquire either

I can spin a wrench. I don't know all the intricacies of tooling around an engine, though. that's why I come here and ask.


Maybe you should STAY in Kommiforniaican'tfixmyowncarastan. You blend well.


I don't. I didn't say "duh...uh..ok" up front. So I'm moving anyways. just want to make sure my ride outta here gets me to there.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:19:28 PM EST

Originally Posted By Dragracer_Art:

Originally Posted By 19suburban96:
by the way I never heard of an oil filter adapter



The 4WD trucks, and any that have an external oil cooler, use an oil filter adapter. It goes between the filter and the block. Normally on a 2WD Chevy V8, the oil filter mounts vertical. On 4WD's, the driveshaft runs right under that part of the engine, requiring an adapter to turn the filter horizontally. On trucks with external oil coolers, the adapter is where the plumbing (oil lines) connect...





Ok now I know what he means.........thanks for the explanation. My 96 is 2wd 3/4 ton and I've got the extra oil cooling setup. Just thought maybe someone was trying to sell him a load of shit
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:19:33 PM EST
FWIW...

If it were "ME", I would do all the repairs myself...

The fuel pump really isn't a big deal to replace. (I did my '94 Suburban this Summer)
The pump mounts in the tank. Just be sure to run the tank down near empty before attempting it...42 gallons of gas is mighty heavy...
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:22:22 PM EST

Originally Posted By Dragracer_Art:
FWIW...

If it were "ME", I would do all the repairs myself...

The fuel pump really isn't a big deal to replace. (I did my '94 Suburban this Summer)
The pump mounts in the tank. Just be sure to run the tank down near empty before attempting it...42 gallons of gas is mighty heavy...


Been there, done that ('01 Suburban)
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:23:44 PM EST
For reference, I live in a snooty part of town in an apartment where they frown on this sort of thing. Plus, it doesn't run right now. I don't have the time till this weekend, so I'd have to let it sit somewhere once I got it towed (away from the shop), and then this weekend, spend the time fiddling with it, which I've never done before. Now I *might* be able to find someone to help me, but that's not a for sure thing either. So in short, I'd be wary of pulling something like a fuel pump on my own, without an extensive set of tooling and help. Valve covers...I can manage. they look easy enough. Open hood, unscrew, pull gaskets, line new gaskets, add sealant, remount valve covers.

I am NOT a car guy by trade, hobby, or other. I don't have the huge set of tools and space to work on them, I don't have the skills to rebuild a small block chevy in my spare time. Ok?
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:26:34 PM EST

Originally Posted By ProfessorEvil:

I can spin a wrench. I don't know all the intricacies of tooling around an engine, though. that's why I come here and ask.


I don't. I didn't say "duh...uh..ok" up front. So I'm moving anyways. just want to make sure my ride outta here gets me to there.



Dude, I'm just soooo yankin yer chain!

Wrenchin on a car is no big deal. Space? I'll work on my truck wherever. I did the front brakes on the 'burb in the parking lot at work.

Working on your own car is alot like dealing with a women:

You start off thinking you're ready to tackle the job successfully, in time for fun later.

Mid-way through, you realize you're in over your head, but it's easier to finish than to just put it all back together.

The car (like a woman) really isn't yours until it's drawn blood. Either accidentally or on puropse.

In the end, your drained, spent more $$$ than you planed, but are ready to go tomorrow. And that's all that counts!!
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:30:25 PM EST
The fuel pump is the biggest bitch. If you've already done that then the rest of what you described is cake. You might have $400 in the whole thing doing it yourself.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:31:52 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/26/2004 3:33:13 PM EST by ProfessorEvil]

Originally Posted By nationwide:
The car (like a woman) really isn't yours until it's drawn blood. Either accidentally or on puropse.



I spilled gas in my eye replacing the fuel filter. that sucked. Somehow the cross frame member that was above my head was downhill from the fuel line dripping (sure didn't look like it, but ok). And conveniently, it splashed right above the top of my safety glasses, off the inside of the glasses and into my freakin' eyeball.
Oh, and I cut the backside of my hand on something doing the plugs. The freaking sheet metal crap around them is just there to fuck with you, i swear.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:34:53 PM EST

Originally Posted By ProfessorEvil:

Originally Posted By nationwide:
The car (like a woman) really isn't yours until it's drawn blood. Either accidentally or on puropse.



I spilled gas in my eye replacing the fuel filter. that sucked. Somehow the cross frame member that was above my head was downhill from the fuel line dripping (sure didn't look like it, but ok). And conveniently, it splashed right above the top of my safety glasses, off the inside of the glasses and into my freakin' eyeball.
Oh, and I cut the backside of my hand on something doing the plugs. The freaking sheet metal crap around them is just there to fuck with you, i swear.



Welcome to the club.............................you havn't lived till you've changed a tranny with a car on ramps, laying in the snow, with your wifes stripped down lamps for lighting
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:36:18 PM EST

Originally Posted By 19suburban96:
Welcome to the club.............................you havn't lived till you've changed a tranny with a car on ramps, laying in the snow, with your wifes stripped down lamps for lighting





I may miss that one, but i'll keep a good thought in my mind for it someday.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:36:56 PM EST

Originally Posted By ProfessorEvil:
[And conveniently, it splashed right above the top of my safety glasses, off the inside of the glasses and into my freakin' eyeball.
Oh, and I cut the backside of my hand on something doing the plugs. The freaking sheet metal crap around them is just there to fuck with you, i swear.




Yes... YES!!!

nationwide can sense your Gearhead Kung-fu is starting to gain strength!!

You must study under the masters, Checker, Schuk's, and Kragen.

They will help you on your path to enlightenment!
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:38:58 PM EST
FWIW...

When I lived in Tempe, AZ my '93 GMC 3/4 ton pickup left me sit on the interstate when the fuel pump took a shit. After my brother towed it with his '94 Z-28 for about 3 miles, we stopped and tried to start the truck again... Guess what ? It started right up and ran long enough to get back to our apartment complex (Foxfire Apts near ASU).
The next day I pulled the truck up on to the curb and dropped the tank right there on the parking lot. I replaced the fuel pump, and drove back to PA 2 weeks later.

Off the top of my head, I think the only tools you'll need to do the pump is:

a screwdriver for the hose clamps on the tank filler neck hose
a deep socket, extension and ratchet for the tank straps
a friend or a floor jack to carry the weight of the tank
a few wrenches for the fuel lines
a hammer to tap the pump retaining nut
penetrating oil

Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:55:18 PM EST
Those oil filter adapters are notorious leakers. Somebody bypassed the oil cooler on my pickup and removed the adapter instead of fixing the leak. The 2 hoses get blamed and people waste money on them instead of buying a new adapter seal kit. The guy I bought my Burb from said he couldn't find the right seal. The parts counter guy didn't even look it up, he just went and got it from the back! The kit is about $14 and has all of the gaskets and o-rings that are needed to stop the leak. My Suburban has been drip free ever since I installed the kit. You can do it easy man. Just need the proper size wrenchs for the nuts on the ends of the cooler lines and basic tools to drop the adapter from the block. Good luck

Also the guy who mentioned that the valve covers have silicon gaskets that last forever is 100% right. Just tighten the bolts a little or replace the grommets around the pvc fittings which might be leaking. Changing the gaskets can be a pain and is probably not neccessary.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 4:10:43 PM EST
Quality tools are an investment that, so long as you have any work ethic, will pay off 1000% over time.

Most of the work is not difficult, with a decent manual you can do it all. Yeah it gets frustrating at times, but as you go a little experience makes things easier.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 5:04:12 PM EST

Originally Posted By chrome1:
I'd do everything but the Tranny service ..... GM trannys have a 80% failure rate at 100K miles whether you service them or not .



Not from my experience. Where did you get this number?
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 5:10:31 PM EST

Originally Posted By Dragracer_Art:
FWIW...

If it were "ME", I would do all the repairs myself...

The fuel pump really isn't a big deal to replace. (I did my '94 Suburban this Summer)
The pump mounts in the tank. Just be sure to run the tank down near empty before attempting it...42 gallons of gas is mighty heavy...



I agree, theyre trying to bleed you, these are simple repairs that you can do, buy a Chiltons book and it will tell you everything you need to know and be weary of the transmissions Chevy trans dont last much past 100k mine has almost 200k BUT it has been rebuilt to handle 500 HP, extra clutch hardened sprag etc.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 5:15:32 PM EST

Originally Posted By ProfessorEvil:
So the fuel pump died on my 96 burb. that sucks, and will get fixed, but the shop i took it to also said I should get the following things repaired as well:

Valve covers are leaking oil
Oil Filter adapter is leaking oil
Power steering high pressure hose is leaking.

Including the pump, tranny service (100k, time for it to get done), coolant service, oil change, and A/C recharge, it's looking towards $1600.

Any advice? I'm tempted to just get it all done.


That's nuts.

Fuel Pump $25-50
Power steering high-pressure hose $25-50
Valve cover gaskets ~$25
Tranny filter & fluid ~$40
Oil & filter change $25
AC service - winter, skip it.

You're talking about $140-$190, and an easy day of wrenching. And as others have mentioned - degrease and tightening may resolve the leaks.

Unless the maintenance is key to keeping your vehicle IN-warranty, it's insane and extraordinarily wasteful to spend an extra $1400 dollars for LABOR for something a person with a minimum set of tools, a tiny bit of skill and opposable thumbs can do.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 5:17:14 PM EST
When did Chevy small blocks go from mechanical fuel pumps on the block to electric pumps in the tank? It's been awhile since I worked on one. In fact I didn't know you could make a Chevys valve covers quit leaking oil over 10,000 miles.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 5:19:54 PM EST

Originally Posted By Pangea:
When did Chevy small blocks go from mechanical fuel pumps on the block to electric pumps in the tank? It's been awhile since I worked on one. In fact I didn't know you could make a Chevys valve covers quit leaking oil over 10,000 miles.



When they ditched carbs for TBI.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 5:36:44 PM EST

Originally Posted By DriftPunch:

Originally Posted By chrome1:
I'd do everything but the Tranny service ..... GM trannys have a 80% failure rate at 100K miles whether you service them or not .



Not from my experience. Where did you get this number?



Just my experience, and although it is a FWD transaxle---original transaxle was rebuilt for a Pontiac GTP at about 62K miles (busted solenoid and slipped badly)---and was replaced (blown front seal and also was slipping badly) at 80K miles with a Goodwrench reman with 50K warranty--and driven easy--not hard at all....I was very disappointed to say the least.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 5:43:13 PM EST
Unless the tranny fluid is very dark and smells burnt, leave it alone. A fluid change (uless burnt) will almost certainly cause the tranny to fail shortly thereafter.

New fluid contains some addities that tenfd to cause old seals to swell badly. Burnt fluid makes it worth the risk but good fluid does not. Suit yourself!

Balavnce of the posts I agree with.

$1600 is outrageous.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 7:19:29 PM EST

Originally Posted By DriftPunch:

Originally Posted By chrome1:
I'd do everything but the Tranny service ..... GM trannys have a 80% failure rate at 100K miles whether you service them or not .



Not from my experience. Where did you get this number?



From my customer service records maybe ??

Seriously , My shop does at least one 4L60/4L80 GM tranny a month . I can remember
doing 3 in one week not long ago , and like it or not most fail within 20,000 miles of 100K .

Technician's Credo: I didn't build it , I didn’t buy it , and I didn’t wear it out . I just
fix what’s in front of me and move on .
Link Posted: 10/27/2004 12:57:23 AM EST

Originally Posted By chrome1:

Originally Posted By DriftPunch:

Originally Posted By chrome1:
I'd do everything but the Tranny service ..... GM trannys have a 80% failure rate at 100K miles whether you service them or not .



Not from my experience. Where did you get this number?



From my customer service records maybe ??

Seriously , My shop does at least one 4L60/4L80 GM tranny a month . I can remember
doing 3 in one week not long ago , and like it or not most fail within 20,000 miles of 100K .

Technician's Credo: I didn't build it , I didn’t buy it , and I didn’t wear it out . I just
fix what’s in front of me and move on .



Not doubting your claims, but my experience so far has shown the opposite... I guess it depends on what part of the country your in, and how the trucks are used. A buddy of mine had his '94 1/2 ton 2wd trans rebuilt at 165000 miles. My '94 3/4 ton 454 powered Suburban has 225000 miles on it and still runs like a champ. Motor and trans have never been out. My '97 Dually was used HARD and never had any tranny problems. I towed 8000-12000 lbs regularly with it, and one time went coast to coast with 11,000 lbs behind me. After 100,000 miles I sold the truck. Had ZERO trouble with it. (Other than warped rotors)

I worked in a Chrysler shop that had only 4 Techs. We had a tranny job, or a rear diff job at least once a week. That doesn't mean they are all junk...

Just my two cents...
Link Posted: 10/27/2004 3:37:10 AM EST

Originally Posted By MickeyMouse:
Unless the tranny fluid is very dark and smells burnt, leave it alone. A fluid change (uless burnt) will almost certainly cause the tranny to fail shortly thereafter.

New fluid contains some addities that tenfd to cause old seals to swell badly. Burnt fluid makes it worth the risk but good fluid does not. Suit yourself!

Balavnce of the posts I agree with.

$1600 is outrageous.




Sounds about right to me. I just changed the fluid in my 700R4 before going on vacation and the damn thing had big problems 2000 miles away from home. It never showed signs of trouble before that and had 40,000 miles on a complete rebuild with heavy duty parts. We limped home with no overdrive and the thing making the "1-2" shift at about 5000 rpm's. After getting home it went out within 30 miles with no gear working at all. I changed the filter and fluid twice on the way back in hotel parking lots to get the chunks of metal and debris out of the pan/filter.

My van at work has 55,000 miles and is on its 4th!! 700R4. Ya we do alot of stopping and starting. I used to have an Astro Van with 50,000 on it that, yup had a 700R4 go bad.
I've heard that the 4L80E is the way to go if you can make the conversion.
I hope you don't have one of these weak POS's.
Link Posted: 10/27/2004 6:02:17 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/27/2004 6:06:41 AM EST by GunLvrPHD]
The AC/Delco fuel pump can cost a lot--at least $200 and possibly more. I have heard that the aftermarket fuel pumps are usually pretty lousy. I'd be pretty happy if my shop replaced it for $500-600. You can do it yourself but I'd hate to have to take off the tank by myself.

Once it's replaced make sure to change your fuel filter fairly often. I'm trying to do mine every 5,000 miles.

Also if your fuel pump ever dies on the road, I have heard hitting the fuel tank a few times with a rubber mallet can get it running long enough to get home.

GunLvr
Link Posted: 10/27/2004 6:22:10 AM EST
Get the fuel pump replaced since you can't do it. Then buy a good degreaser, the industrial strength soap kind, and drive to the car wash with lots of quarters. Bring a squirt bottle from under the sink that windex comes in or something similiar to mix the soap in at about 50/50. While the engine is still hot, soak in down good from top to bottom by leaning under it to spray all the engine and under hood. Let it soak about 15 minutes then hit it again. Now clean the hell out of it with the wash on rinse to make it look new and get all the grease,oil, and dust off. Don't spray in the air cleaner or distributor if it still has one. Have a can of WD-40 to spray in the distributor if it gets wet. Now drive about 30 minutes to see if you really have any leaks. Over time a small leak can look like everything on the engine is slinging out shit like the Valdez. You may only have a very small leak that can be fixes for less than $50. Do you ever need to add oil or power steering fluid? I clean all my vehicles at least once a month just to be able to see leaks when they happen and it is a lot easier to work on a clean engine.
Link Posted: 10/27/2004 2:28:23 PM EST
Ok, now they're telling me the fuel sender is damaged and needs replacing as well.
Link Posted: 10/27/2004 6:07:22 PM EST
The fuel sender probably should be replaced. They tend to suck on GM vehicles. I'd probably do it if it were my Suburban.

GunLvr
Link Posted: 10/27/2004 6:14:40 PM EST
The fuel pump can be a real bitch, especially if the tankis full , other than that everything is a easy fix.............Do it yourself and save your self a $1000.00
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