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Posted: 12/24/2005 7:46:19 AM EDT
[#1]
+1 |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 7:50:40 AM EDT
[#2]
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Posted: 12/24/2005 7:51:57 AM EDT
[#3]
Say it with me: "beauty." |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 7:59:18 AM EDT
[#4]
Hey, in 1915 THEY were the fighters and WE sat around with our thumbs up our asses without a viable military.
Things change. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 8:04:33 AM EDT
[#5]
"Hank Aaron. Beauty." "Can he hit?" |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 8:06:47 AM EDT
[#6]
If the conservatives get in on January 23rd you will see a BIG CHANGE!!
The CPC will Bring back the AIRBORNE Division Buy Stategic Lift Aircraft ( C-17??) Build 3 ARMED HEAVY Icebreakers to monitor OUR northern Territories. Instsll a sensor net under the Northern ICE Shelf to detect intruder submarines. Yes some of the "intruder" subs are American but I cannot blame you at the moment as we cannot defend our own norther frontier. However soon we will be able, to. VOTE CPC!!!!!!!!! |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 8:07:31 AM EDT
[#7]
fixed it for you 
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Posted: 12/24/2005 8:17:14 AM EDT
[#8]
That was 90 YEARS AGO ! Try to keep up with current events hmmkay ? |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 8:20:25 AM EDT
[#9]
They where in both world wars from the start...
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Posted: 12/24/2005 8:22:05 AM EDT
[#10]
Lots of Canuks here in Afghanistan as well.
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Posted: 12/24/2005 8:25:13 AM EDT
[#11]
United Nations operation , Germans and French too. None of whom would be there as US allies. Canada the peacekeeper? A myth that should die By SUNIL RAM Globe and Mail Update The myth of Canada as the great peacekeeper is one of the more fanciful delusions under which Canadians live. It's time to let the myth die. Peacekeeping, for Canadians, is indelibly linked with Lester Pearson, who as secretary of state for external affairs won the 1957 Nobel Peace Prize for his concept of armed peacekeeping - specifically, the United Nations Emergency Force, which was deployed to end the Suez crisis. As Pearsonism permeated the psyche of average Canadians, a national myth was born: Canada as compassionate, middle-power peacekeeper. On the surface, the myth seems true. According to the Department of National Defence, Canada has been involved in more than 40 UN and non-UN sponsored peacekeeping missions (some sources put the number as high as 90) since 1948. More than 100,000 personnel have been committed to these missions, during which time the Canadian Forces has suffered more than 100 casualties. The cost to the taxpayer has been tens of billions of dollars. Added to these figures is a much-ballyhooed government statement that Canada has been involved in every peacekeeping mission. According to a 1999 DND survey, 92 per cent of Canadians "believe it is important for the CF to be able to protect human rights in fragile democracies." In fact, even in the glare of the Somalia and Rwanda conflicts, Canadians see Canada's military role as that of a benign peacekeeper rather than a fighter. But the perception withers when confronted with facts. Early in 2002, Paul Heinbecker, Canada's then-ambassador to the UN, asked members of the Canadian Institute of International Affairs where Canada ranked as a peacekeeper. Most of the audience assumed that Canada was among the top 10 nations. Mr. Heinbecker revealed that Canada was 31st. By March of 2004, Canada had slipped to 38th. The myth runs counter to the actual history of Canadian military operations since the end of the Cold War: the 1991 Persian Gulf war; the 1993 battle of the Medek pocket in Croatia; the 1999 invasion of Kosovo; and Afghanistan in 2003. Yet, the myth of Canada as peacekeeper has been reiterated by many of the respondents to the 2003 federal initiative known as the Canadian Foreign Policy Dialogue. Most citizens who took part in the project put a huge emphasis on Canadian peacekeeping. Sean Maloney of the Royal Military College says: "Canadians are ceaselessly inundated with the ideology that Canada doesn't fight wars, that Canadians are peacekeepers ....."Policy emphasis on peacekeeping, meanwhile, perpetuates the myth that Canada's military mainly does peacekeeping, that we are good at it and that we gain international respect for it. Are we good at peacekeeping? No, we're not. Canadian soldiers do a superb job with what limited support they get from Ottawa and DND. But this is rarely co-ordinated. It's the professionalism of the troops rather than a solid, integrated policy that has allowed Canadian governments to maintain the peacekeeping myth. Canada's rating of 38th in the world in 2004 is based on actual military and civilian police personnel commitments. Critics of this rating argue that it's not the quantity but the quality that counts, but such a perspective is ill-informed. Consider the actual numbers of personnel committed to missions: for most, Canada has commited few personnel. Between 1948 and 2003, there have only been seven UN or non-UN missions to which Canada sent more than 1,000 troops. Canada didn't contribute anyone to another seven missions. For 31 missions, we committed fewer than 100 military and civilian police (many of these missions had fewer than 10 people). Only 19 missions had between 100 and 900 personnel. After the mid-1990s, Ottawa policy dictated that Canada would only commit to specific missions rather than all UN peacekeeping missions. In 2002, the year the bulk of Canada's deployable military capability was in Bosnia-Herzegovina as part of NATO's Stabilization Force, Canada had only 314 UN peacekeepers. During the same year, Bangladesh committed 6,029, India 2,843, Ghana 2,575, and Nepal 1,111. That year, Canada represented less than 1 per cent of the nearly 48,000 troops committed by nations for UN peacekeeping. Nor can it be argued that Canada was busy in the Balkans. Of the nearly 40,000 troops committed directly or indirectly to the region by NATO, Canada's force was less than 1 per cent of the total. As of June of 2004 - thanks to our short-term commitment in Haiti - 726 Canadian personnel were on UN missions. In that same time, Brazil had committed 1,351 troops, Germany 3,306, India 2,928, South Africa 2,365 and Uruguay 1,908. One reason for this disparity is that many developing nations use UN deployments to generate hard currency. The UN pays countries that commit to its missions $1,000 (U.S.) per UN soldier per month, and these soldiers still take home their regular pay. Clearly, given Canada's limited commitments, we cannot claim to be the world's leading peacekeeper. In terms of UN operations, countries such as Ghana or India or the Scandinavian states are far superior in terms of their long-term commitments and the professionalism of their troops. Unlike Canada, countries such as Norway and Australia have integrated foreign, defence and aid policies when pursuing the peacekeeping paradigm. The fundamental problem for Canada is that the conceptualization of Pearsonian peacekeeping is an anachronism. True, the number of boots on the ground is a major factor in effective peacekeeping and peace enforcement. Experience has shown that the presence of a robust combat-capable force does deter violence and allows non-governmental organizations the protection they need to do their work. As retired major-general Lewis MacKenzie has noted, modern peacekeeping missions must have well-trained, equipped and armed soldiers who may be required to kill to protect themselves and others. In the post-Cold War era, peacekeeping is more about peace enforcement; at its extreme, it might be thought of as war by other means. Canadian policy simply has not adapted to this reality, and this has very much been driven by public opinion. The public clings to the notion that our peacekeeping role has brought us international respect. But there's no evidence that Canada's limited commitments to peacekeeping have any effect on how other states deal with us. Peacekeeping has always been an ad hoc process for the military and the government. The most recent folly related to the peacekeeping myth is the Liberal government's announcement that it would create a 5,000-person "UN peacekeeping brigade." The only way this can be achieved without more funding, or raising the manning levels of the Canadian Forces, would be to strip the navy and the air force of personnel. Even then, it is doubtful that more than 1,000 to 2,000 troops of dubious peacekeeping quality could be committed. What the government of Paul Martin has proposed is akin to what the Germans were forced to do toward the end of the Second World War as they ran out of combat troops: They put ill-equipped air force and navy personnel into front-line roles. For its part, the UN will not care. At the end of the day, Bangladesh or Ghana can still put more boots on the ground than Canada. Sunil Ram is a professor of military history and land warfare at American Military University, where he also teaches peacekeeping. He is also the author of the UNITAR training program for peacekeeping in the Balkans and is currently revising the UNITAR program on the modern history of peacekeeping. A former Canadian soldier, he holds a UN Global Citizen Award for furthering awareness of peace and peacekeeping. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servl...BNStory/Front/ |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 8:30:08 AM EDT
[#12]
Canada has been and still is a faithful friend and ally, no matter what the present political climate indicates.
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Posted: 12/24/2005 8:30:53 AM EDT
[#13]
Good luck brother! Happy holidays.
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Posted: 12/24/2005 8:31:33 AM EDT
[#14]
My mother, who's still holds Canadian citizenship, still accuses us of waiting to see who would win before getting into WWII. The Canadians were in from the git-go. Of course, they were probably still still a British colony at the time. (I'm a little fuzzy on my Canadian history.)
I don't know how they got to be such pansies in the last 60 years but they really are. Almost all of my family is Canadian, so I know. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 8:38:37 AM EDT
[#15]
Check your facts, they operate as part of ISAF, which is a NATO operation. The UN is not in charge of jack shit here except handing out bags of food from time to time. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 8:41:54 AM EDT
[#16]
Bullshit. No one that is up on current events can hold that view. If they were a faithfull friend and ally they would have troops in THE central war on terror in Iraq. Their politicians would not be winning elections based on bashing the US .gov and it's policies on the WOT. The El Salvadorians have had more troops in OIF Iraq than Canada. Think about it. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 8:50:46 AM EDT
[#17]
Before you sit there and criticize someone else view on current events, brush up yourself, and learn the true nature of Canadian and NATO involvment in Afghanistan. The Canadians have more troops here than any other of our allies, or very close to it. I haven't seen any El-Salvadorns here yet. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 9:33:22 AM EDT
[#18]
NATO's website says NATO troops in Afghanistan number about 8000 Canada has about 992 , Germany 1800, France 772 . Turkey 862. etc. US around 18,000. NATO fact sheet Feb '05 I never said El-Salvadorans were in Afghanistan. I said Iraq. How many Canadians are in Iraq now ?. I can't seem to find any in the news. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 9:33:37 AM EDT
[#19]
Before you counter-criticize you should re-read what he wrote; he did not make any comments about Canadian troop levels in Afghanistan but Iraq. And he is correct. I for one have no problem with Canada sitting out Iraq. They don't want to do it, fine. They are just going to have to live with the fact that their lack of contribution means that they will not have a say in the future Iraq. I have a problem, just like weptak, of Canadians voting for anti-American candidates because they are anti-american. Canada's political views are very much European and it shows. I do not consider Canada an ally at this time. Not as bad as the french, but getting there. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 9:35:27 AM EDT
[#20]
What? Canadians have broiled over NORAD for decades. There are active groups within their government and think-tanks that have been lobbying to get Canada out of NORAD. Canadian funding and other contributions to NORAD is at an all-time low. There maybe some good reasons why Canada should exit the NORAD cooperative. First, the technology has shifted to SBR (satellite based radar) of which Canada has no assets. Second, Canada is funding about 15% of the total NORAD expenses. Their aircraft response fleet is down to around 30 jets. The anti-USA liberal politicians have seized upon the NORAD issue for exploitation. Perhaps we should take that away from them? |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 9:47:37 AM EDT
[#21]
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Posted: 12/24/2005 9:48:37 AM EDT
[#22]
The number of Canadians here has gone up a great deal since that sheet was published almost a year ago. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 9:55:26 AM EDT
[#23]
My main critcism is that he claims to be up on current events, but claims the Canadians are here in Afghanistan as part of a UN operation, something that is not true as I pointed out above. I guess I did a poor job of tying it all together. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 10:37:07 AM EDT
[#24]
Okay, we can agree your reading comprehension and debating skills are poor and I was mistaken about the precise degree of UN involvement. I still don't understand how an American can argue that Canada is an ally any more than France or Germany are right now. France has almost as many troops as Canada, and Germany has twice as many in Afghanistan . That said, I believe France and Germany's perfidious behavior in the run up to the IRAQ war made it, and our casualties inevitable. Saddam thought the French and Germans would protect him so he didn't bend an inch on inspections. The Canadians have done drop-dead nothing to help in Iraq and maybe someone can tell me where I am wrong. Oh , and by the way the ISAF was created by a UN MANDATE. Once again , I argue that if not for the UN the Canadians, Germans French and the like would not be there. The original ISAF (ISAF I) was established by UN Security Council Resolution (UNSCR) 1386 of 20 December 2001. Its mandate was and remains to assist the Afghan Transitional Authority in maintaining security in and around Kabul, so that the Afghan Transitional Authority and UN personnel are able to operate in a safe environment. In addition, ISAF may assist the Afghan Transitional Authority in developing and training Afghan security structures and forces and in civil reconstruction. (link)UN NATO source Garand_shooter , I can't tell you how much I appreciate the fact that you are in Afghanistan and I'm thankful for your service whatever it is. It just pisses me off to no end that our brave men & women in Iraq are in so much danger while the other countries like France, Canada and Germany not only sit it out, but actively work against us in the middle east. Tell me where I'm wrong, but I can't make excuses or forgive these pricks like you can. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 10:47:55 AM EDT
[#25]
I've got the tape in my car. My quote was correct. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 10:55:51 AM EDT
[#26]
Re Iraq: RCMP were training Iraqi police officers at a location in Jordan. Don't know if that is still happening.
I figure that since the action in Iraq is now anti-terrorist, CDN forces should be there. It was a disgrace that Canada didn't respond when their closest ally asked for help. The Canadian involvement in Afghanistan is about to increase, up to 2000 troops, and a Canadian command group will assume overall UN forces command. My brother's unit has been told they might be deployed there. I agree that with the CDN Armed Forces at strength of only 40,000, its dramatically undersized, and even at that size, its underfunded. There is a joke that the Liberals would send out CDN soldiers with mules and Lee-Enfields if they could get away with it. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 11:23:19 AM EDT
[#27]
I don't have to "think about it". I know precisely what their contributions are and I occasionally work with them. Let's just leave it at that. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 11:45:53 AM EDT
[#28]
Pooby, Do you happen to know if the McKenzie Brothers have ever traveled overseas to entertain the Canadian troops and their allies? Now that would be showing some support worthy of mention! 
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Posted: 12/24/2005 11:48:39 AM EDT
[#29]
Typical "I could tell you but I'd have to kill you" bullshit answer. But thanks for stopping by ! edit , I've worked with them too, on Border and Law Enforcement issues. So Let's just leave it at that.  Sheesh. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 11:52:51 AM EDT
[#30]
Centershot! Nice goin hosehead! |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 12:13:00 PM EDT
[#31]
I will grant Canada the one distinction of having produced the world's greatest English speaking comedians. SCTV, The Kids In The Hall, Dave Thomas, Rick Moranis, Dan Ackroyd etc. There are too many to list. Unfortunately for Canada they were all forced to flee Canada for artistic freedom in the US. Anyone who is anyone in comedy lives and works in the US now. The McKenzie brother sketch was only created as a backlash when Canadian Censors cracked down on SCTV for not having the required 10% Canadian content in their program. It turned out to be one of their funnier bits, even though it was created to thumb their nose at the Canadian FCC. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 12:47:59 PM EDT
[#32]
Yeah what is up with all the Canadian comics leaving Canada for the US?
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Posted: 12/24/2005 12:51:03 PM EDT
[#33]
ISAF may be a NATO mission, but there is a UN mission there concurrently. Ireland has soldiers in Afghanistan, and domestic law prohibits deployments abroad on non-UN missions. NTM |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 2:27:48 PM EDT
[#34]
I was living in Ottawa from 1974-1980, or pretty much the heyday for Second City TV, John Candy, Eugene Levy, and all the rest. Kind of like catching all the very best of Saturday Night Live, when it's comedians were actually working hard to be funny and creative. Lord, what laughs! One night I was in Hull (small town in Quebec, across from Ottawa), after the Ottawa bars had closed. It was about 2:00am, and these two guys got kicked out of a bar. Once they were outside and on the sidewalk, they started complaining about why they were thrown out, how much they had to drink, etc. Believe me when I tell you, these two looked and sounded like the McKenzie Brothers: dressed in plaid shirts and ski jackets, tooques (worn almost straight up, to give that "conehead" look), and absolutely drunk as they could be. Within minutes they were yelling at each other, and then started fighting each other, but constantly slipping and falling on the icy sidewalk! Truly, one of the funniest things I've ever witnessed. You would have almost thought it was being filmed for SCTV. 
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Posted: 12/24/2005 3:20:21 PM EDT
[#35]
With icebreakers?  They make what, 8 knots breaking ice and 15 in open water?  WE protect your northern flank. And so it will remain until you pony up for nuclear submarines. BTW, good luck on the elections. Kick the fucking liberals in the nuts and burn the Canadian Firearms Center to the ground. Eh. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 3:22:57 PM EDT
[#36]
And the Canadians had more troops in Afghanistan then El Salvador did. From whatI have heard, most Canadians who have served and fought there were damn proud to do so. Dont the Canadians hold the record long distance kill? |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 3:28:35 PM EDT
[#37]
Ummm, you are the one that said Canada is still a "faithful friend and ally" and when asked to back that up, this is your answer? You have not stated any evidence that suggests that Canada, or at least the current Liberal Party regime, is a friend in any way. I don't see them working against us like Germany or France but an ally they are not. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 3:30:04 PM EDT
[#38]
Take off, it a beauty way to go. Bob and Doug, the original Dumb and Dumber. I wish they were still popular.  I MUST have this 
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Posted: 12/24/2005 3:54:10 PM EDT
[#39]
I dont know if they ever did but I think they would have had the opportunity arose. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 6:18:46 PM EDT
[#40]
When the Canadian apologists chime in , all they can bring up are the oft mentioned Afghan-Canuckistani snipers. This apparently is Canada's ONLY military accomplishment since WWII or Korea worth mentioning which is exactly my point. My other point is other than NORAD and tracking Santa on Christmas Eve, the Canadians will not bend over to pick up their own jock-strap unless Kofi Annan and all the other dictatorships and thugocracies of the UN give them the go-ahead. I'm still waiting for anyone to convince me that Canada is an ally in it's current political configuration. |
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Posted: 12/24/2005 6:27:53 PM EDT
[#41]
Talking to a German soldier while I was in Graf training. I was impressed, they are very down to earth, (only down was discipline was lacking somewhat (smoking at ammo points while loading ammo, etc.)) but his uncle was some high ranking officer in the German Army and he said that they were gonna be going Iraq soon from the looks of things.
Should be good. |
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