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10/20/2017 1:01:18 AM
9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 9/27/2005 7:14:46 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/27/2005 8:30:18 AM EDT by BeetleBailey]


ETA: I think this is correct:



I worked on this last night but couldn't figure it out for the life of me. This is the setup in my bathroom. It's an older house so there is no ground. I'm trying to figure out where the juice is coming into to the circuit from the fusebox, either at the switch or the light/outlet. I used my multimeter and got the following results:

switch turned off:
> continuity between the black and white wire on the switch
> no continuity between the black and white on the light/outlet
> continuity between the switch white wire and all other wires

which would lead me to believe that the juice is coming in at the light/outlet, and going back out on the black wire on the switch.

My aim is to add an outlet somewhere on the circuit between the switch and the light, and I'm trying to figure out how to do this.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 7:16:27 AM EDT
Just start hooking wires up. Once you get the combination that doesn't start a fire stick with it
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 7:29:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/27/2005 7:31:33 AM EDT by 338winmag]
1. Run black and white wires From fuse box to receptacle.

2. Run black wire from other screw on receptacle to one side of switch.

3. Run white wire from receptacle to light.

4. Run black wire from other side of switch to light.

When switch is turned on light works.

Receptacle works all the time.

Need more info. Ask.

ETA: for added clarity.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 7:55:56 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BeetleBailey:
homepage.uab.edu/beetle/circuit.bmp

I worked on this last night but couldn't figure it out for the life of me. This is the setup in my bathroom. It's an older house so there is no ground. I'm trying to figure out where the juice is coming into to the circuit from the fusebox, either at the switch or the light/outlet. I used my multimeter and got the following results:

switch turned off:
> continuity between the black and white wire on the switch
> no continuity between the black and white on the light/outlet
> continuity between the switch white wire and all other wires

which would lead me to believe that the juice is coming in on the white wire at the switch, and going back out on the white wire on the light/outlet.

My aim is to add an outlet somewhere on the circuit between the switch and the light, and I'm trying to figure out how to do this.



Sounds like the white is the common wire. Was the switch pre-existing?

I tried to draw up a quick schematic of your description, and the light and outlet should be in parallel to each other. If that is the case, just add another outlet in parallel.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 7:56:31 AM EDT

Originally Posted By 338winmag:

When switch is turned on light works. yes

Receptacle works all the time. no

Need more info. Ask.

ETA: for added clarity.

Link Posted: 9/27/2005 7:59:27 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/27/2005 8:02:40 AM EDT by BeetleBailey]

Originally Posted By RyanAR15:

Sounds like the white is the common wire. Was the switch pre-existing?

I tried to draw up a quick schematic of your description, and the light and outlet should be in parallel to each other. If that is the case, just add another outlet in parallel.



Yes, switch is preexisting. Also, the light fixture is one of the old ones with the outlet attached to it, as you can see. Also, I updates the orig. post for correctness

Could this be it?

Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:07:58 AM EDT
You will have to hook onto the outlet to add another always hot outlet, if you interrupt the switch-wire to put in an outlet, the outlet will be switched also.BTW if your drawing is accurate the existing wiring is standard procedure, sometimes you run into some strange configurations done by amateurs like me, before I bought a book. There are some great books available for home wiring.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:09:17 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/27/2005 8:18:47 AM EDT by ZW17]


Oarnge spots represent wire nuts.

All the whites need to be connected together back to the fuse box where they are grounded on the grounding bar.

Check the plug by removing the black and white wires from the plug terminals and run a continuity test across the terminals.

ETA - Black is hooked to the circuit breaker or fuse terminal in the box.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:10:38 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BeetleBailey:

Originally Posted By RyanAR15:

Sounds like the white is the common wire. Was the switch pre-existing?

I tried to draw up a quick schematic of your description, and the light and outlet should be in parallel to each other. If that is the case, just add another outlet in parallel.



Yes, switch is preexisting. Also, the light fixture is one of the old ones with the outlet attached to it, as you can see. Also, I updates the orig. post for correctness

Could this be it?

homepage.uab.edu/beetle/circuit2.bmp



No. Your drawing shows the switch as a device not as a switch.

You will break the black wire. You will not have the black wire coming into the switch and the white going out.

What your drawing should show is a black wire going into the switch from the fuse box. Another black wire coming out of the switch and going over to the junction of the light and the receptacle. The white wire coming from the junction of all the white wires and going back to the fuse box.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:11:24 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BeetleBailey:

Originally Posted By RyanAR15:

Sounds like the white is the common wire. Was the switch pre-existing?

I tried to draw up a quick schematic of your description, and the light and outlet should be in parallel to each other. If that is the case, just add another outlet in parallel.



Yes, switch is preexisting. Also, the light fixture is one of the old ones with the outlet attached to it, as you can see. Also, I updates the orig. post for correctness

Could this be it?

homepage.uab.edu/beetle/circuit2.bmp



That looks about right.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:11:45 AM EDT

That's nuts. They split the wires like that!!!

Before going any further it's in your best intrests to get a new electrical box with modern capacity. Those old ones can't deal with modern power usage.

And White and Ground should meet at the box and go into the grounding rod.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:13:14 AM EDT

Originally Posted By ZW17:
img.photobucket.com/albums/v232/ZW17/circuit.jpg

Oarnge spots represent wire nuts.

All the whites need to be connected together back to the fuse box which are grounded on the grounding bar.

Check the plug by removing the black and white wires from the plug terminals and run a continuity test across the terminals.



This is correct.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:20:26 AM EDT



this appears to make the outlet switched as well as the light.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:24:38 AM EDT
The exact config depends on whether the switch, light, or outlet is first in the circuit.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:27:19 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/27/2005 8:30:40 AM EDT by ZW17]


If you want to add a UNswitched plug to the mix, this is how you would wire it.

Sorry for the crappy pic, I have no time to do it nice.

Very important to grab the 120vdc (black wire) BEFORE the switch or it will be a SWITCHED outlet.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:29:42 AM EDT

Originally Posted By bullsi:
The exact config depends on whether the switch, light, or outlet is first in the circuit.



the light and outlet are together, and it appears that they are first, due to my meter readings (both wires are always hot)
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:32:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/27/2005 8:34:21 AM EDT by BeetleBailey]

Originally Posted By ZW17:


ETA - Black is hooked to the circuit breaker or fuse terminal in the box.



That can't be right, because it appears that the power is coming into the series/circuit at the light. Thats why I'm thinkg that this is correct:

Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:32:19 AM EDT
You still using fuses over there in Bama, over here in GA we have gone modern with circuit breakers.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:33:21 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/27/2005 8:33:31 AM EDT by BeetleBailey]

Originally Posted By eodtech2000:
You still using fuses over there in Bama, over here in GA we have gone modern with circuit breakers.



yes, it is a breaker box smartass
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:33:52 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BeetleBailey:

Originally Posted By bullsi:
The exact config depends on whether the switch, light, or outlet is first in the circuit.



the light and outlet are together, and it appears that they are first, due to my meter readings (both wires are always hot)



No, you cannot have both (black, white) wires hot. Are you grounding one side of the meter to a good ground? White should NEVER be hot unless there is a major short in the wire.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:35:42 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/27/2005 8:36:22 AM EDT by BeetleBailey]

Originally Posted By ZW17:

Originally Posted By BeetleBailey:

Originally Posted By bullsi:
The exact config depends on whether the switch, light, or outlet is first in the circuit.



the light and outlet are together, and it appears that they are first, due to my meter readings (both wires are always hot)



No, you cannot have both (black, white) wires hot. Are you grounding one side of the meter to a good ground? White should NEVER be hot unless there is a major short in the wire.



With the switch off - at the light there is one meter connection thingy to the black, one to the white = continuity. That's how I know that it's not coming into the switch first.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:37:07 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BeetleBailey:

Originally Posted By ZW17:
img.photobucket.com/albums/v232/ZW17/circuit.jpg

ETA - Black is hooked to the circuit breaker or fuse terminal in the box.



That can't be right, because it appears that the power is coming into the series/circuit at the light. Thats why I'm thinkg that this is correct:

homepage.uab.edu/beetle/circuit2.bmp



Go take a pic of the light and post it. I ill look at it after lunch. Something if FUBAR'd here.

You want the circut to be in series with the switch, otherwise it would never shut off with a switch.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:39:43 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/27/2005 8:40:30 AM EDT by ZW17]

Originally Posted By BeetleBailey:

Originally Posted By ZW17:

Originally Posted By BeetleBailey:

Originally Posted By bullsi:
The exact config depends on whether the switch, light, or outlet is first in the circuit.



the light and outlet are together, and it appears that they are first, due to my meter readings (both wires are always hot)



No, you cannot have both (black, white) wires hot. Are you grounding one side of the meter to a good ground? White should NEVER be hot unless there is a major short in the wire.



With the switch off - at the light there is one meter connection thingy to the black, one to the white = continuity. That's how I know that it's not coming into the switch first.



All devices have 2 terminals. take your meter and ground one lead to the sink faucet and with the switch OFF take the other lead and touch it to the BLACK wire terminal on the light. Let me know what you get.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:43:34 AM EDT
Sounds like you have a switch loop, the ONLY situation where white is allowed to be hot. Am not going to try to explain it here. You need a good book.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:43:45 AM EDT
not at home yet, can do this evening. on phone with electrician
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 8:47:20 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BeetleBailey:
not at home yet, can do this evening. on phone with electrician



I'll be on this evening, I'll look for your results.

Or you can pay an electrician, we like your $$$
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 9:06:53 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/27/2005 9:08:19 AM EDT by RyanAR15]

Originally Posted By ZW17:

If you want to add a UNswitched plug to the mix, this is how you would wire it.

Sorry for the crappy pic, I have no time to do it nice. hevdc VAC (black wire) BEFORE the switch or it will be a SWITCHED outlet.



Absolutely right. [duh] Oh, you wanted an unswitched outlet? [/duh] h.gif

What did I hear about going to college and getting stupider? LOL

ETA: Fixed that for ya.
Link Posted: 9/27/2005 6:35:42 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ZW17:

Originally Posted By BeetleBailey:
not at home yet, can do this evening. on phone with electrician



I'll be on this evening, I'll look for your results.

Or you can pay an electrician, we like your $$$



Well, my camera is having issues tonight, but the first picture of the thread is exactly what it looks like
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