"They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security" - Benjiman Franklin

"Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel." - Patrick Henery

"If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen." - Samuel Adams

What do you think these guys would have to say about the Patriot Act, the Department of Homeland Security or the idea of military imposed quarantines?

Hey my favorite quote from Ben Franklin.  I think a lot of things in this country are so far gone from what the Founding Fathers envisioned they're crying and rolling in their graves right about now.

I bet they would have said:

"Take up your arms, ring the church bells and let's go fuck shit up"

Needs to be drilled into the general publics heads.  Maybe we would be a Republic again.

I often think of our founding fathers and just what they would say about the state this country is in.

-The concept of lobbying. The golden rule: he who has the gold makes the rules.

They would be pissed.

-Taking firearms from citizens who otherwise have no defense from devious thugs.

They would be infuriated.

-Increasing the breadth and depth of the FEDERAL Govment for the SAKE of the greater good (Its for your own security sir).

They damn well just might start another revolution.

This country lost sight of the beauty of freedom quite some time ago and the masses have followed the pied piper all the way out of town.



I love this country and am damn proud to be an American, but it is about time we got this train back on its tracks and quit letting self-serving politicans on ego trips with greedy desires run our country.

But I'm just following orders!  There are no un-lawful orders under martial-law!!  Its for the children!  Don't you know that the Constitution is full of out-dated, antiquated ideas!  Don't you know that the founding fathers were evil white-men, and therefore their philosophies and ideas are automatically wrong!!  The Bill of Rights doesn't apply to you in certain situations, we need to not be so focused on the rights of individuals, you must be some kind of right-wing extremist wacko militia guy!

Quoted: What do you think these guys would have to say about the Patriot Act, the Department of Homeland Security or the idea of military imposed quarantines?

Who knows?  They're dead.

But look at it this way; those guys advocated revolution over a few tax hikes.  How do you think they'd react to Osama Bin Laden's attack?

Quoted: Quoted: What do you think these guys would have to say about the Patriot Act, the Department of Homeland Security or the idea of military imposed quarantines? Who knows?  They're dead. But look at it this way; those guys advocated revolution over a few tax hikes.  How do you think they'd react to Osama Bin Laden's attack?

The same way that they reacted when the English and seperately the pirates in North Africa attacked American shipping after the revolution and pressed American Sailors into service with their fleets. They went after the enemy and not the rights of Americans.  

And actually, those guys patiently abided tax hikes, and the closure of their elected governments, and the failure of the King to provide them with any representation in his government, and many other oppressive acts. They did not revolt until the government used the military to confiscate their arms and round up the "trouble makers".

well we already know what they would think about it, america is here because of how it made them feel. And many brits where killed

Quoted: The same way that they reacted when the English and seperately the pirates in North Africa attacked American shipping after the revolution and pressed American Sailors into service with their fleets. They went after the enemy and not the rights of Americans.

That's a poor analogy, since the Barbary pirates' attacks were so much different in nature from the 9/11 attacks.  I don't think I have to explain how. Pearl Harbor is the better analogy, especially because it showed how resistrictions of citizens' liberties was restored after the threat vanished.

If the government didn't try to prevent the way the terrorists attacked and the terrorists set off say a nuke or other WMD, would not have making it more difficult for the terrorists to infiltrate America been the right thing to do?  I would say no.

Anyway, this argument's been going on for 4 years.  Trite is too mild a word to describe it.

Quoted: Quoted: The same way that they reacted when the English and seperately the pirates in North Africa attacked American shipping after the revolution and pressed American Sailors into service with their fleets. They went after the enemy and not the rights of Americans.   That's a poor analogy, since the Barbary pirates' attacks were so much different in nature from the 9/11 attacks.  I don't think I have to explain how. Pearl Harbor is the better analogy, especially because it showed how resistrictions of citizens' liberties was restored after the threat vanished. If the government didn't try to prevent the way the terrorists attacked and the terrorists set off say a nuke or other WMD, would not have making it more difficult for the terrorists to infiltrate America been the right thing to do?  I would say no. Anyway, this argument's been going on for 4 years.  Trite is too mild a word to describe it.

The Bush administration has pushed to have many of the provisions of the Patriot Act made permenant, and I don't think that they are asking for a temporary repeal of Posse Comitatus or of the Insurection Act. On it's own, the Patriot Act seems reasonalbe for dealing with terrorists, and you could even say the same for the detention of Jose Padilla. But when viewed in light of the fact that the 82nd Airborne was used to help police NO, and now that the government is considering repealing and amending Posse Comitatus and the Insurection Act, and the fact that Bush has said that he wants to be able to use the military to enforce quarantines it starts to become quite a bit more alarming.

I'm sorry that you find this subject to be unoriginal and boring. In my eyes, alot of men fought and died for the freedoms that we are surrendering right now. I think that we owe it to those men to at least discuss whether or not we should be going down this road. I can't in good conscience sit back in silence while the government to consolidates it's power and infringes on our rights. I think we owe the men who are buried in Arlington at least that much.

The Constitution is a living breathing document.

Words no longer mean things.

edit to add: I know the original statements of the post were not from the Constitution but I hope you get the idea.

Quoted: What do you think these guys would have to say about the Patriot Act, the Department of Homeland Security or the idea of military imposed quarantines?

I think they would say, "we shed blood and labored hard to create the best form of government we could possibly imagine.  We transcribed our thoughts in the process of creating the document we would live by and gave you cautions of what to watch for and what to expect.  Why did our progeny not heed our warnings?  Why was the expedient allowed to replace the correct?  We would never wear the shackles that you find acceptable.  So, why has nothing been done in support of your birthrite!"