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Posted: 5/7/2004 3:06:06 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/7/2004 3:11:31 PM EST by 1shott]
I have a project on the agenda, it involves concrete...

I am going to pour a landing for the front entrieway, right now it is just the porch, and you step off onto the lawn..

I am going to pour a roughly 4ftx4ft square landing, and then a step from that up to the front porch.

My question is, should I dig and pour a footer for the landing? My frost line here is only about a foot, so I can trench out by hand the trough for the footer.

This would keep the landing from heaving and busting, so it should last a awhile.

Also how deep should the pad be? I was thinking about 3in should do it.

Edit for my CRAPPY SPELLING......

Also about how much concret would I need, I was thinking of useing ReadyMix, and mixing it in my wheelborrow.
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:06:54 PM EST
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:10:48 PM EST

Originally Posted By KA3B:

LOL, crap busted again... Thanks.....
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:12:26 PM EST
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:20:34 PM EST
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:22:18 PM EST
if you are going to do it right---Do it RIGHT

Dig the footer - and don't be lazy if you spend three days that is what it takes

Sakcrete is fine for the footer

Order ready mix concrete

a 3,500 psi or a 4,000 psi mix is the best and make sure it is air-entrained

you can also order it by the sak meaning 5.25 sak or 6.1 sak cement

1 sak of cement is 94 lbs and measures 1 cubic foot.

footer means just that pour 1 foot thick

don't be cheap

4" concrete is usually good enough for doing steps

The key is properly forming the concrete

It may be better if you are really new at this is to have a local guy do it and you watch or "help"

Concrete is ordered by the cubic yard and there is usually a minimum charge for delivery and usually a Saturday charge as well

If you don't know how to float the concrete or trowel or broom the concrete and don't want to accidently seal the bleed water in you are probably just throwin' your money away...
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:22:57 PM EST
Holy shit, is your AC unit 50x as dense as gold?

Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:23:36 PM EST
Call me.
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:24:16 PM EST
Minimum depth is four inches. No footers should be required. Get a section of steel mesh (3X3") and get some top hats to raise it off. Use a two by four for the formwork and trench down an extra inch or so.
Do not do a pour any shallower than 4 inches! Use steel mesh for reinforcement. Make sure you keep it wet for a day or two while it cures.
You'll be fine.
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:26:48 PM EST
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:27:38 PM EST
You'll probably be buying quite a few bags if you don't get it from a truck. If you can do it on a weekday and order a short load you'd be better off. If you can find a construction site near you they might even cut you a good deal if you take their leftovers.

I don't know boo about frost lines, we ain't gots 'em 'round here.
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:28:25 PM EST

Originally Posted By Hawkeye:
Call me.

And what would you like me to call you,
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:28:55 PM EST

Originally Posted By thebeekeeper1:
I poured a little pad for my central air unit that is similar to what you are doing. My buddies are still laughing at me. My mindset--if two screws are good, ten are five times better.

Here's what I did:

Framed with 2X4's. Inside of that I dug a foot-deep hole in each corner. Inside of each of these, I pounded a 6' fence post 3" below final grade, and another in the middle, same finished height. To these, I wired about 20 lbs. of reinforcing rods in roughly a checkerboard pattern. This took about 7 60 lb. bags of concrete. Be sure to get an edger to make nice round edges. I then sealed it with the clear concrete sealer that looks like water, but seals water out. Two years later it is perfect.

BK I know you are king of most things but concrete...c'mon

I have patios that are still perfect 30 years later - 2 years is mere child's play
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:29:14 PM EST
Thanks for all the tips so far guys.....
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:32:11 PM EST
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:44:31 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/7/2004 3:49:07 PM EST by E-95]
Three to four inches should be fine for Oklahoma. I wouldn't be a bad idea to check with someone at your local Home Depot or Lowes though just to be on the safe side. You need to decide before this project starts if you want the step to be part of the same pour though. If so, you'll have to prep your step frame so that you can lay it on top of your still wet pad.

The first step should be to dig out your pad roughly 6 to 8 inches deep and lay about 3 or 4 inches of construction sand as a base. Once you've leveled this out, wet it down with a fog stream from the hose for about 15 minutes to compact the sand (sand compacts naturally when wet).

You should now have about 3 or 4 inches below grade for your pad. Build your frame for the concrete and put down a vapor barrier (a heavy sheet of plastic from the hardware store) to prevent fluid migration. Additionally lay down some steel mesh to prevent cracking. You might want to check the frame with a level to make sure rain water will run away from the house. That will prevent for example an ice sheet during cold weather.

Now mix up your concrete and start pouring. You'll probably need about 6 to 8 bags to finish the job. Add just enough water to make the wet concrete easy to manage when finishing. It should be a really thick paste rather than a soupy mess. The less water you use during mixing, the stronger the finished concrete will be.

Use a board that will reach all the way across your frame to level out the pad and do your finishing work. There are a number of specially designed concrete tools. Probably a good finishing trowel and an edge finisher would be a good idea.

Wet it down once or twice a day until it cures (28 days) and you're done.

I'm a little under the weather here and not exactly thinking right so someone make sure I gave him all the steps. Hope your project turns out well.


Edited to add: Just remember the good news. If you screw up the first time, you can always spend hours with a sledge hammer and start all over again!
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:47:38 PM EST
Nope, no experience here. What's concrete, BTW?

Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:50:48 PM EST

Originally Posted By Wobblin-Goblin:
Nope, no experience here. What's concrete, BTW?

When I lived in CT, I had a some buddies like you, no help at all......
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:54:14 PM EST
4" is recommended. For the VERY few extra $$$ it will cost, DO IT RIGHT.

3000# is fine.

If you can get a 'crete truck in there, call the redimix guys and they can pour it right into the form for you.

The MOST important part of the job is the form.

The form should NOT be level - it should SLIGHTLY slope away from your houses foundation, for water run off.

Make sure the form is solidly braced and square. Measure your diagonals.

Have a board ready to scrape across the top of the form to screed off the slag, and to finish the concrete fairly smooth. Board should be 2 to 3' wider than your form. You go back and forth in a sawing motion, with the board on edge.

Advice beyond this point is fee - only.

You have to learn the hard way like the rest of us.

Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:56:24 PM EST

Originally Posted By garandman:

Advice beyond this point is fee - only.

You have to learn the hard way like the rest of us.

Thats what I was trying to avoid.....
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 4:26:26 PM EST
If you form with a standard 2"X4" and no footer you will need about .20 cubic yards of concrete. You should stake this form at each corner and once in between. There is no such thing as too many stakes when you are dealing with concrete. Just keep them below flush with the top of your form so you can screed it easily. Get enough lathe to go frome edge to edge on your form from Lowes or any building supply store. Rebar wouldn't hurt but I doubt you would need it on a small pour like this. Lathe is an expanded metal with about 1/4th inch mesh.

Figure the CUBIC INCHES of your form with footer and divide by 46656 to get your cubic yards of concrete if you decide to go with a footer. The sacks will have the volume on them.

There are several do it yourself project guys here and some professionals too. Use their expertise!

Good luck.
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 4:31:56 PM EST
Asking about what to do about concrete is like asking what beer should I drink or which gun should I buy

Everybody has different ideas - and most have very solid ideas

Knowing what level of understanding that you will need for this project is important

If I give you too much advice your head hurts and you'll never get it straight until after the job is done.

As a Doctor of Civil Engineering and who worked as the Project Engineer on Soldier Field (Chicago Bears Stadium) which has lots of steps - here is some general advice...

Obviously you won't need what we used at the Stadium

Just read through everyones advice and once you think you have enough opinions plan and execute the project.

No matter how good you do you will still make mistakes it just comes with the territory

There is no right or wrong generally, it is a matter of degrees of correctness

How long to do want it to last?

How pretty does it have to look?

How functional is it?

What color? What texture? What finish?

Before you know it you'll be swimming in it

Link Posted: 5/7/2004 10:59:04 PM EST
Frostline? dirt freezes? oh that's right I live in the wrong part of the country.
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