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Posted: 6/16/2002 8:44:03 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/16/2002 8:46:47 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/16/2002 8:51:12 PM EDT
Never pull/show your weapon unless you fear for your life and are going to pull the trigger.  To brandish the weapon as a scare tactic seems negligent, IMHO.

I would definately call the cops immediately with his plate #.  The "heated discussion" would never have started as I would have called the law on him as soon as I felt he was escalating the situation and persisted with his banter.  In a situation like this I would use a cell phone first, and my gun as the final means of mitigating the situation, which would result in dead motorist.
Link Posted: 6/16/2002 9:05:59 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/16/2002 9:06:01 PM EDT
A 'heated discussion' starts and this guy steps out of his vehicle to basically exchange more than just words. You 'kindly' expose your weapon to diffuse the situation, guy thinks to himself: "you know what? I have better places to be right now" and gets back in his car and leaves in a hurry. Situation diffused.
View Quote

I'm sure it varies from state to statebut in most jurisdictions the person could be charged
with "brandishing" or "aggrivated asault".

As the law sees it, your first obligation would to have either made some sort of retreat or have avoid the "heated discussion' to begin with. Barring any immenent danger or threat of serious injury or death, the person could be in deep shit.

[b]Here is the question: What if the guy takes down your license plate and calls the cops? Do you call them first and tell them what happened or do you wait till they come to you?[/b]
If you wait until they come to you, doesnt that make the situation worse for your defense?
View Quote

It's kind of damned if you do, damned if you don't situation. If the guy doesn't call the cops, you're in the position of turning yourself in (and hopefuly the cops will just give you a warning). OTOH, if the guy calls the cops and you don't, you'll be seen as the assailant.
Link Posted: 6/16/2002 9:20:11 PM EDT
Thanks for the clarification.  Let me update my response.....

Move out of the PRK for starters, if not, see my above post.  [:D]

I had a guy like this stumble into my day a few months ago.  My wife, my 2 month old baby and myself are driving to a friends b-day party.  Guy cuts me off.  I give a slight toot, he freaks it.  I continued driving he got off an exit.  Cops got a call about road rage with a plate #.
Link Posted: 6/16/2002 9:45:38 PM EDT
I had somewhat of a similar situation, except the guy started harassing me, my wife, and my not even 1 year old daughter for no reason that we could discern.  

Scenario:  We were driving to the grocery store at 9pm on a Friday night when I noticed the headlights of a GMC/Chevy truck coming up behind us.  I'm in the slow lane doing 65MPH in a 55MPH zone with no one else around.  Anyway, instead of passing me, the assclown runs up on my bumper and stays there for about 30 seconds.  There is what I'd estimate is less than two feet between our vehicles.  I don't do anything except maintain my speed, and even sped up at one point, but he had more power than me.  If I tap my brakes he's likely to hit me and injure my baby daughter.  So, he whips around me and starts weaving in and out of his lane, forcing me to hit my brakes and almost off the road.  Then, he gets in front of me, starts slowing down, and then slams on his brakes.  We almost come to a stop and I'm ready to poke holes in whoever pops out of the car, but instead of stopping he speeds off.

By this point, I'm pissed, but I have my wife and duaghter in the car with me.  I follow him long enough to get his license plate number.  Had I been alone, I would have followed him to the pool hall he and his friends went to and put my hands upon him, but this was not an option.  The next Monday night, I pulled the registration of the car and the license information for other people who lived at the home, since it didn't seem to be the type of behavior of a 50 year old man.  He has a 16 year old daugher and an 18 year old son who appears to fit the description of who I saw driving.  I call the person who owns the Tahoe up (his name is Randy) and the conversation goes like this:

Randy: "Hello?"
Me: "Excuse me sir, but is this Randy XXXXXXX?"
Randy: "Yes it is."
Me: "Sir, you do not know me, but according to my records, you own a 1997 Chevy Tahoe SUV.  Is this correct?"
Randy: "Yes.  What exactly is this about?"
Me: "Sir, were you driving that vehicle on Friday night?"
Randy: "No sir, I was not.  My son was driving it out with his friends.  Again, what is this about?"
Me: "Well sir, on Friday night I was driving to the grocery store with my wife and my baby daughter to pick up some items when someone driving your Tahoe nearly ran me off the road repeatedly.  Had I been on the job, your son would not have come home and you would be without a vehicle.  He's luckier still that I didn't take his actions to be a threat against the lives of myself and my family."
Randy: "I see..."
Me: "Sir, I've had some time to think about it, and I've calmed down since Friday.  But, I figured you should be informed that your son was endangering the lives of my family, as well as abusing your expensive SUV."
Randy: "I appreciate that."
Randy in the background "Boy, get your ass in here, now!"
Randy: "How did you get my information?"
Me: "Sir, that's what I do for a living.  Thank you for your attention in the matter and good night."

It was the first day of summe, and this kid was a year behind, so he had just become a Senior.  I think I put a damper on his summer.

Remember the Alamo, and God Bless Texas...
Link Posted: 6/16/2002 10:31:12 PM EDT
First of all, YOU DON'T GET INTO A HEATED DISCUSSION!!! You simply drive on about your business & let him act the fool. If he jumps out of his car at a red light & beats on your door/window, that's a different story.

Argueing with a fool is like the other guy says about Special Olympics: even if you win or don't win, you're still retarded!
Link Posted: 6/16/2002 11:19:14 PM EDT
... First requirement of concealed carry is to keep it concealed.
Link Posted: 6/17/2002 3:11:44 AM EDT
Pulling a weapon if your life is not in imminent danger is "brandishing" and can get you into trouble.  There is a thread elsewhere on the board about a fellow racking a shotgun in the doorway of his own home. The cops were down on HIM.  Of course the lies the other kid's father told helped those matters.

Your first weapon is your brain.  Use it and avoid the situation.  Go away if you reasonably can.  

If the guy starts weaving around and harassing you, go to second weapon, your cell phone.  Get tag number and call the police.  You probably even have an express dial number available (for example  *FHP, in FL)  .  Find out what it is and keep it in memory.  The police like aggressive/hostile driving even less than you do.  Frankly, and I apologize for the criticism, but you should not even stop for the discussion in the first place.  If I missed something, and the stop was at a stoplight, for example, then the police call is important.

Third weapon, the firearm only in the last resort, and only if the other guy approaches with a weapon.  Maybe if he breaks your glass you might be on reasonable ground using a weapon.

Think how the police, who must be neutral in this, and did not see the beginning, would react if you beat the crap out of someone who might even have deserved it.  No matter what someone did, you have no right to assault and batter the other person.  Only exception is defense if he attacks you.  In reality, the latter sometimes is hard to prove.  

Damn shame we have to think like this, but it's the way things are.
Link Posted: 6/17/2002 3:14:11 AM EDT
If I ever show my concealed handgun, it's going to be the muzzle end I'm showing and somebody is going to get shot at. I'd never pull it out to "scare" somebody.
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