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Posted: 10/10/2007 8:50:44 AM EDT
On the one hand it's Turkey's not so secret secret that they slaughtered the Armenians. They were better than the Nazis at covering it up. On the other hand, this goes right in the same category as apologizing for slavery and American Indians. Who's idea was this to?

I had a few Armenian friends and we always went to Armenian singles events in NYC. Oh man these women are nice. White with dark complexions, think flowing hair, playboy playmate type bodies. No size zero typical Manhattan women at these events. The funny thing was the question that they always asked. "So where are you from?" That meant your country where your family was from. Most of the Armenians are not from Armenia. Turkey decimated their population and scattered them all over Persia and Europe. It's was very encouraging to see my buddies having Armenian friends all over the world and making an effort to keep the culture alive and thriving.


Here's the story

www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/10/10/us.turkey.armenians/index.html

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- The Bush administration Wednesday lobbied heavily against a House resolution that labels the killings of Armenians in Turkey during World War I as "genocide," saying it would hurt relations with a key U.S. ally.


Condoleezza Rice called the resolution "problematic for everything that we're trying to do in the Middle East."

"We recognize the feelings of those who want to express their concern and their disdain for what happened many years ago," Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice said outside the White House. "But the passage of this resolution at this time would, indeed, be very problematic for everything that we're trying to do in the Middle East because we are very dependent on a good Turkish strategic ally to help with our efforts."

The nonbinding proposal, which is to be considered by the House Foreign Affairs Committee, acknowledges the "genocide" of Armenians in the early 20th century during the collapse of the Ottoman Empire, which preceded the creation of modern Turkey in 1923.

"In the case that Armenian allegations are accepted, there will be serious problems in the relations between the two countries," said President Abdullah Gul in a letter to President Bush, who staunchly opposes the resolution.

Nabi Sensoy, Turkey's ambassador to the United States, told CNN the resolution's passage would be a "very injurious move to the psyche of the Turkish people."

He predicted a "backlash" in the country, saying there will be setbacks on several fronts: Turkish-American relations, Turkish-Armenian relations and the normalization of relations between the nations of Turkey and Armenia.

Defense Secretary Robert Gates said good relations with Turkey are vital because 70 percent of the air cargo intended for and 30 percent of the fuel consumed by the U.S. forces in Iraq flies through Turkey.

U.S. commanders, Gates said, "believe clearly that access to airfields and roads and so on in Turkey would very much be put at risk if this resolution passes and the Turks react as strongly as we believe they will."

"Our heavy dependence on the Turks for access is really the reason the commanders raised this and why we're so concerned about the resolution," Gates said.

The resolution, which has much support in the full House, is "calling upon the president (Bush) to ensure that the foreign policy of the United States reflects appropriate understanding and sensitivity concerning issues related to human rights, ethnic cleansing and genocide documented in the United States record relating to the Armenian genocide, and for other purposes."

A similar resolution passed the committee two years ago 40-7, but it never reached the full House floor.

Rep. Adam Schiff, D-California, the resolution's author and sponsor refers to "the systematic and deliberate annihilation of 1,500,000 Armenians as genocide."

The term genocide is defined in dictionary.com as "the deliberate and systematic extermination of a national, racial, political, or cultural group."

But this opinion is hotly disputed in Turkey, the predominantly Muslim, but modern and secular, pro-Western ally of the United States.

Turks argue that all peoples -- Armenians and Turks -- suffered during the warfare. But Armenians maintain there was an organized genocide by the Ottoman Turkish authorities, and have been campaigning across the world for official recognition of the genocide.

The resolution arrives at a particularly sensitive juncture in U.S.-Turkish relations. The United States has urged Turkey not to send its troops over the border into northern Iraq to fight Kurdish separatist rebels, who have launched some cross-border attacks against Turkish targets.

Observers of U.S.-Turkish relations have argued such a House resolution could make Turkey less inclined to use restraint in dealing with its longstanding problems with the Kurdistan Workers Party, known as the PKK.

Schiff, who represents a southern California district with many Armenian-Americans, said the "bipartisan measure currently has 226 cosponsors, more than a majority in the House and the most support an Armenian genocide resolution has ever received."

"The United States has a compelling historical and moral reason to recognize the Armenian genocide, which cost a million and a half people their lives," said Schiff. "But we also have a powerful contemporary reason as well. How can we take effective action against the genocide in Darfur if we lack the will to condemn genocide whenever and wherever it occurs?"

That is a reference to the violent conflict in the Sudanese region of Darfur
Link Posted: 10/10/2007 9:18:24 AM EDT

Originally Posted By chibajoe:
So genoside is only genoside when we've got something to gain by calling it that?

Yep
Link Posted: 10/10/2007 9:22:45 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/10/2007 9:26:13 AM EDT by BillSouthCarolina]
Why should we let the Turks intimidate us?
the European Union has passed a resolution acknowledging the genocide and we should do the same.

Bush is the same clown who told us that islam is a religion of peace, he is not to be taken serious.
Link Posted: 10/10/2007 9:25:19 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BillSouthCarolina:
Why should we let the Turks intimidate us? the European Union has passed a resolution acknowledging the genocide and we should do the same.


What is the greater good? Officially acknowledging a horrible crime that everyone agrees happened or appeasing yet another middle eastern country for the sake of trying to stabilize a listing Iraq?

Glad I don't have to make these decisions!
Link Posted: 10/10/2007 9:26:57 AM EDT
The timing on this makes one wonder. Obviously, bringing this subject up right now is not the most convenient from the standpoint of our national interests. Interestingly, the resolution was introduced by the Democrats, so one has to be suspicious.

On the other hand, Turkey's deportation and murder of the Armenians was simply more of the same old Muzzy "KILL the INFIDEL" shit that the world has seen so much of over the past 1,400 years. I DO get a bit tired of walking on eggshells around those assholes.
Link Posted: 10/10/2007 1:12:26 PM EDT
Well, the Turks felt screwed over by GHW Bush and the second Gulf War (the first one we were in) cost them a lot of trade revenue that GHW Bush suggested that the US would help make up. Like most of his promises, nothing happened.

Fast forward to the present. Powell was essentially making his own foreign policy behind Bush's back and was whipsawing the Turks between State and the military. Finally they put their foot down. Unfortunately, they sided with State. And Powell left, of course. This gave them no say so on dealing with the PKK and is widely considered to be a bad move inside Turkey.

There is a history here. The Turks keep getting screwed over by the US and they are tired of it. That is why this seems like such a big deal to them.

And it's a shame, because the Turks should be one of our strongest allies.
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