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Posted: 6/21/2005 8:59:22 AM EDT
On FX tonite!,my beer is on ice as i post. that is all.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:00:09 AM EDT
Great movie. Watched it the other day. Good with surround sound...
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:00:10 AM EDT
you know, you can spend $13 and watch it any time you wish
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:02:01 AM EDT

Originally Posted By TheRedHorseman:
you know, you can spend $13 and watch it any time you wish



also the TV version will probably edited...
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:08:18 AM EDT

Originally Posted By bigthicket:
On FX tonite!,my beer is on ice as i post. that is all.



You honestly wait for it to come on tv? It should be in your dvd-speedloader at all times... what kind of mall ninja are you?!
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:09:17 AM EDT
The movie is very good, the book is awesome.
For me it's tough to watch because it pisses me off.
We should have leveled that city.

Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:10:13 AM EDT

Originally Posted By RSF45:
The movie is very good, the book is awesome.
For me it's tough to watch because it pisses me off.
We should have leveled that city.




My sentiments EXACTLY.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:10:20 AM EDT
I just watched that last week when I was at home from work sick. That DVD is a requirement for any DVD collection.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:10:51 AM EDT

Originally Posted By RSF45:
The movie is very good, the book is awesome.
For me it's tough to watch because it pisses me off.
We should have leveled that city.




Twice.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:15:19 AM EDT

Originally Posted By SPTiger:
I just watched that last week when I was at home from work sick. That DVD is a requirement for any DVD collection.



+1

I got the 3 disk version for $15. Its got some really great special features including "modified" Ranger and Delta training for the actors.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:16:36 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/21/2005 9:18:12 AM EDT by NorCal_LEO]
Just read this about the "Grimesy" character played by Ewan MacGregor. Sorry if dupe, I found it interesting.


December 18, 2001

The Army pressured the filmmakers of "Black Hawk Down" to change the name of the war hero portrayed by Ewan McGregor - because the real-life soldier is serving a 30-year prison term for rape and child molestation, says the man who wrote the book that spawned the movie.
In Ridley Scott's highly anticipated movie, McGregor plays Ranger John Grimes, a desk jockey who is called into battle during the botched Army operation in Somalia in 1993.

The character is based on real-life Ranger John "Stebby" Stebbins, but Pentagon officials asked his name be changed in an attempt to keep his shame a secret, claims author Mark Bowden, who also penned the original screenplay for the movie.

Stebbins' embittered ex-wife, Nora Stebbins, complained in an e-mail to The Post: "They are going to make millions off this film in which my ex-husband is portrayed as an All-American hero when the truth is he is not."

Army sources confirmed to The Post that Stebbins - who was awarded the Silver Star, one of America's highest honors, for his bravery in the bloody Battle of Mogadishu - was court-martialed and sentenced on June 8, 2000.

Janet Wray, a spokeswoman for Fort Leavenworth military prison in Kansas, confirmed yesterday: "We have a John Stebbins here. He arrived on June 9 last year and is serving a 30-year sentence for sodomy with a child under 12 and rape."

"Black Hawk Down," the Jerry Bruckheimer-produced movie which opens Dec. 28, is based on Bowden's best-selling book of the same name.

In the book, Bowden refers to Stebbins by his real name and says he surprised everyone with his heroics.

"He was a changed man, a wild animal, dancing around, shooting like a madman," wrote Bowden, who also penned the original draft of the screenplay.

But Stebbins will not get to see McGregor's portrayal of him in the $95 million film, which was filmed in Kenitra, Morocco, in March this year.

"As it happened, Stebbins got in trouble with the law," Bowden was quoted as saying recently. "The Army asked us to change the name."

A Revolution Studios spokeswoman would say only that the name-change was "a creative decision made by the producers."

"There were 100 men in the battle and only 40 speaking parts, so we had to condense some of the characters," she said. "[Grimes] is one who is a compilation of a number of soldiers who fought in that battle so his name was changed."

Stebbins, 36, a former baker from upstate Ithaca, had tried and failed to join the Army three times during the Persian Gulf War and finally made it into the crack Rangers unit, Bowden's book says.

But he worked as a company clerk, and was ribbed by his fellow soldiers as "chief coffee maker" and "paper pusher."
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:18:18 AM EDT
I just watched it last night on DVD. Its one of the greatest combat movie ever made, but difficult to watch.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:19:44 AM EDT

Originally Posted By B-O-A-T-S:

Originally Posted By TheRedHorseman:
you know, you can spend $13 and watch it any time you wish



also the TV version will probably edited...




what???? you mean they will edit it
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:23:30 AM EDT
NorCal_LEO: That is unfortunate of what happened to the soldier in real life. These people are flesh and blood like any one of us, and are not supermen and are vulnerable just like anyone of us.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:32:33 AM EDT
For the abridged version of Mark Bowden's book Blackhawk Down that was printed in the Philadelphia Inquirer. The website also had extra images and maps that was not in the book.
abridged vers. of Blackhawk Down
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:33:55 AM EDT

Originally Posted By warlord:
NorCal_LEO: That is unfortunate of what happened to the soldier in real life. These people are flesh and blood like any one of us, and are not supermen and are vulnerable just like anyone of us.



Very true. I had actually just read this in a magazine article two days ago about the armed forces film liason and had never heard a word about it before. Ugly and sad twist, but anyone with half a brain can separate the two halves of the story. Well, here I don't know...

NorCal

Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:35:17 AM EDT
Pisses me off too. Good movie, love the book too.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:50:23 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:50:55 AM EDT

Originally Posted By RSF45:
The movie is very good, the book is awesome.
For me it's tough to watch because it pisses me off.
We should have leveled that city.




Interesting solution to the humanitarian crises we were there for.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:53:05 AM EDT
Bookhound, i agree and we know whose politics it was too, thx. Billy Boy!
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 9:58:12 AM EDT

Originally Posted By bigthicket:
Bookhound, i agree and we know whose politics it was too, thx. Billy Boy!



You are right.

Why the fuck did Bush Sr. have us there?
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 10:03:15 AM EDT
THe locals had got rough with the UN people and we were the "backup". Then it turned into a shitstorm. I just hope we learned SOMETHING from this clusterfuck!
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 10:07:52 AM EDT


will be watchin it again tonight

by the way, a friend of mine asked why did the downed chopers not use the minis to help repel the sommolis--i said that its cause that the down choper did not have any electrical power to power the motors on the minis

sound right?

if so, why cant there be a manual crank to work the minis?
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 10:10:54 AM EDT

Originally Posted By ALPHAGHOST:


will be watchin it again tonight

by the way, a friend of mine asked why did the downed chopers not use the minis to help repel the sommolis--i said that its cause that the down choper did not have any electrical power to power the motors on the minis

sound right?

if so, why cant there be a manual crank to work the minis?



Probably cause you'd have be crankin pretty fast to get the intended effect
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 10:13:27 AM EDT

Originally Posted By ALPHAGHOST:


will be watchin it again tonight

by the way, a friend of mine asked why did the downed chopers not use the minis to help repel the sommolis--i said that its cause that the down choper did not have any electrical power to power the motors on the minis

sound right?

if so, why cant there be a manual crank to work the minis?


Not a weapons expert, but I think they were electricity operated, and I don't think they had time to get them operational, as the Somalis were almost on top of them. The Mini-guns from what I understand are pretty complicated pieces of machinery, and it is not easy to keep them going as they require a lot of maintence.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 10:15:58 AM EDT

Originally Posted By FredM:

Originally Posted By bigthicket:
Bookhound, i agree and we know whose politics it was too, thx. Billy Boy!



You are right.

Why the fuck did Bush Sr. have us there?



Bush wasn't President in 1993.

SBG
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 10:16:09 AM EDT
damn

guess you are right that the minis do require a lot of maintainence

at least those rangers/US forces gave em hell
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 12:32:14 PM EDT
An aquaintence of mine was there but doesn't say much about it. He did say the guys from hollywood were like gnats trying to get him to tell his story. Even pestered his parents. Can't confirm it but he said his character is the big eared guy with the machinegun who gets left by the convoy. He looks just like the guy in the movie or vice versa and is damn near deaf.
He is still in service and will be deploying (again) in about two weeks.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 12:37:39 PM EDT

Originally Posted By bigthicket:
THe locals had got rough with the UN people and we were the "backup". Then it turned into a shitstorm. I just hope we learned SOMETHING from this clusterfuck!



Yep, clinton is/was a fucktard.

No armor and no air support.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 12:42:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By rocketman223:
An aquaintence of mine was there but doesn't say much about it. He did say the guys from hollywood were like gnats trying to get him to tell his story. Even pestered his parents. Can't confirm it but he said his character is the big eared guy with the machinegun who gets left by the convoy. He looks just like the guy in the movie or vice versa and is damn near deaf.
He is still in service and will be deploying (again) in about two weeks.



Is he still a Ranger?
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 12:45:55 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:

Originally Posted By RSF45:
The movie is very good, the book is awesome.
For me it's tough to watch because it pisses me off.
We should have leveled that city.




Twice.




And then again just to make sure
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 12:53:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By NonConformist:

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:

Originally Posted By RSF45:
The movie is very good, the book is awesome.
For me it's tough to watch because it pisses me off.
We should have leveled that city.




Twice.




And then again just to make sure


I think leveling would be a bit much, how about just some freaking armor and airsupport.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 12:59:50 PM EDT

Originally Posted By guardian855:

Originally Posted By RSF45:
The movie is very good, the book is awesome.
For me it's tough to watch because it pisses me off.
We should have leveled that city.




Interesting solution to the humanitarian crises we were there for.




The older people worked with us, they wanted us there and they were sad for the way things went. The younger generation were the ones marked with hate, greed and were easily persuaded by the gang leaders.

Thugs.

Leveling the city would have done nothing.

One thing the movie does not portray is that the US Army handed out a serious butt kicking over that time frame. I know they portray 'it' and they lay out some # fact's....But still.

Semper Fi.

All I kept from there were some photo's, $$ and the leaflets that were handed out and dropped. I shipped home a used AT4 tube as well.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 1:01:31 PM EDT
Damned good movie. I think the Army put in an extraordinary effort, considering what they were up against. All I can say is those guys got balls that clank.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 1:02:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By NorCal_LEO:
Just read this about the "Grimesy" character played by Ewan MacGregor. Sorry if dupe, I found it interesting.


December 18, 2001

The Army pressured the filmmakers of "Black Hawk Down" to change the name of the war hero portrayed by Ewan McGregor - because the real-life soldier is serving a 30-year prison term for rape and child molestation, says the man who wrote the book that spawned the movie.
In Ridley Scott's highly anticipated movie, McGregor plays Ranger John Grimes, a desk jockey who is called into battle during the botched Army operation in Somalia in 1993.

The character is based on real-life Ranger John "Stebby" Stebbins, but Pentagon officials asked his name be changed in an attempt to keep his shame a secret, claims author Mark Bowden, who also penned the original screenplay for the movie.

Stebbins' embittered ex-wife, Nora Stebbins, complained in an e-mail to The Post: "They are going to make millions off this film in which my ex-husband is portrayed as an All-American hero when the truth is he is not."

Army sources confirmed to The Post that Stebbins - who was awarded the Silver Star, one of America's highest honors, for his bravery in the bloody Battle of Mogadishu - was court-martialed and sentenced on June 8, 2000.

Janet Wray, a spokeswoman for Fort Leavenworth military prison in Kansas, confirmed yesterday: "We have a John Stebbins here. He arrived on June 9 last year and is serving a 30-year sentence for sodomy with a child under 12 and rape."

"Black Hawk Down," the Jerry Bruckheimer-produced movie which opens Dec. 28, is based on Bowden's best-selling book of the same name.

In the book, Bowden refers to Stebbins by his real name and says he surprised everyone with his heroics.

"He was a changed man, a wild animal, dancing around, shooting like a madman," wrote Bowden, who also penned the original draft of the screenplay.

But Stebbins will not get to see McGregor's portrayal of him in the $95 million film, which was filmed in Kenitra, Morocco, in March this year.

"As it happened, Stebbins got in trouble with the law," Bowden was quoted as saying recently. "The Army asked us to change the name."

A Revolution Studios spokeswoman would say only that the name-change was "a creative decision made by the producers."

"There were 100 men in the battle and only 40 speaking parts, so we had to condense some of the characters," she said. "[Grimes] is one who is a compilation of a number of soldiers who fought in that battle so his name was changed."

Stebbins, 36, a former baker from upstate Ithaca, had tried and failed to join the Army three times during the Persian Gulf War and finally made it into the crack Rangers unit, Bowden's book says.

But he worked as a company clerk, and was ribbed by his fellow soldiers as "chief coffee maker" and "paper pusher."



Before the movie came out there was a website that discussed this very issue. Many of the actual BHD participants felt that Stebby got the wrong end of the justice stick and felt that his wife set this up. I'm not familiar with his case but it seems as if there was enough evidence to convict him.

What he did that day was truely brave, what he did after that was not. The movie honors what happened that day to those men, not their actions since October 1993.

The book is excellent by the way and should be read before the movie is seen. So much more intense action in the book. The movie does alright but really condenses a lot of the information and action. The movie is still good though.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 1:06:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By warlord:
NorCal_LEO: That is unfortunate of what happened to the soldier in real life. These people are flesh and blood like any one of us, and are not supermen and are vulnerable just like anyone of us.

+1 Thanks for shittin in my cereal
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 1:09:31 PM EDT
I read the book twice and have seen the movie countless times.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 1:11:51 PM EDT
followed by the premiere of Rescue Me
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 1:18:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Forest:

Originally Posted By RSF45:
The movie is very good, the book is awesome.
For me it's tough to watch because it pisses me off.
We should have leveled that city.




My sentiments EXACTLY.


But that's why we're the badass good guys. We could've leveled the city but chose to take the slings and arrows to only deal with the true bad guys.

Sorry if that sounds PC, I just think it's really fantastic that we have the power, and we choose to stick our necks out to avoid creating unnecessary casualties.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 1:22:51 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/21/2005 1:23:30 PM EDT by Stryfe]

Originally Posted By ScaryBlackGuns:

Originally Posted By FredM:

Originally Posted By bigthicket:
Bookhound, i agree and we know whose politics it was too, thx. Billy Boy!



You are right.

Why the fuck did Bush Sr. have us there?



Bush wasn't President in 1993.

SBG


Bush got us into Somalia.
It wasn't Bush that withdrew military support.
It wasn't Bush that thought that tanks would appear to be too aggressive even while ordering assaults into the city.
If there's a just God, Les Aspin is roasting in hell right now.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 1:35:38 PM EDT
My wife loves me. She got me the 3-disk special edition.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 1:55:48 PM EDT
Good think I searched! I just noticed that it is on tonight! Might have to watch it, then watch what's left of the game.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 2:06:08 PM EDT
Awesome movie. Compelling. Sad.

#2 on my all-time favorite list.

#1 is Braveheart.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 2:10:09 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/21/2005 2:16:07 PM EDT by warlord]

Originally Posted By Only_Hits_Count:

Originally Posted By bigthicket:
THe locals had got rough with the UN people and we were the "backup". Then it turned into a shitstorm. I just hope we learned SOMETHING from this clusterfuck!



Yep, clinton is/was a fucktard.

No armor and no air support.


Then Def Sec Les Aspen "took the bullet" for Bill Clinton. I'm sure this stuff went straight to Bill himself for a decision, because throughout the Clintons'(bill & hillary) administration, Bill & Hillary kept their minions on a pretty short leash.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 2:15:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By muddawggin:
Damned good movie. I think the Army put in an extraordinary effort, considering what they were up against. All I can say is those guys got balls that clank.


I've got the early DVD, and on one of the tracks extra footage, they should many of the actors got a short ranger course at a closed US Army base. Also the US Army loaned real Blackhawk choppers for the movie, and had an extensive hand in the technical stuff.

Death2usama: Sorry, but these guys are not gods, they were just doing their jobs, but they just did their jobs extraordinarily well.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 2:37:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ScaryBlackGuns:
Bush wasn't President in 1993.



Bush was from January 1 - 20 1993. Bush was responsible for the original mission to Somalia, but not the Ranger/Delta operation going on to get Aidid. That was Clinton's doing.

It's been a while, but seems like 10th Div was there - just checked: the 2-14 INF QRF was dispatched to secure the ground evac route.

Some of us Intel weenies questioned why a tank-heavy task force from 24th ID (M) hadn't been chopped to 10th Inf Div (MTN), since it would provide adequate protection against the technicals and RPGs commonly in use in theatre at the time. The HMMWVs and 5 tons were tin cans.

We also questioned why the 10th Div was under command of a foreign UN commander. That, again, was a decision made during the Bush Administration and not corrected by the Clinton Administration. Had the 10th Div been under US command, the communications/intelligence failures would have been fewer.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 2:42:08 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ScaryBlackGuns:

Originally Posted By FredM:

Originally Posted By bigthicket:
Bookhound, i agree and we know whose politics it was too, thx. Billy Boy!



You are right.

Why the fuck did Bush Sr. have us there?



Bush wasn't President in 1993.

SBG



The initial involvement was under Bush Sr.
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 2:43:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:

Originally Posted By RSF45:
The movie is very good, the book is awesome.
For me it's tough to watch because it pisses me off.
We should have leveled that city.




Twice.



Three times a MOAB..........


I see humanitarian crisis as a bunch of peace keeping troops getting mowed down by every tom,dick,and harriet in that damn ghetto.

There comes a point in life where the house is just SO infested with roaches and filth that it cannot be salvaged.
Better to just level it and start over.

Flame away
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 2:52:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ultramagbrion:

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:

Originally Posted By RSF45:
The movie is very good, the book is awesome.
For me it's tough to watch because it pisses me off.
We should have leveled that city.




Twice.



Three times a MOAB..........


I see humanitarian crisis as a bunch of peace keeping troops getting mowed down by every tom,dick,and harriet in that damn ghetto.

There comes a point in life where the house is just SO infested with roaches and filth that it cannot be salvaged.
Better to just level it and start over.

Flame away



Mogadishu delenda est.

Link Posted: 6/21/2005 2:59:27 PM EDT

Originally Posted By RiffRandall:

Originally Posted By ultramagbrion:

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:

Originally Posted By RSF45:
The movie is very good, the book is awesome.
For me it's tough to watch because it pisses me off.
We should have leveled that city.




Twice.



Three times a MOAB..........


I see humanitarian crisis as a bunch of peace keeping troops getting mowed down by every tom,dick,and harriet in that damn ghetto.

There comes a point in life where the house is just SO infested with roaches and filth that it cannot be salvaged.
Better to just level it and start over.

Flame away



Mogadishu delenda est.




et tu randall
Link Posted: 6/21/2005 3:02:01 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/21/2005 3:05:36 PM EDT by tc556guy]

Originally Posted By wgjhsafT:

Originally Posted By NorCal_LEO:
Just read this about the "Grimesy" character played by Ewan MacGregor. Sorry if dupe, I found it interesting.


December 18, 2001

The Army pressured the filmmakers of "Black Hawk Down" to change the name of the war hero portrayed by Ewan McGregor - because the real-life soldier is serving a 30-year prison term for rape and child molestation, says the man who wrote the book that spawned the movie.
In Ridley Scott's highly anticipated movie, McGregor plays Ranger John Grimes, a desk jockey who is called into battle during the botched Army operation in Somalia in 1993.

The character is based on real-life Ranger John "Stebby" Stebbins, but Pentagon officials asked his name be changed in an attempt to keep his shame a secret, claims author Mark Bowden, who also penned the original screenplay for the movie.

Stebbins' embittered ex-wife, Nora Stebbins, complained in an e-mail to The Post: "They are going to make millions off this film in which my ex-husband is portrayed as an All-American hero when the truth is he is not."

Army sources confirmed to The Post that Stebbins - who was awarded the Silver Star, one of America's highest honors, for his bravery in the bloody Battle of Mogadishu - was court-martialed and sentenced on June 8, 2000.

Janet Wray, a spokeswoman for Fort Leavenworth military prison in Kansas, confirmed yesterday: "We have a John Stebbins here. He arrived on June 9 last year and is serving a 30-year sentence for sodomy with a child under 12 and rape."

"Black Hawk Down," the Jerry Bruckheimer-produced movie which opens Dec. 28, is based on Bowden's best-selling book of the same name.

In the book, Bowden refers to Stebbins by his real name and says he surprised everyone with his heroics.

"He was a changed man, a wild animal, dancing around, shooting like a madman," wrote Bowden, who also penned the original draft of the screenplay.

But Stebbins will not get to see McGregor's portrayal of him in the $95 million film, which was filmed in Kenitra, Morocco, in March this year.

"As it happened, Stebbins got in trouble with the law," Bowden was quoted as saying recently. "The Army asked us to change the name."

A Revolution Studios spokeswoman would say only that the name-change was "a creative decision made by the producers."

"There were 100 men in the battle and only 40 speaking parts, so we had to condense some of the characters," she said. "[Grimes] is one who is a compilation of a number of soldiers who fought in that battle so his name was changed."

Stebbins, 36, a former baker from upstate Ithaca, had tried and failed to join the Army three times during the Persian Gulf War and finally made it into the crack Rangers unit, Bowden's book says.

But he worked as a company clerk, and was ribbed by his fellow soldiers as "chief coffee maker" and "paper pusher."



Before the movie came out there was a website that discussed this very issue. Many of the actual BHD participants felt that Stebby got the wrong end of the justice stick and felt that his wife set this up. I'm not familiar with his case but it seems as if there was enough evidence to convict him.

What he did that day was truely brave, what he did after that was not. The movie honors what happened that day to those men, not their actions since October 1993.

The book is excellent by the way and should be read before the movie is seen. So much more intense action in the book. The movie does alright but really condenses a lot of the information and action. The movie is still good though.


He was a bit of a loose cannon when he was my XO in the NY Guard; maybe his wife set him up, maybe not. Regardless of his previous and subsequent mistakes, yes, he did apparently did good during his time over there.
I posted this link to the local paper when the movie came out, but I'll repost; alittle more info on Stebbins.

www.theithacajournal.com/news/stories/20020118/topstories/1487258.html
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