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10/20/2017 1:01:18 AM
9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/31/2005 11:07:53 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/31/2005 11:09:43 AM EDT by crazyhorse705]
this and gulf port could put the death toll to over 8000 dead.


HOLY SHIT


NBC, MSNBC and news services
Updated: 2:48 p.m. ET Aug. 31, 2005

NEW ORLEANS - In a surprising assessment of Hurricane Katrina’s lethal destruction, New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin said Wednesday he feared that thousands had died in his city alone.

“We know there is a significant number of dead bodies in the water,” Nagin told reporters, adding that there are others dead in attics.

Asked for a number, he said, “Minimum hundreds, most likely thousands.”

The mayor's estimate of the number of dead was far higher than those of other public officials and there was no immediate way to confirm its accuracy. In Mississippi, officials said that at least 100 people were killed by the storm and indicated the toll will almost certainly go much higher.


Shortly before Nagin's remarks, the Bush administration declared a public health emergency across the Gulf Coast, as flooding in New Orleans delayed rescues and forced authorities to lay plans to evacuate 25,000 refugees to Houston's Astrodome.

Health Secretary Michael Leavitt told reporters that 40 medical centers with 10,000 beds would be set up to treat victims. Experts will also be sent to monitor potential disease outbreaks.

In New Orleans, officials plan to evacuate those in shelters using buses. But floodwaters surround the Superdome, so getting buses to the ramps will be difficult, if not impossible. That could mean using boats to ferry evacuees to the buses.

The flooding also threatens the generators providing electricity for the remaining lighting.

The situation inside the dank and sweltering Superdome was becoming desperate: The air conditioning was out, toilets were broken, and tempers rose as did temperatures.

New Orleans was filling with water after an initial attempt to stop one leaking levee failed, while police fought to stop widespread looting in the stricken city.

Louisiana Gov. Kathleen Blanco said everyone now huddled in the Superdome and other rescue centers needs to leave. She said she wanted the Superdome evacuated within two days.

475 buses to be used
“We need to evacuate the people in the Superdome and other shelters and in the hospitals,” she told NBC’s “Today” show on Wednesday. “Those are our basic missions today.”

Officials in Houston, Texas, later said those evacuees would be sent on 475 buses to the city’s Astrodome, located 350 miles away. The stadium’s schedule was cleared through December to make it available.

Some 240 soldiers from the 4th Infantry Division in Ft. Hood, Texas, were told to deploy with 14 helicopters to southern Louisiana Wednesday to help with evacuations. They will join thousands of National Guardsmen and Coast Guard crew helping throughout the region.

Blanco said that trying to fix the levees has been “an engineering nightmare,” with sandbags dropped from the air simply falling “into the eternal black hole.”

At the same time, sections of Interstate 10, the only major freeway leading into New Orleans from the east, lay shattered, dozens of huge slabs of concrete floating in the floodwaters. I-10 is the only route for commercial trucking across southern Louisiana.

“This is a nightmare,” Blanco added, “but one that will give us an opportunity for rebirth.”

Hundreds feared dead
In Mississippi, officials confirmed that at least 100 people had died in the killer storm and said the toll was almost certain to go much higher.

Vincent Creel, a spokesman for Biloxi, Miss., said that in that city alone the death toll is “going to be in the hundreds.”

A 30-foot storm surge in Mississippi wiped away 90 percent of the buildings along the coast at Biloxi and Gulfport, leaving a scene of destruction that Mississippi Gov. Haley Barbour said was “like there’d been a nuclear weapon set off.”

Many areas were “absolutely obliterated,” he told NBC’s “Today” show, making it tough for rescue crews. “You can't see any asphalt because the streets are covered with lumber and shingles and furniture. And so it’s one house at a time; most places it’s not really a house, it's digging through three, four, five feet of rubble to see if anybody’s under there.”

The number of Hurricane Katrina victims in Red Cross shelters across the Gulf Coast was said to be 45,000 and growing.

Some 250 shelters were open in the storm damaged area and the Red Cross had set up 15 emergency kitchens capable of feeding 350,000 people, spokeswoman Deborah Daley said Wednesday.

“This is our largest mobilization in the history of the organization,” she said.

New Orleans dead pushed aside
U.S. Sen. Mary Landrieu of Louisiana said she had heard at least 50 to 100 people were dead in New Orleans, where rescue teams were so busy saving people stranded in homes they had to leave bodies floating in the high waters.

Rescuers in boats and helicopters plucked bedraggled flood refugees from rooftops and attics. Louisiana Lt. Gov. Mitch Landrieu said 3,000 people have been rescued by boat and air, some placed shivering and wet into helicopter baskets. They were brought by the truckload into shelters, some in wheelchairs and some carrying babies, with stories of survival and of those who didn’t make it.

Katrina, one of the most punishing storms to hit the United States in decades, struck Louisiana on Monday with 140 mph, then slammed into neighboring Mississippi and Alabama.

New Orleans at first appeared to have received a glancing blow, but the raging waters of Lake Pontchartrain tore holes in the levees that protects the low-lying city, then slowly filled it up.

Nagin said at least 80 percent of the city, much of it below sea level, was covered with water that was in places 20 feet deep.

In Jefferson Parish, one of the hardest-hit areas, parish president Aaron Broussard said a complete rebuilding would be required. “Jefferson Parish as we knew it is gone forever,” he told reporters.

500-foot hole in one levee
To repair one of the levees holding back Lake Pontchartrain, officials late Tuesday dropped 3,000-pound sandbags from helicopters and hauled dozens of 15-foot concrete barriers into the breach. Maj. Gen. Don Riley of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers said officials also had a more audacious plan: finding a barge to plug the 500-foot hole.

Riley said it could take close to a month to get the water out of the city. If the water rises a few feet higher, it could also wipe out the water system for the whole city, said New Orleans’ homeland security chief, Terry Ebbert.

Corps senior project engineer Al Naomi said the biggest ally in the fight to save the city may be nature itself, he said.

“The flow has pretty much eased mainly because the lake is dropping in elevation,” Naomi told Reuters.

In 36 hours, the lake, which was whipped high by the storm, should return to normal levels and the water now flooding New Orleans would begin to drain, Naomi said.

He said the historic French Quarter, the hallmark of New Orleans and the main draw for its huge tourist industry, should escape with only minor flooding because it sits five feet above sea level.

The floods knocked out electricity, contaminated the city water supply and cut off most highway routes into New Orleans.

A million people fled before Katrina arrived, but those who stayed were running out of food and water.

'You loot, I shoot'
Wild scenes of looting erupted around the Crescent city as people broke into stores to grab supplies, but also television sets, jewelry, clothes and computers.

In some areas, gun-toting citizens took to the streets to try to restore order. Where it was still dry, store owners were seen sitting in front of their businesses, guns in hand.

One had put up a sign: “You loot, I shoot,” it said.

Authorities were so intent on rescuing flood victims that at first they chose to let the looting go unstopped.

But Mayor Nagin said 3,500 National Guard troops were being sent to the city, and state police director H.L. Whitehorn was sending 40 state troopers and two armored personnel carriers.

“It’s a lot of chaos right now,” Whitehorn said of the looting

Surreal scene in Biloxi
In devastated Biloxi, areas that were not underwater were littered with tree trunks, downed power lines and chunks of broken concrete. Some buildings were flattened.

The string of floating barge casinos crucial to the coastal economy were a shambles. At least three of them were picked up by the storm surge and carried inland, their barnacle-covered hulls sitting up to 200 yards inland.

One of the deadliest spots appeared to be Biloxi’s Quiet Water Beach apartments, where authorities estimated 30 people were washed away, although the exact toll was unknown. All that was left of the red-brick building was a concrete slab.

“We grabbed a lady and pulled her out the window and then we swam with the current,” 55-year-old Joy Schovest said through tears. “It was terrifying. You should have seen the cars floating around us. We had to push them away when we were trying to swim.”

Health concerns, oil prices
Before striking the Gulf Coast, Katrina last week hit southern Florida and killed 11 people.

Federal Emergency Management Agency director Mike Brown warned that structural damage to homes, diseases from animal carcasses and chemicals in floodwaters made it unsafe for residents to come home anytime soon.

FEMA is considering putting people on cruise ships, in tent cities, mobile home parks, and so-called floating dormitories — boats the agency uses to house its own employees.

The storm also swept through oil and gas fields in the Gulf of Mexico, source of 20 percent to 25 percent of U.S. production of the commodities. U.S. oil prices on Tuesday jumped $3.65 a barrel to peak at $70.85 as oil firms assessed damage.

The Bush administration said Wednesday it would release oil from federal petroleum reserves to help refiners affected by Katrina.

Katrina, which was downgraded to a tropical depression, packed winds around 30 mph as it moved through the Ohio Valley early Wednesday, with the potential to dump 8 inches of rain and spin off deadly tornadoes.

Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:10:02 AM EDT
No shit.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:10:08 AM EDT
That poor guy hasn't slept in days. I take what he says with a grain of salt.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:10:40 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:17:40 AM EDT
Someone this board from another said that this could a reasonable number.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:18:50 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/31/2005 11:19:46 AM EDT by LARRYG]

Originally Posted By michaelj1978:
Dupe.

www.foxnews.com/



It's a dupe on ar15.com of a Fox story??????????????

ETA, I don't think the number will be any where near that.

Also, everyone had at minimum 3 days notice.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:21:02 AM EDT
He is also mad that his 'carefully laid out plan' for recovery isn't being followed by the Corps of Engineers and nature.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:21:31 AM EDT

Originally Posted By LARRYG:

Originally Posted By michaelj1978:
Dupe.

www.foxnews.com/



It's a dupe on ar15.com of a Fox story??????????????



ty for that these people must not think when they type DUPE because i have been on here off and on since 7am i am being carfeul not to dupe another thread.


Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:23:21 AM EDT
Doesn't surprise me one bit.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:25:40 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/31/2005 11:26:02 AM EDT by crazyhorse705]
oh hell yeah their sending in the navy seals for some rescue/asskicking missions. read red part.


NEW ORLEANS Aug 31, 2005 — The mayor said Wednesday that Hurricane Katrina probably killed thousands of people in New Orleans.

"We know there is a significant number of dead bodies in the water," and others dead in attics, Mayor Ray Nagin said. Asked how many, he said: "Minimum, hundreds. Most likely, thousands."

The frightening prediction came as Army engineers struggled to plug New Orleans' breached levees with giant sandbags and concrete barriers, while authorities drew up plans to move some 25,000 storm refugees out of the city to Houston in a huge bus convoy and all but abandon flooded-out New Orleans.

Gov. Kathleen Blanco said the situation was desperate and there was no choice but to clear out.

"The logistical problems are impossible and we have to evacuate people in shelters," the governor said. "It's becoming untenable. There's no power. It's getting more difficult to get food and water supplies in, just basic essentials."

The Pentagon, meanwhile, began mounting one of the largest search-and-rescue operations in U.S. history, sending four Navy ships to the Gulf Coast with drinking water and other emergency supplies, along with the hospital ship USNS Comfort, search helicopters and elite SEAL water-rescue teams. American Red Cross workers from across the country converged on the devastated region in the agency's biggest-ever relief operation.

The death toll from Hurricane Katrina has reached at least 110 in Mississippi alone. But Louisiana has put aside the counting of the dead to concentrate on rescuing the living, many of whom were still trapped on rooftops and in attics.

A full day after the Big Easy thought it had escaped Katrina's full fury, two levees broke and spilled water into the streets Tuesday, swamping an estimated 80 percent of the bowl-shaped, below-sea-level city, inundating miles and miles of homes and rendering much of New Orleans uninhabitable for weeks or months.

"We are looking at 12 to 16 weeks before people can come in," Nagin said on ABC's "Good Morning America, "and the other issue that's concerning me is we have dead bodies in the water. At some point in time the dead bodies are going to start to create a serious disease issue."

With the streets awash and looters brazenly cleaning out stores, authorities planned to move at least 25,000 of New Orlean's storm refugees most of them taking shelter in the dank and sweltering Superdome to the Astrodome in Houston in a vast exodus by bus.

Around midday, officials with the state and the Army Corps of Engineers said the water levels between the city and Lake Pontchartrain had equalized, and water had stopped rising in New Orleans, and even appeared to be falling, at least in some places. But the danger was far from over.

The Army Corps of Engineers said it planned to use heavy-duty Chinook helicopters to drop 3,000-pound sandbags Wednesday into the 500-foot gap in the failed floodwall. But the agency said it was having trouble getting the sandbags and dozens of 15-foot highway barriers to the site because the city's waterways were blocked by loose barges, boats and large debris.

Officials said they were also looking at a more audacious plan: finding a barge to plug the 500-foot hole.

"The challenge is an engineering nightmare," the governor said on ABC's "Good Morning America."

As New Orleans descended deeper into chaos, hundreds of people wandered aimlessly up and down Interstate 10, pushing shopping carts, laundry racks, anything they could find to carry their belongings. Dozens of fishermen from up to 200 miles away floated in on caravans of boats to pull residents out of flooded neighborhoods.

On some of the few roads that were still passable, people waved at passing cars with empty water jugs, begging for relief. Hundreds of people appeared to have spent the night on a crippled highway.

In one east New orleans neighborhood, refugees were being loaded onto the backs of moving vans like cattle, and in one case emergency workers with a sledgehammer and an ax broke open the back of a mail truck and used it to ferry sick and elderly residents.

Police officers were asking residents to give up any guns they had before they boarded buses and trucks because police desperately needed the firepower: Some officers who had been stranded on the roof of a motel said they were being shot at overnight.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:28:15 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/31/2005 11:29:42 AM EDT by jkstexas2001]

Originally Posted By ZW17:
That poor guy hasn't slept in days. I take what he says with a grain of salt.



Why do you find that figure so hard to believe? Do you really believe only a couple of hundred folks got killed overall?

--Gulfport, pop 70,000, a little over half made it out, has been wiped off the map
--Biloxi - same story
--Metairie - same story
--Gretna - same story
--Slidell, MS --same story

then you throw in New Orleans

the total death toll could easily reach between 10,000 and 20,000. Some folks do not realize the scale of the destruction here - combined with many folks deciding to "ride it out" because previous hurricanes weren't that bad, could make this the worst natural disaster (in terms of human lost and cost, and economic impact) that the US has ever experienced.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:30:53 AM EDT

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:

Originally Posted By ZW17:
That poor guy hasn't slept in days. I take what he says with a grain of salt.



Why do you find that figure so hard to believe? Do you really believe only a couple of hundred folks got killed overall?

--Gulfport, pop 70,000, a little over half made it out, has been wiped off the map
--Biloxi - same story
--Metairie - same story
--Gretna - same story
--Slidell, MS --same story

then you throw in New Orleans

the total death toll could easily reach between 10,000 and 20,000. Some folks do not realize the scale of the destruction here - combined with many folks deciding to "ride it out" because previous hurricanes weren't that bad, could make this the worst natural disaster (in terms of human lost and cost, and economic impact) that the US has ever experienced.



I agree. I'm not sure that the full impact of what happened down there has been realized yet by most people in the US or even the media. The next few days and weeks I fear are going to be real eye openers...
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:34:13 AM EDT

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:

Originally Posted By ZW17:
That poor guy hasn't slept in days. I take what he says with a grain of salt.



Why do you find that figure so hard to believe? Do you really believe only a couple of hundred folks got killed overall?

--Gulfport, pop 70,000, a little over half made it out, has been wiped off the map
--Biloxi - same story
--Metairie - same story
--Gretna - same story
--Slidell, MS --same story

then you throw in New Orleans

the total death toll could easily reach between 10,000 and 20,000. Some folks do not realize the scale of the destruction here - combined with many folks deciding to "ride it out" because previous hurricanes weren't that bad, could make this the worst natural disaster (in terms of human lost and cost, and economic impact) that the US has ever experienced.



It's not that I don't believe that 1000's have died, I just have been watching him on the local news station for the past few days and he is becoming zombie like. He needs to rest and let someone else take over for a day.

Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:37:13 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:42:40 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/31/2005 11:43:02 AM EDT by eodtech2000]

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:

Originally Posted By ZW17:
That poor guy hasn't slept in days. I take what he says with a grain of salt.



Why do you find that figure so hard to believe? Do you really believe only a couple of hundred folks got killed overall?

--Gulfport, pop 70,000, a little over half made it out, has been wiped off the map
--Biloxi - same story
--Metairie - same story
--Gretna - same story
--Slidell, MS --same story

then you throw in New Orleans

the total death toll could easily reach between 10,000 and 20,000. Some folks do not realize the scale of the destruction here - combined with many folks deciding to "ride it out" because previous hurricanes weren't that bad, could make this the worst natural disaster (in terms of human lost and cost, and economic impact) that the US has ever experienced.



Here what I have heard about Keesler AFB in Biloxi.

Huge damage at Keesler

* Base Commander is estimating $800M -$900M
* Every single structure is damaged
* Entire Housing areas under water
* Everyone accounted for - no deaths at Keesler
* Storm so powerful, picked The President Casino up and threw it across the street
* Beau Rivage - water up to 3rd story
* Keesler is limping through with generators
* 80% of all trees - gone
* 9 Foot water in commissary/BX
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:42:54 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/31/2005 11:43:50 AM EDT by crazyhorse705]

Originally Posted By Aimless:

Originally Posted By NewbHunter:


I agree. I'm not sure that the full impact of what happened down there has been realized yet by most people in the US or even the media. The next few days and weeks I fear are going to be real eye openers...



I don't watch television, but I did look at wwltv's weblink. Their coverage definitely gives the impression that the city and state were woefully unprepared for this and that the government is not capable of handling this.



this is not good at all my last 2 threads have been visited either by a moderator or the site staff.

im going to go hide my dog now.

yeah i dont think we have seen the worst of it yet.remeber they were told New orleans was going to taking this full force not mississippi,alabama,and florida.

lots of the people left behind were sick,very old,poor.and no one thought at the last second the bitch would veer east towards mississippi,bama,or florida.



Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:45:49 AM EDT
"Is the situation dangerous... Authorities say no, but my producer says 'yes'."
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:58:45 AM EDT
And, as much as I hate reminding folks of this, we are still early in the hurricane season...

Link Posted: 8/31/2005 12:04:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Aimless:
I don't watch television, but I did look at wwltv's weblink. Their coverage definitely gives the impression that the city and state were woefully unprepared for this and that the government is not capable of handling this.



Probably, but I don't think there really is any realistic preparation for this. It was always known that if the levees started to give way, it could get real ugly real quick.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 12:06:36 PM EDT
Clearly they will find many many dead bodies in the submerged houses.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 12:09:15 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 12:14:09 PM EDT
What a mess
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 12:16:03 PM EDT
And...someone has set fire to the French Quarter also. The animals are trying to control the zoo I spose.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 1:23:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By michaelj1978:
Dupe.

www.foxnews.com/



Dupe policeman - stick it where the sun don't shine.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 1:25:17 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 1:32:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/31/2005 1:32:59 PM EDT by guns762]

Originally Posted By Sylvan:
You think he is scared? Mary Landreu just lost her reelection.
All her voters are drowning or being shot for looting.


Dang it! that is funny; wrong, but very funny.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 1:39:14 PM EDT
I think the worst hasn't even happened yet.

There is a medical epidemic waiting the begin.

Link Posted: 8/31/2005 1:43:41 PM EDT

Originally Posted By HardShell:
And, as much as I hate reminding folks of this, we are still early in the hurricane season...




Yeah......I am really scared of how many people they are going to find in these attics when they can finally drain the city.........I really do not think that a few thousand deaths is unrealistic at all.......
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 2:01:03 PM EDT

Originally Posted By go3:
He is also mad that his 'carefully laid out plan' for recovery isn't being followed by the Corps of Engineers and nature.



Yea, he's mad all right-

He made the comment that "there are too many cooks in the kitchen" and he's "hot about it" referring to the Army Corps of Engineers not following his orders to clog that levee break.


Dude either needs a break, or frankly - comment removed for CoC compliance- if you ask me!
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 2:18:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Sylvan:
You think he is scared? Mary Landreu just lost her reelection.
All her voters are drowning or being shot for looting.



She is against the AWB...I'll trade you Dewine or Voinovich, both Rs, if you don't want her...
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 2:20:22 PM EDT
A lot of ppl. probably won't be found, at least in the costal areas...
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 2:27:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/31/2005 2:28:12 PM EDT by supersix4]

Originally Posted By Sylvan:
You think he is scared? Mary Landreu just lost her reelection.
All her voters are drowning or being shot for looting.




Link Posted: 8/31/2005 2:51:48 PM EDT
At the same time, sections of Interstate 10, the only major freeway leading into New Orleans from the east, lay shattered, dozens of huge slabs of concrete floating in the floodwaters. I-10 is the only route for commercial trucking across southern Louisiana.





On a more serious note: I hope those numbers are not nearly that high even though there will be a significant loss of life.
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 11:52:57 AM EDT
The govt needs to broadcast public service announcements explaining that it is hard to swim when your pockets are full of looted jewelry.
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 11:54:01 AM EDT
there will be a lot of dead in their attics, unable to summon help.
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 12:00:51 PM EDT
How many of the dead will later be found to have stab wounds and/or gunshot wounds?
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 12:20:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/1/2005 12:25:10 PM EDT by Villuj_idiot]

Originally Posted By thinman:
At the same time, sections of Interstate 10, the only major freeway leading into New Orleans from the east, lay shattered, dozens of huge slabs of concrete floating in the floodwaters. I-10 is the only route for commercial trucking across southern Louisiana.








I'm not sure I understand your emphasis, but concrete does float. During WWII we had hundreds, if not thousands, of concrete ocean-going vessels, if you include the barges.

http://www.concreteships.org/history/

Link Posted: 9/1/2005 12:35:20 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 12:38:36 PM EDT
After watching the new WWL footage, I increase my estimate of the death toll to 20,000. Some of the towns they showed looked like THERE WAS NEVER A TOWN in that location. If even 5 percent decided to "ride it out", we are talking tens of thousands of deaths. Just prepare yourself for the numbers to go up. I have never been so sad in my life.
Link Posted: 9/2/2005 4:34:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/2/2005 4:35:03 PM EDT by jkstexas2001]
Senator say death toll could pass 10,000

news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20050902/pl_afp/usweatherdeaths
Link Posted: 9/14/2005 12:52:03 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
Senator say death toll could pass 10,000

news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20050902/pl_afp/usweatherdeaths



Reality says "senator is full of shit". It does not appear that the death toll will be a tenth of that.
Link Posted: 9/14/2005 12:55:27 PM EDT
Katrina death toll now 659.
Link Posted: 9/14/2005 3:23:16 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AR15fan:
Katrina death toll now 659.



water is still not all the way out it will climb but not to the highs the mayor thought. maybe a 2000 or 3000 thousand.
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