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Posted: 11/20/2008 10:35:14 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 10:37:15 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 10:41:11 AM EDT
What do they carry on airplanes to sedate someone?

A heavy 3D flashlight....
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 10:50:21 AM EDT
if I was on a plane and they asked this if any passenger was a qualified pilot.

they had better have a suitcase full of money waiting for me on the ground

but really though they make it sound like the Attendant actually landed the plane alone.
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 10:52:24 AM EDT
Did any of you guys see the Mythbusters episode on this?

They had a pilot walk both of them through landing the plane over the radio (simulator).

Dont ALL of these planes have the ability to land themselves?
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 10:53:30 AM EDT
Originally Posted By AZ_Sky:
What do they carry on airplanes to sedate someone?

A heavy 3D flashlight....



Probably a big whack of Valium or Ativan..
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 11:00:33 AM EDT
Originally Posted By skygod:
Did any of you guys see the Mythbusters episode on this?

They had a pilot walk both of them through landing the plane over the radio (simulator).

Dont ALL of these planes have the ability to land themselves?


Not only can't all planes land themselves, the airport must also have the specialized instrument landing system that supports the 'autoland' feature. Additionally, its not even close to totally automated and someone must be able to operate the computers at least.
Since their was still actually a pilot in control, I doubt that anyone was in serious danger. The pilot might have been a bit overworked though.
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 11:07:48 AM EDT
license for reading instruments?

uh...perhaps the journalist meant instrument license?

Link Posted: 11/20/2008 11:08:17 AM EDT
I can see it now....

Copilot wigs out.

Hot Attendant comes in to help.

Pilot starts freaking out on landing.....OMG, OMG...We have problems..We're going in...We're going Tits Up!! ....Pull your Boobies out now!!!..............
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 11:09:05 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 12:06:57 PM EDT
I'm not a rated pilot, but I'm still working on my private pilot's license. (Supposedly...when I have the time to commit to it.) But I can guarantee you that a 767 is not a tough aircraft to fly and I think half the arfcommers reading this topic would be able to sit in the copilot's seat, take directions from the pilot, and see a successful landing. Better yet, I'd say that
nearly 100 percent of us could do that, and more than half of us could actually land it under
clear skies and good visibility conditions, given a little guidance.


I'll stick my neck way out and say that I could land any modern airliner myself, if I just have
a few minutes to familiarize myself with the fundamentals of landing that plane. Range of
approach speeds, flap and spoiler settings, location and operation of flaps, spoilers, and
thrust reversers, optimal touchdown speed, etc. Ten minutes with the checklists would
be sufficient.

I think anyone here who has any pilot experience could do the same thing.


CJ
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 12:25:14 PM EDT
Originally Posted By cmjohnson:
I'm not a rated pilot, but I'm still working on my private pilot's license. (Supposedly...when I have the time to commit to it.) But I can guarantee you that a 767 is not a tough aircraft to fly and I think half the arfcommers reading this topic would be able to sit in the copilot's seat, take directions from the pilot, and see a successful landing. Better yet, I'd say that
nearly 100 percent of us could do that, and more than half of us could actually land it under
clear skies and good visibility conditions, given a little guidance.


I'll stick my neck way out and say that I could land any modern airliner myself, if I just have
a few minutes to familiarize myself with the fundamentals of landing that plane. Range of
approach speeds, flap and spoiler settings, location and operation of flaps, spoilers, and
thrust reversers, optimal touchdown speed, etc. Ten minutes with the checklists would
be sufficient.

I think anyone here who has any pilot experience could do the same thing.


CJ



I think CMJ is generally right.

I have my private ticket, and I'm confident I could get a big jet on the ground in mostly one piece. Might need a little touch up here and there, and I would probably
need new shorts afterwards, but I bet it could be done.

Shit, I'd worry more about landing a P-51 than I would a 747.

<sits back and listens to the commercial pilots laugh>

Link Posted: 11/20/2008 3:13:21 PM EDT
Originally Posted By James23:
Originally Posted By cmjohnson:
I'm not a rated pilot, but I'm still working on my private pilot's license. (Supposedly...when I have the time to commit to it.) But I can guarantee you that a 767 is not a tough aircraft to fly and I think half the arfcommers reading this topic would be able to sit in the copilot's seat, take directions from the pilot, and see a successful landing. Better yet, I'd say that
nearly 100 percent of us could do that, and more than half of us could actually land it under
clear skies and good visibility conditions, given a little guidance.


I'll stick my neck way out and say that I could land any modern airliner myself, if I just have
a few minutes to familiarize myself with the fundamentals of landing that plane. Range of
approach speeds, flap and spoiler settings, location and operation of flaps, spoilers, and
thrust reversers, optimal touchdown speed, etc. Ten minutes with the checklists would
be sufficient.

I think anyone here who has any pilot experience could do the same thing.


CJ



I think CMJ is generally right.

I have my private ticket, and I'm confident I could get a big jet on the ground in mostly one piece. Might need a little touch up here and there, and I would probably
need new shorts afterwards, but I bet it could be done.

Shit, I'd worry more about landing a P-51 than I would a 747.

<sits back and listens to the commercial pilots laugh>

I "landed" a Delta 727 simulator(yes,the real thing)when I was 11,wasn't hard at all. Landing a date with a faithful flight attendant,much harder.(damned lying skank!)

Link Posted: 11/20/2008 3:20:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/20/2008 3:23:00 PM EDT by Frost7]


The front end is for terrorists, the back end is for unruly co-pilots' heads.

Originally Posted By cmjohnson:
I think anyone here who has any pilot experience could do the same thing.

Yeah. Biggest issue is "where is everything and what switch does what."

Get past that and usually, a plane is a plane.

Granted, in a 767 you can't do a few hard S-curves on the way in to bleed off some speed and time.
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 3:24:42 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Frost7:
http://quanticotactical.com/graphics/40/410504ODL.jpg

The front end is for terrorists, the back end is for unruly co-pilots' heads.

Originally Posted By cmjohnson:
I think anyone here who has any pilot experience could do the same thing.

Yeah. Biggest issue is "where is everything and what switch does what."

Get past that and usually, a plane is a plane.

Granted, in a 767 you can't do a few hard S-curves on the way in to bleed off some speed and time.


I'd tend to agree. Put me in the right seat of a KC-135 and I can be helpful. Put me sitting second in a 767 and I'll sure answer the radio and given a few minutes to look around lower the flaps on command.
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 3:24:46 PM EDT
In the movie THE HIGH AND THE MIGHTY, there is one scene were the pilot (played by Robert Stack) can't take the stress anymore, and wigs out. The co-pilot (played by John Wayne) reaches over and slaps him in the face a couple times - and these here ain't no love taps, either.

Stack manages to pull himself together, then says "Thanks for knocking some sense into me!"

Sounds like the back side of Duke's hand would have come in handy here as well.
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 3:28:02 PM EDT
[Airplane!]"Excuse me ladies and gentlemen...does anybody know how to fly this plane?"[/Airplane!]
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 3:34:52 PM EDT
Wonder if he could have had a diabetic emergency i.e. hypoglycemia ?
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 3:39:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/20/2008 3:39:26 PM EDT by Nighthawk08]
Originally Posted By omega62:
In the movie THE HIGH AND THE MIGHTY, there is one scene were the pilot (played by Robert Stack) can't take the stress anymore, and wigs out. The co-pilot (played by John Wayne) reaches over and slaps him in the face a couple times - and these here ain't no love taps, either.

Stack manages to pull himself together, then says "Thanks for knocking some sense into me!"

Sounds like the back side of Duke's hand would have come in handy here as well.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnrTq9Y-uJY

CRM at its finest!
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 3:41:54 PM EDT
Originally Posted By GR8TWYT:
Wonder if he could have had a diabetic emergency i.e. hypoglycemia ?


I had an ex girlfriend that was not diabetic, but had to eat at exact intervals or she'd have low blood sugar. She turned into a roaring bitch when her blood sugar hit the "I'm ready for dinner NOW" point in time. It really was something to behold.

Link Posted: 11/20/2008 3:58:21 PM EDT
Originally Posted By GR8TWYT:
Wonder if he could have had a diabetic emergency i.e. hypoglycemia ?


not if he ended up in a mental ward for 11 days
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 4:21:24 PM EDT
Originally Posted By TheAvatar9265ft:
Originally Posted By GR8TWYT:
Wonder if he could have had a diabetic emergency i.e. hypoglycemia ?


not if he ended up in a mental ward for 11 days


Good point.
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 4:28:00 PM EDT
Originally Posted By GR8TWYT:
Wonder if he could have had a diabetic emergency i.e. hypoglycemia ?


I don't know this for a fact, but I doubt airline pilots can continue to fly if they have diabetes.
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 4:37:16 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 4:48:21 PM EDT
Sedation on airplanes. I was wondering the same thing tonight when I read the article. Why is there always a doctor and ability to sedate when you read these stories...

If I were to guess, airlines began carrying auto-injectors for such situations (probably diazepam). They're probably locked away in a certain part of the plane due to the fact they're a class 4 narcotic.

Relatively simple to use with minimal medical knowledge. Will knock down crazed passengers, nutty pilots or the occasional shoe bomber in a matter of minutes.
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 4:52:28 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/20/2008 4:54:28 PM EDT by BillofRights]
I can clarify a couple things for the the non aviators amongst us. A pilot in either seat can land any commercial aircraft without the help of any flight attendants (except for the occasional backrub and cup of coffee) The "Attendent helps land plane" is was purely unnecessary.

Pilots are immediately disqualified if they show even a hint of Diabeetus or any other disease. Naturally some pilots get very good at ignoring and hiding symptoms since their entire livelihood depends on maintaining perfect health.


Airliners do carry a special medical kit that is only allowed to be opened by a DR. I don't recall if there is a sedative included, but I would assume it does.
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 7:31:53 PM EDT
Originally Posted By cmjohnson:
I'm not a rated pilot, but I'm still working on my private pilot's license. (Supposedly...when I have the time to commit to it.) But I can guarantee you that a 767 is not a tough aircraft to fly and I think half the arfcommers reading this topic would be able to sit in the copilot's seat, take directions from the pilot, and see a successful landing. Better yet, I'd say that
nearly 100 percent of us could do that, and more than half of us could actually land it under
clear skies and good visibility conditions, given a little guidance.


I'll stick my neck way out and say that I could land any modern airliner myself, if I just have
a few minutes to familiarize myself with the fundamentals of landing that plane. Range of
approach speeds, flap and spoiler settings, location and operation of flaps, spoilers, and
thrust reversers, optimal touchdown speed, etc. Ten minutes with the checklists would
be sufficient.

I think anyone here who has any pilot experience could do the same thing.


CJ


I have the hardest time judging when to begin the descent, and my rate usually sux too. I need to get better at reading the VOR/DME.

Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:23:05 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/21/2008 1:28:06 AM EDT by luvpilot]
Originally Posted By James23:
Originally Posted By cmjohnson:
I'm not a rated pilot, but I'm still working on my private pilot's license. (Supposedly...when I have the time to commit to it.) But I can guarantee you that a 767 is not a tough aircraft to fly and I think half the arfcommers reading this topic would be able to sit in the copilot's seat, take directions from the pilot, and see a successful landing. Better yet, I'd say that
nearly 100 percent of us could do that, and more than half of us could actually land it under
clear skies and good visibility conditions, given a little guidance.


I'll stick my neck way out and say that I could land any modern airliner myself, if I just have
a few minutes to familiarize myself with the fundamentals of landing that plane. Range of
approach speeds, flap and spoiler settings, location and operation of flaps, spoilers, and
thrust reversers, optimal touchdown speed, etc. Ten minutes with the checklists would
be sufficient.

I think anyone here who has any pilot experience could do the same thing.


CJ



I think CMJ is generally right.

I have my private ticket, and I'm confident I could get a big jet on the ground in mostly one piece. Might need a little touch up here and there, and I would probably
need new shorts afterwards, but I bet it could be done.

Shit, I'd worry more about landing a P-51 than I would a 747.

<sits back and listens to the commercial pilots laugh>



With all do respect, no..they couldn't.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:49:04 AM EDT
Originally Posted By luvpilot:
Originally Posted By James23:
Originally Posted By cmjohnson:
I'm not a rated pilot, but I'm still working on my private pilot's license. (Supposedly...when I have the time to commit to it.) But I can guarantee you that a 767 is not a tough aircraft to fly and I think half the arfcommers reading this topic would be able to sit in the copilot's seat, take directions from the pilot, and see a successful landing. Better yet, I'd say that
nearly 100 percent of us could do that, and more than half of us could actually land it under
clear skies and good visibility conditions, given a little guidance.


I'll stick my neck way out and say that I could land any modern airliner myself, if I just have
a few minutes to familiarize myself with the fundamentals of landing that plane. Range of
approach speeds, flap and spoiler settings, location and operation of flaps, spoilers, and
thrust reversers, optimal touchdown speed, etc. Ten minutes with the checklists would
be sufficient.

I think anyone here who has any pilot experience could do the same thing.


CJ



I think CMJ is generally right.

I have my private ticket, and I'm confident I could get a big jet on the ground in mostly one piece. Might need a little touch up here and there, and I would probably
need new shorts afterwards, but I bet it could be done.

Shit, I'd worry more about landing a P-51 than I would a 747.

<sits back and listens to the commercial pilots laugh>



With all do respect, no..they couldn't.


+1

They will most likely put it in the dirt. It's still an airplane, but it isn't like landing a 172.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 1:52:25 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Patriot328:
+1

They will most likely put it in the dirt. It's still an airplane, but it isn't like landing a 172.

I never had a problem in simulators.

(Famous last words )
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 4:58:26 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Patriot328:
Originally Posted By luvpilot:
Originally Posted By James23:
Originally Posted By cmjohnson:
I'm not a rated pilot, but I'm still working on my private pilot's license. (Supposedly...when I have the time to commit to it.) But I can guarantee you that a 767 is not a tough aircraft to fly and I think half the arfcommers reading this topic would be able to sit in the copilot's seat, take directions from the pilot, and see a successful landing. Better yet, I'd say that
nearly 100 percent of us could do that, and more than half of us could actually land it under
clear skies and good visibility conditions, given a little guidance.


I'll stick my neck way out and say that I could land any modern airliner myself, if I just have
a few minutes to familiarize myself with the fundamentals of landing that plane. Range of
approach speeds, flap and spoiler settings, location and operation of flaps, spoilers, and
thrust reversers, optimal touchdown speed, etc. Ten minutes with the checklists would
be sufficient.

I think anyone here who has any pilot experience could do the same thing.


CJ



I think CMJ is generally right.

I have my private ticket, and I'm confident I could get a big jet on the ground in mostly one piece. Might need a little touch up here and there, and I would probably
need new shorts afterwards, but I bet it could be done.

Shit, I'd worry more about landing a P-51 than I would a 747.

<sits back and listens to the commercial pilots laugh>



With all do respect, no..they couldn't.


+1

They will most likely put it in the dirt. It's still an airplane, but it isn't like landing a 172.



I don't doubt that for a second.

Airspeed is airspeed, though, and I still think a trained pilot could get the thing on the ground (without rolling it up into a giant ball of aircraft grade aluminum, I mean).

A couple clarifiers as pointed out by CMJ are critical, to be sure: ".....could actually land it under clear skies and good visibility conditions, given a little guidance".

Crappy weather, a crosswind from hell, a real short runway or left completely alone to accomplish the task. All would significantly reduce your chances and would probably result in quite a large fireball.

But with a little guidance (maybe on the radio just like in the movies), good throttle control and close watch on the little gadget that says AIRSPEED, I honestly think I could do it. Again, it wouldn't be pretty, but I think it could be done.

Now, ask me if as a trained pilot I could just hop in a P-47 and take off? That's a scenario that I think you have virtually no chance.

Whatever the truth is, this is a fun debate.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 9:17:24 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/21/2008 9:18:50 AM EDT by cmjohnson]
Well, I can say this: After having "flown" a simulatd F-16 on my PC for many hundreds of hours, when I got a chance to fly a real full cockpit Lockheed-Martin F-16 simulator system, my first landing was just fine, thank you very much. Right on the numbers, and very smooth. Every other landing was fine, too. Though the full hemispherical projection system gives so much visual information to you that I FELT every movement of the simulated
aircraft with great realism, none of that was disorienting or distracting in any way and
if anything, only helped me to "feel" the landing. Even the feel of coming into ground
effect just prior to touchdown was accurately felt, from visual cues alone.

(Having flown Pipers and Cessnas on several occasions, I know the feel of ground effect
flight rather well.)


I may be a LITTLE bit better trained than the average guy who has NO cockpit experience,
but I maintain my belief that I and MOST other people could land a commercial airliner
safely under good conditions with a little guidance.


CJ
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 9:19:04 AM EDT
Originally Posted By AFARR:
I can see it now....

Copilot wigs out.

Hot Attendant comes in to help.

Pilot starts freaking out on landing.....OMG, OMG...We have problems..We're going in...We're going Tits Up!! ....Pull your Boobies out now!!!..............


I almost peed laughing so hard
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 9:24:31 AM EDT
Originally Posted By skygod:
Dont ALL of these planes have the ability to land themselves?


I wouldn't necessarily call it landing, but it will eventually be on the ground.

Link Posted: 11/21/2008 9:36:27 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Patriot328:
Originally Posted By luvpilot:
Originally Posted By James23:
Originally Posted By cmjohnson:
I'm not a rated pilot, but I'm still working on my private pilot's license. (Supposedly...when I have the time to commit to it.) But I can guarantee you that a 767 is not a tough aircraft to fly and I think half the arfcommers reading this topic would be able to sit in the copilot's seat, take directions from the pilot, and see a successful landing. Better yet, I'd say that
nearly 100 percent of us could do that, and more than half of us could actually land it under
clear skies and good visibility conditions, given a little guidance.


I'll stick my neck way out and say that I could land any modern airliner myself, if I just have
a few minutes to familiarize myself with the fundamentals of landing that plane. Range of
approach speeds, flap and spoiler settings, location and operation of flaps, spoilers, and
thrust reversers, optimal touchdown speed, etc. Ten minutes with the checklists would
be sufficient.

I think anyone here who has any pilot experience could do the same thing.


CJ



I think CMJ is generally right.

I have my private ticket, and I'm confident I could get a big jet on the ground in mostly one piece. Might need a little touch up here and there, and I would probably
need new shorts afterwards, but I bet it could be done.

Shit, I'd worry more about landing a P-51 than I would a 747.

<sits back and listens to the commercial pilots laugh>



With all do respect, no..they couldn't.


+1

They will most likely put it in the dirt. It's still an airplane, but it isn't like landing a 172.


Yeah, and I could board that Saudi Tanker and take down the Somali Pirates just like a Navy Seal...because, you know...I know how to shoot guns and stuff......

Seriously though, the Arfarrogance here can be astounding sometimes.

The problem with trying to land an Airliner is that you wouldn't even know how to work the radio, much less the FMS, and the speedbrakes, reversers, manage the airspeed and vertical nav.... When a professional pilot transfers from one jet to another it takes hours in the sim just to get familiar with the new system. A professional pilot could jump in another jet and get it landed safely, but even that would be an uncomfortable situation for most.

A private pilot with some experience and a large amount of aptitude could do it IF they had somebody on board who could familiarize them with what does what, and if they didn't panic. For example, if the Captain and Co-Pilot were somehow paralyzed, but coherent, they could Maybe talk you down. You would probably slide off the runway, but it might be survivable.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 9:43:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/21/2008 9:50:20 AM EDT by Maxwell71]
Originally Posted By GonzoAR15-1:
Originally Posted By GR8TWYT:
Wonder if he could have had a diabetic emergency i.e. hypoglycemia ?


I had an ex girlfriend that was not diabetic, but had to eat at exact intervals or she'd have low blood sugar. She turned into a roaring bitch when her blood sugar hit the "I'm ready for dinner NOW" point in time. It really was something to behold.



I am the same way
I have never been called a bitch though, only asshole when I get hungry

And no thank you

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