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9/19/2017 7:27:10 PM
Posted: 12/14/2001 11:36:51 AM EDT
BERLIN (AP)--U.S. Attorney General John Ashcroft praised Germany's newly enacted law that allows authorities to ban religious organizations used as fronts for extremists, saying Friday it was a necessary measure in the war on terrorism. The law, which took effect Dec. 8, was brought about after authorities investigating possible connections to the Sept. 11 terror attacks argued they were being hamstrung in their efforts by strict legislation protecting religious freedoms. Interior Minister Otto Schily made quick use of the new law, on Wednesday banning an Islamic organization he accused of being a "breeding ground for terrorists," and saying the legislation could lead to the expulsion of many extremists who have been granted asylum in Germany. "We commend Germany for its actions to provide greater opportunity to detect and disrupt terrorism through a better framework of laws in Germany," Ashcroft said after meeting with Schily to talk about the legislation and the overall German investigation into the attacks, which U.S. and German authorities believe were planned by a terrorist cell of Osama bin Laden's al-Qaida network in the German city of Hamburg. Later in the day, the German government passed an even broader antiterrorism package that will come into effect Jan. 1. Under the new laws, law enforcement agencies will be allowed to request information from financial institutions, telecommunications companies, and airlines -all of which was previously prohibited under the country's data protection statute. The new package also makes it easier to deport foreign extremists living in Germany, allows for the addition of biometrics - such as a fingerprint - to passports and identity documents, and allows for the addition of sky marshals on flights.... (END) DOW JONES NEWS 12-14-01 02:45 PM- - 02 45 PM EST 12-14-01 i wonder if those wonderful abortion clinic b0mbers who claim to be Christian will get Christianity banned???
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 11:40:59 AM EDT
Fatty - Sorry, but I don't beleive I have recently seen a more misleading thread title than this one. Ashcroft didn't applaud "banning religions." He applauded banning the "abuse of religions" which I would THINK we would ALL be happy about. Come on, man. Why put such a negative spin on the ONLY guy in the last 20 years to acknowledge a Constitutional defintion of the Second Amendment???? No matter WHAT else he does, he's your friend. [rolleyes]
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 11:44:31 AM EDT
Originally Posted By garandman: He applauded banning the "abuse of religions" which I would THINK we would ALL be happy about. Why put such a negative spin on the ONLY guy in the last 20 years to acknowledge a Constitutional defintion of the Second Amendment????
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Agreed. He applauded them for not allowing people to use religion as an excuse to start a "holy" war. Ashcroft in office is the best thing that has happened to firearm ownership rights in years.
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 11:44:48 AM EDT
"religious organizations used as fronts for extremists" Yep......total ban[rolleyes]
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 11:46:34 AM EDT
"U.S. Attorney General John Ashcroft praised Germany's newly enacted law that allows authorities [red]to ban religious organizations used as fronts for extremists[/red]..." "to BAN religious organizations..." seems pretty cut and dry to me!
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 11:47:07 AM EDT
Worse yet, I see FAR too much of a willingness by people on THIS board to beleive the lies teh Leftists are telling about Ashcroft. Come on - he supports the full RKBA. Do you REALLY think he's FOR vioalting the First Amendment??? The Liberals who want to take your guns away are LYING about Ashcroft, and you beleive the Liberals?? Ever heard of divide and conquer??? Ashcroft is THE BEST FRIEND IN THE WORLD of a Constitutionalist. The Libs are bad mouthing him, and ya'll are lapping it up. Sheesh. [rolleyes]
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 11:49:07 AM EDT
i didn't say or read total ban, shit, do you people need a dynamic entry before you feel the noose of tyranny tightening? think about an abortion clinic b0mber who claims that God made him do it ~ is he not an extremist using a religious organization as a front?
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 11:50:08 AM EDT
Originally Posted By fatty: "U.S. Attorney General John Ashcroft praised Germany's newly enacted law that allows authorities [red]to ban religious organizations used as fronts for extremists[/red]..." "to BAN religious organizations..." seems pretty cut and dry to me!
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THATS WHAT WE ARER TRYING TO TELL YOU!.....butt head
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 11:50:38 AM EDT
Originally Posted By fatty: "U.S. Attorney General John Ashcroft praised Germany's newly enacted law that allows authorities [red]to ban religious organizations used as fronts for extremists[/red]..." "to BAN religious organizations..." seems pretty cut and dry to me!
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To ban organizations USED AS A FRONT. What does that mean about TRUE religions who aren't a front?? HE'LL BE LEAVING THEM ALONE. Think 1920's dry cleaners that was a mafia front for booze running. It wasn't REALLY a dry cleaners - it was a shell to hide booze runners. Similarly, organizations that use religion to hide their terrorisat activities ARE NOT a religion. They are a shell, to hide terrorist activity.
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 11:53:31 AM EDT
Please cite a DIRECT Ashcroft quote where he said he was gonna "ban religions." You fell for the Leftist media lie. They hate Ashcroft, and you lap it up. They hate your guns, and you lap up their lies. [rolleyes]
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 11:56:46 AM EDT
ok, i'm not saying he is the enemy. if you can come up with a quote that says i don't even like him, i'd love to see it. what i am saying is that we need to be eternally vigilant. "oh, my guns are safe for now, so i'm gonna look the other way while he praises acts that would make TJ roll over in his grave." [rolleyes] ...strange days indeed...
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 12:00:27 PM EDT
Originally Posted By fatty: ok, i'm not saying he is the enemy. if you can come up with a quote that says i don't even like him, i'd love to see it. what i am saying is that we need to be eternally vigilant. "oh, my guns are safe for now, so i'm gonna look the other way while he praises acts that would make TJ roll over in his grave." [rolleyes] ...strange days indeed...
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yes, indeed - eternally vigilant. But while I own my firearms, i can countermand ANY gov't action. Ashcroft has RISKED HIS ENTIRE POLITICAL career to state and make policy that will help me to keep my guns. As much as I can with ANY politician, I trust John Ashcroft. He's one of us. Vigilance is good, but being suspicious of Ashcroft is in my opinion paranoid..
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 12:01:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/14/2001 11:55:33 AM EDT by fatty]
everone just stop putting words on my screen! i never said ashcroft was gonna ban our religions! i DID ask a question that you're all unwilling to answer! that question is: what if a Christian criminal uses the Church as a front? HOW will he be dealt with, HOW LONG will it take, WHAT will become of HIS religion? and what funking religion do you think they're talking about?? Islam? oh! its ok to ban that one, ITS NOT MINE! and wow you people all woke up all of a sudden, when you'd like to meke me be something i'm not, but in the other thread, when i soundly thrash you with blinding logic, you stay silent? hhhmmmm.....
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 12:14:23 PM EDT
In reference to the guy that bombed the abortion clinics, I say he is mentally ill. God did not tell him to do this. That is a one in a million case. The whole religion should not be banned because of this. The Koran specifically praises those that inflict pain and suffering on anyone that is of or aids Christian beliefs. The bible in no way shape or form mentions anything like this. Christ taught to love your neighbor as you love yourself. If Christians would study the Bible and all that it says, they would realize that our place in the world is to show his love to those that are hurting and not condemn the world. We are to love our brothers. This means even if they are homosexuals, abortionist, murderers, theives, etc, etc. These people need to know there is a God that loves them and can deliver them out of any situation and fill them with peace, hope, love, and the promise of everlasting life. Christ came to save the world, not condemn it. Fatty, your topic may have thrown me off as it states "Ashcroft applauds banning of religions" as he is for banning any religion all together. If that was not your intentions, I apologize.
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 12:20:05 PM EDT
misleading...MY bad. another question, if Usama gets caught, and hides behind Islam, then Islam is banned in Germany? Islam is not a religion of hate either ~ which is why i need more info on this, and i want to know why such a proponent of liberty like Ashcroft is praising it! all i'm saying is that i would have hoped that someone like him would think of the future ramifications of such a law before cumming all over the paper it was written on!
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 12:23:36 PM EDT
Originally Posted By fatty: , when i soundly thrash you with blinding logic, .....
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heh heh.... That gave me a chuckle. My point in this thread is that Ashcroft doesn't want to ban Islam. He wants to ban organizations - al Queda, teh Taliban etc - that USE and ABUSE Islam to KILL people. Frankly, I wish he WOULD ban any so-called "Christian" organizations that KILL people. it has NOTHING to do with religion - it has to do with murder, and organizations whose purpose is to MURDER. In effect, this is a NON-event. Ashcroft is going after murderers. is that really newsworthy?? No. Then WHY did it make the news? To take another shot at Ashcroft, BECAUSE they hate his RKBA stand, among other things. They KNOW you are gonna "knee jer" at this type of yellow journalism. And they caught you up in it. They have achieved their goal. You besmirch his intentions, even possiby his charachter, when he's your BEST FRIEND. What of lurkers who take from your post that Ashcroft is against the First Amendment, cuz they didn't dop their homework, and go bad mouth him to others? The media starts the lie, you unknowingly repeat it, it grows and grows, and collateral damage the leftists want is done. And you helped. Let's let bygones be bygones. just don't fall for their trick again. And in reality, I'm taking my frustration out on you, for ALL the other gun owners I see in this forum who fall for the leftists trick.
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 12:24:50 PM EDT
Don't know. There are a lot of gray areas with this law that I'm sure we don't know about that would answer these questions. Almost makes you wonder if the lack on a Constitution in Germany will make this possible... I don't think Ashcroft is narrow minded enough to support a ban of a religion based on some schmuck's goofy interpretation of the religion. i.e. bin laden
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 12:26:26 PM EDT
Originally Posted By fatty: misleading...MY bad. another question, if Usama gets caught, and hides behind Islam, then Islam is banned in Germany? Islam is not a religion of hate either ~ which is why i need more info on this, and i want to know why such a proponent of liberty like Ashcroft is praising it! all i'm saying is that i would have hoped that someone like him would think of the future ramifications of such a law before cumming all over the paper it was written on!
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I REALLY doubt Ashcroft is supporting teh banning of Islam, while at teh same time Bush is visiting mosques in teh US. Its about banning organizations - NOT religions. I assure you, Ashcroft sees the "big picture." He's a close to me in ideology as any person in gov't today. If you know me, you know him. And I am DEFINITELY not for banning Islam for ANY reason. Peace, dude.
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 12:28:12 PM EDT
Originally Posted By garandman:
Originally Posted By fatty: , when i soundly thrash you with blinding logic, .....
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heh heh.... That gave me a chuckle.
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he he, i thought you'd like that! [}:D] well, you made some interesting points, actually, and i'll consider them on my $^@(#(*^&$ing 2 hour commute home! until next time then, have a good one guys!
Link Posted: 12/14/2001 12:29:28 PM EDT
Originally Posted By fatty: think about an abortion clinic b0mber who claims that God made him do it ~ is he not an extremist using a religious organization as a front?
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No HE I not a religious organization he is a guy how is nuts. The Taliban is a religious organization,there is (was) a buch of poeple in this organization and they did many things. Is the Black Panthers a religious organization? Yes there are ,they are muzzies and they are anti-American. Don't you think somebody should do something about them? Is the Church of Jesus Christ a religious organization? Yes is it a front for terrorism? no it's not. There safe. You get what I'm telling you here? The key part of this hole thing is terrorism.
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