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10/20/2017 1:01:18 AM
9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 7/6/2005 6:53:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/6/2005 8:48:21 PM EDT by Detslider]
Anyone have any info other than what's listed in this article. Specificly who is eligible.
Thoughts on this award?
I had no idea it was in ther works untill I stumbled across an article saying It was now being awarded.

ETA: Nevermind, looks like the full story can be found here
Link Posted: 7/12/2005 6:22:48 PM EDT
all i know is that im getting one.
Link Posted: 7/12/2005 8:23:05 PM EDT
Sorry, but that looks ghey......A knife in lieu of a rifle?
Link Posted: 7/12/2005 9:23:58 PM EDT
My thoughts? I support the award of the CAB for non infantry units that are task organized as provisional infantry, for example 1-7 FA in Baiji (Redlegs old stomping grounds). They earned it. But instead of doing that, the Army has decided to award it to all MOSs. So a cook that never leaves the FOB can be awarded it if he recieves indirect fire that lands 500 meters from his position. As long as someone is in "danger" they can recieve it.

The soft skill MOSs are complaining that they are not being recognized for their service in combat. They are, it's called a combat patch. I know truck drivers run the gauntlet of IEDs and VBIEDs daily and they have my undying respect and gratitude, hell I have been hit by 2 VBIEDs and 2 IEDs, but they run and gun, not locate, close with and destroy the enemy. Units like 1-7 FA did.

Just my .02
Link Posted: 7/16/2005 4:26:04 AM EDT
You can only know so much about a Christmas tree by the ribbons and badges that are displayed. The ones that earned their ornaments quickly separate themselves from the ones that didn't.

It's like the age old debate about how valid a battle patch is. They still do battle patches right? At least it's not like the AF where you get issued badges for decoration.
Link Posted: 7/16/2005 4:06:16 PM EDT
The Army is badge obsessed - we could take a cue from the Marines - -
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 1:05:55 PM EDT
My opinion is simple. I've never earned a CIB (got bumped from my deployment) but i DO NOT like the idea of a CAB for everyone else. A CIB is a badge of honor, Infantryman go out into combat daily knowing they may not come home. It's our job. So now they make another badge for all the damn desk jockeys who happen to be in a damn convoy when it gets hit. It also carries the same weight as a CIB. Thats a load of shit. hey may hear bullets fly by their heads once or twice, after that they're back in their damn AC controlled office talking about how cool they were under pressure (probably pissed themselves).

I've got enough friends over in Iraq and Afghanistan, some aint coming home. So why we don't just give the fucking desk natzi's a badge even though they all hey do is piss and moan about there not being any hot coffee in the damn chow hall.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 6:06:42 PM EDT
Don't forget the combat medics and the CMB . I'll have to agree with B-O-A-T-S for the rest of the post.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 6:10:19 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ChrisLe:
Sorry, but that looks ghey......A knife in lieu of a rifle?



+1
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 11:39:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By B-O-A-T-S:
My opinion is simple. I've never earned a CIB (got bumped from my deployment) but i DO NOT like the idea of a CAB for everyone else. A CIB is a badge of honor, Infantryman go out into combat daily knowing they may not come home. It's our job.



I'm not an Infantryman but my job took me off the FOB and into potentially hostile areas on every mission and on a nearly daily basis. I considered many times that I may not go home alive. In fact several infantry patrols that I came across had non-infantry support soldiers out with them. Did the bombs and bulets somehow miss them during engagements, were they not expected to also engage the enemy alongside their infantry brothers?
I accepted and completed every mission that was given to me, I have not been awarded an CAB, I am not pushing to get one, however if one is awarded to me at a later date I will wear it proudly.
I agree that not every soldier should recieve the CAB, that there needs to be very a very clear set of requirements outlining who is eligible. Do I know how it should be worded, no. I'll leave that for someone with more weight on their collar than me.
How about you drop Sgt. April Pashley a note telling her how she's not in the infantry and shouldn't be recognized for her actions.
James

Link Posted: 7/21/2005 11:41:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Stryker_11A:
My thoughts? I support the award of the CAB for non infantry units that are task organized as provisional infantry, for example 1-7 FA in Baiji (Redlegs old stomping grounds). They earned it. But instead of doing that, the Army has decided to award it to all MOSs. So a cook that never leaves the FOB can be awarded it if he recieves indirect fire that lands 500 meters from his position. As long as someone is in "danger" they can recieve it.

The soft skill MOSs are complaining that they are not being recognized for their service in combat. They are, it's called a combat patch. I know truck drivers run the gauntlet of IEDs and VBIEDs daily and they have my undying respect and gratitude, hell I have been hit by 2 VBIEDs and 2 IEDs, but they run and gun, not locate, close with and destroy the enemy. Units like 1-7 FA did.

Just my .02



+1
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 11:55:06 PM EDT

Originally Posted By B-O-A-T-S:
My opinion is simple. I've never earned a CIB (got bumped from my deployment) but i DO NOT like the idea of a CAB for everyone else. A CIB is a badge of honor, Infantryman go out into combat daily knowing they may not come home. It's our job.



I'm an MP in the Guard. When I was at Sustainer Army Airfield outside of Balad, my unit would load up in trucks and drive up and down the roadways until we got ambushed and we would return fire with Mk-19s and SAWs. We were in unarmored Humvees.

Guess who was stuck working security at the front gate? Infantry (couple of units from Florida)

When I was at FOB St. Mere, again we would do convoys and get hit with IEDs everyday. A unit from the 82nd Airborne guarded the gates.

In this war, a lot of people besides infantry "go out into combat daily knowing they may not come home."
Link Posted: 7/22/2005 4:22:30 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Detslider:

Originally Posted By B-O-A-T-S:
My opinion is simple. I've never earned a CIB (got bumped from my deployment) but i DO NOT like the idea of a CAB for everyone else. A CIB is a badge of honor, Infantryman go out into combat daily knowing they may not come home. It's our job.



I'm not an Infantryman but my job took me off the FOB and into potentially hostile areas on every mission and on a nearly daily basis. I considered many times that I may not go home alive. In fact several infantry patrols that I came across had non-infantry support soldiers out with them. Did the bombs and bulets somehow miss them during engagements, were they not expected to also engage the enemy alongside their infantry brothers?
I accepted and completed every mission that was given to me, I have not been awarded an CAB, I am not pushing to get one, however if one is awarded to me at a later date I will wear it proudly.
I agree that not every soldier should recieve the CAB, that there needs to be very a very clear set of requirements outlining who is eligible. Do I know how it should be worded, no. I'll leave that for someone with more weight on their collar than me.
How about you drop Sgt. April Pashley a note telling her how she's not in the infantry and shouldn't be recognized for her actions.
James




I will agree with that. And as always i respect any other service members opinion. But my personal feelings are strong. I'm not saying some people don't deserve to be recognized for actions in Combat. Alot of people do, however most are never given any recognition. But the idea of it carrying the same weight as a CIB and CMB (Hell i know someone with both. lol) kind of bothers me.
Link Posted: 7/22/2005 4:25:08 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/22/2005 4:35:26 AM EDT by B-O-A-T-S]

Originally Posted By guardian855:

Originally Posted By B-O-A-T-S:
My opinion is simple. I've never earned a CIB (got bumped from my deployment) but i DO NOT like the idea of a CAB for everyone else. A CIB is a badge of honor, Infantryman go out into combat daily knowing they may not come home. It's our job.



I'm an MP in the Guard. When I was at Sustainer Army Airfield outside of Balad, my unit would load up in trucks and drive up and down the roadways until we got ambushed and we would return fire with Mk-19s and SAWs. We were in unarmored Humvees.

Guess who was stuck working security at the front gate? Infantry (couple of units from Florida)

When I was at FOB St. Mere, again we would do convoys and get hit with IEDs everyday. A unit from the 82nd Airborne guarded the gates.

In this war, a lot of people besides infantry "go out into combat daily knowing they may not come home."



Ok, got more coffee and head is clearing up.

Here goes. In my opinion MP's should be categorized under the Combat Arms field as well as LE. In any war i can think of, MP's have had some role in combat one way or the other. Should MP's receive the CAB? No. I think the MP profession should have one of it's own. They don't qualify for the CIB (MOS specific) but they shouldn't be generalized with the rest of the troops and awarded a CAB.

Now time to regress. Perhaps my original post was a bit harsh, i still stand behind my opinions because they're mine. But i guess i could have worded it slightly different. Bash away folks.
Link Posted: 7/22/2005 8:29:10 AM EDT

Originally Posted By B-O-A-T-S:

Originally Posted By guardian855:

Originally Posted By B-O-A-T-S:
My opinion is simple. I've never earned a CIB (got bumped from my deployment) but i DO NOT like the idea of a CAB for everyone else. A CIB is a badge of honor, Infantryman go out into combat daily knowing they may not come home. It's our job.



I'm an MP in the Guard. When I was at Sustainer Army Airfield outside of Balad, my unit would load up in trucks and drive up and down the roadways until we got ambushed and we would return fire with Mk-19s and SAWs. We were in unarmored Humvees.

Guess who was stuck working security at the front gate? Infantry (couple of units from Florida)

When I was at FOB St. Mere, again we would do convoys and get hit with IEDs everyday. A unit from the 82nd Airborne guarded the gates.

In this war, a lot of people besides infantry "go out into combat daily knowing they may not come home."



Ok, got more coffee and head is clearing up.

Here goes. In my opinion MP's should be categorized under the Combat Arms field as well as LE. In any war i can think of, MP's have had some role in combat one way or the other. Should MP's receive the CAB? No. I think the MP profession should have one of it's own. They don't qualify for the CIB (MOS specific) but they shouldn't be generalized with the rest of the troops and awarded a CAB.

Now time to regress. Perhaps my original post was a bit harsh, i still stand behind my opinions because they're mine. But i guess i could have worded it slightly different. Bash away folks.



I could agree with that.

I also agree that they need to set some sort of rules, and just hearing a mortar go off or having it land somewhere in your camp should not qualify you for the CAB. But who knows?

One thing I wonder though, if someone was in the infantry and never left camp but that camp got mortared a few times, would he be eligiable for the CIB? Serious question here since I do not know.
Link Posted: 7/22/2005 8:38:26 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/22/2005 8:39:48 AM EDT by B-O-A-T-S]

Originally Posted By guardian855:

Originally Posted By B-O-A-T-S:

Originally Posted By guardian855:

Originally Posted By B-O-A-T-S:
My opinion is simple. I've never earned a CIB (got bumped from my deployment) but i DO NOT like the idea of a CAB for everyone else. A CIB is a badge of honor, Infantryman go out into combat daily knowing they may not come home. It's our job.



I'm an MP in the Guard. When I was at Sustainer Army Airfield outside of Balad, my unit would load up in trucks and drive up and down the roadways until we got ambushed and we would return fire with Mk-19s and SAWs. We were in unarmored Humvees.

Guess who was stuck working security at the front gate? Infantry (couple of units from Florida)

When I was at FOB St. Mere, again we would do convoys and get hit with IEDs everyday. A unit from the 82nd Airborne guarded the gates.

In this war, a lot of people besides infantry "go out into combat daily knowing they may not come home."



Ok, got more coffee and head is clearing up.

Here goes. In my opinion MP's should be categorized under the Combat Arms field as well as LE. In any war i can think of, MP's have had some role in combat one way or the other. Should MP's receive the CAB? No. I think the MP profession should have one of it's own. They don't qualify for the CIB (MOS specific) but they shouldn't be generalized with the rest of the troops and awarded a CAB.

Now time to regress. Perhaps my original post was a bit harsh, i still stand behind my opinions because they're mine. But i guess i could have worded it slightly different. Bash away folks.



I could agree with that.

I also agree that they need to set some sort of rules, and just hearing a mortar go off or having it land somewhere in your camp should not qualify you for the CAB. But who knows?

One thing I wonder though, if someone was in the infantry and never left camp but that camp got mortared a few times, would he be eligiable for the CIB? Serious question here since I do not know.



From here: Pentagon

(1) A soldier must be an Army infantry or special forces officer (SSI 11 or 18) in the grade of Colonel or below, or an Army enlisted soldier or warrant officer with an infantry or special forces MOS, who subsequent to 6 December 1941 has satisfactorily performed duty while assigned or attached as a member of an infantry, ranger or special forces unit of brigade, regimental, or smaller size during any period such unit was engaged in active ground combat. Eligibility for Special Forces personnel (less Special Forces medical sergeant) accrues from 20 December 1989. Retroactive awards for Special Forces personnel are not authorized.

(2) A recipient must be personally present and under hostile fire while serving in an assigned infantry or Special Forces primary duty, in a unit actively engaged in ground combat with the enemy. The unit in question can be of any size smaller than brigade.

(3) Personnel with other than an infantry or special forces MOS are not eligible, regardless of the circumstances. The infantry or special forces SSI or MOS does not necessarily have to be the soldier’s primary specialty, as long as the soldier has been properly trained in infantry or special forces tactics, possesses the appropriate skill code, and is serving in that specialty when engaged in active ground combat as described above. Commanders are not authorized to make any exceptions to this policy.
Link Posted: 7/22/2005 5:09:28 PM EDT
The badge is not quite that easy to be awarded. You have to have been in a situation where you could have been injured or killed. A mortar attack doesn't do it unless you were within a few meters of the attack and survived unscathed. You also have to have 2 or more eyewitness statements included in the award request.

I qualify for one but the event where I earned the award was a car bomb at the front gate of our base. During the badge earning portion of the event, there were only two of us running through the fire and smoke to prevent the bad guys from attacking. We are both short an eyewitness letter.

We had over 60 mortar rounds land on our base in the 13 months I was there. 13 in one day in a 2 minute period. No one on the FOB was near the explosion sites and can't use the attacks to justify the badge. There were only 5 soldiers able to claim the mortar attacks for the badge. 2 were wounded and the other 3 were walking on the flight line and a 107mm rocket missed them by 45 meters. It was however close enough to spray them with schrapnel and dirt. Luckily they weren't injured.

The badge sounds easy to earn but it still has to get approved at DA level and only the most deserving (hopefully) will be awarded the badge.
Link Posted: 7/22/2005 11:12:27 PM EDT
A 5 round mortar barrage landed in the vicinity of our battalion TOC. My buddy is a battle captain there and he told me that the first thing the TOCroaches asked was if they just earned the CAB. Not if anyone was wounded, but if they now qualify for the friggin badge. I have even money that they entire BN staff will get it.

Such is war.
Link Posted: 7/23/2005 2:19:09 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Stryker_11A:
So a cook that never leaves the FOB can be awarded it if he recieves indirect fire that lands 500 meters from his position.



Most of the guys in my platoon got their CIB for exactly that. Most of them were never in a firefight, but all have CIBs they hold real high because of mortar and rocket attacks on the FOB. Now they are pissed about how the non-infantry will get a CAB for the same thing...

In my opinion, the combat patch should be called a deployment patch... and the CIB and CAB should be awarded for firefights.
Link Posted: 7/23/2005 10:28:40 AM EDT
thats a big +1 on the thought of only awarding the badges for fire fights. I was mortared real bad and real close (yall can search for that post from last year if ya want and have archive) but i dont think that having a couple mortars fall within a few feet makes me deserving of a badge.


the badges shoud only be awarded for direct fire, line of sight, man on man engagements.
I feel that i am deserving of the award for those kind of engagements. It doesn't matter if you are on a truck or on foot, its a completely different kind of war from what most fobbits see.

As far as in concerened, anyone ducking bullets and rpgs, and returning fire with direct fire weapons deserve the recognition. Everyone has to duck indirect fire, not everyone has to go outside the wire and directly engage armed enemies intent on ending heir life.

All of the medics on our fob were awarded the cmb, even though i know of 3 that never left the wire (or the toc or lsa areas for that matter). I find it appaling that they can be awarded a cmb for that. I feel the same about infantrymen that were awarded the cib for taking mortar fire but never engaging the enemy.

Think of it this way real quick, and lets put a face on it:

This man, SFC Jones, of 1/7 FA was shot with a RPG, while he was laying down suppressive fire and pulling other soldiers out of a burning truck during a complex ambush by insurgent forces out side of bayji iraq last year. He was killed. Up until the CAB was created he wasn't authorized any recognition simply because of the fact that he was a Field Artilleryman instead of a Infantryman. He is deserving.
On the other hand, why should someone be awarded the same award for simply hiding in a bunker and wetting themself while mortars fall 70 meters away.

I realize that most people would rather argue about the awarding of these kinds recognition to non infantry soldiers, but my simple statement to them is fuck off and go do your job, you aren't any different than any other soldier who has to go out and fight the enemy face to face. Just because you went to specialized training and have an ego to go with it doesn't make you anything special.
By the way that most peoples arguements go i have come to a different conclusion than most people. I think that if you want to fight a badge, you should fight your own cib. Infantrymen are trained and expected to do nothing but fiught the enemy face to face, so basicaly they get a special badge for doing what they are taught and expected to do. If anyone should get a badge it should be the people who are made to go out and dpo the job without all of the specialized training.

As it is though, as far as im concerened, if you fight face to face, you should get recognized.

RIP SFC Jones, you might have ridden my ass like a madman when you were a chief, but you were a soldiers soldier, and a fine human being.

Link Posted: 7/23/2005 1:52:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Stryker_11A:
My thoughts? I support the award of the CAB for non infantry units that are task organized as provisional infantry, for example 1-7 FA in Baiji (Redlegs old stomping grounds). They earned it. But instead of doing that, the Army has decided to award it to all MOSs. So a cook that never leaves the FOB can be awarded it if he recieves indirect fire that lands 500 meters from his position. As long as someone is in "danger" they can recieve it.

The soft skill MOSs are complaining that they are not being recognized for their service in combat. They are, it's called a combat patch. I know truck drivers run the gauntlet of IEDs and VBIEDs daily and they have my undying respect and gratitude, hell I have been hit by 2 VBIEDs and 2 IEDs, but they run and gun, not locate, close with and destroy the enemy. Units like 1-7 FA did.

Just my .02



Fuckin' A! I'm a 33W, I fix shit. Other than my initial convoy in FEB 04 I never left Balad. I never saw direct fire and any indirect fire that landed near me certainly wasn't aimed at me. Despite having several mortars and rockets come down and explode within 50M of me and one that hit where I was working 15 minutes earlier, I will not wear this badge because I don't feel that I should.
Link Posted: 7/23/2005 5:38:43 PM EDT
I gotta weigh in here. I was a grunt and ended my Army time as an MP. I always thought that a combat patch was enough for anyone who wasn't authorized a CIB or CMB. I changed my mind when they decided to honor all those non infantry Soldiers who are now pulling grunt duty in Iraq and Afghanistan with the creation of the CAB. If they are going to give it away to anyone within the sound of the gunfire then it's worthless and why bother. Some Soldiers truly deserve the CAB, but is sounds like most of the awards are going to be to the RAMF pousers.
Link Posted: 7/25/2005 5:17:00 AM EDT
from what i'm reading here, it oughta go like this:

cib - inf

cab - non inf who actually shoot back (mp's, folks who run convoys and come under fire, folks who come under DIRECT fire and are in the immed area when fire is returned).

combat patch - folks who are in a unit deployed to a combat ao. may come under INDIRECT fire or are in a convoy hit by vied/ied's where there is no direct fire.

Link Posted: 7/25/2005 5:54:06 AM EDT

Originally Posted By GlockLuvinRedleg:
Think of it this way real quick, and lets put a face on it:
photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=38832
This man, SFC Jones, of 1/7 FA was shot with a RPG, while he was laying down suppressive fire and pulling other soldiers out of a burning truck during a complex ambush by insurgent forces out side of bayji iraq last year. He was killed. Up until the CAB was created he wasn't authorized any recognition simply because of the fact that he was a Field Artilleryman instead of a Infantryman. He is deserving.



Not arguing the fact CAB, but are you telling me he wasn't awarded ANYTHING? No posthumous Purple Heart, Bronze Star, or anything else? Or don't you consider those to be recognition?

If the CAB is awarded properly and not just given to anyone who has a few thrusts per squeeze I can see the point in it. At first I was a little skeptical about it because the Army has a tendency to reduce the validity of one thing by giving it out to everyone... take the beret for example. Or wearing a flag on your shoulder.
Now I think that it's probably warranted considering it seems like a lot of soldiers in Iraq are actually being soldiers first and their MOS secondary.
Link Posted: 7/25/2005 7:33:08 AM EDT

Originally Posted By OrionSix:
The Army is badge obsessed - we could take a cue from the Marines - -



+1. Badges (and chasing badges) are a huge source of BS, the FreeIB being the worst.
Link Posted: 7/25/2005 7:54:45 PM EDT
FreeIb??? CAB just another way of showing you arnt Infantry. Kidding, relax. Yes indeed the badges and medals need tightening up.
Link Posted: 7/26/2005 5:53:04 AM EDT
Hey, in the Army every little bit of cool points on your chest counts. Who the hell likes walking around with a bare set of greens?

Badges rock.
Link Posted: 7/26/2005 6:11:23 AM EDT
I had a first shirt who wore sanitized OD fatigues. Nothing but name tapes, rank, and the current unit patch. The I saw a ficture of him in his class A's. HOLLY S**T! He had more fruit salid than anyone else in the battalion save on other NCO. He wore his ribbons four across for the FIRST THREE ROWS! His CIB was at the top of his uniform just under the epaulette. I asked him why he didn't wear anyhting on his fatigues and he told me "I don't need to wear my f*****g 201 file on my uniform!". I hope he retired as at least a brigade SGM. A great man and an even better top, E.L Fitch.


Originally Posted By pathfinder74:
Hey, in the Army every little bit of cool points on your chest counts. Who the hell likes walking around with a bare set of greens?

Badges rock.

Link Posted: 7/31/2005 12:44:56 AM EDT
I'm gonna get flamed for this but I don't care.

People who gripe because they want a badge because they got shot at and can't get a CIB are pathetic. Is your self esteem so low that you need a badge to show other people how important or brave you are?

Non combat MOS's get combat patches and decorations/awards for when they get into battle. The whole argument about being recognized for going outside of your job training and performing an "infantry" job so now I deserve a badge is crap because before you are a cook, you are a gun toting soldier. On a Team everyone was an infantryman first and an 18e, 18c, or 18d second.

Just like a black beret, you give it to everyone and it's no longer worth a shit.
Link Posted: 7/31/2005 8:50:52 AM EDT
+100


Originally Posted By FROST18E:
I'm gonna get flamed for this but I don't care.

People who gripe because they want a badge because they got shot at and can't get a CIB are pathetic. Is your self esteem so low that you need a badge to show other people how important or brave you are?

Non combat MOS's get combat patches and decorations/awards for when they get into battle. The whole argument about being recognized for going outside of your job training and performing an "infantry" job so now I deserve a badge is crap because before you are a cook, you are a gun toting soldier. On a Team everyone was an infantryman first and an 18e, 18c, or 18d second.

Just like a black beret, you give it to everyone and it's no longer worth a shit.

Link Posted: 7/31/2005 9:02:58 AM EDT

Originally Posted By RictusGrin:
the FreeIB being the worst.



Just Comming home means that your a 1st Time Go at this station...................
Link Posted: 7/31/2005 9:08:15 AM EDT
What if you never used your bayonet in combat....? I guess using it to open MRE's
would suffice.

Very stupid badge...


LB
Link Posted: 7/31/2005 4:24:57 PM EDT

Originally Posted By pathfinder74:

Originally Posted By GlockLuvinRedleg:
Think of it this way real quick, and lets put a face on it:
photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=38832
This man, SFC Jones, of 1/7 FA was shot with a RPG, while he was laying down suppressive fire and pulling other soldiers out of a burning truck during a complex ambush by insurgent forces out side of bayji iraq last year. He was killed. Up until the CAB was created he wasn't authorized any recognition simply because of the fact that he was a Field Artilleryman instead of a Infantryman. He is deserving.



Not arguing the fact CAB, but are you telling me he wasn't awarded ANYTHING? No posthumous Purple Heart, Bronze Star, or anything else? Or don't you consider those to be recognition?


If the CAB is awarded properly and not just given to anyone who has a few thrusts per squeeze I can see the point in it. At first I was a little skeptical about it because the Army has a tendency to reduce the validity of one thing by giving it out to everyone... take the beret for example. Or wearing a flag on your shoulder.
Now I think that it's probably warranted considering it seems like a lot of soldiers in Iraq are actually being soldiers first and their MOS secondary.



He got a bronze star, but to give you an idea about bronze stars lately, our cav unit awarded 40 (yes forty) bronge stars as service awards to personel for simply having worked while they were in iraq. It was explained to us like this: e7 a6 and lower who get metals get arcoms, e7 and higher who get medals get bronze stars. The only one i knew of who earned his was one of my battle buddies, who is an e5, and he won't even say what he got it for. all i know is he was the only guy under e7 in the unit who didn't get awarded a bronze star posthumusly.

and yea, i do agree that medals are a little out of hand, they told us that an aam or msm aren't "medals awarded during war" and that you could only get arcoms or bronze stars.
Link Posted: 8/1/2005 12:05:18 AM EDT

Originally Posted By GlockLuvinRedleg:

Originally Posted By pathfinder74:

Originally Posted By GlockLuvinRedleg:
Think of it this way real quick, and lets put a face on it:
photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=38832
This man, SFC Jones, of 1/7 FA was shot with a RPG, while he was laying down suppressive fire and pulling other soldiers out of a burning truck during a complex ambush by insurgent forces out side of bayji iraq last year. He was killed. Up until the CAB was created he wasn't authorized any recognition simply because of the fact that he was a Field Artilleryman instead of a Infantryman. He is deserving.



Not arguing the fact CAB, but are you telling me he wasn't awarded ANYTHING? No posthumous Purple Heart, Bronze Star, or anything else? Or don't you consider those to be recognition?


If the CAB is awarded properly and not just given to anyone who has a few thrusts per squeeze I can see the point in it. At first I was a little skeptical about it because the Army has a tendency to reduce the validity of one thing by giving it out to everyone... take the beret for example. Or wearing a flag on your shoulder.
Now I think that it's probably warranted considering it seems like a lot of soldiers in Iraq are actually being soldiers first and their MOS secondary.



He got a bronze star, but to give you an idea about bronze stars lately, our cav unit awarded 40 (yes forty) bronge stars as service awards to personel for simply having worked while they were in iraq. It was explained to us like this: e7 a6 and lower who get metals get arcoms, e7 and higher who get medals get bronze stars. The only one i knew of who earned his was one of my battle buddies, who is an e5, and he won't even say what he got it for. all i know is he was the only guy under e7 in the unit who didn't get awarded a bronze star posthumusly.

and yea, i do agree that medals are a little out of hand, they told us that an aam or msm aren't "medals awarded during war" and that you could only get arcoms or bronze stars.



If all he got was a bronze star for his actions and you think he deserved more, than its his command and his supervisor who have the problem of no backbone for not pushing for something higher.

Any Unit that says only certain ranks get certain awards is fucked up anyways. Awards are for actions not paygrades. Thats the "Regular Army" for you though.

Sorry your buddy died, but if he's the straight shooter you say he is, I doubt he would want his name associated with this thing.

PS go to Selection. Than you can go to a real unit and see what the army is supposed to be like.
Link Posted: 8/1/2005 12:40:25 AM EDT

Originally Posted By ChrisLe:
Sorry, but that looks ghey......A knife in lieu of a rifle?



+1
Link Posted: 8/1/2005 12:46:18 AM EDT

Originally Posted By FROST18E:
I'm gonna get flamed for this but I don't care.

People who gripe because they want a badge because they got shot at and can't get a CIB are pathetic. Is your self esteem so low that you need a badge to show other people how important or brave you are?

Non combat MOS's get combat patches and decorations/awards for when they get into battle. The whole argument about being recognized for going outside of your job training and performing an "infantry" job so now I deserve a badge is crap because before you are a cook, you are a gun toting soldier. On a Team everyone was an infantryman first and an 18e, 18c, or 18d second.

Just like a black beret, you give it to everyone and it's no longer worth a shit.



+1...........i still feel the sadness of the black beret
Link Posted: 8/1/2005 9:24:41 AM EDT
i'd love to go to selection, but i wouldn't be able to hack it, as much as it pains me to say it. I'm not a good runner, and now i have a permanant profile anyway.
Link Posted: 8/1/2005 9:32:58 AM EDT

Originally Posted By GlockLuvinRedleg:
He got a bronze star, but to give you an idea about bronze stars lately, our cav unit awarded 40 (yes forty) bronge stars as service awards to personel for simply having worked while they were in iraq. It was explained to us like this: e7 a6 and lower who get metals get arcoms, e7 and higher who get medals get bronze stars. The only one i knew of who earned his was one of my battle buddies, who is an e5, and he won't even say what he got it for. all i know is he was the only guy under e7 in the unit who didn't get awarded a bronze star posthumusly.



Yeah... unfortunately I have noticed the Bronze Star seems to have gotten watered downa bit. Where it once meant you committed a true act of valor or something, now it's almost like a PCS award for leaving Iraq. Very sad.
Link Posted: 8/1/2005 10:07:27 AM EDT

Originally Posted By pathfinder74:

Originally Posted By GlockLuvinRedleg:
He got a bronze star, but to give you an idea about bronze stars lately, our cav unit awarded 40 (yes forty) bronge stars as service awards to personel for simply having worked while they were in iraq. It was explained to us like this: e7 a6 and lower who get metals get arcoms, e7 and higher who get medals get bronze stars. The only one i knew of who earned his was one of my battle buddies, who is an e5, and he won't even say what he got it for. all i know is he was the only guy under e7 in the unit who didn't get awarded a bronze star posthumusly.



Yeah... unfortunately I have noticed the Bronze Star seems to have gotten watered downa bit. Where it once meant you committed a true act of valor or something, now it's almost like a PCS award for leaving Iraq. Very sad.



I used to think the same thing about bronze stars. Imagine my surprise when I got attached to 5th Group, from 1st Group for the invasion, that a bronze star is nothing more than an ARCOM given out during wartime I guess that the only bronze stars given for valor naturally (duh) have the "V" device attached.

Link Posted: 8/1/2005 12:45:01 PM EDT
i really think that any medal should be viable in wartime. There were plenty of guys deserving of aams, but had to be put in for arcoms, that than got downgraded to coins.

aams and msms have their place, and just because your in a war enviroment doesnt mean that aomething deserving of an aam should get an arcom.
Link Posted: 8/1/2005 3:45:46 PM EDT

Originally Posted By GlockLuvinRedleg:
i really think that any medal should be viable in wartime. There were plenty of guys deserving of aams, but had to be put in for arcoms, that than got downgraded to coins.

aams and msms have their place, and just because your in a war enviroment doesnt mean that aomething deserving of an aam should get an arcom.



But since AAMs ARCOMs and MSMs seem to be an automatic freebie award for a PCS anymore, it seems to almost hold no weight when you then get one in combat... so they somehow thing that chucking bronze stars around as a combat ARCOM is appropriate.

I ashamed to say I got one... I'm still not sure what I did for it and it's one of those things that haunts me. I probably should have declined it, and I seriously considered it, but my unit seemed to think it was appropriate given the circumstances and all...
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