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Posted: 5/19/2005 12:47:13 PM EDT
Looking from the issue from both sides I really can't decide whether illegal aliens are THAT bad.


Here's my reasons why they are good:

Will take any job (even one a black man wouldn't take)
Will work for low wages
Pay sales tax on their purchases they make here (food, clothing)
Name one white guy that would put a tile roof on an Arizona house on a 115 degree day.


Here's my reasons why they are bad:

Take US money back home and spend it there.
Take some US jobs, even though they are low pay, I"m sure there are American citizens who would still have taken them.



BUT, here's what gets me thinking that they might not be that bad. Would we really want 10-15 million new citizens who make a gross income of 15,000-30,000 dollars each? No way!

When you are in that bracket you normally get most of what you paid in back out, but think of the families who have 2-5+ children, they would be getting back more than they paid in. A lot more.

For instance, a single mother of 2 who makes 15,000 pays in about 0 in taxes, but gets almost 5,000 back.

That 5,000 doesn't even include what other benefits that woman and kids would receive from the government if they were legalized. Food stamps, section 8 housing, medicaid, etc... That's at least another 8-10,000 in government support.


I know that we compain that they don't pay (federal/state) taxes, and they take up health care, but it seems in reality that if they were legalized, they'd get back what they paid and then some, and we'd still be taking care of their health care bill, and then some.

Am I making sense?
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 12:49:37 PM EDT
hmm, they use free healthcare at our hospitals. they fuck over american drivers here because they drive without insurance(if you dont have uninsured/underinsured here in AZ you're a moron) they smuggle drugs with them when they come up. they litter the desert. they are changing the southwest to a spanish only zone.

want some more?
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 12:50:22 PM EDT
None what so ever.
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 12:50:27 PM EDT

Originally Posted By michaelj1978:
Looking from the issue from both sides I really can't decide whether illegal aliens are THAT bad.


Here's my reasons why they are good:

Will take any job (even one a black man wouldn't take)
Will work for low wages
Pay sales tax on their purchases they make here (food, clothing)
Name one white guy that would put a tile roof on an Arizona house on a 115 degree day.


Here's my reasons why they are bad:

Take US money back home and spend it there.
Take some US jobs, even though they are low pay, I"m sure there are American citizens who would still have taken them.



BUT, here's what gets me thinking that they might not be that bad. Would we really want 10-15 million new citizens who make a gross income of 15,000-30,000 dollars each? No way!

When you are in that bracket you normally get most of what you paid in back out, but think of the families who have 2-5+ children, they would be getting back more than they paid in. A lot more.

For instance, a single mother of 2 who makes 15,000 pays in about 0 in taxes, but gets almost 5,000 back.

That 5,000 doesn't even include what other benefits that woman and kids would receive from the government if they were legalized. Food stamps, section 8 housing, medicaid, etc... That's at least another 8-10,000 in government support.


I know that we compain that they don't pay (federal/state) taxes, and they take up health care, but it seems in reality that if they were legalized, they'd get back what they paid and then some, and we'd still be taking care of their health care bill, and then some.

Am I making sense?



You're trying to get lynched, aren't you.
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 12:51:58 PM EDT
You forgot the part about being able to rob, rape and kill then run back over the border for sanctuary so you cam come back later for a repeat performance.
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 12:53:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/19/2005 12:56:54 PM EDT by AR15fan]

Originally Posted By michaelj1978:
Looking from the issue from both sides I really can't decide whether illegal aliens are THAT bad.


Here's my reasons why they are good:

Will take any job (even one a black man wouldn't take)
Will work for low wages...


No the taxpayers just subsidize their wages

You might pay them 5.00 an hour to mow your lawn. But the taxpayer has to pick up the increased infrastructer costs for the freeways, hospitals, schools, jails. In state tution for the illegals, WIC/Welfare for their kids. Then they is the increase in auto insurance rates, medical insurance rates, ect.

Illegals cost Cali 11 Billion a year!

They cost Arizona over 1 Billion a year.
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 12:55:24 PM EDT
No, they're not that bad. They're worse.
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 12:55:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TheRedHorseman:
hmm, they use free healthcare at our hospitals. they fuck over american drivers here because they drive without insurance(if you dont have uninsured/underinsured here in AZ you're a moron) they smuggle drugs with them when they come up. they litter the desert. they are changing the southwest to a spanish only zone.

want some more?

+1
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 12:56:57 PM EDT
No they are not ok

I live here and produce something for the better of society, they come here for a free ride. If they wanted to become part of this nation then they would take the legal routes.
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 12:58:29 PM EDT
Yes, they really are that bad.
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 12:59:32 PM EDT
Let's not forget all the strange /obscure/not seen here since the '1930's diseases they contribute.
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 1:02:38 PM EDT
Anyone who thinks Mexican illegals are bad has never dealt with Russians.

Link Posted: 5/19/2005 1:04:38 PM EDT

Originally Posted By michaelj1978:

Name one white guy that would put a tile roof on an Arizona house on a 115 degree day.



My Dad. My aging, white dad.
Had a roof over head and food on the table growing up thanks to him.



+1 on what everyone else said.
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 1:08:46 PM EDT
Are you trying for a verbal asskicking here dude, of course there are arguments for both sides of the story, but the real question should be " Are .50cal BMG really all that bad"?

+1 to all comments above.

Oh yeah IBTL. This could get really bad really quick.
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 1:12:40 PM EDT
Illegals don can't want to become Americans. They and their sponsers want America to bend the rules for them so they can turn the USA into a third world hell hole.
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 1:18:08 PM EDT

Originally Posted By California_Kid:
Anyone who thinks Mexican illegals are bad has never dealt with Russians.




When the Russians overrun the country like those from central and south America then I'll worry about them. Anyways, some of the Russian women are hot so they can come over if they want to...
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 1:19:36 PM EDT
The problem is there are:

Illegals that otherwise are "good folks" and take honest jobs and work hard. There are problems associated with not paying the right taxes (ie loading on hospitals and schools) but other than that aren't a problem. This could be dealt with by an appropriate work permit system.

Illegals that are hard core criminals. These are gang members, rapists and murders, that prey on everyone, and find it easier to "hide" since they aren't documented.

Drug dealers bringing coke, pot, etc etc in by the backpack full. These are smugglers, and there is all the resultant crime from that.

Possible terrorists.

It looks like the bottom three groups are overrepresented amongst those who sneak across the border. Thats a problem.
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 1:48:45 PM EDT
5.8 billion a year spent on federal prisons
1.6 billion a year spent on state prisons
200 million a year spent on local jails



All for illegal aliens.
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 2:16:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/19/2005 2:37:38 PM EDT by thebeekeeper1]
<Removed>
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 2:21:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/19/2005 2:22:54 PM EDT by lu380]
It's not necessarily that they're bad people, it's just that it's against the law to just waltz into America. Pros and cons are irrelavent, but if you want to get into all that, the cons far outweigh the pros. My main issue with illegal (mostly Mexican) immigration is that it changes our cultural/national identity. You can call me racist if you want, but I'm only being honest. If too many Mexicans immigrate here, they will eventually have children who will be citizens and hold a lot of seats in public office and push for legislation aimed at "Latino-American rights". This legislation will have nothing to do with "rights", and a lot to do with "Get Whitey". If it doesn't come in the form of legislation, it will be a series of hair-brained court decisions. Don't get me wrong, I believe in rights for everyone, just not the special treatment that they will be after, not to mention the new wave of political correctness that will only get worse.


I'm not a racist, I'm a realist.
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 2:22:49 PM EDT
Put it this way, since they started swarming my stock in Lysol and Raid have tripled
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 2:24:39 PM EDT
I can give you 6000 reasons every day WHY they are bad.

the first one is that they are here....wait for it....


ILLEGALLY! That means they are CRIMINALS with no respect for the law.

Period.

Jail them and deport them ALL!

Even the legal alliens that are here hate them.

Sgat1r5
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 2:27:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By michaelj1978:

Am I making sense?



None what so ever. I for one would GLADLY take a low paying construction job in my area. But guess what?



I CAN'T! becaause the illegals take them all and the companies are KNOWINGLY hiring them. These companies ALSO need to be held accountable.

Sgatr15
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 2:28:54 PM EDT
I have a hard time blaming the illegals for the situation. They are not the cause. It's our gov't refusing to enforce our own laws.

My increased insurance rates and the underpaid strawberry pickers are just symptoms. Personally, if I were a poor Mexican laborer I'd probably do exactly the same thing.
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 2:29:55 PM EDT

Are Illegals Really That Bad?


Yes, they are. They're fucking disgusting and I want every single leech who's living here off my fucking tax dollars deported.
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 2:32:19 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/19/2005 2:38:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/19/2005 2:38:11 PM EDT by thebeekeeper1]
7.) Posting topics or discussions with the desire to do the site or community harm.
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