Are you surprised?

Here's the article -

[size=4]Arabs call U.S. videotape fake[/size=4]
Cairo |Reuters | 15-12-2001

Angry over U.S. support for Israel, ordinary Arabs yesterday accused the United States of faking a videotape it says proves Osama bin Laden's guilt in the September 11 attacks on U.S. cities.

But the few Arab officials and analysts who commented on the tape, released by the Pentagon on Thursday, accepted it as damning evidence that the Saudi-born extremist was behind the attacks which killed nearly 3,300 people.

Most newspaper editorials and columnists ignored the tape, devoting attention to an escalation in tension between Israel and the Palestinians, after Israel cut all ties with President Yasser Arafat on Thursday and confined him to Ramallah.

"The attitude in the region is disturbing. Arab newspapers have been saying for three months that there is no proof of bin Laden's involvement, and then they play down the tape," said Lebanese political commentator Michael Young.

Egyptian state television ran the video on Thursday night describing it has "the tape which proves Osama bin Laden's involvement in the September 11 events". But commentators who appeared in Egyptian talk shows yesterday were sceptical.

"The tape is suspicious. It's not continuous and the sound is muffled," military analyst Hassan Suweilam said on one show.

"If the United States has evidence which condemns bin Laden, it should present it to courts, not on television screens."

Most reaction among television viewers in North Africa  and the Gulf was similar.

"Sometimes it was as if they were turning down the sound so that you couldn't hear what he was saying," said Beirut shopper Myrna Ghosn. "I don't think the translation is right."

"Bin Laden was articulating his words in a way that is different from his previous television appearances...I'm not convinced that was him speaking," said 24-year-old Tunisian university student Hichem Masmoudi.

Others questioned the tape's significance after the U.S. toppled Afghanistan's radical Taliban movement, sending bin Laden and his followers on the run, and while Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon tightens his vice on Palestinians.

"The U.S. is making a lot of noise about bin Laden's tape, while keeping quiet on Sharon's atrocities both in the past and present... where is justice?" asked an Omani civil servant.

"The tape...is irrelevant since Arabs have already condemned the attacks in the United States. The focus now should be on Sharon and his criminal acts against the Palestinians, which the U.S. is ignoring," an Omani university lecturer said.

But the few Arab officials to comment were damning. "The tape displays the cruel and inhumane face of a murderous criminal who has no respect for the sanctity of human life or the principles of his faith," Saudi ambassador to the United States Prince Bandar bin Sultan said.

[url]http://www.gulf-news.com/Articles/news.asp?ArticleID=35426[/url]

Eric The(WillThey[u]Ever[/u]Learn?)Hun[>]:)]

Also see [url]http://www.gulf-news.com/Articles/news.asp?ArticleID=35458[/url] for the Pakistanis calling the tape a fake!

From watching the various reactions on the cable news channels looks to me as if few have changed their position.
One thing perhaps noteworthy a few of the Muslim clerics, including the Oman (NY ?) have now agreed this was evidence that Usama really did the deed.

That alone probably makes the tape worth while.

They appear, for the most part, to be a bunch of fuckheads anyway, so what else should we expect.

ARnSC

Who gives a crap what they think?

[spank]

[b]It's called denial[/b]

It seems like anyone following the muslim faith can do no wrong.  It always seems to be someone else's fault, like the Jews, Christians, and those Buddhists.  You know...the one's who graffitied the wall with those gigantic Buddhas.

These are the same folks who refused to believe that one of their(EgyptAire?) own an airline company's off-duty pilots wrestled control of an airliner and crashed it in a suicide.  It wasn't until months later that they grudgingly admitted that is what happened. What about that blind Muslim cleric(Rachman?) who that he had nothing to do with WTC1 attack and was sentence to life in prison for his involvement in the WTC1 attack.? There seems to be a bit of a creditability gap from the leaders of the Arab world.

The racist American police planted the bloody glove on him.

---------
"Do you deny that you are in denial?"

and if de glove don fit you gotta a quit

What are all you sponges going to do when you find out that the folks feeding you these lies are in fact the perpetrators of this crime against humanity? How exactly will you be able to answer for all the Muslims who were falsely killed in our names based on complete and utter lies?

 as  W  said , your with us or against us


I say fuck all those Ignorant bastards!

Bin Laden is scum & should rot in hell for what he did.  I hope he suffers numerous deaths for every life he took & affected over the years.

So, now that you know where I stand:

I'm curious:  this POS has access to all sorts of firearms, weapons, etc. & is a multi-millionaire.

And he doesn't have access to a $99.00 Radio Shack VideoCam that can record a tape better than what we saw on TV?  The recording was "so bad" that the govt had to wait for days just to translate it?

Or maybe its a copy, of a copy, of a copy....

Doesn't make sense to me that someone that rich can't make a half-decent videotaped recording....considering he has all sorts of other communication devices.  The Afghans & Arabs may be barbarians but those that perpetrated this are rich beyond most Americans' dreams....you can't pull off an operation like this without money & lots of it.

So why the crappy video?

I am gonna guess "the crappy video" is because this appears to have been shot by some guy making home movies of his hero Binnie.  It wasn't a "produced" tape like the usual Binnie formal releases.

As for the jackasses denying the legitimacy of the tape, let's just deny we are even in Afghanistan.  "But we have tape of US operations!" they say.  It's fake.  "But we have pieces of U.S. bombs that fell on us!"  Fake, you bought them at a junk yard.  "But we have witnesses!"  Yeah, they are your allies and friends, and/or you bribed them.

Screw them, we should throw their BS back in their freaking faces.

The more they keep up this denial crap, the more the sheeple here will come to think that all Muslims, especially Arab and Middle Eastern muslims, really are terrorists and the less they will care what our military does to them...

Imbroglio?

Frankly I don't give a shit if [b]all[/b] the Jawas, I mean Muslims, are slaughtered.  They are inferior.  They are vermin.  I want this to become a jihad for them so we can kill them all and rid the world of the great evil that is Islam.

Is that too extreme?    

That's fine. The US military stomping your country's ass is fake too right?[heavy]

I have to say I am not surprised Arabs are saying the video's a fake.  

Whether the Arabs think the video's a fake is kind of irrelevant.  Even though Bin Laden's culpable for this crime, the fact is Most of the Arab world is glad 9/11 happened.  

Arabs feel 100% justified in bombing the WTC because we have the gall to station planes in Saudi Arabia TO DEFEND THEM FROM SADDAM.  Ingrate Kuwaitis are very pro-Bin Laden as well.

What I'd like to do is just go in and seize all the oil, nuke Mecca and Medina, and bomb the Aswan Dams and flood the Nile Valley. That'd learn 'em good not to even think of messing with America.  

Raven I second that motion. I have had a gut full of hearing about how we should be concerned over what the Moslem and Arab nations think.

Since when does the USA need to get permission to defend itself? If I told the rest of you how I really feel about it you would think I am wacko.  

I think a good solution would be to help the Russians develop their oil industry with us as the primary customer. It would pump up their economy and help insure the success of democracy there. After that we could pull out of the middle east and tell them to solve their own damn problems. And oh, by the way since we won't be needing your oil any longer you won't be needing our money.

Los Angeles Times: Bush Bristles at Suggestion Video Was Tampered With

[url]http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-000099386dec15.story?coll=la%2Dheadlines%2Dnation%2Dmanual[/url]

THE BIN LADEN TAPE
Bush Bristles at Suggestion Video Was Tampered With
Evidence: Though there are skeptics in the Arab world, the president calls the
tape 'a devastating declaration' of Bin Laden's guilt in attacks.
By JAMES GERSTENZANG
TIMES STAFF WRITER

December 15 2001

WASHINGTON -- President Bush called it "preposterous" Friday to suggest that the
tape of Osama bin Laden had been doctored and said it didn't matter whether the
terrorist leader was dead or alive when found.

"I don't care," the president said, as the military operation in Afghanistan
focused increasingly on capturing Al Qaeda and Taliban leaders. "Dead or alive,
either way. It . . . doesn't matter to me."

In his first public comments about the Bin Laden videotape since it was
televised around the world Thursday, Bush brushed aside any notion that it was
less than authentic. "That's just a feeble excuse to provide weak support for an
incredibly evil man," he said.

Bush read the transcript of the tape two weeks ago. He said he wanted the video
made public as soon as possible and called it "a devastating declaration of
guilt" by the man he contends is the mastermind of the Sept. 11 terrorist
attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon.

But, Bush said Friday, he also was reluctant to let the tape be shown, out of
concern for the feelings of the victims' families.

Administration officials have said that the video has a date stamp of Nov. 9 and
was found in the ruins of a building in Jalalabad, Afghanistan, that appeared to
have been hastily vacated.

Among those already convinced of Bin Laden's complicity in the attacks, the
video immediately was portrayed as "smoking gun" proof. But people in parts of
the Arab world were skeptical, questioning whether the tape had been fabricated.

"Some people think we didn't walk on the moon, and others think Elvis is among
us," scoffed Deputy Secretary of State Richard L. Armitage on NBC's "Today"
show. "Those voices will be drowned out by the voices of reason in the region."

Bush even worked the war on terrorism into a speech he delivered at a Washington
hotel, where he signed legislation extending a federal anti-drug program in
public schools.

"It's so important for Americans to know that the traffic in drugs finances the
work of terror, sustaining terrorists," he said. "Terrorists use drug profits to
fund their cells to commit acts of murder."

White House Press Secretary Ari Fleischer was ready with endorsements of the
videotape from Middle Eastern governments, reading for reporters statements by
Prince Bandar ibn Sultan, the Saudi ambassador to the United States, and the
information minister of the United Arab Emirates.

"There is no doubt in my mind that Bin Laden was behind these operations. The
tape confirms that in a way that leaves no room for doubt," said Sheik Abdullah
bin Zaid al Nahayan, the Emirates official, Fleischer reported.

From the start of the campaign to track down Bin Laden, Bush has made it clear
that he wanted the Saudi exile "dead or alive."

But his comments Friday took on new timeliness as the Afghan militias allied
with the United States gained greater control across the country, particularly
in Tora Bora, the mountainous area of eastern Afghanistan where Bin Laden may be
in hiding.

Fleischer said U.S. officials "very strongly believe" that Bin Laden still is in
Afghanistan.

But Bush, speaking to reporters during a photo session after meeting with Prime
Minister Thaksin Shinawatra of Thailand, renewed his words of caution that
tracking down the Al Qaeda leader could take time.

"I don't know whether we're going to get him tomorrow or a month from now or a
year from now," Bush said. "But we're going to get him.

"The American people must understand that I have no timetable in mind. I don't
have a calendar that I say, 'Well, gosh, if he's not gotten by this certain
moment, then I'll be disappointed,' because I am pleased with the progress that
we're making in Afghanistan."

With that progress, he said, "there is no such thing as a Taliban."

As for the tape, which shows the man at the focus of the U.S. war effort serene
and often smiling as he recounts the attacks: "This is Bin Laden unedited," Bush
said.

"This is Bin Laden, the Bin Laden who has murdered people. This is the man, Bush
said, "who sent innocent people to their deaths. This is a man who's so devious
and coldhearted that he laughs about the . . . so-called suicide bombers that
lost their lives."

For information about reprinting this article, go to http://www.lats.com/rights

Finally we have a president that has the balls to state exactly what he thinks.  

A guy was on O'Reilly the other night representing the Arab community.  He was saying this is really a small percentage that thinks we are full of it.  There are far too many ignorant Arabs that do believe we are wrong, but of course that is not all of them.  

Not at all...while you're at it, why don't you finish off all those Jews Adolf.

Nah.  The Jews don't have a religion that is based on the premise that killing "infidels" will gain you entrance to paradise.  Besides, I have a Jewish last name and am Catholic, not very popular in Nazi Germany.

And if you read the last line you would have realized I was joking jackass.  I don't believe in killing off anybody simply because I don't like them.  Do I hate Muslims?  Abso-fucking-lutely.  Do I think it reasonable to annihilate them all?  No.  I don't want them to rise from persecution like Christianity did.

Yup, whether the tape is phony or not is irrelevant.  Those bombs are sure real enough!

I was gonna use this line, but somehow I couldn't make it fit.

They probably learned how to deny the tapes authenticity by watching Klinton and our own slimy lying ass politicians, JUST DENY DENY DENY and when it gets to hot,  give em the <<<>>>.

Dumb f**king Americans, always worrying about  their enemies constitutional rights. Maybe we don't deserve this Great Nation after all.

If Osama was smart, he should have used his money to hire a publicity firm and a bunch of DemoKrat constitutional lawyers to help him destroy America. They would have found a government grant somewhere, or sued for discrimination and he never would have had to use a penny of his own money.

Damn can't you just see the satisfied looks on liberals faces if he won.  

No, the correct line is 'If the turban don't fit, You must acquit.'

Eric The(anti-JohnnieL.Cochran)Hun[>]:)]

The really shitty thing is that is competely within the realm of possibility.

[/quote]
And if you read the last line you would have realized I was joking jackass.  I don't believe in killing off anybody simply because I don't like them.  Do I hate Muslims?  Abso-fucking-lutely.  Do I think it reasonable to annihilate them all?  No.  I don't want them to rise from persecution like Christianity did.[/quote]

Didn't come across as a joke to me.  Its sometimes difficult to tell when one is "joking":

"Frankly I don't give a shit if all  the Jawas, I mean Muslims, are slaughtered. They are inferior. They are vermin. I want this to become a jihad for them so we can kill them all and rid the world of the great evil that is Islam."

Oh yeah...real funny, now I get it.

As for hating the entire Muslim religion based on this incident, I think that makes you the jackass. [-!-]

Of course, we live in a country where you are entitled to your hate & opinions...as I am entitled to mine.

LMAO!!  

Okay Bin Laden didn't do it.

 The planes were reported by passengers to be held up and controlled by Arabs.  

[b]If it wasn't Bin Laden Arab people, who the F$%^ was it??!!??!! [/b]

The United States isn't bombing Afghanistan.

Those are old Russian munitions exploding, bought after the Iron Curtain went down.  The airplanes are Migs.... nothing more, piloted by lawn gnomes.

I like fantasy land.

Your walking a thin rascist line on that Turban comment.  I'm going to tell a Moderator. nah nah nah Nah Nah!!

The tape was genuine and accurately translated!

But it will be seen by the Muslim world from an entirely different perspective than seen here in the US.

First of all, you need to look at the lies already put out by the various "talk-shows".

"Bin Laden laughed when he stated the terrorists didn't know the exact mission until just before it was to take place".

Duh? They volunteered for martyrdom, but didn't know they'd die in a suicide operation???!!  These guys were trained like Kamakaze. They knew what their mission was.  They just didn't know the exact details.

Bin Laden was gloating about his OPSEC procedures, not about the fact that he sent unwitting dupes to their death.

Watch the COMPLETE UNEDITED tape!

DaMan    



 

Folks, the "its a fake" response isn't all that surprising.

The extremist mullahs are putting out things like
- The WTC atrocity never happened, it was done in a hollywood studio, then broadcast by the Zionist controlled world media...
- Israel made the WTC atrocity occur.
- There was no WTC atrocity at all.
- the world is flat, the moon is made of cheese, etc etc.

Systematic examination of the evidence is boring.  Just scroll through a few topics here in General Discussion for proof. [;)]

Actually, I've hated Muslims for a long time.  This incident just reaffirmed my hatred for them.  You can dislike me all you like, I really don't care.  All I can say is that if you really believe that Islam is all about peace and love and that the Muslim next door just wants to be a friendly neighbor you need to wake the fuck up.  Better yet, take a course in Middle Eastern history and read the Qu'ran.  Islam was spread by Mohammed at the blade of a sword, he encouraged his followers to slaughter "infidels," and many of the Muslims in todays world believe the same damn thing.

[/quote]Actually, I've hated Muslims for a long time.  This incident just reaffirmed my hatred for them.  You can dislike me all you like, I really don't care.  All I can say is that if you really believe that Islam is all about peace and love and that the Muslim next door just wants to be a friendly neighbor you need to wake the fuck up.  Better yet, take a course in Middle Eastern history and read the Qu'ran.  Islam was spread by Mohammed at the blade of a sword, he encouraged his followers to slaughter "infidels," and many of the Muslims in todays world believe the same damn thing.[/quote]

Well my fragile ego is just devastated.

I am the Muslim next door & I have been the best neighbor my neighbors could have asked for.
I don't have to take a course (although I have taken three) since I was raised in the Islamic faith....funny though, I was never raised to slaughter anyone or preach my religion by the sword.  I have been taught tolerance & peace.  I would not hurt anyone unless they chose to hurt me or my family first...just like most other people in this country.

Well, guess that blows a hole in your theory of all Muslims being murderous bastards.

Why exactly do you hate Muslims so much?  I've met many a Christian that the planet could do without but I certainly don't hate all Christians.

If you are bent out of shape about what happened 2000 yrs (?) ago...well, I would suggest you let the past lie where it is & try to enjoy the short life you (we all) have.

I'm glad you don't live next door to me.  

I hate exactly what you've said.  "I have been taught tolerance & peace."  If it quacks like a duck and walks like a duck and flies like a duck don't tell me it's a fucking dog.  Throughout the history of Islam hate and violence have ruled the roost, not tolerance and peace.  I don't see Christian fundamentalists flying airliners into skyscrapers.  I don't see Jewish or Christian fundamentalists blowing up school buses.  I don't see Christian fundamentalists stoning women to death because the holes in their face mesh were too big.  Muslims do the very same things as a matter of course.  Furthermore, the mullahs and imams in both America and the United Kingdom have stated fully that they intend to take over.  I'm sorry bud, but I don't think having a Jawa as president, leading us down the road of ignorance, backwardness, and ultra-violence is very appealing.

I hate Islam because Muslims are lying sacks of shit.  They say one thing and do the exact fucking opposite.  I wouldn't hate Muslims so much if they weren't such damned hypocrites.

Maybe this will help you understand my hatred:  My 2nd cousin was killed by a Palestinian suicide bomber in 1986 in Tel Aviv in front of me.  Seeing somebody blown apart and being sprayed with guts and blood isn't exactly a fun thing to experience at 5 years old.

"If you are bent out of shape about what happened 2000 yrs (?) ago...well, I would suggest you let the past lie where it is & try to enjoy the short life you (we all) have."  Islam is only 1400 years old.  All of the terrible events perpetrated by Muslims didn't occur just 1400 years ago.  They have been perpetrated throughout the history of the religion.  To say jihad, i.e. the slaughter of innocent people (which in case you have forgotten is one of the pillars), is no longer a part of Islam is to say that Communion is no longer apart of Catholicism.

If you were taught tolerance and peace as a Muslim, good, maybe that means Islam has finally arisen from the Dark Ages.  I don't believe you though.

redmanfms is 100% correct.  

If you really hate that much, go to where the war is...don't start another one here to satiate your blood lust.  We already have enough judges (& wars) amongst us.  You sure sound alot like sopmodm4 or whatever the heck is name was...real "Muslim hating Jew" by his own charaterization & words.

Sorry about your cousin though...been there, done that.  It ain't pleasant but hate will not defeat hate.

"They say one thing and do the exact fucking opposite. I wouldn't hate Muslims so much if they weren't such damned hypocrites."  

Sounds like most of humanity to me, unless you've got a halo above your head.

1400 yrs, 2000 yrs...who cares?  Were you there?
Did it affect your life today?  If you want to wage war against the Muslims you hate, buy a ticket to the Middle East & wage away.  Leave the rest of us in peace.

As for Jihad, you are partially correct.

"Sometimes, a sixth pillar is included in discussions of ibadat, 'acts of worship.'  It is Jihad, meaning 'striving, exertion' in the way of God.  Most often it is translated in the west as 'holy war,' but that is only on aspect of the phenomenon.  Muslims recognize a greater and lesser jihad.  The greater is the individual's personal struggle with his or her base instincts and lack of faith and devotion.  This is a spirtual type of jihad. The lesser jihad involves, IF NECESSARY, armed struggle against the enemies of Islam, although it should only be in SELF-DEFENSE.  The Quran commands that 'there shall be no compulsion in religion' (2:256).  Jihad as exertion is definitely aimed at the spread of Islam, but by PEACEFUL means like preaching, travel, establishing educational institutions, and setting a good example.  Jihad as warfare is generally aimed at righting a wrong and has even been proclaimed by one Muslims group with reference to another."

An Introduction to Islam (1985) by Frederick Mathewson Denny.  Macmillan Publishing Company, New York.  

I guess it depends on what you were taught & by whom.  Hmmmmm....maybe not all Muslims are the same?  Maybe, some believe in Freedom, Liberty & Justice for All.  Maybe some are not barbarians who treat their women like dogs & who slaughter but don't really know why they do so.

I am too busy with my life to worry about killing Christians or converting anyone.  I want to live a decent life, free to live where I want & do what I want within the confines of the law.  

Life is too short to live in hate.  Make your peace & live your life.  Let the past lie where it is.