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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/7/2005 5:53:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 5:56:34 AM EDT by Dru]
The corporation I work for has a ‘Pay & Progression’ system......... It appears they system was implemented before it was well thought out, as it’s not that effective. (I think this is what they wanted any how).

The pay & Progression is a system based on levels, you have to master certain skills in your department or work area in order to move up levels and receive a pay increase. But you have to pass a written and sometimes a skills test to move up to the next level. After you have succeeded in passing the test, getting your raise, you have to wait 6 to 9 months before you can take your next test to move up another level.

Example: Operator A is at level 1, he is ready to move to level 2 as his 6 months has passed, he needs to learn how to run X reactor, which he has trained on for the past 6 months. He takes the test on the in’s & out’s of X reactor, passes and gets promoted to level 2 and level 2 pay increase. Now he will have to wait 6 more months to test for level 3, in the mean time he starts to train on Y reactor, as he needs to know this before he can test for level 3.

Sounds like an easy way to make money right? Wrong! You see the problem with this is if he picks up on how to run Y reactor in two months, he can’t test early and has to wait the 6 months. But will be expected to run Y reactor in his daily work if required

Then there is the problem or written test not being available when it’s time to take the test. There have been and still are some cases of test not even been made up at all. So operators are stuck, waiting to advance but can’t due to no test being available.

One guy had to wait a year and a half on a test to be made, he eventually over lapped two levels but was only allowed to test for one. Still waiting on the other one!

Now giving that a lot of operators have to wait to take test, because of the companies inability to make a test. Retro or back pay will be given IF they past the test the first time around. If they fail the test, they receive no back pay & have to wait three more months to retest, third time fail and they go 6 more months.

As for the back pay, they only give three months. In the case above, the one operator waited a year and a half to test, he only got three months retro.

What is management & HR’s take on all of this? The answers vary from “We don’t have a test” to “Were working on it” to ‘You shouldn’t wait so long to let you supervisor know it’s time to test”

How many of you have a job where you need to notify management it’s time for a raise? Those that due notify management, usually get one of the answers above.

How many of you have heard of this system of raises?

Morale is at an all time low........ And people are quitting in droves........


You’ve got personnel that have some time in to the company that was automatically topped out in pay when the system was implemented because of there skill level, never to receive a raise again (‘Cept the low cost of living increase) and you have talented individuals at the bottom who aren’t able to gain and move up due to inept management........



<­BR>


Link Posted: 8/7/2005 5:54:01 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 5:57:31 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Paul:
US Military has been doing it.



Sweet............ Maybe thats where the assholes got it from........
But then again it's a swiss company........
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:06:30 AM EDT
Dru, I can't say I disagree with the concept. A hell of a lot better, IMO, than paying some fucktard more just because he's been around longer.

However, it seems the implementation has been FUBAR.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:23:03 AM EDT
It can be worse. You can be tested on equipment that you've never seen, never trained on, and will never use.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:30:01 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 7:32:46 AM EDT by Dru]

Originally Posted By AeroE:
It can be worse. You can be tested on equipment that you've never seen, never trained on, and will never use.



Yea or like.......... having a test available at all.

[management] In order to get your next raise........ you need to train on that equipment....[/management]

[worker bee] Okay no problem, I'm ready[/worker bee]

[management] Oh... well we don't have a test yet..... working on one right now[/management]

Link Posted: 8/7/2005 7:35:51 AM EDT

Originally Posted By SWO_daddy:
Dru, I can't say I disagree with the concept. A hell of a lot better, IMO, than paying some fucktard more just because he's been around longer.

However, it seems the implementation has been FUBAR.



Words here don't even began to described it......

FUBAR...
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 8:10:41 AM EDT
This is just your company's underhanded way of fucking its employees up the ass without any lube.

Simple fact is they don't want to pay people more, so they make it such a pain in the ass that people will either quit or bend over and take it without any expectations of a raise. Much like all the incremental gun laws.

Businesses often say that anyone is replaceable, which is true, in order to save themselves a buck. What the idiots don't consider is that losing skilled, hard working, dependable people isn't a very good thing when you have to train their replacements and wonder if they will work hard and show up daily on time. This is especially true in more specialized or education requiring jobs (replacing a BurgerKing employee isn't much of a big deal).

Capitalism is all about making money, and the objective of a business is just - which means that the employee should only be looking out for his own best interests as well.

Link Posted: 8/7/2005 11:34:58 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 11:36:06 AM EDT by PeteCO]

Originally Posted By A_G:
This is just your company's underhanded way of fucking its employees up the ass without any lube.

Simple fact is they don't want to pay people more, so they make it such a pain in the ass that people will either quit or bend over and take it without any expectations of a raise. Much like all the incremental gun laws.

Businesses often say that anyone is replaceable, which is true, in order to save themselves a buck. What the idiots don't consider is that losing skilled, hard working, dependable people isn't a very good thing when you have to train their replacements and wonder if they will work hard and show up daily on time. This is especially true in more specialized or education requiring jobs (replacing a BurgerKing employee isn't much of a big deal).

Capitalism is all about making money, and the objective of a business is just - which means that the employee should only be looking out for his own best interests as well.




While I totally agree with what is in red above, and I do believe in cost of living raises, I hated those employees that used to come to me every six months EXPECTING a raise because they were nice enough not to die. They were doing the same job, had developed no new skills, but for some reason they figured that they deserved a raise......just because. I hate that poverty, entitlement midset.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 12:57:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2005 12:57:33 PM EDT by Dru]

Originally Posted By PeteCO:

Originally Posted By A_G:
This is just your company's underhanded way of fucking its employees up the ass without any lube.

Simple fact is they don't want to pay people more, so they make it such a pain in the ass that people will either quit or bend over and take it without any expectations of a raise. Much like all the incremental gun laws.

Businesses often say that anyone is replaceable, which is true, in order to save themselves a buck. What the idiots don't consider is that losing skilled, hard working, dependable people isn't a very good thing when you have to train their replacements and wonder if they will work hard and show up daily on time. This is especially true in more specialized or education requiring jobs (replacing a BurgerKing employee isn't much of a big deal).

Capitalism is all about making money, and the objective of a business is just - which means that the employee should only be looking out for his own best interests as well.




While I totally agree with what is in red above, and I do believe in cost of living raises, I hated those employees that used to come to me every six months EXPECTING a raise because they were nice enough not to die. They were doing the same job, had developed no new skills, but for some reason they figured that they deserved a raise......just because. I hate that poverty, entitlement midset.




While I agree.............. The Employees in this case are holding up to there end of the bargan, the company is not.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 2:32:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By PeteCO:

Originally Posted By A_G:
This is just your company's underhanded way of fucking its employees up the ass without any lube.

Simple fact is they don't want to pay people more, so they make it such a pain in the ass that people will either quit or bend over and take it without any expectations of a raise. Much like all the incremental gun laws.

Businesses often say that anyone is replaceable, which is true, in order to save themselves a buck. What the idiots don't consider is that losing skilled, hard working, dependable people isn't a very good thing when you have to train their replacements and wonder if they will work hard and show up daily on time. This is especially true in more specialized or education requiring jobs (replacing a BurgerKing employee isn't much of a big deal).

Capitalism is all about making money, and the objective of a business is just - which means that the employee should only be looking out for his own best interests as well.




While I totally agree with what is in red above, and I do believe in cost of living raises, I hated those employees that used to come to me every six months EXPECTING a raise because they were nice enough not to die. They were doing the same job, had developed no new skills, but for some reason they figured that they deserved a raise......just because. I hate that poverty, entitlement midset.




...and I agree with you on that. Just because you stay at a company doesn't entitle you to a raise, other than perhaps the 3% cost of living raise.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 2:56:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By A_G:

Originally Posted By PeteCO:

Originally Posted By A_G:
This is just your company's underhanded way of fucking its employees up the ass without any lube.

Simple fact is they don't want to pay people more, so they make it such a pain in the ass that people will either quit or bend over and take it without any expectations of a raise. Much like all the incremental gun laws.

Businesses often say that anyone is replaceable, which is true, in order to save themselves a buck. What the idiots don't consider is that losing skilled, hard working, dependable people isn't a very good thing when you have to train their replacements and wonder if they will work hard and show up daily on time. This is especially true in more specialized or education requiring jobs (replacing a BurgerKing employee isn't much of a big deal).

Capitalism is all about making money, and the objective of a business is just - which means that the employee should only be looking out for his own best interests as well.




While I totally agree with what is in red above, and I do believe in cost of living raises, I hated those employees that used to come to me every six months EXPECTING a raise because they were nice enough not to die. They were doing the same job, had developed no new skills, but for some reason they figured that they deserved a raise......just because. I hate that poverty, entitlement midset.




...and I agree with you on that. Just because you stay at a company doesn't entitle you to a raise, other than perhaps the 3% cost of living raise.




We got 2.8%..............
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 3:09:51 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Dru:

Originally Posted By A_G:

Originally Posted By PeteCO:

Originally Posted By A_G:
This is just your company's underhanded way of fucking its employees up the ass without any lube.

Simple fact is they don't want to pay people more, so they make it such a pain in the ass that people will either quit or bend over and take it without any expectations of a raise. Much like all the incremental gun laws.

Businesses often say that anyone is replaceable, which is true, in order to save themselves a buck. What the idiots don't consider is that losing skilled, hard working, dependable people isn't a very good thing when you have to train their replacements and wonder if they will work hard and show up daily on time. This is especially true in more specialized or education requiring jobs (replacing a BurgerKing employee isn't much of a big deal).

Capitalism is all about making money, and the objective of a business is just - which means that the employee should only be looking out for his own best interests as well.




While I totally agree with what is in red above, and I do believe in cost of living raises, I hated those employees that used to come to me every six months EXPECTING a raise because they were nice enough not to die. They were doing the same job, had developed no new skills, but for some reason they figured that they deserved a raise......just because. I hate that poverty, entitlement midset.




...and I agree with you on that. Just because you stay at a company doesn't entitle you to a raise, other than perhaps the 3% cost of living raise.




We got 2.8%..............



No one is Entitled to any raise at all.

You can deep six that candy-assed socialist crap folks. When you signed on with your employer you agreed to trade your work for x hours per day for x amount of dollars. Perhaps there are also other benefits, but they are part of the initial bargain. Past that, you are on your own.

If you aren't making enough money, drag your ass out and find another job. If you can't, get trained for a new field of work. It is not your employers job to make a living for you.

Yep, I'm a dick. But I have encountered walls many time in my life and I have surmounted them. It's not the "mans" job to take care of me or my family . . . it's my job.

Disconnector
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 3:27:05 PM EDT
So a person working at a company for several years, who shows up on time and works hard, and does his job well isn't worth keeping around with cost of living raises?

You illustrate the point I was trying to make which is companies often hurt themselves screwing good hard working reliable employees because they're so preoccupied with saving a few cents, literally in some cases.

No, people aren't entitled to anything. However, often times it makes business sense to give employees cost of living raises which help to keep people from becoming frustrated and quitting. A company with a high turn over rate having to train new people, weed out the bad new people, etc. only hurts itself. Again, this is especially true in specialized fields where lots of training or experience is required.

I'm not a union supporter or a marxist by any stretch, but I am also not a stupid myopic idiot so fixated on a dollar that I forget good employees are humans and not machines that don't have families and can just be tossed to the curb.
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