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Posted: 1/6/2012 2:18:19 PM EDT
How long till "excessive facial makup and/or unkempt hair in public" becomes a crime?

http://boingboing.net/2012/01/05/dazzle-makeup-and-hairstyles-t.html


CV Dazzle is a systematic approach to creating "dazzle" makeup and hair effects that fool computer vision systems. For example, you could change the symmetry of your face by painting a lightning bolt across it, causing all computer vision systems to mistakenly identify you as David Bowie.

http://cvdazzle.com/
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:21:58 PM EDT
Do simple sunglasses prevent FR from recognizing you?
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:26:43 PM EDT
Because a lightning bolt painted across your face will make you blend in.

I prefer this look:

]

Or maybe this one:


Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:28:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Bhart89:
Do simple sunglasses prevent FR from recognizing you?

Simple sunglasses? No.



Lady Gaga Cigarette Sunglasses? Yes.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:29:51 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:32:19 PM EDT


It has been illegal for almost a hundred years in tx to wear a mask in public. I don't doubt the do-gooders would make "face altering makeup" a crime, too.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:34:08 PM EDT
Randomly tag yourself and others?
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:34:46 PM EDT
Just shave your mustache and leave the beard.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:38:33 PM EDT
facial recognition does not work in the first place.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:39:56 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:41:22 PM EDT
Right, crazy hair and splotches of paint on your face totally don't stand out in a crowd.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:42:47 PM EDT
there are baseball caps and glass with small IR LEDs aimed down over the face. the light is invisible to the naked eye but all cameras see is a white blob of light over the face...
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:42:48 PM EDT
I thought I heard that a big smile caused facial recognition software to take a dump.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:43:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Skillshot:


It has been illegal for almost a hundred years in tx to wear a mask in public. I don't doubt the do-gooders would make "face altering makeup" a crime, too.

This is why we can't have nice things!

Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:44:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Lapp_Dance:
Defeat Skynet, become Costa!





Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:44:36 PM EDT
Members of al Qaeda and run-of-the-mill street criminals all thank you for this information.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:44:45 PM EDT
Just put an IR LED on your ballcap, and be done with it.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:46:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/6/2012 2:47:40 PM EDT by bcw107]
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:48:38 PM EDT
i plan to wear a penguin mask and run around naked.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:48:57 PM EDT

Go Tycho Brahe on them and use interchangeable noses.

Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:49:18 PM EDT


Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:49:40 PM EDT
Originally Posted By John87:
i plan to wear a penguin mask and run around naked.


People will just mistake you for Aimless.

Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:50:30 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Mosin_Nagant:
Right, crazy hair and splotches of paint on your face totally don't stand out in a crowd.


Not if everyone does it.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:50:50 PM EDT

Originally Posted By RenegadeX:
facial recognition does not work in the first place.


Sure. You go ahead and believe that.

Independent national level tests have proven otherwise. I have looked at the data, the systems and the test protocols.

How about you? What is your experience?
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:52:27 PM EDT
A burqa would work too in a pinch.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:52:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By mcantu:
there are baseball caps and glass with small IR LEDs aimed down over the face. the light is invisible to the naked eye but all cameras see is a white blob of light over the face...


I thought this was about automated facial recognition? You seem to be referring to street surveillance systems.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:54:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/6/2012 2:54:36 PM EDT by MotorMouth]
Originally Posted By CWO:

Originally Posted By mcantu:
there are baseball caps and glass with small IR LEDs aimed down over the face. the light is invisible to the naked eye but all cameras see is a white blob of light over the face...


I thought this was about automated facial recognition? You seem to be referring to street surveillance systems.


Don't automated facial recognition systems use cameras?
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:55:38 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MotorMouth:
Originally Posted By CWO:

Originally Posted By mcantu:
there are baseball caps and glass with small IR LEDs aimed down over the face. the light is invisible to the naked eye but all cameras see is a white blob of light over the face...


I thought this was about automated facial recognition? You seem to be referring to street surveillance systems.


Don't automated facial recognition systems use cameras?

Yes. So?
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:56:11 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DzlBenz:

Originally Posted By Skillshot:


It has been illegal for almost a hundred years in tx to wear a mask in public. I don't doubt the do-gooders would make "face altering makeup" a crime, too.

This is why we can't have nice things!


We can't have crappy things like Erlenmeyer flasks, either.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:56:39 PM EDT
Originally Posted By CWO:

Originally Posted By MotorMouth:
Originally Posted By CWO:

Originally Posted By mcantu:
there are baseball caps and glass with small IR LEDs aimed down over the face. the light is invisible to the naked eye but all cameras see is a white blob of light over the face...


I thought this was about automated facial recognition? You seem to be referring to street surveillance systems.


Don't automated facial recognition systems use cameras?

Yes. So?


Well, if the camera can't render an image of your face, how would the facial recognition system that relies on the camera be able to do its job?
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:57:26 PM EDT
I dont know if paint would do it, dont these systems work off distances between facial features? eyebrows to nose, nose iris, iris to iris, iris to mouth. things that CANT change unless you flex, and then take a wide selection of data points indicating yes or no and say this person has a 99% chance of being X person from database we built using data previously collected. The IR thing sounds interesting,
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 2:59:24 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MotorMouth:
Originally Posted By CWO:

Originally Posted By MotorMouth:
Originally Posted By CWO:

Originally Posted By mcantu:
there are baseball caps and glass with small IR LEDs aimed down over the face. the light is invisible to the naked eye but all cameras see is a white blob of light over the face...


I thought this was about automated facial recognition? You seem to be referring to street surveillance systems.


Don't automated facial recognition systems use cameras?

Yes. So?


Well, if the camera can't render an image of your face, how would the facial recognition system that relies on the camera be able to do its job?

What causes you to think that the suggested technique would render the image of the target face unusable? Because the author said so?

Ask the person who wrote that what his experience is with facial recognitions systems.

My guess is that he will say that he "read it on the Internet somewhere".
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:01:20 PM EDT
this is what wearing a couple of small IR LEDs will look like to a camera...


Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:02:46 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SoCalJBT:
Members of al Qaeda and run-of-the-mill street criminals all thank you for this information.


Last time I checked Al Qaeda was best known for their suicide attacks, kind makes hiding your face irrelevant. Heck most of the time they video their own attacks and post them to the web. I'm guessing this isn't something they would loose any sleep over.

And I don't know if you have much experience when dealing with run of the mill street criminals, but more often than not, they are fucking stupid. I don't mean just slow but real honest to God morons. And they are usually lazy as all hell. I have a hard time picturing any of the ones I have known getting special hates and elaborate setups to fool the cameras.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:03:19 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Mech2007:
Originally Posted By John87:
i plan to wear a penguin mask and run around naked.


People will just mistake you for Aimless.



ohh good my plan is working. will people also think that aimless is hung like a horse
















fly?
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:03:38 PM EDT
Originally Posted By CWO:

Originally Posted By MotorMouth:
Originally Posted By CWO:

Originally Posted By MotorMouth:
Originally Posted By CWO:

Originally Posted By mcantu:
there are baseball caps and glass with small IR LEDs aimed down over the face. the light is invisible to the naked eye but all cameras see is a white blob of light over the face...


I thought this was about automated facial recognition? You seem to be referring to street surveillance systems.


Don't automated facial recognition systems use cameras?

Yes. So?


Well, if the camera can't render an image of your face, how would the facial recognition system that relies on the camera be able to do its job?

What causes you to think that the suggested technique would render the image of the target face unusable? Because the author said so?

Ask the person who wrote that what his experience is with facial recognitions systems.

My guess is that he will say that he "read it on the Internet somewhere".


I'm certainly no expert, but I have seen what an IR light will do to video that is rendered for viewing by people.

Are you saying that the information necessary for facial recognition systems to do its thing is still captured by the camera despite the IR?
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:09:46 PM EDT
I was also under the impression that the IR LEDs would cause the facial image to be un readable.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:21:26 PM EDT
Isn't IR light dangerous to your vision?
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:23:40 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Mosin_Nagant:
Isn't IR light dangerous to your vision?


I don't think that it is, but again, I'm no expert. I do know that the right wave lengths of UV are dangerous.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:24:36 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Mosin_Nagant:
Isn't IR light dangerous to your vision?


Ultraviolet is. IR, isn't, to my recollection.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:30:20 PM EDT
Older software requires the eye location and distance between them measurable. Estimation can be conducted for sunglasses depending upon the quality of the photo.

Dunno about the newer stuff, budget won't allow upgrading.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:32:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/7/2012 3:05:54 AM EDT by Ponyboy]
Originally Posted By mcantu:
this is what wearing a couple of small IR LEDs will look like to a camera...

http://hackedgadgets.com/wp-content/2/_IR_LED_Blocks_Security_Camera.jpg



That is an IR camera. It won't work for any camera with IR or UV filters which is pretty much all of them. Most cameras don't have night vision capability.

Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:33:23 PM EDT
Exactly what is the point about facial recognition software anyway? For three shifts, they are going to have to hire 930,000,000 employees to keep tabs on everybody. Then of course, more people to keep tabs on the new employees.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:34:58 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Strykewolf:
Originally Posted By Mosin_Nagant:
Isn't IR light dangerous to your vision?


Ultraviolet is. IR, isn't, to my recollection.


IR can be. So can normal visible light. Just depends on the power.

I'm no expert either, but I believe IR is more dangerous tho, because your pupils don't react to it.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:39:26 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Strykewolf:
Originally Posted By Mosin_Nagant:
Isn't IR light dangerous to your vision?


Ultraviolet is. IR, isn't, to my recollection.


IR light in the lower wavelengths can definitely be harmful. Higher wavelengths less so.

Very intense lower wavelength light can be especially harmful because you can't see it, so you won't have a blink response while it's burning your retina.

Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:40:18 PM EDT
Cross your eyes?
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:40:25 PM EDT
If you really want to break the algorithms instead of just camera detection, you'll need to apply some serious countershading and change the profile of the eye-nose bridge.

Make the eye sockets, lower surfaces of the lips and underside of the nose bright, bring down the brightness of the forehead, cheekbones, nose, upper lip and upper chin, change the profiles and the algorithm will have a much harder time making out exactly who you are.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:44:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Rogue-Sasquatch:
If you really want to break the algorithms instead of just camera detection, you'll need to apply some serious countershading and change the profile of the eye-nose bridge.

Make the eye sockets, lower surfaces of the lips and underside of the nose bright, bring down the brightness of the forehead, cheekbones, nose, upper lip and upper chin, change the profiles and the algorithm will have a much harder time making out exactly who you are.

So you're saying shave your beard differently and wear sunglasses.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:46:07 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:48:37 PM EDT
Originally Posted By kevinb120:

Originally Posted By Rogue-Sasquatch:
If you really want to break the algorithms instead of just camera detection, you'll need to apply some serious countershading and change the profile of the eye-nose bridge.

Make the eye sockets, lower surfaces of the lips and underside of the nose bright, bring down the brightness of the forehead, cheekbones, nose, upper lip and upper chin, change the profiles and the algorithm will have a much harder time making out exactly who you are.

So you're saying shave your beard differently and wear sunglasses.


Oh, if only.

Think backwards Joker makeup and then some. White in the eye sockets and the downward-facing planes of the face, darker skin tones on the upward facing and brighter areas, all of that on top of silicone prosthetics to change the actual topology.

It can be done, but it's getting into Mission Impossible territory.
Link Posted: 1/6/2012 3:51:17 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Rogue-Sasquatch:
Originally Posted By kevinb120:

Originally Posted By Rogue-Sasquatch:
If you really want to break the algorithms instead of just camera detection, you'll need to apply some serious countershading and change the profile of the eye-nose bridge.

Make the eye sockets, lower surfaces of the lips and underside of the nose bright, bring down the brightness of the forehead, cheekbones, nose, upper lip and upper chin, change the profiles and the algorithm will have a much harder time making out exactly who you are.

So you're saying shave your beard differently and wear sunglasses.


Oh, if only.

Think backwards Joker makeup and then some. White in the eye sockets and the downward-facing planes of the face, darker skin tones on the upward facing and brighter areas, all of that on top of silicone prosthetics to change the actual topology.

It can be done, but it's getting into Mission Impossible territory.

Why wouldn't I just take out the camera with a shotgun?
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