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Posted: 7/24/2005 7:35:01 PM EDT
http://www.danielpipes.org/article/2714

Scriptural: The Koran itself in several places insists that its God is the same as the God of Judaism and Christianity. The most direct statement is one in which Muslims are admonished to tell Jews and Christians "We believe in that which has been revealed to us and revealed to you; our God and your God is One, and to Him we do submit" (E.H. Palmer translation of Sura 29:46) Of course, the verse can also be rendered "our Allah and your Allah is One" (as it is in the notorious Abdullah Yusuf Ali translation)

Historical: Chronologically, Islam followed after Judaism and Christianity, but the Koran claims Islam actually preceded the other monotheisms. In Islamic doctrine (Sura 3:67), Abraham was the first Muslim. Moses and Jesus introduced mistakes into the Word of God; Muhammad brought it down perfectly. Islam views Judaism and Christianity as flawed versions of itself, correct on essentials but wrong in important details. This outlook implies that all three faiths share the God of Abraham.
God Ackbar!

Linguistic: Just as Dieu and Gott are the French and German words for God, so is Allah the Arabic equivalent. In part, this identity of meaning can be seen from cognates: In Hebrew, the word for God is Elohim, a cognate of Allah. In Aramaic, the language spoken by Jesus, God is Allaha. In the Maltese language, which is unique because it is Arabic-based but spoken by a predominantly Catholic people, God is Alla.

Further, most Jews and Christians who speak Arabic routinely use the word Allah to refer to God. (Copts, the Christians of Egypt, do not.) The Old and New Testaments in Arabic use this word. In the Arabic-language Bible, for instance, Jesus is referred to as the son of Allah. Even translations carried out by Christian missionaries, such as the famous one done in 1865 by Cornelius Van Dyke, refer to Allah, as do missionary discussions.

The God=Allah equation means that, however hostile political relations may be, a common "children of Abraham" bond does exist and its exploration can one day provide a basis for interfaith comity. Jewish-Christian dialogue has made great strides and Jewish-Christian-Muslim trialogue could as well.

Link Posted: 7/24/2005 7:39:17 PM EDT
My God had a son. Allah didn't.
The son created me and saved me.

The ROP'ers are VERY insistant that allah is ONE.
Their god is not my GOD.
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 7:40:52 PM EDT
uh huh.
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 7:41:21 PM EDT
The God of Scripture is NOTHING like the Muslim god, in personality, disposition or character.

Link Posted: 7/24/2005 7:42:28 PM EDT

Originally Posted By postpostban:
My God had a son. Allah didn't.
The son created me and saved me.

The ROP'ers are VERY insistant that allah is ONE.
Their god is not my GOD.



Same for Judaism. Both Judaism and Christianity believe in the Old Testament, one and the same.
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 7:44:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:

Originally Posted By postpostban:
My God had a son. Allah didn't.
The son created me and saved me.

The ROP'ers are VERY insistant that allah is ONE.
Their god is not my GOD.



Same for Judaism. Both Judaism and Christianity believe in the Old Testament, one and the same.



They are mistaken. Muslims are wrong.
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 7:45:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By postpostban:

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:

Originally Posted By postpostban:
My God had a son. Allah didn't.
The son created me and saved me.

The ROP'ers are VERY insistant that allah is ONE.
Their god is not my GOD.



Same for Judaism. Both Judaism and Christianity believe in the Old Testament, one and the same.



They are mistaken. Muslims are wrong.



But Jews aren't?
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 7:45:44 PM EDT

Originally Posted By postpostban:

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:

Originally Posted By postpostban:
My God had a son. Allah didn't.
The son created me and saved me.

The ROP'ers are VERY insistant that allah is ONE.
Their god is not my GOD.



Same for Judaism. Both Judaism and Christianity believe in the Old Testament, one and the same.



They are mistaken. Muslims are wrong.



You're all wrong. There is no God.

This isn't going anywhere is it?
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 7:51:04 PM EDT

Originally Posted By postpostban:
My God had a son. Allah didn't.
The son created me and saved me.

The ROP'ers are VERY insistant that allah is ONE.
Their god is not my GOD.



Yes but if you study the trinity, The Father, The Son and the Holy Ghost, they are one as well. Jesus was not the son of God so much as he was a human manifestation of God. So Allah was, indeed if you belive in such things is Jesus.

All three religions are base on Abrahamian beliefs.
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 7:53:47 PM EDT

Originally Posted By garandman:
The God of Scripture is NOTHING like the Muslim god, in personality, disposition or character.



Have your read he complete text of the Old Testament and the Q'uran as it was written by those so inspired or are you just basing this on a limited knowledge of both.
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 7:55:01 PM EDT

Originally Posted By sysadmin:

Originally Posted By postpostban:
My God had a son. Allah didn't.
The son created me and saved me.

The ROP'ers are VERY insistant that allah is ONE.
Their god is not my GOD.



Yes but if you study the trinity, The Father, The Son and the Holy Ghost, they are one as well. Jesus was not the son of God so much as he was a human manifestation of God. So Allah was, indeed if you belive in such things is Jesus.

All three religions are base on Abrahamian beliefs.



I think you need to look a little closer. When Jesus was baptised, the voice from heaven didn't say" This is my beloved me , in whom I am well pleased with myself."
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 7:58:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By sysadmin:

Originally Posted By garandman:
The God of Scripture is NOTHING like the Muslim god, in personality, disposition or character.



Have your read he complete text of the Old Testament and the Q'uran as it was written by those so inspired or are you just basing this on a limited knowledge of both.



Allah asks you to die for him.


God sent His Son to die for you.

Link Posted: 7/24/2005 7:58:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:

Originally Posted By postpostban:

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:

Originally Posted By postpostban:
My God had a son. Allah didn't.
The son created me and saved me.

The ROP'ers are VERY insistant that allah is ONE.
Their god is not my GOD.



Same for Judaism. Both Judaism and Christianity believe in the Old Testament, one and the same.



They are mistaken. Muslims are wrong.



But Jews aren't?



No, the jews don't believe in a single god. Genesis is their bible too and it says "lets US make man in OUR image"

The Jew's problem is that they reject thier own messiah because he didn't establish an earthly kingdom when he first came.
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 8:08:28 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:

The God=Allah equation means that, however hostile political relations may be, a common "children of Abraham" bond does exist and its exploration can one day provide a basis for interfaith comity. Jewish-Christian dialogue has made great strides and Jewish-Christian-Muslim trialogue could as well.




Is that you dad? Man you sound just like him.

Yes, Abraham's illegitmate son Ishmael was the first of the Arabs. So yes, techniquely they are the same God.

You see the problem starts when a religion starts indoctrinating it's followers to believe that all people not practicing your religion must die, which is what the Koran teaches.



Link Posted: 7/24/2005 8:11:04 PM EDT

Originally Posted By postpostban:

No, the jews don't believe in a single god. Genesis is their bible too and it says "lets US make man in OUR image"




Many Jews do beleive in one God "Hear O Israel the Lord our God is one" and reject the notion of Jesus the Son of God


The Jew's problem is that they reject thier own messiah because he didn't establish an earthly kingdom when he first came.


A BIG +1 there.

Link Posted: 7/24/2005 8:13:41 PM EDT

Originally Posted By garandman:

Originally Posted By sysadmin:

Originally Posted By garandman:
The God of Scripture is NOTHING like the Muslim god, in personality, disposition or character.



Have your read he complete text of the Old Testament and the Q'uran as it was written by those so inspired or are you just basing this on a limited knowledge of both.



Allah asks you to die for him.


God sent His Son to die for you.




So I guess the answer to my question is no. You haven't read the completed text of your Old Testament or the Q'uran and you are basing not only our your belief the Christian God but your opinion of the Muslim Allah on a limited knowledge of both.

No worries. This is typical behavior.
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 8:22:47 PM EDT

Originally Posted By JHMC79:

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:

The God=Allah equation means that, however hostile political relations may be, a common "children of Abraham" bond does exist and its exploration can one day provide a basis for interfaith comity. Jewish-Christian dialogue has made great strides and Jewish-Christian-Muslim trialogue could as well.




Is that you dad? Man you sound just like him.

Yes, Abraham's illegitmate son Ishmael was the first of the Arabs. So yes, techniquely they are the same God.

You see the problem starts when a religion starts indoctrinating it's followers to believe that all people not practicing your religion must die, which is what the Koran teaches.




Yes and then there was the Hundred Year War, the Crusades, the Spanish Inquisition. Centuries of Kings Ruling nations by devine right with tyranny and blasphemy being crimes punishable by death because if you say something un-pleasant about the King since he is the King because God said so you are tyrannous and blasphemous and vis-versa.

Remember in Serbia it was the Christians that were doing the lions share of mass executions on the muslim population. In WWII it was the Christians and Catholics that were executing the Jews thousands a day.
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 8:26:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By sysadmin:

Originally Posted By garandman:

Allah asks you to die for him.


God sent His Son to die for you.




So I guess the answer to my question is no. You haven't read the completed text of your Old Testament or the Q'uran and you are basing not only our your belief the Christian God but your opinion of the Muslim Allah on a limited knowledge of both.

No worries. This is typical behavior.



What I said is factually true, and accurately representative of both Christianity and Muslims.

And besides, there is more to Christianity than just teh Old Testament. As such, if I were you, I wouldn't go around making assertions about my knowledge of the Old testament or the Koran.

Because you have NO IDEA of my knowledge base.



Link Posted: 7/24/2005 8:29:11 PM EDT

Originally Posted By sysadmin:

Yes and then there was the Hundred Year War, the Crusades, the Spanish Inquisition. Centuries of Kings Ruling nations by devine right with tyranny and blasphemy being crimes punishable by death because if you say something un-pleasant about the King since he is the King because God said so you are tyrannous and blasphemous and vis-versa.

Remember in Serbia it was the Christians that were doing the lions share of mass executions on the muslim population. In WWII it was the Christians and Catholics that were executing the Jews thousands a day.



DO you think someone is a Chrisitan SIMPLY because they say they are???

DO you NOT understand that a Chrsitian BY DEFINITION must be Christ like? And that such acts are almost a CERTAIN guarantee those performing such acts are NOT CHristian??

Link Posted: 7/24/2005 8:33:34 PM EDT

Originally Posted By garandman:

Originally Posted By sysadmin:

Yes and then there was the Hundred Year War, the Crusades, the Spanish Inquisition. Centuries of Kings Ruling nations by devine right with tyranny and blasphemy being crimes punishable by death because if you say something un-pleasant about the King since he is the King because God said so you are tyrannous and blasphemous and vis-versa.

Remember in Serbia it was the Christians that were doing the lions share of mass executions on the muslim population. In WWII it was the Christians and Catholics that were executing the Jews thousands a day.



DO you think someone is a Chrisitan SIMPLY because they say they are???

DO you NOT understand that a Chrsitian BY DEFINITION must be Christ like? And that such acts are almost a CERTAIN guarantee those performing such acts are NOT CHristian??




Well, they certainly seemed to BELIEVE they were doing the Christian thing at the time didn't they?

Can you say, "Onward Christian Soldier." can you say "Even now in Heaven their are Angels with savage weapons."?
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 8:34:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Justa_TXguy:

Originally Posted By postpostban:

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:

Originally Posted By postpostban:
My God had a son. Allah didn't.
The son created me and saved me.

The ROP'ers are VERY insistant that allah is ONE.
Their god is not my GOD.



Same for Judaism. Both Judaism and Christianity believe in the Old Testament, one and the same.



They are mistaken. Muslims are wrong.



You're all wrong. There is no God.

This isn't going anywhere is it?



Thank you for demonstrating your insecurity in your athiesm by barging into the religion forum.

Link Posted: 7/24/2005 8:38:51 PM EDT

Originally Posted By fizassist:

Originally Posted By Justa_TXguy:

You're all wrong. There is no God.

This isn't going anywhere is it?



Thank you for demonstrating your insecurity in your athiesm by barging into the religion forum.




As an atheist, I have a keen interest in religion. It affects me.
Sorry, I didn't see the "No people with IQs greater than their shoe size allowed" sign. My apologies.

Link Posted: 7/24/2005 8:40:34 PM EDT

Originally Posted By sysadmin:

Originally Posted By garandman:

Originally Posted By sysadmin:

Yes and then there was the Hundred Year War, the Crusades, the Spanish Inquisition. Centuries of Kings Ruling nations by devine right with tyranny and blasphemy being crimes punishable by death because if you say something un-pleasant about the King since he is the King because God said so you are tyrannous and blasphemous and vis-versa.

Remember in Serbia it was the Christians that were doing the lions share of mass executions on the muslim population. In WWII it was the Christians and Catholics that were executing the Jews thousands a day.



DO you think someone is a Chrisitan SIMPLY because they say they are???

DO you NOT understand that a Chrsitian BY DEFINITION must be Christ like? And that such acts are almost a CERTAIN guarantee those performing such acts are NOT CHristian??




Well, they certainly seemed to BELIEVE they were doing the Christian thing at the time didn't they?

Can you say, "Onward Christian Soldier."



I'm sorry...which scripture was that....?

If you continue with the song, you will notice that they are "marching as to war", not "marching to war". That's a "simile", and it means, by definition, they are not marching to war.


can you say "Even now in Heaven their are Angels with savage weapons."?


Yes. I can. It's from a Grade B movie. It's not scripture.



www.unomaha.edu/jrf/Vol7No2/angels.htm

I love people who quote the bible who have never read the bible. You should actually read it. It would be good for you.
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 8:41:56 PM EDT
My humble opinion: Allah is the Muslim word for God. I just personally believe that Muslims have greatly misunderstood Him.

Of course it's more complicated than that, but this is my summary.
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 8:43:25 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Justa_TXguy:

Originally Posted By fizassist:

Originally Posted By Justa_TXguy:

You're all wrong. There is no God.

This isn't going anywhere is it?



Thank you for demonstrating your insecurity in your athiesm by barging into the religion forum.




As an atheist, I have a keen interest in religion. It affects me.



Huh? Maybe it's me, but did that just make no sense whatsoever?


Sorry, I didn't see the "No people with IQs greater than their shoe size allowed" sign. My apologies.



Yeah, it's rough having size 165 shoes, but I deal.
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 8:45:51 PM EDT

Originally Posted By sysadmin:

Originally Posted By garandman:

DO you think someone is a Chrisitan SIMPLY because they say they are???

DO you NOT understand that a Chrsitian BY DEFINITION must be Christ like? And that such acts are almost a CERTAIN guarantee those performing such acts are NOT CHristian??




Well, they certainly seemed to BELIEVE they were doing the Christian thing at the time didn't they?



And when people beleived the earth was flat, did that make it so? ?If I beleive I'm a millionaire and a Nobel peace prize winner, would that make it a good idea to quit my job tomorrow??

I don't care WHAT they beleived. Christianity is OBJECTIVELY measured, by the Word of God, the Bible.


Can you say, "Onward Christian Soldier." can you say "Even now in Heaven their are Angels with savage weapons."?


Please cite chapter and verse of Scripture where these concepts are taught, and we'll pursue the discssion from there
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 8:46:06 PM EDT
Im thinking the religious section should have been subheaded under The Pit.
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 8:50:03 PM EDT

Originally Posted By fizassist:

Originally Posted By Justa_TXguy:
As an atheist, I have a keen interest in religion. It affects me.


Huh? Maybe it's me, but did that just make no sense whatsoever?



This world is a religious world. Religion, and what is happening with it, affect me directly. Whether it is as innocuos as someone as work asking me if I'm Methodist or as direct as jihad, it affects me.



Originally Posted By fizassist:

Originally Posted By Justa_TXguy:
Sorry, I didn't see the "No people with IQs greater than their shoe size allowed" sign. My apologies.



Yeah, it's rough having size 165 shoes, but I deal.



The ladies must love you...or run screaming from your might. One of the two.
In fact, we have something in common.

We're both ninjas.


Link Posted: 7/24/2005 8:59:53 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
Im thinking the religious section should have been subheaded under The Pit.



THink of it as a more focused "Pit."

Without the F-bombs.

Ooops - scratch that second part.

Link Posted: 7/24/2005 9:09:12 PM EDT
When Jesus got a group of followers He died for them.

When allah got a group of followers he made them die for him.

'nuff said.

Sgtar15
Link Posted: 7/24/2005 9:10:06 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:

But Jews aren't?



We're still working on them .........


Sgatr15
Link Posted: 7/25/2005 1:58:42 AM EDT
Link Posted: 7/25/2005 5:13:20 AM EDT

Originally Posted By sgtar15:

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:

But Jews aren't?



We're still working on them .........


Sgatr15




That's classic.
Link Posted: 7/25/2005 11:10:30 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
Im thinking the religious section should have been subheaded under The Pit.





+1 --------- I give it a week before the insults and COC violations begin.
Link Posted: 7/25/2005 11:13:46 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/25/2005 11:15:43 AM EDT by olyarms]

Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
Im thinking the religious section should have been subheaded under The Pit.


now your just being a pessimist.



+1 --------- I give it a week before the insults and COC violations begin.

See twists is an optimist
Link Posted: 7/25/2005 11:25:19 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/25/2005 11:25:46 AM EDT by Twister]

Originally Posted By olyarms:

Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
Im thinking the religious section should have been subheaded under The Pit.


now your just being a pessimist.



+1 --------- I give it a week before the insults and COC violations begin.

See twists is an optimist





I'm excluding Sarge of course, he may not last the day.
Link Posted: 7/25/2005 11:30:33 AM EDT

Originally Posted By postpostban:

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:

Originally Posted By postpostban:

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:

Originally Posted By postpostban:
My God had a son. Allah didn't.
The son created me and saved me.

The ROP'ers are VERY insistant that allah is ONE.
Their god is not my GOD.



Same for Judaism. Both Judaism and Christianity believe in the Old Testament, one and the same.



They are mistaken. Muslims are wrong.



But Jews aren't?



No, the jews don't believe in a single god. Genesis is their bible too and it says "lets US make man in OUR image"

The Jew's problem is that they reject thier own messiah because he didn't establish an earthly kingdom when he first came.



Please don't speak for the Jews. Your perception of how we view G-d is in error.

Link Posted: 7/25/2005 11:30:54 AM EDT
Heres a good book. While Man Slept by Kerby Fanin PHD. Muslums and Christians myself included have been duped. Most bible translations contain essential flaws. Go to Amazon and read the covers I just finished the book. Christianity is not the watered down baby food most of us have been fed.

Link Posted: 7/25/2005 11:55:13 AM EDT

Originally Posted By postpostban:

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:

Originally Posted By postpostban:

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:

Originally Posted By postpostban:
My God had a son. Allah didn't.
The son created me and saved me.

The ROP'ers are VERY insistant that allah is ONE.
Their god is not my GOD.



Same for Judaism. Both Judaism and Christianity believe in the Old Testament, one and the same.



They are mistaken. Muslims are wrong.



But Jews aren't?



No, the jews don't believe in a single god. Genesis is their bible too and it says "lets US make man in OUR image"

The Jew's problem is that they reject thier own messiah because he didn't establish an earthly kingdom when he first came.




They also thought Christ (the saviour) would be more militant in the saving of the Jews, they were unprepared for the way Jesus acted and as such do not beleive he is the saviour, they are still waiting for their Messiah, We (Christains) accept that he has been here and will be again, that he died for our sins and then rose from the dead. He will come again to us. Christains beleive this, Jews even beleive their will be a saviour from God

Muslims do not (at least nowhere that I can find in their books) and their godhead is not the triumvirate, God, Jesus and the Holy ghost are all one, and yet not
Link Posted: 7/25/2005 12:04:37 PM EDT
Originally Posted by AssaultRifler:

http://www.danielpipes.org/article/2714

Scriptural: The Koran itself in several places insists that its God is the same as the God of Judaism and Christianity. The most direct statement is one in which Muslims are admonished to tell Jews and Christians "We believe in that which has been revealed to us and revealed to you; our God and your God is One, and to Him we do submit" (E.H. Palmer translation of Sura 29:46) Of course, the verse can also be rendered "our Allah and your Allah is One" (as it is in the notorious Abdullah Yusuf Ali translation)

Historical: Chronologically, Islam followed after Judaism and Christianity, but the Koran claims Islam actually preceded the other monotheisms. In Islamic doctrine (Sura 3:67), Abraham was the first Muslim. Moses and Jesus introduced mistakes into the Word of God; Muhammad brought it down perfectly. Islam views Judaism and Christianity as flawed versions of itself, correct on essentials but wrong in important details. This outlook implies that all three faiths share the God of Abraham.
God Ackbar!

Linguistic: Just as Dieu and Gott are the French and German words for God, so is Allah the Arabic equivalent. In part, this identity of meaning can be seen from cognates: In Hebrew, the word for God is Elohim, a cognate of Allah. In Aramaic, the language spoken by Jesus, God is Allaha. In the Maltese language, which is unique because it is Arabic-based but spoken by a predominantly Catholic people, God is Alla.

Further, most Jews and Christians who speak Arabic routinely use the word Allah to refer to God. (Copts, the Christians of Egypt, do not.) The Old and New Testaments in Arabic use this word. In the Arabic-language Bible, for instance, Jesus is referred to as the son of Allah. Even translations carried out by Christian missionaries, such as the famous one done in 1865 by Cornelius Van Dyke, refer to Allah, as do missionary discussions.

The God=Allah equation means that, however hostile political relations may be, a common "children of Abraham" bond does exist and its exploration can one day provide a basis for interfaith comity. Jewish-Christian dialogue has made great strides and Jewish-Christian-Muslim trialogue could as well.


________________________________________________________________________

True, and you have eloquently hit upon the truth before all of us. Our commonalities FAR outweigh our differences. Scripture is what binds faith communities, though it's our common code of ethics which we share are what we should concentrate upon and explore in this forum.

Derisiveness over scripture in past posts have almost entirely missed the point of understanding and learning, which are also shared common values.



Ed

Link Posted: 7/25/2005 1:49:53 PM EDT

Originally Posted By postpostban:
My God had a son. Allah didn't.
The son created me and saved me.

The ROP'ers are VERY insistant that allah is ONE.
Their god is not my GOD.




Originally Posted By garandman:
The God of Scripture is NOTHING like the Muslim god, in personality, disposition or character.



Personally I'm tired of the thinly veiled Christian bashing coming from the LWM/MSM who refuse to use the word "Allah", instead always using "God". Despite the decendents of Abraham, etc, the precepts of islam and form of worship of Allah are so fundamentally different from Christianity (and Judaism) that calling Allah and the Judeo-Christian God by the same name is a bit outragous.
Link Posted: 7/25/2005 2:03:57 PM EDT

Originally Posted By garandman:

Originally Posted By sysadmin:

Originally Posted By garandman:
The God of Scripture is NOTHING like the Muslim god, in personality, disposition or character.



Have your read he complete text of the Old Testament and the Q'uran as it was written by those so inspired or are you just basing this on a limited knowledge of both.



Allah asks you to die for him.


God sent His Son to die for you.




I disagree on the last point.

Christ tells us that the true Believers WILL be killed and persecuted when we preach the Gospel.
Christ compells us to preach the Gospel.

Christ compells us to do something that will likely lead to our death.

I feel that argument holds no water.
Link Posted: 7/25/2005 2:14:25 PM EDT

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally Posted By garandman:


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally Posted By sysadmin:


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally Posted By garandman:
The God of Scripture is NOTHING like the Muslim god, in personality, disposition or character.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------




Have your read he complete text of the Old Testament and the Q'uran as it was written by those so inspired or are you just basing this on a limited knowledge of both.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------




Allah asks you to die for him.


God sent His Son to die for you.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------




I disagree on the last point.

Christ tells us that the true Believers WILL be killed and persecuted when we preach the Gospel.
Christ compells us to preach the Gospel.

Christ compells us to do something that will likely lead to our death.

I feel that argument holds no water.


________________________________________________________________

As with many texts, and let us assume the Koran, the Christian New Testament, and the Hebrew Bibles (Oh, and let me throw in history narratives) are among them are not unlike...Okay... this is gonna hurt...written for an audience!

True. For the faiths above, and those not listed, I believe we may have a consensus on this. For instance, when you folks go to a book store, will you tend to go to your favorite section (forget 'bout religion), or to that section that has no purpose for you.

So often is true of biblical texts. Really, let's face it...who wouldn't want NOT to be read?

Ed



Link Posted: 7/26/2005 12:13:00 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/26/2005 12:17:51 AM EDT by skypirate7]

Historical: Chronologically, Islam followed after Judaism and Christianity, but the Koran claims Islam actually preceded the other monotheisms. In Islamic doctrine (Sura 3:67), Abraham was the first Muslim. Moses and Jesus introduced mistakes into the Word of God; Muhammad brought it down perfectly. Islam views Judaism and Christianity as flawed versions of itself, correct on essentials but wrong in important details. This outlook implies that all three faiths share the God of Abraham.


Muslims believe that God sent down many prophets throughout the ages, and that Moses and Jesus were Muslim prophets (because they worshipped God and told their people to worship God). For a while, "Judaism" was the "Islam" of the time. However, over time the people became misguided. Jesus was sent to bring people back to worshipping God, and for a while, "Christianity" was the "Islam" of the time. However, people became misguided and changed the Bible, and so God sent the final prophet, Mohammed, who taught his people the final Islam.

You are correct in saying that in an Arabic Bible, the word for God is Allah. In Arabic, Allah means God. However, Muslims and Christians have very different beliefs about God. Muslims believe that God has no partners, no sons, no family, etc. Muslims believe that God is above all of his creation. Time, death, the universe, every particle of sand... all of these are God's creations and nothing happens without God's knowledge.

Muslims believe that Jesus was born to virgin Mary. Muslims believe that Jesus did not die, but instead, was lifted up to heaven. Muslims believe that Jesus will return to Earth one day to fight the Messiah Dajal (false Messiah) or what Christians may call the "anti-Christ." Muslims believe that when Jesus returns, he will pray with the Muslims and help them defeat the Messiah Dajal.
Link Posted: 7/26/2005 5:26:50 AM EDT

Originally Posted By scuba_ed:
Scripture is what binds faith communities, though it's our common code of ethics which we share are what we should concentrate upon and explore in this forum.



Ethics is the study of what is right outside the context of religion.
Link Posted: 7/26/2005 4:22:01 PM EDT
Satan is the "father of lies". So, when he tells you that he is the same things as God, he is lying. Satan once said " I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High."


Satan wants you to believe he is God.

Link Posted: 7/26/2005 5:46:59 PM EDT

Originally Posted By thedoctors308:

Originally Posted By garandman:

Originally Posted By sysadmin:

Originally Posted By garandman:
The God of Scripture is NOTHING like the Muslim god, in personality, disposition or character.



Have your read he complete text of the Old Testament and the Q'uran as it was written by those so inspired or are you just basing this on a limited knowledge of both.



Allah asks you to die for him.


God sent His Son to die for you.




I disagree on the last point.

Christ tells us that the true Believers WILL be killed and persecuted when we preach the Gospel.
Christ compells us to preach the Gospel.

Christ compells us to do something that will likely lead to our death.

I feel that argument holds no water.



Allow me to clarify -

In order to have a right relationship with Allah, you must kill for him.

Ir order for you to have a right relationship with God, He died for you.

Please forgive my obtuseness.

Link Posted: 7/26/2005 8:05:03 PM EDT

Originally Posted By leo6223:
Satan is the "father of lies". So, when he tells you that he is the same things as God, he is lying. Satan once said " I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High."


Satan wants you to believe he is God.




Stop talking sense, man!
Link Posted: 8/2/2005 10:31:25 AM EDT
It's funny how people discuss Islam with no knowledge of the religion basing everything on things they have heard from others. A person who murders the innocent is not following islam he is only following his own desires the Quran says that if u kill one person it is as if u killed all of humanity and if you save one persons life it is as if u saved all of humanity. No one blames christianity for the actions of Timothy Macveigh or Hitler, then why do you people blame Islam for the actions of an individual or individuals that are not even following the basic tenets and beliefs of Islam. When people use verses that state that kill people wherever you find them the verses are taken way out of context. The verses following those and the ones prior to it are taking about those people that oppress you and are fighting against you and the verse after it says if they stop fighting and oprressing then u should stop too.
Link Posted: 8/2/2005 11:06:53 AM EDT

Originally Posted By humzai:
It's funny how people discuss Islam with no knowledge of the religion basing everything on things they have heard from others. A person who murders the innocent is not following islam he is only following his own desires the Quran says that if u kill one person it is as if u killed all of humanity and if you save one persons life it is as if u saved all of humanity. No one blames christianity for the actions of Timothy Macveigh or Hitler, then why do you people blame Islam for the actions of an individual or individuals that are not even following the basic tenets and beliefs of Islam. When people use verses that state that kill people wherever you find them the verses are taken way out of context. The verses following those and the ones prior to it are taking about those people that oppress you and are fighting against you and the verse after it says if they stop fighting and oprressing then u should stop too.



you're about to recieve some nasty replies from the anti-Muslim crowd

Link Posted: 8/2/2005 12:41:02 PM EDT
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