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Posted: 10/22/2004 6:27:33 AM EST
I was just talking to one of my buddies, who is now a first year cadet in Virginia Tech's Corps of Cadets. This guy is all about wargaming. He got me to start dabbling with airsoft, and hosted some killer Ghost Recon LAN parties...

I always offered to take him up to a range and let him try out my AR15 as payback for all this, but he never took me up on it.

He failed to qualify with an M16A2 at 25m (got a 24/40, the cutoff was 25/40). He told me this over the phone, and after I finished laughing he said he'd try "real steel" over thanksgiving break.

Given the amount of contempt you guys hold habitual airsofters in, I figured you'd like this story.
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 6:47:42 AM EST
What kind of damn fool DECLINES to shoot an AR-15?!?

Sounds like he is getting over it though.

Soon, he'll have one of his own. Then another. And then another. Etc....
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 6:49:53 AM EST
Scary AR-15 makes a lot more noise that the pffft of an airsoft.
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 6:50:57 AM EST
Damn, alternate qualification at 25m is to fucking easy. If you don't shoot 40/40, you need to practice.
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 6:53:29 AM EST

Originally Posted By fallingwrench:
What kind of damn fool DECLINES to shoot an AR-15?!?



Link Posted: 10/22/2004 6:54:25 AM EST
if he couldnt hit shit at 25m with an AR, he probably wasn't worth a shit with the airsoft crap either
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 7:37:08 AM EST
and why is boy george in the A-Team van???
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 7:43:51 AM EST

Originally Posted By DvlDog:
and why is boy george in the A-Team van???



It's Boy George Preppard.
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 7:44:32 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/22/2004 7:44:52 AM EST by AdrianUSP9]

Originally Posted By fallingwrench:
What kind of damn fool DECLINES to shoot an AR-15?!?



Luckily, that guy.
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 7:45:29 AM EST
C'mon, couldn't hit at least 25 in 25m.
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 7:45:48 AM EST
If he hit 24 targets, he qualified. Standard for Marksman is 23/40.
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 7:46:05 AM EST
I saw that episode with boy george-


WORST... fing...episode.........EVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 7:48:05 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/22/2004 7:48:44 AM EST by Garand_Shooter]

Originally Posted By redleg13a:
If he hit 24 targets, he qualified. Standard for Marksman is 23/40.



The standard is a little higher when using the 25m paper target system. I guess to compensate for the fact the targets don't move on you.
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 7:49:21 AM EST

Originally Posted By alloy6061:

Originally Posted By fallingwrench:
What kind of damn fool DECLINES to shoot an AR-15?!?



www.btinternet.com/~s.essom/bernie3.jpg



Link Posted: 10/22/2004 8:01:33 AM EST
Airsoft is not a good substitute for training with the REAL thing. Hopefully he will see the error of his ways and quit playing with TOYS.

Link Posted: 10/22/2004 8:06:48 AM EST

Originally Posted By DOA:
Airsoft is not a good substitute for training with the REAL thing. Hopefully he will see the error of his ways and quit playing with TOYS.
hr


+1 Airsoft sucks. There is NOTHING like handling and shooting the real thing.
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 8:06:55 AM EST
All things in their place and time. Toys are good for training. For team organization as well as realistic opponents. Too bad it is'nt possible to play paintball with real guns. The only place you can do that is in some third world country, But I hear if you get "shot" there is no refund.
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 8:10:49 AM EST

Originally Posted By peekay:
if he couldnt hit shit at 25m with an AR, he probably wasn't worth a shit with the airsoft crap either



Airsoft=(relatively long) bursts of fullauto at ranges of maybe 40 yds at the outside, usually inside 20yds...
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 8:13:25 AM EST

Originally Posted By t-stox:
All things in their place and time. Toys are good for training.



LEO and Mil use Simmunitions which are REAL guns, not toys. Toys are a poor choice for training. Can you imagine giving Seal teams Airsoft toys and asking them to train with them??
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 8:13:37 AM EST
TheLastBoyScout,

I am in the area and occasionally go to the National Forest range that is 15 minutes from campus. If your friend needs practice time I can supply the hardware. All he would need is some ammo and a few targets.

Doc
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 8:17:33 AM EST

Originally Posted By dport:
It's Boy George Preppard.





How big of a target are you shooting at when you qualify?
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 8:28:04 AM EST
at 25M???? is he cross-eyed?
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 8:30:45 AM EST

Originally Posted By dport:

Originally Posted By DvlDog:
and why is boy george in the A-Team van???



It's Boy George Preppard.




Bada- BING!
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 8:33:39 AM EST

Originally Posted By dport:

Originally Posted By DvlDog:
and why is boy george in the A-Team van???



It's Boy George Peppard.



Damn.
That's a nice comeback.
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 8:40:16 AM EST
What are the qualification standards for the Known Distance Alternate Course or the Scaled 25 meter Alternate Course?

• Expert - 38-40
• Sharpshooter - 33-37
• Marksman - 26-32
• Unqualified - 25-Below

What are the qualification standards for a Record Fire Range (pop-up targets)?

• Expert - 36-40
• Sharpshooter - 30-35
• Marksman - 23-29
• Unqualified - 22-Below



www.armystudyguide.com/m16/studyguide.htm



Link Posted: 10/22/2004 8:47:02 AM EST
25m?

What size target?
What stance/position?

Link Posted: 10/22/2004 8:51:46 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/22/2004 8:53:42 AM EST by Lightning_P38]
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 8:52:51 AM EST
unbelievable, but typical...

sounds like someone needs some remedial training...
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 8:54:35 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 8:58:14 AM EST

Originally Posted By alloy6061:

Originally Posted By fallingwrench:
What kind of damn fool DECLINES to shoot an AR-15?!?



www.btinternet.com/~s.essom/bernie3.jpg



LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!­!!!!!!!

CMOS
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 9:14:53 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/22/2004 9:17:49 AM EST by nightstalker]
At 25 yds. how big is the scoring area??

ETA.nevermind, different sizes ok
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 9:17:17 AM EST

Originally Posted By nightstalker:
At 25 yds. how big is the scoring area??



big enough for my 12 yr old brother to qual.
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 9:32:31 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/22/2004 9:33:20 AM EST by rifleman2000]
A 25m alternate qual target is one large sheet w/ 10 targets on it, simulating the size of a silhouette at ranges from 300m to 50m. The smallest traget is 300m (same silhouette as an M16 zero target) and is no problem to hit! The 50m target could be hit with a rock, eyes closed. Your bullet just has to touch black to count for one point. Me, I always put them in the circle in the middle for two points, 40/40. If you can zero a rifle, you can shoot 40/40.




The shooting course: You get two 20 round mags, and shoot one mag in prone supported, and one mag in prone unsupported. Each target should have two bullets in it when you are done. Each bullet touching the a silhouette is worth one point. Each bullet in the 4cm circle in the middle of the silhouette is worth two points.
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 9:45:09 AM EST
I shot a 35/40 on that stupid 25m course a few days ago, with an M-16 that had a rear sight that I had to push back to the left against the carry handle after each shot (sight assembly was missing a spring or something). The 5 that were out were JUST out, too. 25 of 40 is pathetic.
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 9:52:11 AM EST

Originally Posted By rifleman2000:
Damn, alternate qualification at 25m is to fucking easy. If you don't shoot 40/40, you need to practice.




ding ding ding

<---- 40/40

Air force is a bit different. We use the same paper targets with 10 range simulated targets.
10 shots prone supported
10 shots prone unsupported
10 shots kneeling
10 shots standing

in each 10 round position, ammo must be split between 2 mags....5 rnds per mag. 1 bullet per silhouette.
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 9:53:04 AM EST

Originally Posted By lokt:
I shot a 35/40 on that stupid 25m course a few days ago, with an M-16 that had a rear sight that I had to push back to the left against the carry handle after each shot (sight assembly was missing a spring or something). The 5 that were out were JUST out, too. 25 of 40 is pathetic.



25/40 is the Airsoft Standard of excellence. Plus, its HARD to shoot with all that noise!
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 9:53:23 AM EST
How do you miss at 25m?
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 10:01:50 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 10:04:41 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 10:14:47 AM EST

Originally Posted By redleg13a:
If he hit 24 targets, he qualified. Standard for Marksman is 23/40.



Not in the alternate 25m range
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 10:27:54 AM EST

Originally Posted By dport:

Originally Posted By DvlDog:
and why is boy george in the A-Team van???



It's Boy George Preppard.

Link Posted: 10/22/2004 3:37:40 PM EST
definitely ghey
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 4:03:10 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/22/2004 7:33:28 PM EST by MoparMike]
Semi-OT question:


If I can hit a propane tank reliably the first time I pick up an AR-15 (about 20 shots, the last 18 hit and I had never used peep-sites before) @ 50 yds, would I qualify? This was standing, with no formal training.

Well, the training was "The safety is here, flick it this way to shoot, its already charged and safed, have fun." Other than that, I have never been "taught" to use a rifle, merely to "point, line up the sites, and let 'r rip!" with about 100 shots like that.


eta: Anyone? Bueller? Bueller?
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 4:18:02 PM EST

Originally Posted By IH8Toyguns_tacpoints:

Originally Posted By t-stox:
All things in their place and time. Toys are good for training.



LEO and Mil use Simmunitions which are REAL guns, not toys. Toys are a poor choice for training. Can you imagine giving Seal teams Airsoft toys and asking them to train with them??




[Lawrence, from the Hit Movie "Office Space"] I do believe you'd get your ASS KICKED. [/Fuckin A!!]
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 4:28:13 PM EST
25m is quite far for a airsoft rifle. Not disgustingly bad but fine for the capabilities of an airsoft rifle.
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 4:31:44 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 4:32:21 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/22/2004 4:35:45 PM EST by Paul]
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 5:02:27 PM EST

Originally Posted By Lightning_P38:
If you want to improve your shooting of an M16 rifle the best training would be to shoot a gun, not go out with a bunch of wannabes and play with childrens toys. A cheapo Mosin Nagant and a thousand rounds of crappy ammo would go a lot further towards improving your marksmanship skills than ten years of playing with toy guns.



+1

You can get everything you need to practice for under $100
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 6:11:33 PM EST

Originally Posted By DoorKicker:

Originally Posted By redleg13a:
If he hit 24 targets, he qualified. Standard for Marksman is 23/40.



Not in the alternate 25m range



Yup. I was wrong. Guess I should research a little before I try to play expert.
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 6:17:12 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/22/2004 6:52:09 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/22/2004 6:53:02 PM EST by freeride21a]

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