Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login

Site Notices
Posted: 10/25/2013 11:26:56 AM EST
The Air Force Academy on Friday announced that it will now be optional for cadets to recite “so help me God” at the end of its honor oath.
http://www.airforcetimes.com/article/20131025/NEWS/310230013/Academy-makes-God-optional-cadets-oath
Link Posted: 10/25/2013 11:28:08 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/25/2013 11:28:54 AM EST
Meh, it was optional in my oath of enlistment 18 years ago. I just assumed it would be the same for officers.
Link Posted: 10/25/2013 11:29:24 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By DrFeelgood:
Meh, it was optional in my oath of enlistment 18 years ago. I just assumed it would be the same for officers.
View Quote

same here
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 7:18:54 AM EST
For at LEAST the last 24 years it's been optional to "affirm" instead of swear, in which case you drop the "so help me God" at the end.

This is not news.
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 7:22:05 AM EST

It's always been optional.
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 7:25:07 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By limaxray:
For at LEAST the last 24 years it's been optional to "affirm" instead of swear, in which case you drop the "so help me God" at the end.

This is not news.
View Quote



Yep.
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 7:28:00 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By DrFeelgood:
Meh, it was optional in my oath of enlistment 18 years ago. I just assumed it would be the same for officers.
View Quote



Came here to post something like this.
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 7:32:16 AM EST
God hasn't been part of the military for a long time.
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 7:43:44 AM EST
Slow news week. They couldn't come up with a fresh article on benefits being slashed, force shaping, or PT so they had to come up with something to re-state what's in the regs. Never understood why people buy the Army/Navy/Air Force/Marine Corps Times, there's never any substance in it. They must have an exclusive deal with AAFES/NEX because it gets top rack placement at every checkout.

Another worthless rag is the Stars and Stripes. Not the same, but equally worthless.

Link Posted: 10/26/2013 7:53:19 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By nukldragr:

same here
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By nukldragr:
Originally Posted By DrFeelgood:

Meh, it was optional in my oath of enlistment 18 years ago. I just assumed it would be the same for officers.

same here

So you two are in on the ground floor of the conspiracy.

I hope you're proud of yourselves.
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 7:58:00 AM EST
Should we force people to swear to Vishnu? How about Allah (even though that is God)?

Why require people to swear an oath to something they don't believe in? Wouldn't that make the oath less meaningful to them?
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 7:58:49 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By crushtheturtle:
God hasn't been part of the military for a long time.
View Quote

Your experience in the military is vastly different than mine.
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 7:59:54 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/26/2013 8:01:34 AM EST by USAF_MTL]
Im sure the bible thumpers will be along shortly with tales of how God is being removed from everything and how the country is going down the tubes.
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 7:59:55 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By maggiethecat:
Should we force people to swear to Vishnu? How about Allah (even though that is God)?

Why require people to swear an oath to something they don't believe in? Wouldn't that make the oath less meaningful to them?
View Quote

They never were required, read the first couple posts. I had the option 14 years ago and every subsequent reenlistment, and I swear to God every time.
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 8:00:31 AM EST
The horror! My God, the horror!
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 8:04:32 AM EST
As a Christian I can say that's fine with me.
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 8:06:41 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By maggiethecat:
Should we force people to swear to Vishnu? How about Allah (even though that is God)?

Why require people to swear an oath to something they don't believe in? Wouldn't that make the oath less meaningful to them?
View Quote


The whole concept of swearing an oath to God (whichever flavor you prefer) is to make a promise before the highest moral authority in the universe. It's a way to ensure the swearer understands the gravity of the promise he's about to make, and it's a statement before witnesses of how serious the oath-taker will take his/her duties and responsibilities.

But it's literally been decades since the military required anyone to swear to God if they didn't want to. In 1986 was asked if I wanted to swear or affirm my enlistment oath, so at least that long. Once again, non-news.
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 8:07:34 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By wingnutx:

So you two are in on the ground floor of the conspiracy.

I hope you're proud of yourselves.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By wingnutx:
Originally Posted By nukldragr:
Originally Posted By DrFeelgood:

Meh, it was optional in my oath of enlistment 18 years ago. I just assumed it would be the same for officers.

same here

So you two are in on the ground floor of the conspiracy.

I hope you're proud of yourselves.

I exercised the option.

I also *gasp* prayed aloud and led worship/bible studies in uniform while in theater (KSA).
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 8:27:02 AM EST
So help me Yaweh
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 8:32:20 AM EST
Old old news, and trust me I'd know.
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 8:41:06 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By DrFeelgood:
Meh, it was optional in my oath of enlistment 18 years ago. I just assumed it would be the same for officers.
View Quote


Call me traditional but I still swear when I re up, even though Im atheist.
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 8:51:21 AM EST
By Grabthar's hammer, by the sons of Worvan, you shall be avenged!
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 8:52:55 AM EST
With all the raping, drug use and cheating, I doubt service academy cadets have much time to think about God anyway.
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 8:53:40 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By GMZ:


Call me traditional but I still swear when I re up, even though Im atheist.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By GMZ:
Originally Posted By DrFeelgood:
Meh, it was optional in my oath of enlistment 18 years ago. I just assumed it would be the same for officers.


Call me traditional but I still swear when I re up, even though Im atheist.

Than what meaning does "so help me god" to you? Why include it?


Link Posted: 10/26/2013 8:56:00 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By crushtheturtle:
With all the raping, drug use and cheating, I doubt service academy cadets have much time to think about God anyway.
View Quote


Congrats on the most ignorant statement of the year.
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 8:57:52 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jherm77:


Congrats on the most ignorant statement of the year.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jherm77:
Originally Posted By crushtheturtle:
With all the raping, drug use and cheating, I doubt service academy cadets have much time to think about God anyway.


Congrats on the most ignorant statement of the year.


How so?
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 9:04:28 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By crushtheturtle:


How so?
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By crushtheturtle:
Originally Posted By jherm77:
Originally Posted By crushtheturtle:
With all the raping, drug use and cheating, I doubt service academy cadets have much time to think about God anyway.


Congrats on the most ignorant statement of the year.


How so?


While there are a few that choose to sexually assualt, use drugs (spice is the specific one coming up), and cheating, we are talking about less than 1% of the cadet population. I wonder how much of the population at Harvard, Princeton, LSU, and UNLV partake in these actions? The media only cares about what sells stories, so take what the media reports as biased.

Since I work intimately with cadets, most of those stories are trumped up and wouldn't be reported at regular universities. We hold them to a much higher accountability, and have very little tolerance for discourse. The vast majority of cadets are fine upstanding military members.
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 9:13:10 AM EST
I disagree. Having attended the naval academy, my experience was that the kids there are no more moral or upstanding than the kids of any other college (or kids not in college). Troublemakers, cheats, drunks and slimeballs. Same as college kids everywhere. Worse actually, with their sense of entitlement. God isn't anymore welcome in their lives than He would be in the lives of the libtard hippies down the street at St Johns. I don't care either way- just an observation.
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 9:17:02 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By crushtheturtle:
I disagree. Having attended the naval academy, my experience was that the kids there are no more moral or upstanding than the kids of any other college (or kids not in college). Troublemakers, cheats, drunks and slimeballs. Same as college kids everywhere. Worse actually, with their sense of entitlement. God isn't anymore welcome in their lives than He would be in the lives of the libtard hippies down the street at St Johns. I don't care either way- just an observation.
View Quote


Well you are certainly entitled to your opinion and you also have credibility for it. I'm an authority figure so I might not see what you see, but I also see things you never saw. What year did you grad?
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 9:28:07 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/26/2013 9:28:47 AM EST by crushtheturtle]
2000. And in retrospect, what do I know- its not as though I had extensive experience in other college environments. I just wasn't terribly impressed with what I saw. Service academy cadets work hard and endure a lot. Morally superior? Thinking about God? Not any more than other kids not required to take an oath.

As an aside, I just remembered the bible says not to take oaths anyway. It's probably a good thing that it's going away. I retract everything I said
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 9:28:42 AM EST
I thank God I never joined the Chair Force!
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 9:29:45 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By KlubMarcus:
I thank God I never joined the Chair Force!
View Quote


I thank God you never did too!
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 9:30:03 AM EST

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By nukldragr:

same here
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By nukldragr:
Originally Posted By DrFeelgood:
Meh, it was optional in my oath of enlistment 18 years ago. I just assumed it would be the same for officers.

same here


same here
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 9:31:59 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/26/2013 9:32:28 AM EST by KlubMarcus]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jherm77: I thank God you never did too!
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jherm77:
Originally Posted By KlubMarcus: I thank God I never joined the Chair Force!
I thank God you never did too!
Yep, because then I'd be a Chair Force loser. Why join an organization where you sit around waiting for someone to die from a heart attack or retire in order to get a payraise?
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 9:45:53 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By KlubMarcus:
Yep, because then I'd be a Chair Force loser. Why join an organization where you sit around waiting for someone to die from a heart attack or retire in order to get a payraise?
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By KlubMarcus:
Originally Posted By jherm77:
Originally Posted By KlubMarcus: I thank God I never joined the Chair Force!
I thank God you never did too!
Yep, because then I'd be a Chair Force loser. Why join an organization where you sit around waiting for someone to die from a heart attack or retire in order to get a payraise?


I retract my latter statement, you now have the most ignorant comment of the year. Resume please?
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 10:04:59 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jherm77:


I retract my latter statement, you now have the most ignorant comment of the year. Resume please?
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jherm77:
Originally Posted By KlubMarcus:
Originally Posted By jherm77:
Originally Posted By KlubMarcus: I thank God I never joined the Chair Force!
I thank God you never did too!
Yep, because then I'd be a Chair Force loser. Why join an organization where you sit around waiting for someone to die from a heart attack or retire in order to get a payraise?


I retract my latter statement, you now have the most ignorant comment of the year. Resume please?


He's actually correct if the discussion is about DAF civilians.
Top Top