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Posted: 4/3/2002 7:06:15 AM EDT
[#1]
If there is grass on the field,
PLAY BALL!!!! [BD] c-rock |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 7:08:04 AM EDT
[#2]
I'll be the first to say, I think she may possibly have a good point.
TheRedGoat |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 7:09:05 AM EDT
[#3]
Ick.
But then the Japanese allow consent by kids the age of 12, don't they? This results in school girls prostituting themselves for some doodad they want from a dimestore. Double Ick. I'd say it needs to be 16 or higher, unless they have a signed note from Mom and Dad (yeah, right!). |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 7:09:57 AM EDT
[#4]
Age of consent in Hawaii= 14. In Japan = 13.
Really, the idea sickens me. But at the same time, I knew that when I was 15-16, I was all about sex. At 17, I DID have a relationship with someone who was 8 years my senior. The problem is, that at the time, I couldn't handle the emotional part worth a crap. Bad idea. |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 7:14:56 AM EDT
[#5]
Quoted: At 17, I DID have a relationship with someone who was 8 years my senior. Do you think the person who had sex with you deserved to be prosecuted for statuatory rape? TheRedGoat |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 7:27:30 AM EDT
[#6]
heard on glen beck yesterday that some people are trying to change it from " child molestation" to " Inter-generational sex"....
the first term was found to hurt the molesters "feelings" but then again, it was the glen beck show so who knows.. |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 7:46:33 AM EDT
[#7]
Ultimately, I don't think it's a reach to say that adults shouldn't have sex with minors. The dilemma comes from the definitions of "adult" and "minor."
I don't think there's any one right answer here. I've known 16 year olds who were more mature than some 30 year olds. But for simplicity's sake, the law arbitrarily picks a number and says, "You can now boink to your heart's delight." To make things even more complicated, different states and countries have different ages. And to make things even more complicated, we have different ages for different things and conditions upon those to even further muck things up. You can vote at one age, drive a car at another, drink beer at another, start having sex at another... You can't sign a contract (unless you're an emancipated minor). You can't join the military until you're a certain age (unless a parent signs off on it). But for many of these things, if you cross a state line, all bets are off and we have to start over again. I don't think you'll find a teenager who [b]isn't[/b] thinking about sex. I remember my first year of college, I was dating a girl who was a senior in high school. Everything that happened between us was consentual but technically, she was underage. Still, nobody, including her parents, seemed to mind. Of course, if anybody even looked funny at my 17 year old niece (who I guess legally could consent), he'd find himself in a world of hurt. |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 7:50:57 AM EDT
[#8]
IMHO, sex between a child, say under 16, and an adult, say over 21, is an abuse of authority. They trust us to do the right thing for them. How can we do that and still be hunting them? I've yet to meet a <16y/o girl that didn't just want a hug and to be told she looked nice. This is one of societies oldest rules and for good reason.
Next thing you know there'll be a new book on the healing power of gang-rape. |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 7:51:07 AM EDT
[#9]
Someone posted the same type of thread over at ASS web.
My views are if you are over 18 it should be illegal for you to have sex with someone who is under 18, period. |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 8:01:59 AM EDT
[#10]
I've been saying for years, that after the media gets us indoctrinated that homosexuality is normal, next it will pedophilia.
So far I'm batting 1000. Up next, beastiality. Remember, you heard it hear first. ...................................... When these things begin to take place, stand up and lift up your heads, because your redemption is drawing near." He told them this parable: "Look at the fig tree and all the trees. When they sprout leaves, you can see for yourselves and know that summer is near. Even so, when you see these things happening, you know that the kingdom of God is near. Luke 21:28-31 NIV |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 8:10:39 AM EDT
[#11]
Quoted: I don't think you'll find a teenager who [b]isn't[/b] thinking about sex. I remember my first year of college, I was dating a girl who was a senior in high school. Everything that happened between us was consentual but technically, she was underage. Still, nobody, including her parents, seemed to mind. I think under Calif's consent law there is a mininum age difference before you can be charged with sex with a minor. I THINK it is something like 2 or 3 years. |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 8:15:06 AM EDT
[#12]
Quoted: Quoted: At 17, I DID have a relationship with someone who was 8 years my senior. Do you think the person who had sex with you deserved to be prosecuted for statuatory rape? TheRedGoat No. The problem is, when you make blanket laws about things, many people get screwed. Some minors are much more mature than others. The thing is, it should be seen on a case-by case basis. Don't even get me started about drinking age, when you can buy certain firearms, etc etc. Mostly, it should be up to the parents to help guide their kids and get involved in the decision making. I have known Dutch folks, and I go to Japan every year for a work trip. I wouldn't say that there is any problem that I could see; but of course, the great majority of the high-school aged kids there were going out with kids in their age group. I did see some age differences, but I am talking something like a 17 year old with a 20 year old, which seems pretty normal. The other thing is, of course, that one can't just bring a completely different cultural attitude here from another country and expect it to go over well at all. Japanese people are inherently different from us on many levels, and from an frequent traveler and observer's point of view: sex is completely different over there (no, not the act, stupid! It's still the same that way! Heh.). We are talking about a country where blowjob parlours are in a legal grey zone and have advertisements all over the place. Hell, I've even seen a saturday night late show that had interviews with some of the gals from them, with ads from a couple of the bigger ones. This book might raise some interesting thoughts and discussions, after all, what man here didn't look at Brittney Spears a few years ago when she was 17 and at least THINK "Damn!" in that way we as men do? Acting upon those thoughts is a different matter entirely. |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 8:19:20 AM EDT
[#13]
Maybe at 16, but 12? that is fricking young. |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 8:22:54 AM EDT
[#14]
Quoted: Quoted: I don't think you'll find a teenager who [b]isn't[/b] thinking about sex. I remember my first year of college, I was dating a girl who was a senior in high school. Everything that happened between us was consentual but technically, she was underage. Still, nobody, including her parents, seemed to mind. I think under Calif's consent law there is a mininum age difference before you can be charged with sex with a minor. I THINK it is something like 2 or 3 years. Which, if true, goes to my point about how confusing these laws can get. And when you're an 18 or 19 year old guy, is that [b]really[/b] what you're going to be thinking about when you're trying to "bed" a younger woman? [b]Especially[/b] if the two of you had been dating prior to your reaching the age of majority. And if two 16 year olds are having sex, is [b]that[/b] illegal? Or is it just if a 16 year old is having sex with a 19 year old (or any age past majority)? I doubt anyone here is advocating pedophilia. As far as that goes, I think it's safe to say that there's a huge difference between a prepubescent child and a late teen girl/woman. I have to drive past a high school daily to get to the freeway on my way to work. There are what would legally be described as children who [b]look[/b] more womanly than some of the women with whom I work. Any adult who trolls a high school looking for a date needs to have his head examined. But if anyone were to see one of these "children" outside of that context, it's getting tough to distinguish them as non-adults. So while it may fit some legal definition somewhere as pedophilia, I don't think it's the same kind of sickness that drives an adult to have sex with an 8 year old child. |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 8:24:39 AM EDT
[#15]
All of you that are saying, "It's no big deal," should consider it from the point of view of the father of a 12 year old girl with a 35 year old man sniffing around her.
What would you do? |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 8:25:16 AM EDT
[#16]
Have you guys seen some of these 16/17 year old girls, some can pass for 21. just remember 16 will get you 20!
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Posted: 4/3/2002 8:25:22 AM EDT
[#17]
If Mother Nature has seen fit to cause the equipment to mature to assume its adult function, who am I to argue?
I personally believe that relations with mutual consent beween people who have obviously reached puberty should be legal regardless of birthdate. That is an adequate statement of nature's way. As C-rock said, if there's grass on the field, play ball! However, the penalties for violating the existing laws are quite severe, and I don't desire to play that game. Besides, I don't have much in common with a girl who's much younger than her mid 20's, dammit. CJ |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 8:31:45 AM EDT
[#18]
Quoted: I've been saying for years, that after the media gets us indoctrinated that homosexuality is normal, next it will pedophilia. So far I'm batting 1000. Up next, beastiality. Remember, you heard it hear first. ...................................... When these things begin to take place, stand up and lift up your heads, because your redemption is drawing near." Mini14jac is absolutely right, this is a sign of the end. Hate to get religious on ya'all but Jesus said that at the end, the love of most would grow cold! Some of you guys are saying that 15 and 16 is old enough, but I bet if it was your daughter... Personally, if an adult even tried to have sex with one of my kids it would be Hydroshock city! |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 8:42:49 AM EDT
[#19]
Quoted: Quoted: I don't think you'll find a teenager who [b]isn't[/b] thinking about sex. I remember my first year of college, I was dating a girl who was a senior in high school. Everything that happened between us was consentual but technically, she was underage. Still, nobody, including her parents, seemed to mind. I think under Calif's consent law there is a mininum age difference before you can be charged with sex with a minor. I THINK it is something like 2 or 3 years. In Californistan, the "age of consent" is 15. An adult having sex with anyone under 15 can be charged with child molestation. For someone over 15 but under 18, the charge is statutory rape. Both are major felonies. |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 8:43:06 AM EDT
[#20]
However 12 is the legal age of consent, having sex with anyone under 16 is still illegal. Even in the Netherlands.
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Posted: 4/3/2002 8:47:27 AM EDT
[#21]
If any of you think that a 12 or 13 year old can rationally "agree" to sex, having a real understanding of all that it entails - & understanding any possible consequences - then you are seriously deluded. That or letting your di*k think for you. You want to tag a 12 year old go to freaking Thailand. Kids are already growing up at too young an age here as it is. Seems they go straight from "Barney" to "blow job contests" these days. The last thing we need is for the State to sanction or accelerate this process.
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Posted: 4/3/2002 8:55:28 AM EDT
[#22]
If you want let you children participate at these ages, well I just don't think it's right.
If catch anyone with my children, consent or not, they are dead. |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 9:35:39 AM EDT
[#23]
Quoted: I've been saying for years, that after the media gets us indoctrinated that homosexuality is normal, next it will pedophilia. So far I'm batting 1000. Up next, beastiality. Remember, you heard it hear first. .................................... That's absolutely correct, mini14jac. Pretty sad state of affairs, isn't it? |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 9:43:13 AM EDT
[#24]
Quoted: If there is grass on the field, I can't believe I quoted this filth...but you are one sick individual. No joke! Based on the topic at hand...you really need to seek help for this ill condition you have. How would you feel if you were the parent of the child (yes, under 18 is still a child)you are relating too? Some of you guys are unbelievable |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 9:47:39 AM EDT
[#25]
Quoted: If any of you think that a 12 or 13 year old can rationally "agree" to sex, having a real understanding of all that it entails - & understanding any possible consequences - then you are seriously deluded. I am pretty sure you are making the Author's point. Although I have not read the book, only the news article. Her point appears to be: Since a minor, who is unable to understand all the possible consequences of sex, is not allowed to have sex with an adult (who would theoretically understand the consequences) then the minors are left guessing and assuming about the outcome/consequences when they have sex only among themselves. The further breakdown of the knowledge chain is accelerated by the dumbing down of sex education in schools. I am not certain, but it looks like the author is trying to say we should break down some of the barriers, so that minors can intereact with more 'responsible' older sexual partners. TheRedGoat |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 9:50:59 AM EDT
[#26]
Quoted: Have you guys seen some of these 16/17 year old girls, some can pass for 21. just remember 16 will get you 20! As a former High School teacher, I understand your point. 16 year old girls just did NOT look like 22 year old pop singers when I was in High School. I don't know what they are putting in Frosted Flakes these days, but man, kids grow up faster than I recall. I saw plenty of males with full beards, and even a few with receding hair lines. No kidding! If I did not KNOW some of these students (male and female) were minors and had only met them on the street, they would have passed for 20-22 easily. TheRedGoat |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 10:00:34 AM EDT
[#27]
Can you run faster than 2,800 feet per second?
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Posted: 4/3/2002 10:01:56 AM EDT
[#28]
Goat, I understand that but I think the author is basing her argument on a faulty premise. Would the gov't come in and supervise as a "responsible" 50 yr. old tagged a 13 yr. old? Who would pick out the responsible older partner? It's just a crock.
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Posted: 4/3/2002 10:17:28 AM EDT
[#29]
Quoted: I've yet to meet a <16y/o girl that didn't just want a hug and to be told she looked nice. My point is this, don't try to tell me that teenage girls just want a hug, they are just as horny as teenage guys. |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 10:33:42 AM EDT
[#30]
Quoted: My point is this, don't try to tell me that teenage girls just want a hug, they are just as horny as teenage guys. they(girls) are just more devious about getting it ;) |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 10:58:56 AM EDT
[#31]
lock, load, unload
any questions? [50] |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 11:30:18 AM EDT
[#32]
It always amazes me that people who writes these stuff never have relavent experiences. The author of the article, a woman no less, does not have children.
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Posted: 4/3/2002 11:34:16 AM EDT
[#33]
[url]http://www.ageofconsent.com/ageofconsent.htm[/url]
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Posted: 4/3/2002 11:40:08 AM EDT
[#34]
Quoted: It always amazes me that people who writes these stuff never have relavent experiences. The author of the article, a woman no less, does not have children. Sometimes that is needed. Some parents just get too hysterical. Just look at the insane weapons policies schools have here, the 'zero tolerance' rules. Can anyone argue that they make the schools any safer? Yet try to get permission for teachers to carry guns and see what happens... |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 11:53:22 AM EDT
[#35]
Personally, I think that any girl under 15 who is looking for love with guys over 18 has problems. Laws are to detract from taking advantage of these girls who are not mature enough to make big decisions like sex. Especially because they are looking for love and eventually might get pregnant thinking a baby is the way to get that love. A 16 year old is better equiped mentally to make these decisions since they understand long term consequenses better as well as what love is. When my girlfriend was 15, she had no clue about life, a year made a big difference. Luckily I found her young!
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Posted: 4/3/2002 11:54:11 AM EDT
[#36]
Quoted: I disagree. [red]I had a 15 year old baby sitter once make it abundantly clear that she wanted sex while I was taking her home. She even went to far as to take off her blouse and bra and try to stick a tittie in my mouth.[/red] [blue] She had a very mature body and attitude, but I declined because of aforementioned jail time.[/blue] Another time, two 16 year olds in a restaurant before school one morning stated outright they wanted to skip school and have a threesome. Again I declined because of the old '16 will get you 20' deal. I guarantee I would not have been the first for any one of them. My point is this, don't try to tell me that teenage girls just want a hug, they are just as horny as teenage guys. [red]A)[/red] I too have know teenage girls that acted in this manner, yet threatened to scream RAPE as soon as they were touched, and ended up with a sizable settlement of what is commonly referred o as "Hush Money!"... Others call it blackmail! [blue]B)[/blue] I certainly hope your real rational for not playing along, was based upon morality! |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 11:55:14 AM EDT
[#37]
Wait a second. There's a big difference between damaged goods who want "a threesome" or strip in front of a neighbor for a quick thrill and normal girls. Normal in the head, that is.
I'm sure right now there's an idiot using his AR for a pogo stick somewhere in the world, but the vast majority aren't. To say girls are hyper sexual these days because you once met a victim exercising her demons is pure projection on your part. You guys can't "play ball" 'till the grass has grown in or you'll f*** up the field. Please considder the inflatable astroturf model. |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 12:03:41 PM EDT
[#38]
I think that it should be illegal for adults to have sex with children in general, but I don't think it should be illegal for an 18 year old to slam a 17 year old.
Maybe a 3 or 4 year age difference is ok? |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 12:10:40 PM EDT
[#39]
Hasn't this age thing come on realtivly recently?
Personally I don't want no 12 year old, but 100 years ago, boys and girls were getting married at about 13 or 14. Also men have been taking child brides forever. This is in response to those who who think the counrty is going to hell. Personally I beleive it is good that this gross subject is getting such resistance. |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 12:11:38 PM EDT
[#40]
Sorry Astrogoth I cant agree with you.
Modern birth control doesn't require a PHD to use. Especally on the girls side. They make IUD's now that are good for 5 years and are as effective as steralization while requiring no thought at all by the girl... A good chunk of the teenage pregnancies these days are from girls who want to get pregnant, because then they are victims that have to be taken care of "for the baby". As to the emotional side, well guess what, it doesnt get any less painful to be dumped by a lover at 23 than it is at 16... I don't beleve someone can become emotionally mature WITHOUT experiencing some pain, and it isn't going to get any better as you get older. Without experience a adolescent forever remains a adolescent... because that is the only difference between them and "adults"- there is no physical difference... And a teenage girl who knows what she wants isn't "damaged goods". |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 1:01:09 PM EDT
[#41]
My grandmother was born in 1912, and she got married when she was 12. Had her first kid at 13. It is a fairly recent mentality. I think the 30-yo guy with 13-yo girl thing is just rude, if nothing else, even if it was consentual. But two people of fairly close ages (say 20-16 or 17-14), I see no problem with.
It's ignorant to assume that these kids are naive about sex. They know what it is. They might not necessarily know about all the finer points, but they have the general idea. If they haven't done it already, they are at least fantasizing about it and probably masturbating like there was no tomorrow. Rape or coersion is something all together different, but if a 22 year-old guy and a 14 year-old girl were honestly and truly in love with each other, and if both were mature enough to understand the consequences (even if I personally didn't think much of the idea), who am I to interfere with their wishes? I say live and let live. |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 1:08:56 PM EDT
[#42]
This sounds like a sneaky way to accomplish the NMBLA agenda.
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Posted: 4/3/2002 2:25:30 PM EDT
[#43]
Put a name and face to the age, your daughter! You want me there? I don't think so.
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Posted: 4/3/2002 3:49:51 PM EDT
[#44]
Quoted: All of you that are saying, "It's no big deal," should consider it from the point of view of the father of a 12 year old girl with a 35 year old man sniffing around her. What would you do? that's what i was going to mention. there may be grass on the field, but it's a whole different ball game when the equipment belongs to your little girl. |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 4:09:00 PM EDT
[#45]
What I always want to know about this is, "Why the double standard?" Think about it - if an older man goes after a minor girl, all Hell breaks loose and there's talk of castration and MAJOR jail time! If an older woman goes after a teenage boy, it's no big deal, or "Harmless" - unless there is a pregnancy involved...
Case in point - I was a busy fella in High School. Not only was I carrying on (for three years) with a HS Sweetheart, but I had my senior Spanish teacher start up an affair with me that lasted for about six months. We didn't say anything (and it caused some real timing headaches for me - but why should I say no?) but I firmly believe it would not have been a problem if it had come to light. So, what was the problem there - I was 16, and they were 17 and 36. Didn't seem like a problem to me... I did sometimes consider trying to get a threesome out of the arrangement, but I don't think it would have worked... Still, if it were to be a male teacher (say, 25 or so) and the girl were under 18, there'd be calls for BOTH of his heads! Again, why is there is double standard? If sex with a minor is to be illegal, then make it illegal NO MATTER WHICH PARTNER IS THE MINOR! If BOTH partners are minors (BTDT,) then something should happen as well. The "You know better" defense won't stand as well as it would otherwise, but it's still SOMETHING to think about... Just my little contribution. FFZ |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 4:21:03 PM EDT
[#46]
I've got an 11 year old daughter who looks older, [i]and[/i] an M16. Do the math!
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Posted: 4/3/2002 4:48:49 PM EDT
[#47]
What's a minor?
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Posted: 4/3/2002 5:34:00 PM EDT
[#48]
As long as the two consenting people are within 2 or 3 years of each other in age, I don't see a problem. I have a semi-adopted daughter that is 15 right now. If I were to catch a 25 year old trying to get her to have sex with him, he wouldn't be lucky enough to get shot. That would be the easy, painless way to leave this world.
My wife was watching this show on HBO called the Vagina Monologues. The speaker was telling a story about a girl that was 16 that spent the night with a female neighbor that was 25. The neighbor had sex with her and introduced the teen to lesbianism. Nobody in the tv audience acted like that was bad. If it had been a 25 year old man, there would have been cries of rape just like there should be. Another interesting double standard. There is a sound clip from King of the Hill where Hank is explaining another sexual double standard to Bobby that is pretty funny. I was going to include a link to it but can't find it using Lycos or AltaVista. I've found it before with Google, but well, I told them their service was off my list of acceptable search engines. Misanthrope |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 5:47:22 PM EDT
[#49]
Quoted: What I always want to know about this is, "Why the double standard?" Think about it - if an older man goes after a minor girl, all Hell breaks loose and there's talk of castration and MAJOR jail time! If an older woman goes after a teenage boy, it's no big deal, or "Harmless" - unless there is a pregnancy involved... . . If sex with a minor is to be illegal, then make it illegal NO MATTER WHICH PARTNER IS THE MINOR! If BOTH partners are minors (BTDT,) then something should happen as well. The "You know better" defense won't stand as well as it would otherwise, but it's still SOMETHING to think about... I think recently there was a prosecution of a woman teacher having an affair with a male student, and she had a child by him. She is now in prison after violating probation and meeting with him again. But generally the man is always prosecuted. |
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Posted: 4/3/2002 5:50:32 PM EDT
[#50]
[b]
Quoted: "My wife was watching this show on HBO called the Vagina Monologues. The speaker was telling a story about a girl that was 16 that spent the night with a female neighbor that was 25. The neighbor had sex with her and introduced the teen to lesbianism Misanthrope Scary sh*t, isn't it? That is why I have never let my daughter stay overnight at any of her friends' house on any special occasions. No exception!! |
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