Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login

Arrow Left Previous Page
Page / 2
Posted: 7/21/2008 8:50:03 PM EDT



The part in red does no say, suggest, or is it recommend.

It says "I order to avoid violations"

What do you think?

I know you all know what AR-15 model SP1 configuration is.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 8:52:41 PM EDT
interesting...
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 8:54:44 PM EDT
IN
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 8:55:36 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Pacs:
i18.tinypic.com/63mv3i0.jpg


The part in red does no say, suggest, or is it recommend.

It says "I order to avoid violations"

What do you think?

I know you all know what AR-15 model SP1 configuration is.

wonderful... accident= violation
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 8:56:45 PM EDT
Am I condemned to hell for having a 9mm bolt?
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 8:56:52 PM EDT
Wow OK
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 8:57:14 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 8:58:34 PM EDT
How recent is this?

Steve
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 8:58:44 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Pacs:
i18.tinypic.com/63mv3i0.jpg


The part in red does no say, suggest, or is it recommend.

It says "I order to avoid violations"

What do you think?

I know you all know what AR-15 model SP1 configuration is.


It also may mean if we test one of your rifles, and get hammer follow and all the parts are not AR-15 Model SP1 parts, and we can get it to double, your ass is ours.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 8:59:42 PM EDT

Originally Posted By NUcadet07:
How recent is this?

Steve


2007
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:01:51 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Pacs:

Originally Posted By Pacs:
i18.tinypic.com/63mv3i0.jpg


The part in red does no say, suggest, or is it recommend.

It says "I order to avoid violations"

What do you think?

I know you all know what AR-15 model SP1 configuration is.


It also may mean if we test one of your rifles, and get hammer follow and all the parts are not AR-15 Model SP1 parts, and we can get it to double, your ass is ours.


until you get a good lawyer to smack that bullshit straight outa court

there are two sides people...
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:05:58 PM EDT
"We can send you to Club Fed for entropy, or by inducing known and dangerous malfunctions, or both."


FUCK YOU, JACKBOOTS.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:12:20 PM EDT
I think if they remove the disconnector and get automatic fire, they are in a world of hurt. But if the disconnector breaks, good luck. But that should be a very rare problem, right?

Since most bolt carriers are now shouded collar, the risk is real.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:13:42 PM EDT

Originally Posted By 0612Devil:
interesting...


I'd expect better grammar from a government office.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:14:28 PM EDT
That sounds exactly like the advise that Bushmaster had posted on their website for a number of years.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:14:45 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:16:00 PM EDT
The FCG's in all my AR-1 rifles are being changed out to true AR-15 FCG's, not M16 done to SP1 configuration.

To heck with then, not taking any chances.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:16:56 PM EDT

Originally Posted By NimmerMehr:

Originally Posted By 0612Devil:
interesting...


I'd expect better grammar from a government office.


I would have to agree.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:17:56 PM EDT

tag
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:23:00 PM EDT
Are their assertions correct?

Can/will you get automatic fire by the means they describe?

­


***If so, aren't they in violation - telling how to "convert" a semi-auto to full-auto?!?
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:23:10 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:24:45 PM EDT
I would chuck any M-16 parts in an AR-15 without reservation. Hell, I even chucked the two stage trigger in my RRA Entry Tactical when it got too light. The Bladerunner debacle has me paranoid.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:24:55 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Former11BRAVO:
Are their assertions correct?

Can/will you get automatic fire by the means they describe?

­


***If so, aren't they in violation - telling how to "convert" a semi-auto to full-auto?!?


uh... it isn't illegal to know how to make machine guns. Or to tell others how to make machine guns. You could publish a how-to make machine-guns for dummies book and they couldn't do jack shit to you for it.

Freedom of speech, baby.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:25:47 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Former11BRAVO:
Are their assertions correct?

Can/will you get automatic fire by the means they describe?

­


***If so, aren't they in violation - telling how to "convert" a semi-auto to full-auto?!?


Apparently you can get hammer follow, which CAN land your ass in prison.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:30:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/21/2008 9:33:27 PM EDT by Rogue-Sasquatch]

Originally Posted By motown_steve:

Originally Posted By Former11BRAVO:
Are their assertions correct?

Can/will you get automatic fire by the means they describe?

­


***If so, aren't they in violation - telling how to "convert" a semi-auto to full-auto?!?


Apparently you can get hammer follow, which CAN land your ass in prison.


Despite the fact that if an ATF agent took his issued semi AR to an ATF armorer because it was exhibiting hammer-follow, the armorer would regard it as a malfunctioning rifle and repair it thusly. Some pigs are more equal than others.

Nobody who knows jack shit about guns is going to argue that hammer follow and potential out-of-battery detonation is anything except a state of perilous malfunction. There's a damn good reason no closed-bolt automatic weapon was ever designed that utilized hammer-follow as a method of operation. Nobody with a two-shits-minimum for brains can honestly argue otherwise.

Nobody, that is, except those who want to send people to jail and scare others.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:30:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/21/2008 9:33:05 PM EDT by Pacs]

Originally Posted By Former11BRAVO:
Are their assertions correct?

Can/will you get automatic fire by the means they describe?

***If so, aren't they in violation - telling how to "convert" a semi-auto to full-auto?!?


You could get hammer follow many ways, if you have hammer follow and the second round goes off. You have a machine gun, abet you would need some M16 parts for the hammer to hit the second primer. With all AR-15 parts the hammer follow should not hit the firing pin but be trapped.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:36:04 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Pacs:
The FCG's in all my AR-1 rifles are being changed out to true AR-15 FCG's, not M16 done to SP1 configuration.

To heck with then, not taking any chances.



wuss..
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:36:17 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Pacs:
You could get hammer follow many ways, if you have hammer follow and the second round goes off. You have a machine gun, abet you would need some M16 parts for the hammer to hit the second primer.


SCOTUS (via the Staples ruling) said otherwise.

ATF is in contradiction of a SCOTUS ruling.

Where are the US Marshals?
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:36:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By motown_steve:
I would chuck any M-16 parts in an AR-15 without reservation. Hell, I even chucked the two stage trigger in my RRA Entry Tactical when it got too light. The Bladerunner debacle has me paranoid.



wuss..
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:38:54 PM EDT
gotta read this tomorrow.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:39:35 PM EDT
the weapon was originally designed using the parts, I'll keep mine right where they are..

Fuck those assholes and the writer Obama sent to pen their "manual"
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:42:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By rexydg7:

Originally Posted By Pacs:
The FCG's in all my AR-1 rifles are being changed out to true AR-15 FCG's, not M16 done to SP1 configuration.

To heck with then, not taking any chances.



wuss..



Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:45:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By rexydg7:

Originally Posted By motown_steve:
I would chuck any M-16 parts in an AR-15 without reservation. Hell, I even chucked the two stage trigger in my RRA Entry Tactical when it got too light. The Bladerunner debacle has me paranoid.



wuss..


2 years in a federal corrections facility and a lifetime as a convicted felon aren't something I'm willing to risk for a hammer follow. Get crossways of the ATF and they will lie, cheat and steal to send your ass up. Malfunctions are machine guns, just ask David Olofson.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:57:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Pacs:
With all AR-15 parts the hammer follow should not hit the firing pin but be trapped.


Then explain my carrier from CMMG:

Shrouded (M16-style) firing pin
Cut rear carrier (standard AR15-style)

I run it with a properly modified M16 hammer and have ZERO issues.
I also maintain and inspect disco and spring often.

100% legal and reliable.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 10:09:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Pacs:

Originally Posted By Former11BRAVO:
Are their assertions correct?

Can/will you get automatic fire by the means they describe?

***If so, aren't they in violation - telling how to "convert" a semi-auto to full-auto?!?


You could get hammer follow many ways, if you have hammer follow and the second round goes off. You have a machine gun, abet you would need some M16 parts for the hammer to hit the second primer. With all AR-15 parts the hammer follow should not hit the firing pin but be trapped.


All of my carriers are shrouded. They are NOT M16, trimmed to within 3/8" of the rear.

As such, they wouldn't trap the hammer.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 10:17:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/21/2008 10:19:12 PM EDT by Pacs]

Originally Posted By GhostRing:

Originally Posted By Pacs:
With all AR-15 parts the hammer follow should not hit the firing pin but be trapped.


Then explain my carrier from CMMG:

Shrouded (M16-style) firing pin
Cut rear carrier (standard AR15-style)

I run it with a properly modified M16 hammer and have ZERO issues.
I also maintain and inspect disco and spring often.

100% legal and reliable.


The AR-15 carrier is milled below the firing pin channel, you can see part of the firing pin.
The AR-15 firing is different than a M16 firing pin.
The AR-15 hammer has a small amount milled out area on the top of the face. about 10 or so mm. long.
These Items allow the hammer to have the milled area on the hammer not to hit the firing pin. or get trapped behind the first larger milled part of the pin. I think.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 10:29:17 PM EDT
This is a new handbook?
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 10:33:46 PM EDT
Well this thread needs at least a temporay tack. Given the implications.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 10:35:59 PM EDT
Once the atf gets your gun it doesn't matter what parts you have in it. If they want to screw you, they will. How do they get away with it? We let them.

They have always been a rouge and corrupt agency but under old gonzales things became much worse. Right now the atf is on a push to declare any semiauto firearm a machine gun using the twisted logic that all semiautos are readily convertible.

Do what you want. Just don't tell anyone what you did.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 10:36:48 PM EDT
Fuck them and their hand book.

If anyone tries to take anything away from me then they will be looked at and dealt with as any other petty thief.


....and yes OMG I do have a M16 bolt in one of my ARs
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 10:37:08 PM EDT
I know it sucks, but at least it is clearly defined. More so than a lot of things from the ATF.

I didn't see when this was published.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 10:41:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MikeS369:
Once the atf gets your gun it doesn't matter what parts you have in it. If they want to screw you, they will. How do they get away with it? We let them.


That may be, but if you do not have the M16 parts in your rifle to begin with it will probably go a lot further for your defense in court.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 10:41:24 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Jrock82:
I know it sucks, but at least it is clearly defined. More so than a lot of things from the ATF.

I didn't see when this was published.


Lead to believe 2007.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 10:48:08 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Pacs:

Originally Posted By Jrock82:
I know it sucks, but at least it is clearly defined. More so than a lot of things from the ATF.

I didn't see when this was published.


Lead to believe 2007.


Thank you, I am curious if this was brought up in Bladerunner's case then?
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 10:49:49 PM EDT
If they will take a disconnector out, they will swap an M16 carrier in there.

How do they establish chain of custody and what protects us from being run roughshod over by the ATF?
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 10:50:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/21/2008 10:55:26 PM EDT by _DR]
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 10:55:33 PM EDT
I own a:

Mini-14
Shoe Strings
A Key Chain


I'm so fucked....
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 11:00:43 PM EDT
Those of you who have any aftermarket trigger parts (JP FCG, for one) might want to ditch the JP hammer, because it can't be "trapped" Like the AR15 hammer. Not like it matters if you have the shrouded FP carrier anyway.

Sucks, last two uppers I bought had AR15 carriers (cut back so they will not trip an auto sear), but still had the shrouded FP.

It gets expensve keeping up with CYA.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 11:02:26 PM EDT
If the ATF was disbanded tomorrow I don't think I could be happier.

Buncha pukes trying to justify their jobs,
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 11:02:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/21/2008 11:02:51 PM EDT by motown_steve]

Originally Posted By _DR:






Link Posted: 7/22/2008 5:21:13 AM EDT
Given the Implications.

THIS NEEDS A TACK.
Arrow Left Previous Page
Page / 2
Top Top