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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 6/20/2001 7:08:40 AM EDT
LA Times http://www.latimes.com/news/state/20010620/t000051225.html Wednesday, June 20, 2001 3 Shots Kill Pit Bull as It Kills Kitten By DAVID PIERSON, Times Staff Writer Bruce Evans said he never thought it would take three shots to stop a stray pit bull's attack on a family kitten. He shot the dog twice but it continued the attack Monday evening on the front porch of his West Hills home, Evans said. The third shot felled the dog. "I shot the first two bullets and it was still finishing off the kitten," said Evans, who is nursing a swollen and cut right hand. "It didn't wince, whimper or anything. It was only after the third shot that it lost some juice." Evans, 52, said he first beat the dog with his fists and a brick to get it to drop the cat, but the pit bull was unfazed. Evans failed to save the 3-month-old kitten, one of four cats belonging to his 11-year-old daughter Shayla, who witnessed the attack. Shayla was given counseling because of the emotional trauma she suffered, her father said. Police said they arrived at the home in the 24000 block of Eagle Mountain Street at 6:25 p.m., after someone placed a 911 call from Evans' home. The dog, which had no collar or microchip identification implant, had approached a neighbor as she picked up her mail. It then crossed the street and attacked the kitten on Evans' doorstep. Los Angeles Police Lt. Tom Smart said Evans was legally in possession of a .38-caliber handgun and had fired it in self-defense. Evans complained that the city's Department of Animal Regulation had never responded to complaints about stray dogs in the neighborhood. Jackie David, public information director for the department, said she had no records of off-leash violations in the area, but officers will patrol the neighborhood in light of Monday's incident. Copyright 2001 Los Angeles Times
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 7:13:33 AM EDT
This is the precise reason for the 45ACP. Mid-bore rounds just don't get the job done alot of the time.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 7:22:19 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/20/2001 7:20:34 AM EDT by medicjim]
ipschoser1. You use the facts of the case to justify your pre-conceived notion that bigger is better. ten .45 slugs creating ten superficial wounds on an animal bred to ignore superficial wounds would have the same effect. SHOT PLACEMENT IS THE KEY. If an individual can shoot a .38 accurately and cannot do the same with a .45, then the .38 is the better weapon for them.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 7:46:32 AM EDT
"Los Angeles Police Lt. Tom Smart said Evans was legally in possession of a .38-caliber handgun and had fired it in self-defense." Nice the media cleared that up for us. I was "really" worried he might have "illegal" possession of a weapon to defend himself... Maybe the otherwise useless oinks could do something about the loose animals instead of worrying about nonsense.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 7:51:54 AM EDT
In another case, if someone had a 38SPL, the outcome would have been vastly different. How sad. So much for the HCI recommendation to get a dog for self-protection in place of a firearm. If I didn't know any better the news media is crusading to ban the pit bull or restrict access to the public. ============================================================== LA Times http://www.latimes.com/wires/20010620/tCB00V7802.html Wednesday, June 20, 2001 Boy Mauled in Pit Bull Attack OAKLAND, Calif.--Three pit bulls savagely mauled a 10 -year-old boy who was riding a bicycle his parents had just given him for doing well in school. The dogs ripped off both Shawn Jones' ears and left bite wounds all over his face, arms and upper body Monday night, police said. He was hospitalized in critical condition Tuesday after 3 1/2 hours of surgery. Dr. James Betts said the boy would be hospitalized for at least a month. It took about four hours just to clean the wounds, Betts said. Shawn was riding a bicycle he had just been given by his mother, Alisa Frost, and his stepfather when the dogs attacked him in nearby Richmond. They knocked him off the bike and bit him repeatedly. Police Sgt. Enos Johnson said Benjamin Moore, 27, and Jacinda Lynn Knight, 33, both of Richmond, were arrested on suspicion of keeping dogs that cause injury or mayhem. The couple, which owned the dogs, was being held Tuesday on $115,000 bail. Moore told police he abandoned two of the dogs in Oakland and one in Richmond after the attack, but authorities believe the dogs are hidden. Copyright 2001 Los Angeles Times
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 7:56:58 AM EDT
Shot placement is definately the key. I took down a large pit bull with one shot to the skull with a 357 magnum (115 gr corbon JHP). I've also took down a huge great dane with one shot to the skull with a 45 acp (230 gr Hydra Shok).
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 8:04:08 AM EDT
screw that i would use a REM700 375 H&H mag this will stop him for shure!
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 8:36:31 AM EDT
My first reaction to this story is THANK GOD the dog attacked a kitten and not the 11 year old girl!! i used to think that there was no such thing as dangerous dogs, only dangerous owners. i know its a macho thing for a guy to have a rottweiler, doberman, or especially a pit bull. a lot of these guys don't discourage dangerous behavior from these dogs because they think its cool or they want them to be good guard dogs or whatever. but this is what can happen when these dogs escape the yard! i believe now that there are dangerous owners AND dangerous dogs. its a genetic fact that some breeds were bred to be pure killers and some are genetically vulnerable to aggressive mental illnesses. i think the gun he used would have easily taken the dog out on the first shot - the article did not say if the first two shots were just flesh wounds or what. i think he was so freaked out that his aim was off for the first 2 shots - resulting in flesh wounds, then he gathered his nerves for a well placed third shot and thats why it went down. even a 22 would have killed that dog if he hit it in the right place. like i said this is only speculation since the article didn't say where the dog was hit.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 8:37:56 AM EDT
MG_ME wrote "screw that i would use a REM700 375 H&H mag this will stop him for shure!" How do you figure. If you say "screw shot placement..." A miss from a 375 H&H mag is no more lethal than a miss from a .22...it just makes your shoulder sore.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 9:15:39 AM EDT
I have to agree that bullet placement is everything. Bullet type is also critical to ending a violent attack quickly. Hard cast lead bullets have superior penitration but not much of a wound channel. Over penitration is not desirable in a urban setting. The 357 loaded with 125hp's has more 1 shot stops (human) than all other handgun cartridges combined. Thats a documented fact. I doubt even a 60lb pitbull would shrug off a center lung shot. Launch one into a watermelon and see what happens. Their just plain NASTY.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 9:32:04 AM EDT
The other night on the news there was a story about a Pitbull biting/holding onto a Scottie dog. The Grandma beat the Pit but it wouldn't let go. So Grandma gets aholt of the loose skin around the Pit's neck and starts biting. I guess Grandma bit the shit out of the Pitbull---he yelped and let go. Neighbor starts whompin on Pit with baseball bat. Mr Pit beats-feets. The Scottie was ok...
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 9:38:25 AM EDT
Originally Posted By platform389: "Los Angeles Police Lt. Tom Smart said Evans was legally in possession of a .38-caliber handgun and had fired it in self-defense." Nice the media cleared that up for us. I was "really" worried he might have "illegal" possession of a weapon to defend himself...
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My point exactly
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 9:39:25 AM EDT
Originally Posted By medicjim: ipschoser1. You use the facts of the case to justify your pre-conceived notion that bigger is better.
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Nothing beats cubic inches.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 9:51:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/20/2001 9:50:31 AM EDT by Sukebe]
Recently once Sunday afternoon we got a call ref two Pit Bulls attacking a Sharpie that was tied up in back yard. The officer who got the call came over the radio and stated that the Pit Bulls had mauled the Sharpie and are turning aggressive towards him. He asked for a supervisor to come out to the scene. As I was heading that way he asked for permission to shoot the Pit Bulls. I told him to do what he had to do. As I was pulling up I heard the distinct sound of a 12ga. report. I walked back to the rear of the house and there were three dying dogs and the patrol officer with his shotgun. The Pits were trying to get up and I told him he better finish them off. He said he was out. I said out of what? and he said out of shotgun rounds. I asked if there were 5 rounds in the gun and as I looked around I saw the answer for myself as he said he fired all 5 I saw the empties on the ground. He had put two rounds each of no. 4 buck shot into the Pits and one into the Sharpie and the Pits were still trying to get up! We finished them off with our pistols and never were able to locate the owners of the Pit Bulls. Incidentally it was obvious that these were trained fighting dogs and there were many children and adults out in the area. What was done had to be done.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 10:21:23 AM EDT
Originally Posted By medicjim: ipschoser1. You use the facts of the case to justify your pre-conceived notion that bigger is better. ten .45 slugs creating ten superficial wounds on an animal bred to ignore superficial wounds would have the same effect. SHOT PLACEMENT IS THE KEY. If an individual can shoot a .38 accurately and cannot do the same with a .45, then the .38 is the better weapon for them.
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I used to use 9mm alot. It is sadly lacking and 38 spec is in the same boat. I agree that placement is paramount but big diameter bullets that penetrate deeply are very important also. Defensive handgun rounds are all underpowered for the task at hand. They are designed to fit in light easily carried guns (available in an emergency)that can be shot fast. This being the case, why not go with the most likely round to save your bacon? To each his own, I'll take a 45.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 10:31:34 AM EDT
So why did the cop shoot the Sparpie that was tied up, and the victim of the Pit Bulls?
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 11:31:33 AM EDT
Originally Posted By warlord: In another case, if someone had a 38SPL, the outcome would have been vastly different. How sad. So much for the HCI recommendation to get a dog for self-protection in place of a firearm. If I didn't know any better the news media is crusading to ban the pit bull or restrict access to the public. ============================================================== LA Times http://www.latimes.com/wires/20010620/tCB00V7802.html Wednesday, June 20, 2001 Boy Mauled in Pit Bull Attack OAKLAND, Calif.--Three pit bulls savagely mauled a 10 -year-old boy who was riding a bicycle his parents had just given him for doing well in school. The dogs ripped off both Shawn Jones' ears and left bite wounds all over his face, arms and upper body Monday night, police said. He was hospitalized in critical condition Tuesday after 3 1/2 hours of surgery. Dr. James Betts said the boy would be hospitalized for at least a month. It took about four hours just to clean the wounds, Betts said. Shawn was riding a bicycle he had just been given by his mother, Alisa Frost, and his stepfather when the dogs attacked him in nearby Richmond. They knocked him off the bike and bit him repeatedly. Police Sgt. Enos Johnson said Benjamin Moore, 27, and Jacinda Lynn Knight, 33, both of Richmond, were arrested on suspicion of keeping dogs that cause injury or mayhem. The couple, which owned the dogs, was being held Tuesday on $115,000 bail. Moore told police he abandoned two of the dogs in Oakland and one in Richmond after the attack, but authorities believe the dogs are hidden. Copyright 2001 Los Angeles Times
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An update on this case. The asshole who owns these dogs stated to the media in an interview that he came upon the child and just assumed he was dead. Never checked the kid. The boy was left alone on the ground for approximately 1 hour before someone found him. The asshole gathered up the dogs and drove them approximately 20 miles south of Richmond where he released them in three different cities (Fremont, Newark and Union City). Thanks a lot asshole!
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 11:50:22 AM EDT
Just a guess but I would say the guy's shots were all placed away from the dogs head and upper body in the hopes of not hitting the kitten trying to save it. A couple of shots in the lower extremities probably just pissed it off.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 11:55:53 AM EDT
I THINK AN AR-15 WOULD WORK???? :s
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 12:36:17 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Crookshanks: So why did the cop shoot the Sparpie that was tied up, and the victim of the Pit Bulls?
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Don't know for sure, but it was probably real torn up and he wanted to put it out of it's misery. Maybe it was beyond help.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 12:44:07 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Crookshanks: So why did the cop shoot the Sparpie that was tied up, and the victim of the Pit Bulls?
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I asked him the same thing. He told me that they had it by the throat and head and were pulling against each other and shaking it. It was in convulsions and suffering terribly according to the officer. It was a humane act.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 12:58:15 PM EDT
Abandon the dogs? they are in for a huge lawsuit if the dog on the loose attack again.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 11:00:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/20/2001 10:58:03 PM EDT by warlord]
Originally Posted By warlord: said Evans, who is nursing a swollen and cut right hand.....
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Have you folks noticed that he shot the dog with his one hand? It seem pretty hard to me.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 11:46:54 PM EDT
yeah, and if he's right handed a left handed shot placement might be difficult.
Link Posted: 6/21/2001 12:02:33 AM EDT
It is my understanding that the American Pit-Bull Terrier is only an aggresive dog if trained be so and only if defending its territory from other male dogs. I believe that the AKC has listed the pit as one of the better family dogs and a majority of bite injuries occur from Dachsunds and Cocker-Spaniels to smaller children. Remember Petie was a pit in the little rascals. The best way to stop a pit attack if possible to to squeeze the hell out of its front paw. I think that it pinches a nerve and have read that it is the only way to get one to let go of a bite. That is from a breeder's book. Please correct me if I am wrong. Thanks
Link Posted: 6/21/2001 12:04:10 AM EDT
Not that I am against shooting an attacking dog though.
Link Posted: 6/21/2001 1:36:23 AM EDT
We've had a rottweiler, doberman and a pit bull. It is all in the owners. These dogs were all goofballs! Super friendly and great family dogs. Like I said. It's the owners. All were goofballs. Just like me.
Link Posted: 6/21/2001 2:10:12 AM EDT
I had to shoot a stray chow that was threatening my daughter once. Unfortunately for the dog it was before I had much knowledge of ballistics (my first shotgun). I used #7 shot and after 3 shots the dog ran off. It just looked like I tore the hide off the dog in 3 places. He later died after screaming for 30 minutes. It had to be done but I actually felt sorry for the tortured dog. I wish I had my .45 then.
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