[url]
http://www.nytimes.com/2002/06/02/international/europe/02BRIT.html[/url]

"I don't know much about America — only what you see on the telly — but that's the direction they're going," Mr. Moss said. "I think that violence promotes violence, and if you find the police carrying guns, they'll be more accessible and more crimes will be committed with guns."


"The use of guns, and the access to guns, is much more widespread than in the past, and the criminals are prepared to go to far more risks," said Chief Superintendent Adrian Lee of the Manchester police force.

In recent months two suspects have fired machine guns in the street, 20 to 30 rounds each time. On another occasion a 70-year-old woman was shot and wounded in the crossfire of a gang-related melee.

But even Superintendent Lee is vehemently opposed to the routine arming of his officers. "It ups the ante, doesn't it?" he said. "If we armed every police officer in south Manchester, the public would get the message that it's a very dangerous place and that the only way to deal with it is guns. And if we're armed, then more criminals are going to say, `We need guns too.' "

All I got to say is that I'm not sending you Brits my surplus rifles like grandad did during WW2 . This time your on your own fighting this crime 'invasion' .

Yeah if the cops are carrying guns the criminals are going to say "now we need guns" maybe the cops should carry flowers that way the criminals will say we should have those.

Now I know in the last year or so i've read a story where a British 'Bobby' got the sh*t kicked out of him, mugged and then graffitied by a gang of youths. I bet he wished he'd been armed.

Mr. Blair, does the word LEND LEASE GARAND ring a bell?

"And if we're armed, then more criminals are going to say, `We need guns too.' "

HELLO, THEY ALREADY DO!

So, he's afraid to arm the cops because of public perception?????  Gee, we wouldn't want the public to know the truth, now would we.  We wouldn't want the public to get the idea that maybe it would be a good idea to be armed against the bad guys, NOOOOOOOOO, that would be bad. [puke]

Who needs guns when the NannyState is watching your every move with cameras and microphones, analyzing your face and voice patterns and predicting crimes before they happen or predicting which kids will commit which crimes in adulthood even before they're old enough to walk so they can start "preventative-behavior  medication" at an early age or genetically engineering "socially responsible and culturally tolerant" babies for cloning entire generations of docile taxpayers.

What a wonderful brave new world they're creating.

Ahhh, A brave New World.

I actually read that when I was getting into high school.
Now that I'm alittle older, I bet if I read it again, it would be a totally different story if you know what I mean. [;)]

People need to see this more and learn from it.  England is slightly ahead of us in time line in the downtrend that comes from catering to the worst elements of society.  In England, all this started just after the turn of the 19th to 20th centuries, when it became illegal to shoot a burglar.  Been going downhill ever since.  The crook politicians grew more and more liberal, not because they truly believed it, but just assemble blocs to get votes.

It takes a while, but time is on the side of creeps, just like rust.  I remember a time when currency was moved around London in simple vans, and the only "guards" were the guys loading and unloading.  Times have changed.

In addition, as a general comment not even specific to England, the idea that  "Easier access to guns than in the past" is a simple, blatant lie.  It says "you are stupid" to everyone who listens and gives even the slightest credibility to the statement.

There are more and more restrictions on guns, as the liberals and their ilk will proudly point.  Then, by definition it was easier to come by guns in the past, completely contradicting the argument.  There was a time, although a long time ago, when one could go into a store in England and buy a gun without more than a how do you do and the price.  Just like here in the US.  No, guns are NOT easier to obtain now than in the past, and the primary pillar of the gun control argument is prima facie ridiculous.

This is the kind of guy you want to just punch in the nose, and ask if violence should be answered with violence, when he says NO, hit him again, ask him the question again.  When he says NO, hit him again, then ask him the question again, when he says NO, hit him again....  ad infinitum, until he GETS IT that you will CONTINUE to be VICTIMIZED until you FIGHT BACK.  

The 'british attitude' is SO freakin pathetic.  They'll be overrun by criminals in no time.

Yesterday I was talking about what is happening in Europe with my father in law.
He is Israeli, and when I mentioned the fact that in England and in France the CCW doesn't exist (not that is no more issued, but DOESN'T EXIST A LAW TO ISSUE IT!) he told me: "But defend yourself is a human right!!!"

"You right [i]aba[/i], but it is like that because they think that they don't need. It's a tradition in that country, that the only ones to have guns are soldiers: if you want a gun join the reserve, and Authorities will tell how, when and to whom to shoot... includind your own people. Americans' Indipendence War against the British started because they wanted to steal guns (and money) from settlers hands"

British, with all the respects to the common people, are a bunch of arrogant sheeps that assumed that they are more civilized than other people. I am happy I am living so far from them...

It all goes back to the middle ages when only the nobility were allowed arms.  I guess to keep the peasants under control.  That's what the British heirarchy are telling you now, and the self-styled aristocrats here in the US want to bring about.

The British common people are some of the best people there are, but their "masters" should be strung up.

BTW, quite a number of years ago, in "American Rifleman", some retired British major wrote in and passed along a comment on BRitish gun laws.  He commented, admittedly anecdotal evidence, that the main reason for the first gun laws in 1920 was the heirarchy was afraid of a revolt by the common people after what they had suffered in WWI.  WWI was a fraud of the aristocracy, and the suffering and losses of the British were enormous.  It's not so widely known because the media wasn't what it is today.  Anyway, the British bring a lot of their problems on themselves.  One of their best traits, loyalty, is being used against them.  I'm glad my ancestors left Wales in the 1700's .  

Nice attitute there. With that kind of thinking, I predict that the British government will be overthrown in 20 years by one guy with a .38 revolver.

After all, if the army has guns, the other countries will want to start wars because... Oh man, my brain hurts trying to think like that.

If you haven't read it, I strongly recommend "[i]All the Way Down the Slippery Slope: Gun Prohibition in England and Some Lessons for Civil Liberties in America[/i]"

[url]www.guncite.com/journals/okslip.html[/url]

Edited to fix the link.

Let me see if I've got this, the cops have no guns but the criminals have full auto weapons ?

See !!  Gun control does work.  

All the cops guns have been taken off the street.  (Great job - LOL - dumbshits)

What a friggen awesome posts man!
You hit the head with the fist with that one!

You know the comments the Mr. Moss could be said just like this....


"I don't care how many of our citizens and police officers have to die, we will not fight back, this will all fizzle over and our country will not have problems, like that other country".

No wonder we kicked their A$$e$ in the 18th century. Those Europeans must really enjoy grabbing hold of their ankles.
Good grief

It must be just peachy for criminals over there. I can just imagine thugs mugging cops in back alleys speaking in unintelligible street British like in Snatch.

[b]AAAAAAARRRGGHH![/b]  No logic.  Brain hurts.  Make it stop.  [>(]

After the war, those weapons became "surplus" and were destroyed in the tens of thousands.  Everytime I think about that I get a little sick. [:(]