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9/19/2017 7:27:10 PM
Posted: 12/23/2001 9:22:21 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2001 11:05:12 AM EDT by 13f]
Gun,SKS, 7.62x39 round. Deer at 500 yds, open sights, one shot, deer was "hit" and got away. Does this round have the energy to take down a healthy deer at that range? Just curious as to what the concensus would be. (had to place this disclaimer that I did not take this shot after mjacvn71's response. Please don't take personal attacks on MY hunting abilities from my question on my friends statement. thks)
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 9:26:59 AM EDT
This is a rediculous question. Of course it was not a good shot. Do you have the deer in your freezer? No? Then it was not a good shot. Not to mention (but I will) that the cartridge is completely underpowered for that range, and I'm willing to bet you don't practice with it at that range either.

Now there is a deer out there with a hole poked in it that will most likely die of a very nasty internal infection that you caused by taking a rediculous shot.

You asked, I answered.

-elliott

Link Posted: 12/23/2001 9:55:35 AM EDT
Irresponsible yes, great no.
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 10:00:55 AM EDT
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 10:02:09 AM EDT
Part of hunting is knowing your limitations, including your equipment, your ability to shoot accurately and at what ranges, and your choice of cartridge and bullet design. If you don't know whether or not the round has the energy to take down a deer at 500 yards, you shouldn't have taken the shot, period. 7.62x39 is the approximate equivalent ballistically to a 30.30. I wouldn't take a 500 yard shot with a 30.30.

How do you know it was hit? Did you follow a blood trail? Please don't tell me you shot it with a FMJ.
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 10:02:31 AM EDT
13f, I feel sorry for you but you did ask for it by your irresponsible behavior. You better get your flame suit on.

Link Posted: 12/23/2001 10:42:38 AM EDT
I happen to agree with the first five answers. I did not take this shot, but a friend did (I was not there, only repeating what he told me). I personaly think that a 7.62x39 is to small out at that range, and I haven't looked at any ballistic tables for this round out to that yardage. What I was looking for was a response from somebody that perhaps had made a similar shot, and took a deer.
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 10:47:59 AM EDT
Hopefully when this bozo said "hit" he meant he shot the deer's tail off! 13F You are a reckless wanna-be hunter. You have zero business in the field and even less business with a firearm. I'm glad I don't have to worry about running into you in my woods here in Illinois. I highly suggest you goto a firearm safety course with a water pistol and hang around a real hunter and learn what is wrong and right! Taking a shot that you are not 100% sure you will hit the target let alone in a kill zone is not only idiotic at 500yds but reckless. What if your buddy was 20yds beyond the deer, you wouldnt have known until the police tracked your sorry a$$ down for murder!
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 11:14:30 AM EDT
I would personally bitch-slap your friend if I ever saw him do something like that. You should never hunt without knowing the limits of your weapon. A 7.62x39 is about as powerful as a 30-30. How many people do you hear about taking 500yd shots with 30-30's?
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 11:20:42 AM EDT
brouhaha, do you know anybody that you can't argue with? Well, he's one of them. I personaly know of shots out to that distance, but all with 300's or greater, and all animals dropped. Fact is I don't believe him.
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 11:32:07 AM EDT

Originally Posted By mjacvn71:
Hopefully when this bozo said "hit" he meant he shot the deer's tail off! 13F You are a reckless wanna-be hunter. You have zero business in the field and even less business with a firearm. I'm glad I don't have to worry about running into you in my woods here in Illinois. I highly suggest you goto a firearm safety course with a water pistol and hang around a real hunter and learn what is wrong and right! Taking a shot that you are not 100% sure you will hit the target let alone in a kill zone is not only idiotic at 500yds but reckless. What if your buddy was 20yds beyond the deer, you wouldnt have known until the police tracked your sorry a$$ down for murder!



he said he didn't take the shot and was just asking about it.
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 11:47:25 AM EDT
mjac,
Why don't you spend more time reading the post
and less time beating your chest.
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 4:22:49 PM EDT
he said it a few times also. "Don't kill the messenger."
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 4:49:04 PM EDT
well lessee...

at 500 yds out of a 24" bbl the bullet would drop about 102" at a 150 yd zero with a 125 gr psp bullet. And he did this with iron sites.

I think it's safe to conclude that your friend is

A) and irresponsible clod.
B) lying
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 5:16:34 PM EDT
This is not an endorsement of shooting deer at 500 yards with anything, much less an SKS, but...

When I was a kid my Dad was employed on a huge Arizona cattle ranch part of which was adjacent to a small town. They had a problem with dogs from the town going stray, packing up and running cattle to death. Of course the owners would never believe that their sweet poochy had anything to do with any stock depredation so the policy became to just shoot the dogs. They would've preferred to shoot the dog owners, but that is illegal.

One day my Dad got a call that some dogs were running cows on the ranch and he headed out with his Model 94 Winchester carbine. A .30-30 with a short barrel, and iron sights.

After tear assing down a ranch road we found the dogs, my old man took a shot on a running German Shepard at (later paced out) 650 yards and dropped the bag bastard dead as Hell with one round through the chest.

Now the old man fully admitted that it was a pure luck shot,made by guessing a huge lead and hold over, but none the less it did drop a deer sized animal in one shot with a ballisticly similar round.

So in theory, an SKS could drop a deer at that range. Not reliably, not morally or responsibly and not too damn often, but it could happen.
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 5:57:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2001 5:49:10 PM EDT by Redmanfms]

Originally Posted By Rabid_Coyote:
This is not an endorsement of shooting deer at 500 yards with anything, much less an SKS, but...

When I was a kid my Dad was employed on a huge Arizona cattle ranch part of which was adjacent to a small town. They had a problem with dogs from the town going stray, packing up and running cattle to death. Of course the owners would never believe that their sweet poochy had anything to do with any stock depredation so the policy became to just shoot the dogs. They would've preferred to shoot the dog owners, but that is illegal.

One day my Dad got a call that some dogs were running cows on the ranch and he headed out with his Model 94 Winchester carbine. A .30-30 with a short barrel, and iron sights.

After tear assing down a ranch road we found the dogs, my old man took a shot on a running German Shepard at (later paced out) 650 yards and dropped the bag bastard dead as Hell with one round through the chest.

Now the old man fully admitted that it was a pure luck shot,made by guessing a huge lead and hold over, but none the less it did drop a deer sized animal in one shot with a ballisticly similar round.

So in theory, an SKS could drop a deer at that range. Not reliably, not morally or responsibly and not too damn often, but it could happen.



Dad made a great shot, give him a pat on the back from me. However, if the deer are the size of German shepards, you got some damn small deer .

500 yard shot with iron sights isn't impossible, but I seriously doubt that most people have the ability to presicely place the shot. Keeping within one's ability is part of being a resposible gun owner and hunter.

I've been hired by farmers in my area to take care of pack dogs (like Rabid_Coyote described) and groundhogs. I use a scoped M1A. I try to be as humane as possible because I don't want to make anything suffer, but in the long run the dogs need to be killed. If they die at the time of the shot great, if they run off somewhere to die, just as good. Domestic dogs can do some serious damage to livestock when they start running in packs, and unlike wolves (which are starting to reappear in VA) they kill just to kill.

Anyway, the longest shot I've ever made on a dog was about 780 yards paced out (give or take 10-15 yards because I'm not a real tall guy). My longest shot on a groundhog was 545 yards solid (had a laser rangefinder). Both animals were deader than a doornail. Of course, I was using a more potent cartridge, but shots like that can still be made.
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 6:09:22 PM EDT
Yes but a .308 drops only about 50 inches at 500 yards. You would have to hold over so much with an sks that you wouldn't even be able to see it anymore!
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 6:17:04 PM EDT

Originally Posted By raf:
I'm with 03shooter and elliott.
The shot ought never have been taken. Not at that range, not with that round, and not with those issue sights.

This is the sort of behavior that gives hunters a bad name.



What they said.
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 6:24:21 PM EDT

Originally Posted By brouhaha:
I would personally bitch-slap your friend if I ever saw him do something like that. You should never hunt without knowing the limits of your weapon. A 7.62x39 is about as powerful as a 30-30. How many people do you hear about taking 500yd shots with 30-30's?




What is the effective range of a bitch-slap?
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 8:25:46 PM EDT
I'm with Brouhaha. If I had witnessed a friend of mine pull that idiotic stunt, I would have punched him.
What an Asshole! You'r not going to hunt with that idiot, are you?
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 8:32:03 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Rabbit9:

What is the effective range of a bitch-slap?



About a yard.
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 8:56:21 PM EDT
According to my tables, a russian 7.62 in 125 gr. bullet has a muzz vel. of 2300 fps at the muzzle and at 500 yds. 1150 fps.

It's muzzle energy out of muzzle is 1500 ft./lbs. and at 500 yds. its 375 ft./lbs.

At a 200 yrd. zero, the bullet will drop 95 inches at 500 yrds!!

Why would your friend take this shot?

I don't see how he could of hit the deer with a drop like!

I think your friend is pullin your chain.[:0)]

Link Posted: 12/23/2001 9:47:18 PM EDT
Shooting a deer at 500 is doable but a lot of things have to come together before the trigger is pulled. First the exact range down to 25 yards is a must be know.. not I think but I KNOW! Then the wind must be dead calm, like early am or late in the day. The rifle/ cartridge combination must be up to the task, carring at least 100lbs of energy at the range of the deer. Last but MOST IMPORTANT the shooter must have proven to himself with lots of practice that it is a high percentage shot.
Link Posted: 12/24/2001 4:50:50 AM EDT
Good shooting, bad hunting.

The ones to brag about are how close you got, not how far away you had to shoot from.
Link Posted: 12/24/2001 7:21:49 AM EDT
Bumped into my buddy this morning who made this claim. Apparently I misunderstood him. His buddy was shooting the sks and couldn't hit the deer (yes I know, again, don't kill the messenger!). My friend was actually shooting a 7.62x54 out of a mossin nagant (spelling?). Said he place the sights just above the the deer's shoulder and thought he hit it in the hind quarters. Please no flames towards me! For myself, if I hunt, I shoot at all ranges in which I will take a shot, if I have not actually hit a target consistantly at the designated range, or if I'm unsure of the range, I WOULD NOT take the shot.
Link Posted: 12/24/2001 8:15:03 AM EDT
Not busting your chops, 13f, but even a shot like that with a Mosin in 7.62x54 is irresponsible and reprehensible.
Link Posted: 12/24/2001 8:55:23 AM EDT
Garmentless, no problem. Experience is the best teacher, and with either gun mentioned, I've never taken shots like that. I consider this guy to actually be above intelegence (which is another reason why I'm trying to figure out why he took this shot, and although I know the other guy he was with, I won't even go there). Never shot the mossin nagant. I'm not trying to "stick up" for him, but asking again becuase the gun cartridge had changed from the 7.62x39 to the 7.62x54 (by the way, why the deer didn't run after the first two shots from the sks I have no idea). And yes, I agree, it was irresponsible, but guess I'm trying to see if the concensus agrees (which I'm taking as a yes)
Link Posted: 12/24/2001 9:20:15 AM EDT
13f, I wish I had more hunting buddies like you.
Because I have to hunt on O.P.P. (other people's property), I'm stuck hunting with nutjobs who won't even follow up on their wounded animals and are constantly taking running shots that they've never been able to make before (that's were most of their wounded animals come from). Makes me so mad I could spit. I can see taking stupid shots at vermin, but to me a deer is a valuable, magnificent animal.
Link Posted: 12/24/2001 10:57:37 AM EDT
I hope that the SKS guy and the 7.62x54 guy both learned a lesson from this sorry display of sportsmanship. Maybe some good can come out of it. Watch-Six
Link Posted: 12/24/2001 11:11:04 AM EDT
The shooter has a responsibility to shoot in a safe and reasonable manner. I pass on insane, "unsporting" shots, and even some merely difficult shots.

Shoot within the limitations imposed by your skill, rifle, and hunting situation. Shooting at those several hundred yard distances with inadequate equipment/judgement means the hunter has a lack of respect for the animal he's hunting.

If you want to actually know what you are capable of (as a shooter), lay your hands on a large paper target and place it at (aprox)500 yards. If you can't put all 5 shots into the black with your hunting rifle/ammo, you have no business taking shots at those distances.

Paper targets cruelly reveal your actual abilities.
Link Posted: 12/24/2001 12:31:57 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/25/2001 10:53:34 PM EDT
13F sorry for busting your chops....I misunderstood your post. All of you guys are "lucky" you get to hunt with rifles! Here in Illinois we can hunt with .22's for squirrels or coons! But if you want one of our nice big whitetails its either a bow or shotgun and no 00 buck! Its either deer slug or nothing! So 90yds is pressing it!!!
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